Welcome to DU!
The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards.
Join the community:
Create a free account
Support DU (and get rid of ads!):
Become a Star Member
All Forums
Issue Forums
Culture Forums
Alliance Forums
Region Forums
Support Forums
Help & Search
Latest Breaking News
In reply to the discussion: Missouri bill would allow teachers to carry guns in schools [View all]PavePusher
(15,374 posts)37. I don't think you actually know how "body armor" works.
It doesn't make you impervious to all effects of gunshots. While it may stop most pistol bullets, it still feels like getting whacked with a bat. Most folks, hit in the torso, will still want to lie down for a while. And it doesn't stop rifle bullets for much, unless backed up with heavy metal or ceramic plates. And those cover only very limited areas.
And this does not even consider the truth that more bullets flying means more people get hit in most cases.
If you look up the actual stats, Citizens shooting in self-defense hit innocent people far less often than police. I'll try to find the study that supports this, I seem to have misplaced the link for it. (Found it, a Newsweek column that's hard to find: http://www.rkba.org/comment/cowards.will. Haven't found a direct link. Yes, it's also old data, but I haven't seen anything to contradict or indicate any change.) Even if it went the way you imply, I fail to see how, for instance, 2 shot by a criminal and 1 or 2 accidently shot by a defender is worse than 20 dead children by a criminal. That math doesn't work.
Civilians cannot be trained to the level of police officers and in particular, they cannot possibly keep up that training as police officers do on a continual basis.
While your faith in police training is admirable, it is rather misplaced. Police in general do not receive the level of firearms training most Citizens think they do. Nor do they "keep (it) up" particularly well. (See the Rand study on NYPD training: http://www.rand.org/pubs/monographs/MG717.html . This is, sadly, not atypical.) As for your opinion on "civilians" (police are very much civilians, FTR), they most certainly can be trained, and frequently well past the level of police. One need merely look at the competitive shooting sports and count the numbers of police vs. Citizens at those events, and the numbers of winners. Overwhelmingly non-police....
Also, defensive options in a classroom are very limited. There are only a few options to chose from, and a correspondingly reduced training demand. A 3-5 days of annual training, with one or two refresher days per year would be more than sufficient.
Edit history
Please sign in to view edit histories.
48 replies
= new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight:
NoneDon't highlight anything
5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
RecommendedHighlight replies with 5 or more recommendations
Missouri bill would allow teachers to carry guns in schools [View all]
Seedersandleechers
Dec 2012
OP
The reason why no one wants to respond to such a question is because it is so obvious
Harmony Blue
Dec 2012
#12
Interesting hypotheticals. Do you have any evidence that supports any of them?
PavePusher
Dec 2012
#21
I don't know about this one...I've hung around teachers before. Better add the stimulation that they
jonesgirl
Dec 2012
#16
I've seen and heard too many teachers talk about how stressful kids are today, and how hard it is to
jonesgirl
Dec 2012
#42
I have explained it. You just don't accept the explanation because of your blind spot on guns.
yellowcanine
Dec 2012
#40