Response to leftynyc (Reply #18)
Fri Apr 20, 2012, 05:01 PM
caseymoz (5,724 posts)
19. Does it occur to you that the person is gone . . .
. . . in those bodies, and how corpses are treated after death is for the dignity of the relatives, the society and, yes, the religion? So, to not respect is an insult to all that?
Don't even get into the positive our military has done. You yourself said nobody on this board believed the bullshit the Bush administration was telling us about rebuilding the nation. You can't have it both ways. Either you're too sophisticated to have ever believed we trying to help people, or you believe we're there altruistically. Those are contradictory positions, mutually excluding. You can't flip from one to the other.
The reason why nobody seems to notice the good our military is doing has nothing to do with anti-military sentiment or a conspiracy in the press. The military has to work both sides between building schools and bombing militants, who often look just like civilians. Guess which one people will notice most?
How is this different from any other organization? If the Red Cross ran hospitals and bombed innocent people while desecrating bodies and burning Bibles, which of those would be noticed? You think we'd forgive them? Make them immune to arrest? You think they'd be loved? If Catholic Charities helped poor people, and tortured the unfaithful, which would they be known for? Would we forgive one for the other?
No. We wouldn't tolerate it. You know this. We'd put them on a terrorist organization list. And that's how we'd feel when the organizations were run by Americans. Now imagine if it was run by a foreign power. What if China had an organization here that built schools, ran hospitals, and killed and tortured people, desecrated bodies, burned Bibles. Now imagine if the did this and they were immune to arrest, prosecution, or civil action. Hell, we'd be suicide bombing it.
Now, how do you think the foreign press would see these "good" organizations that sometime bomb people? The same way. Don't whine that people aren't noticing all the good things we're doing. You couldn't have expected anything else, and that won't change. Ever.
There's a real life organization that illustrates this: Hamas. They're not known for the schools and hospitals they build and run either. They also do charity work, and they're probably as clueless about why people never notice as you about why nobody notices our noble military. Israel has embargoed and quarantined them, they're said forget their charity work.
I feel also sympathy for the suffering women in Afghanistan, but I have one suggestion: leave. Get out. Saddle Afghanistan with a population that's only one-third women. If Afghan women did that, I assure you, the men there would act better toward the remaining women.
The oppression and abuse of Afghan women is heartbreaking, but being realistic: there is almost nothing we could do for them while they're living in that country. Period. We can't change the abusive douche bags living there, and if we kill them, it just makes the rest douchier. The best thing we could do, then, is not occupy the country, but give the women asylum and encourage them to escape.
And that's a test. If we're not willing to do that, then any of our caring for them was bullshit to begin with. Similar to caring about a character in a novel, but not enough care to prompt action.
I'm sorry about your father. My regards and best wishes for any possible recovery. Of course, I won't refer to that example again, and I didn't choose it knowing, nor did I think there was a good chance you were facing that very thing. That part was bad luck, and I'm sorry for the results. I'm hoping you trust I would have never went that direction if I had any idea.
But a false dilemma is still a fallacy.
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