Reply #67

In the discussion thread: 49 Years After Kennedy Signed The Equal Pay Act, Women Still Earn 77 Cents To A Man’s Dollar [View all]

Response to uponit7771 (Reply #51)

Tue Jun 12, 2012, 01:00 PM

4th law of robotics (6,801 posts)

67. A wage gap is not proof of discrimination

a wage gap that exists after all relevant factors influencing pay have been accounted for is.

You are arguing the former we're trying to point out that you should be looking at the latter.

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158 replies	Author	Time	Post
49 Years After Kennedy Signed The Equal Pay Act, Women Still Earn 77 Cents To A Man’s Dollar [View all]	SunsetDreams	Jun 2012	OP
Well, that's because they want it that way.....	Darth_Kitten	Jun 2012	#1
Plus, a large percentage of 'em have babies and lose work hours.	BlancheSplanchnik	Jun 2012	#21
Seriously? A woman's part time employer should pay her more because she does more household work?	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#27
I known women who have applied for various "tech" jobs	xmas74	Jun 2012	#33
Women do not "opt" for lesser jobs	treestar	Jun 2012	#68
What is it about plumbing, welding and garbage collection that precludes women?	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#70
so, you support pay inequity?	noiretextatique	Jun 2012	#78
A female welder should absolutely earn the same hourly wage as an equally accomplished male welder.	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#79
yes, that's what the OP is about	noiretextatique	Jul 2012	#157
I have no children, I'm an Accountant	noiretextatique	Jun 2012	#77
Romney would work to get that to women earning 50 cents or less to a man’s dollar. n/t	RKP5637	Jun 2012	#2
Exactly how stupid does a woman have to be to vote for a Republican?	Walk away	Jun 2012	#3
The "Stay at home dad" is not yet a paradigm in this country.	MADem	Jun 2012	#4
Injustice. Amazing that on a LIBERAL board, so few join the cause.	BlancheSplanchnik	Jun 2012	#5
I noticed that at least one has replied in this thread.	xmas74	Jun 2012	#34
that's not what I usually say	hfojvt	Jun 2012	#42
You could always try proving him wrong.	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#54
just curious but	Skittles	Jun 2012	#110
Indeed not.	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#127
that one is a LIVE one too!	Skittles	Jun 2012	#108
I've noticed that from many of his posts.	xmas74	Jun 2012	#133
Some people prefer cluelessness.	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#142
....	rational_democrat	Jun 2012	#6
let's be fair about this	spooky3	Jun 2012	#8
yep - and:	dana_b	Jun 2012	#9
Let's take some women I know.	Igel	Jun 2012	#10
agreed that the headline is misleading for the reason you gave.	spooky3	Jun 2012	#24
the fact that women have a bachelor's degree doesn't tell you much. what's the degree in?	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#91
Young metropolitan women are better educated and make more money than their male peers?	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#16
read the entire article	spooky3	Jun 2012	#22
What about singled, divorced and widowed women? They are usually the ONLY breadwinners.	spooky3	Jun 2012	#7
Sorry, but I HATE this bull shit, manufactured story	joeglow3	Jun 2012	#11
Again, HOURS TO HOURS women get paid less given all RELAVENT JOB FACTORS. Now if you want to	uponit7771	Jun 2012	#57
the 77% statistic doesn't compare hours to hours. it compares full-time workers to full-time	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#88
Since discrimination is illegal, where is the disparity coming from?	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#12
Thanks for posting that.	jp11	Jun 2012	#13
you don't get it	Skittles	Jun 2012	#14
they get it. they don't want to acknowledge it. n/t	Scout	Jun 2012	#15
CORRECT	Skittles	Jun 2012	#20
The anecdotes aren't supported by the data.	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#17
LOLOL	Skittles	Jun 2012	#18
I found that funny too.	xmas74	Jun 2012	#35
check this out	Skittles	Jun 2012	#83
Why am I not surprised?	xmas74	Jun 2012	#84
QUIZ FOR YOU	Skittles	Jun 2012	#115
if you experienced discrimination, why wouldn't you file suit? why would you care about people	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#116
see #35	Skittles	Jun 2012	#134
right, attorneys never take discriminations cases. you want other people to help highly paid	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#137
LOL	Skittles	Jun 2012	#140
how does posting a half-dozen "lols" with eye-rolling avatars make you tired? it's not exactly	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#145
I work 50 hour weeks (AT NIGHT)	Skittles	Jun 2012	#146
i'm not trying to keep you. all you post is "lol" anyway.	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#150
I guess B), from personal experience.	xmas74	Jun 2012	#132
A hoot?	chervilant	Jun 2012	#62
read Prof. Francine Blau's and other experts' MULTIVARIATE research on pay issues	spooky3	Jun 2012	#23
What was the bottom line?	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#26
Looks like they studied the issue as it was 20-30 years ago	Major Nikon	Jun 2012	#30
here's one of doctor blau's papers (2000). she looks at various countries & their ratio of male to	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#106
here ya go	Skittles	Jun 2012	#82
$12,000 per year less n/t	Scout	Jun 2012	#86
that's an article from msnbc. other people post research articles and you ignore them.	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#92
LOLOL	Skittles	Jun 2012	#99
yes, & i trust the media to report research accurately like i trust the mafia. seen them	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#103
6% - OH DEAR, IS THAT ALL???	Skittles	Jun 2012	#104
gosh you're annoying. as my criticism of all these posts that blare "TWENTY-THREE PERCENT WAGE	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#105
aw poor BABY !!!!	Skittles	Jun 2012	#107
that attitude will win you lots of supporters & voters among low-wage women, i'm sure.	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#109
There are lots of sociological reasons why women make less on average	Major Nikon	Jun 2012	#19
Well said.	MightyOkie	Jun 2012	#28
I've seen some studies which suggest it's even lower	Major Nikon	Jun 2012	#29
I've been looking around, trying to find where they get the 77% figure	SickOfTheOnePct	Jun 2012	#31
That's it. It just comes from the census data	Major Nikon	Jun 2012	#32
You have it exactly right. n/t	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#61
that's exactly what it is. they just compared the median wage of all male v. female workers	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#96
There's a residual error value of 5-10%	4th law of robotics	Jun 2012	#47
Here's what the CONSAD study said on that topic	Major Nikon	Jun 2012	#73
So you're saying MOST of the pay disparity is voluntary? If not then what you've said makes little..	uponit7771	Jun 2012	#38
So you're saying everyone who authors comprehensive studies on gender pay shouldn't bother?	Major Nikon	Jun 2012	#39
If it is voluntary	4th law of robotics	Jun 2012	#48
According to AAUW, 80% of the pay gap is a consequence of choices. n/t	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#49
which there seem to be a lot of in this thread. you'd think it was 1950, some of the rhetoric is	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#93
if that was your experience, why didn't you file a lawsuit? illegal since 1963.	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#89
+++ THIS IS RIGHT WING BULLSHIT!!! WOMEN WITH SAME AMOUNT OF TIME ON JOB STILL PAID LESS +++	uponit7771	Jun 2012	#37
Luv the all caps	Major Nikon	Jun 2012	#41
Thx, gotta make sure to holler louder for the truth than conservative do for lies	uponit7771	Jun 2012	#50
awwwwww poor BABY!!!!!!!!!!!	Skittles	Jun 2012	#98
Is this like a form of tourettes?	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#131
The study author from the first link is a liar.	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#46
Then you're making their point and your link is STILLY LYING, there's gap... no matter what...	uponit7771	Jun 2012	#51
My opinion also happens to be consistent with the facts.	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#58
A wage gap is not proof of discrimination	4th law of robotics	Jun 2012	#67
The tough part is quantifying "all relevant factors"	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#71
And I think those things you mention	4th law of robotics	Jun 2012	#81
no one said there wasn't a gap. they said the gap is not 23%.	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#94
Also, the study was work hours to work hours...you can NOT discard that as a control!!	uponit7771	Jun 2012	#52
There may be a gap. It might be as much as one-fifth of that claimed by the op. n/t	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#59
LOL	Skittles	Jun 2012	#100
Sure.	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#128
it was not work hours to work hours. it was "full-time" to "full-time". full-time can be anything	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#95
Old propaganda that doesn't fly. Women in the same jobs, with the same experience, still earn less.	DirkGently	Jun 2012	#90
:sigh: I'll never forget the horselaugh my Grandmother let out when she heard the news.	TygrBright	Jun 2012	#25
Which begs the question...	Cerridwen	Jun 2012	#36
Great point... Time to get rid of this outdated business model... Time to	midnight	Jun 2012	#43
it punishes men's work too. non-union framers here start at around $8-$10. and union jobs are	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#114
not this again.	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#40
I've read that women in general are less aggressive in pushing for raises	4th law of robotics	Jun 2012	#45
This is false, hours to hours women still get paid less. Also, women HAVING to "push" for the same..	uponit7771	Jun 2012	#56
Negotiation isn't discrimination. n/t	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#60
A) if you going by that study you posted above	4th law of robotics	Jun 2012	#66
because when they do they are called SHRILL BITCHES	Skittles	Jun 2012	#101
so what? seriously, men are called names too when they are pushy, but it doesn't seem to stop them.	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#117
So women prefer to avoid social stigma	4th law of robotics	Jun 2012	#119
you're not understanding the systemic effects of sexism	Skittles	Jun 2012	#135
The problem with these kinds of theories	4th law of robotics	Jun 2012	#138
do some REAL LIFE RESEARCH	Skittles	Jun 2012	#141
I'm a woman & I've worked for 40 years. You post smiley-faces and LOLs and "poor baby" at me.	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#151
Anecdotes don't actually prove much	4th law of robotics	Jun 2012	#153
"People think stuff like this is going to win Obama the women's vote. I doubt it."	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#53
awwwwwwwwww poor BABIES!!!	Skittles	Jun 2012	#102
another bs post, hours to hours women get paid LESS PERIOD end of story. You can fudge how MUCH	uponit7771	Jun 2012	#55
the number simply compares all male full-time workers to all female full-time workers, with no	HiPointDem	Jun 2012	#87
Just one more in the list of disgraceful things about this country.	libtodeath	Jun 2012	#44
Well...	chervilant	Jun 2012	#63
Just FYI, those who deny sexism in pay rates:	chervilant	Jun 2012	#64
No matter how times change, the rhetoric doesn't	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#65
that sounds like a repuke	Skittles	Jun 2012	#97
So sad...	chervilant	Jun 2012	#124
I'm not complimenting the use of a 320 year old poem in defense of the factual basis of the OP. n/t	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#126
Now, see,	chervilant	Jun 2012	#144
Thanks for clarifying. All this time, I thought that facts mattered.	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#149
She sent me notice that I'm on her ignore list too	4th law of robotics	Jun 2012	#154
Statistics may be more valuable	4th law of robotics	Jun 2012	#120
I've hired many people over the years. Aggressiveness really does play a role.	Xithras	Jun 2012	#69
Why would a woman be less inclined to ask though	treestar	Jun 2012	#72
there is a lot of research to support that women	La Lioness Priyanka	Jun 2012	#74
I said I wouldn't speculate, but I think the second may have a bit to do with it.	Xithras	Jun 2012	#75
good point about the risk taking behavior.	La Lioness Priyanka	Jun 2012	#76
"Acting aggressive" in this context is less offputting to the boss than to peers	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#80
It is all in what a person feels their value is	treestar	Jun 2012	#123
How would you propose to rectify the pay imbalance which results?	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#130
I'm arguing about the usual "women choose" this or that inferior situation	treestar	Jun 2012	#143
right	noiretextatique	Jul 2012	#158
I must have slept through the "Negotiating Salaries for Men" class	4th law of robotics	Jun 2012	#121
The Paycheck Fairness Act would have helped with this	Major Nikon	Jun 2012	#85
Women negotiate for different things	Sen. Walter Sobchak	Jun 2012	#112
Reading through the replies, the focus is not fully in the root causes.	Amimnoch	Jun 2012	#111
To illustrate my point:	Amimnoch	Jun 2012	#113
hmm...	chervilant	Jun 2012	#125
Well we all know the only differnce between men and women is the plumbing	Major Nikon	Jun 2012	#118
obviously there is more to it than that	Skittles	Jun 2012	#139
What do you think is the cause behind the massive disparity	4th law of robotics	Jun 2012	#122
Yes. Yes, we know... Dear god, WHAT ABOUT THE MEN?!?!?!?!?!?!	redqueen	Jun 2012	#147
I asked the question not to divert the discussion here but rather	4th law of robotics	Jun 2012	#152
It ain't socialization.	lumberjack_jeff	Jun 2012	#129
CORRECT	Skittles	Jun 2012	#136
Brogressives.	redqueen	Jun 2012	#148
bingo...it's cultural	noiretextatique	Jul 2012	#156
Too bad for me	Puzzledtraveller	Jun 2012	#155

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