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True Blue Door

(2,969 posts)
Sun Oct 26, 2014, 10:14 AM Oct 2014

Why is the American left not as effective as the European left? [View all]

Whenever I ask this question, there are always a torrent of responses that attribute the American left's relative weakness to external causes: Mainly the wealth, power, and ruthlessness of the (pseudo-)American right. But such explanations only illustrate the real answer - the left in the US has an almost entirely negative self-definition, as a political space where the destructive ideologies of the right are rejected without necessarily having any unified vision of what to do with that space.

This is why the multi-generational failure of the American left to establish lasting foundations of governance in this country is almost universally excused as a product of Enemy Action: "They won't let us do the things we should do!" And for some reason it's usually just left at that, with no further examination. The laziness and childishness of this attitude should be immediately obvious, as well as the fact that it's an excuse for failure rather than a productive thought process toward achieving better results.

It also can't escape notice that it's essentially false: Contrary to myth accepted by both the left and the right, principled left-wing politicians are not rare in America. What's rare are principled left-wing legislative accomplishments, because the American left doesn't reward leaders who do things - it punishes them, because action intensifies attention, which (under the previously mentioned negative self-definition) causes unreasoning and unprioritized obsession on flaws.

A left-wing legislator who just sits quietly between symbolic speeches, but never once passes or in any way tangibly affects a bill that actually does anything, will not be punished by the left for their laziness. But a legislator who fights actual battles, and causes legislation to be passed that moves the country in some tangibly leftward direction, will not be rewarded for it - they will be tarred with the difference between that legislation and a perfectly ideal conception of what it should be, as if that ideal were a real thing and the bill they passed were a movement to the right for not living up to it.

This is an illustration of the quixotic, monkish, fantasy-based solipsism in American left-wing politics. It's a mentality that is self-satisfied with inaction - because inaction doesn't disturb the tranquil contemplation of ideal absolutes - while the rigors of actual governance are resigned to right-wing politicians and moderates. Think about this scenario:

Let's say that only 40% of the people have healthcare. The left says 100% of the people should have healthcare. Every once in a while, left-wing politicians introduce legislation (that never leaves committee) providing healthcare to 100% of the people. The fact that these bills never pass does not register with them or their base - the mere symbolic act of advocating them is considered an achievement in itself, sufficient and perfect, because the reality that no one is actually getting healthcare because of them is considered immaterial. None of these politicians are penalized by their base for doing nothing to actually create healthcare for real people - in fact, they're rewarded for "standing firm" in the face of reality.

Now suppose a pragmatic liberal politician gets a bill passed that increases the percentage of people with healthcare from 50% to 80%, and this is the first time in, say, thirty years that anyone has significantly increased the proportion of people with healthcare. Any remotely sane progressive would be over the Moon at this accomplishment, doubling the provision of healthcare to the American people, right? But in the negative psychology of the American left, that's not what just happened: That bill did not just double healthcare, it cut it from 100% down to 80%. And thus the liberal politician who just saved millions of lives is not a liberal at all, but some kind of Republican Lite or corrupt Betrayer who "sold out" the remaining 20% in some kind of smoke-filled backroom deal with cigar-smoking Mayflower descendents.

And...this is not an exaggeration of how left-wing politics in America thinks. It's the exact picture. I'm not saying that everyone on the left is guilty of this, or guilty to an equal extent, but it is the general environment. The American left operates like a set of monastic orders, not a political movement. It retreats from the world and from messy reality, content in impotence, seeing it as preferable to guard ideas from the dangers of practical trials than to participate in a "profane" and "corrupt" system that can't possibly do them justice. Needless to say, this is a perfect recipe for self-inflicted under-representation and irrelevance - more perfect than anything the other side could possibly design.

It is, in essence, a Loser Factory: A set of attitudes and cultural prejudices that turn humanistic ideals against themselves, and make people who could do the most end up doing the least. It takes away vital public support from politicians who try to achieve things, making them instead targets of the very people they try to serve, and make useless rhetoric machines incapable of political accomplishment into heroes. There seems to be no analytical ability to distinguish between real liberal achievers and people who legitimately deserve the title of "sellout," and the result is that the latter are empowered because insultingly pitiful fig leaf accomplishments still feed more people than Noam Chomsky monographs recited to empty committee rooms.

While the left is characteristically fractious everywhere, in Europe it actually has an interest in governing. Relative to our version, it definitely rewards its leaders for winning elections and passing legislation, instead of treating these accomplishments as grounds for suspicion. There are all the same ideals and kaleidoscopic interest groups, but except for the most impotently and irrelevantly radical of them, they don't jealously withhold their ideals from practical politics like some kind of sacred idol - they try to demonstrate their ideals in practice so that other people can see the benefits, and build networks of political support to continue and grow their programs.

When a left-wing leader is elected in Europe, their first order of business is coalition-building to navigate their agenda into effect. They find out who's who and what's what, and figure out how to make something happen. In the United States, it's more like "Well, I'm going to be a tireless advocate for thus-and-such, and if they won't listen, that's their problem." There's no recognition that being a politician (they despise the very word, let alone the concept) is their job, not being a motionless totem pole to symbolically represent their agenda. If you added 20 exact copies of Dennis Kucinich to the House of Representatives, they still wouldn't do anything, because zero times twenty is still zero.

That's why in America the issues we support, that have the backing of huge majorities of the people, are treated in politics like a radical agenda: Because our left doesn't merely disbelieve in the union of ideals and practical achievement, it won't allow it. Achievement, for all intents and purposes, is the enemy. Achievement is a distraction from basking in moral perfection. So leaders who want to achieve cannot count on support from the left. It can be had briefly, but it cannot form a stable base. There is nothing to gain over the long-term by trying to form a solid political alliance with the left in America - it doesn't reward those who serve it, and does reward those who sabotage it. Like a battered wife, it only feels at home in utter powerlessness, and resents anyone who challenges its comfortable resignation.

The worst part isn't that the American left likes to elect weaklings - it's that they turn against leaders who prove to be strong, almost like clockwork. If you go to any of the more stridently ideological discussion forums and tell the people there that President Barack Obama is a liberal progressive, they're absolutely scandalized by this statement. In their world, opening up healthcare to tens of millions of more Americans, opening the military to gays, preventing war with Iran, using Executive Orders to advance all sorts of labor and environmental objectives, etc. etc. - these things are not liberal achievements because (as with the 100% vs. 80% example above) there is some divergence with a perfect, ideal system that never existed.

Obama halted the march to war with Iran in its tracks and opened up diplomacy, but because the US still wages war somewhere, on some level, he's Dick Cheney. We have Obamacare, but because it involves mandates and private health insurers rather than a purely public system, it's the same as doing nothing and letting millions die from lack of healthcare. Then there's the ever-present "What has he done for us lately?" which never seems to acknowledge the existence of the other two branches of government, like if Obama were a true liberal President, he would magically overcome a bottomlessly corrupt GOP Congress by the sheer force of his progressive piety.

The attention paid by the American left to a subject tends to be inversely proportional to its own influence over it, so Congress - which we can affect much more quickly and effectively than any other aspect of the federal government - gets short shrift in these conversations. When it decides (usually erroneously) that the White House is failing to meet its obligations, does the American left then say "Hey, there's a midterm election coming up, let's take over Congress and force the Executive branch to the left from another branch"? Of course not. Because achievement is the enemy.

An achievement-oriented, left-dominated Congress would be extremely effectual - far more so even than having a liberal President - and yet that goal makes a vanishingly small element of political activism and conversation on the left. It would be so effectual that the other two branches, even if in the hands of the radical right, would be constantly on the defensive: A right-wing Republican (but I repeat myself) in the White House would have to practically automate the process of vetoes, and would frequently be overridden; and the Lawless Five on the Supreme Court would have to be in session 24/7 to strike down all the progressive legislation, probably resulting in some Constitutional amendments passing to override them or at least check their radical judicial abuses of power.

So, in summary, this is why the American left is far less effective than the European left:

1. Self-absorbed and insular, waiting for the country to come to it rather than acting as bold missionaries for its values.

2. Flighty and abstract, obsessing on symbols and feelings while treating objective judgment and logic as profane.

3. A negative self-definition that unjustly concedes the moral substance of American culture to false right-wing definitions.

4. Rewards dereliction by political leaders who fill the void of accomplishment with ineffectual symbolic advocacy.

5. Punishes leaders who produce tangible achievements by obsessing on flaws as measured against nonexistent fantasy programs rather than against the preceding state of affairs.

6. Virtually ignores Congress - the most effectual branch of government to control - in favor of obsessing on the Executive Branch.

7. Instinctively prefers the personal freedom of being inconsequential over the moral dangers of governing effectively.


If you see any of this in yourself, address it and you will - by however small a measure - make the country a better place, make better decisions as a citizen, and probably be more effective as an activist.

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tl;dr leeroysphitz Oct 2014 #1
Go back and read it, then comment. Or do neither. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #3
I scanned it Warpy Oct 2014 #35
It's not War and Peace. Read the OP like a grownup, then get back to me. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #46
Answering th OP question fadedrose Oct 2014 #193
You didn't miss much. Kalidurga Oct 2014 #201
america is a country that desperately wants to believe in fairey tales. KG Oct 2014 #2
Belief isn't the problem. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #4
What a pantload. 99Forever Oct 2014 #5
Any substantive criticism, or did you just want to confirm my point? True Blue Door Oct 2014 #6
You got all you deserve. 99Forever Oct 2014 #9
... scarletwoman Oct 2014 #11
you get a rainbow! nashville_brook Oct 2014 #18
You've said nothing. treestar Oct 2014 #22
Your President, from the Left, is what we would think of as Centre-Right. mr blur Oct 2014 #104
In the USA I am to the left Quantess Oct 2014 #139
And oh look, *crickets* Starry Messenger Oct 2014 #183
non-responsive treestar Oct 2014 #194
You have nothing to say. Your comment is a perfect example of my point. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #36
aggressively attacking posters does nothing to improve your OP nashville_brook Oct 2014 #49
Can you suggest a more constructive response to someone True Blue Door Oct 2014 #57
Your post is entirely self describing AgingAmerican Oct 2014 #52
And you just said "I know you are, but what am I?" Thanks for playing. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #58
And you react negatively to, and lash out at, all criticism AgingAmerican Oct 2014 #61
The OP is criticism that you can't handle. Irony fail. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #66
The OP is a pantload AgingAmerican Oct 2014 #67
Then why haven't any of you even tried to "debunk" it? True Blue Door Oct 2014 #71
You are doing a fine job of it yourself AgingAmerican Oct 2014 #72
Dismissing it in its entirety without explanation is "the slightest criticism"? True Blue Door Oct 2014 #76
You mean flushing it? AgingAmerican Oct 2014 #80
I mean trolling. I.e., what you're doing. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #93
Centrism will always fail AgingAmerican Oct 2014 #77
Centrism isn't relevant to this discussion. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #96
If your position is neither Centrist nor Leftist, what is it? AgingAmerican Oct 2014 #185
Rational. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #212
... 99Forever Oct 2014 #73
LOL! True Blue Door Oct 2014 #94
I have zero idea what you are babbling on about ... 99Forever Oct 2014 #98
Umm, I'm "babbling" about the article cited in the post you linked to. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #160
My guess AgingAmerican Oct 2014 #186
sounds like it was written by somebody who came into office as a youngish progressive nashville_brook Oct 2014 #7
Then how come the left doesn't get anything done? treestar Oct 2014 #12
i've been seeing "the left" get LOTS done -- paid sick time, raise the wage, and GOTV nashville_brook Oct 2014 #16
In the 60s? treestar Oct 2014 #20
i don't know about where you live (maybe you're all online) nashville_brook Oct 2014 #33
No, that would be here and now by lefties, at least on the 'left coast.' suffragette Oct 2014 #84
I've seen the liberal leaders whom the left constantly trashes get those things done. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #38
So you are a right winger? AgingAmerican Oct 2014 #53
Non sequitur. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #62
You loathe the left AgingAmerican Oct 2014 #64
I loathe individual people who care more about their egos than about other people. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #68
Reacting to the reaction AgingAmerican Oct 2014 #69
Exactly. The OP is a reaction to present circumstances, and argues for changing them. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #70
What do you think the LGBT rights advances came from, the right? Centrists who nattered about Bluenorthwest Oct 2014 #25
precisely. there's no "there there" in centrism. nashville_brook Oct 2014 #37
Here's the problem. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #56
Well, first time I've seen a straw dolphin. suffragette Oct 2014 #88
My point was that these things had been "pushed for" by the left for decades. Ineffectually. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #95
The state senator I vote for every time is consistently the most progressive one in my state. suffragette Oct 2014 #106
That's great. Promote her to higher office. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #163
Yep. QC Oct 2014 #13
if you don't love republican policy from a "progressive" label, nashville_brook Oct 2014 #17
It's still progress. treestar Oct 2014 #23
Do you not give the slightest of shits about the millions of Americans True Blue Door Oct 2014 #27
FYI, they have health insurance, not health care. truebluegreen Oct 2014 #43
And food stamps are not food. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #63
Are you claiming the two are equivalent? truebluegreen Oct 2014 #115
I'm claiming that "x is not y" is not a logical argument that "x < y". True Blue Door Oct 2014 #164
I am overwhelmed by your erudition truebluegreen Oct 2014 #167
Can't help missing what isn't there. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #182
*sigh* truebluegreen Oct 2014 #184
The distinction is just a matter of degree. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #213
Um, no. truebluegreen Oct 2014 #225
It's not equivalent. It's a means. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #227
This really shouldn't be so difficult to understand. truebluegreen Oct 2014 #231
They have health insurance, not health care. QC Oct 2014 #47
Then accomplish something better. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #78
I love the fact I finally got my teeth taken care of thanks to Obamacare. Too bad you only care KittyWampus Oct 2014 #42
That must mean your teeth are right-wing sellouts! :D True Blue Door Oct 2014 #79
Yet another comment that has nothing whatsoever to do with the OP. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #28
You are describing your own reaction AgingAmerican Oct 2014 #54
Once again, "I know you are, but what am I?" is not a rebuttal. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #82
Again AgingAmerican Oct 2014 #91
And again, you're trolling childish retorts because you have no rational arguments to make. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #157
Again AgingAmerican Oct 2014 #205
But you haven't disagreed with me, just insulted me. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #214
The OP is a fact free load of crap AgingAmerican Oct 2014 #234
I noticed that, too. Marr Oct 2014 #151
There is no 'American Left' leftstreet Oct 2014 #8
Exactly. polichick Oct 2014 #19
You don't consider yourself American? True Blue Door Oct 2014 #29
LOL n/t leftstreet Oct 2014 #118
Well, which is it? Do you not consider yourself American, or do you not consider yourself Left? True Blue Door Oct 2014 #155
Excellent. A lot of the left needs to hear that. treestar Oct 2014 #10
A lot of people on the left demand to be ignored. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #89
Less than 100% equals 0% FrodosPet Oct 2014 #14
The first part is indeed their attitude. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #30
Because Europe's media isn't owned in its entirety by five billionaires, like it is in the US. PSPS Oct 2014 #15
Because they have a government that wouldn't allow it. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #31
I would argue that the "American Left" you describe never existed... brooklynite Oct 2014 #21
As long as they are completely without influence, fine treestar Oct 2014 #24
That might be. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #32
How many mechanics; how many factory workers; how many miners LuvLoogie Oct 2014 #60
That's a fair and important criticism. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #92
This is very true. Thanks for bringing it up. appalachiablue Oct 2014 #123
My history professor a few semesters back had never heard of Blair Mountain. Brigid Oct 2014 #138
Pretty bad. This is takeover of education/history by RW in 35 yrs., corporate media, dumbed down. appalachiablue Oct 2014 #146
It's not "the left" here that most often trashes blue collar workers Fumesucker Oct 2014 #219
No backing from the established party. Zephyr Teachout, Barbara Buono who were Both sound contenders adirondacker Oct 2014 #26
So you're saying they didn't know they would be fought by big money? True Blue Door Oct 2014 #34
Yes, silly candidates - they ran on issues, not ass-kissing. djean111 Oct 2014 #41
And to you that's enough, but not to anyone who actually needs help from the government. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #97
"If it's all about money and return on investment and stock shares and all that, adirondacker Oct 2014 #45
The bullshit is only going to get heavier and heavier and more voluminous when the 2014 djean111 Oct 2014 #50
If there are no primary contenders, whose fault would that be? True Blue Door Oct 2014 #99
I agree with Moyers, but I don't see how this relates to what we're discussing. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #100
the OP displays a conveniently limited view of contemporary politics. nashville_brook Oct 2014 #40
Another recent thread explains who to Blame when the shit hits the fan... adirondacker Oct 2014 #51
Mmmmm - Lefty punching - it's what's for breakfast! djean111 Oct 2014 #39
also, watch what happens when left congress folk try to form coalitions with libertarian Rs nashville_brook Oct 2014 #44
Good point dumbcat Oct 2014 #81
Ludicrous accusation. Constructive, rational criticism = "lefty punching." Sheer insecurity. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #102
What a load of crap AgingAmerican Oct 2014 #48
You didn't even read the OP. You've made that clear, now stop spamming. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #103
Sure, if you say so, uhuh, that must me it! AgingAmerican Oct 2014 #105
I read it. He's right. So, who's spamming whom? BillZBubb Oct 2014 #121
Sorry, I don't buy it. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #125
I thought you were going to tell us how the European Left differs. eShirl Oct 2014 #55
I guess you stopped reading before this point: True Blue Door Oct 2014 #108
I did miss that in my scan of that wall of text, yes. eShirl Oct 2014 #207
Maybe you should scan less and actually read things. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #215
This is pure fantasy MFrohike Oct 2014 #59
And still they're more effective than the American left. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #109
Uh, no? BlindTiresias Oct 2014 #116
I'm well aware of the political situation in Europe. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #126
Hell of a choice MFrohike Oct 2014 #159
Democracy is the least awful system of government. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #166
It is TL/DR....but why do you think the "European Left" is so successful? They aren't. MADem Oct 2014 #65
This may be presently true laundry_queen Oct 2014 #83
The rightward trajectory in Europe isn't new--and it's concerning, I think. MADem Oct 2014 #107
The far right made gains in one election. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #110
Which are being reversed! BlindTiresias Oct 2014 #117
They would have to be reversed quite a long ways to become like our systems. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #127
Decades? Berlusconi and Sarkozy were progressive? Merkel is a rightie. Le Pen almost won in France. MADem Oct 2014 #119
Believe me, I'm not a Eurofanboy. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #128
There are serious cracks in that armor. They aren't new, and they are getting worse, not better. MADem Oct 2014 #192
Progress is not a straight line, so there were bound to be reversals for Europe. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #216
Progress may not be a straight line, but when the entire region, pretty much, screams MADem Oct 2014 #221
Well written. My right-wing cousin... LuvLoogie Oct 2014 #74
I use the term "trustafarians." True Blue Door Oct 2014 #113
Well, I read some of it laundry_queen Oct 2014 #75
Thank you. Excellent post. (nt) scarletwoman Oct 2014 #85
Excellent points. thucythucy Oct 2014 #101
So should there be restrictions on the media? treestar Oct 2014 #122
Well, generally laundry_queen Oct 2014 #196
I don't know where those conclusions come from. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #124
Well, I have no idea where your conclusions come from. laundry_queen Oct 2014 #197
I would agree, and take it further Savannahmann Oct 2014 #86
1200 hate radio stations owned, run, and staffed by the looniest of the loony right. Complete Doctor_J Oct 2014 #87
We complain about all that propaganda, but what do we do about it? True Blue Door Oct 2014 #130
It was self-described Centrists who sat out the last election. Marr Oct 2014 #148
Just stop with the slander already. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #153
Slander? lol-- ok, I just realized you're trolling. Marr Oct 2014 #154
Which one of us accused the other being a centrist True Blue Door Oct 2014 #168
AUTOMATED MESSAGE: Results of your Jury Service LostOne4Ever Oct 2014 #171
Thanks for posting that. Marr Oct 2014 #189
This may be the best post that I have ever read on DU. Yavin4 Oct 2014 #90
Seems to have pissed off quite a few people who see themselves reflected in it. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #131
Yep. And now that you realize that, take the insults (because there was no discussion Number23 Oct 2014 #152
Oh, I do. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #169
The Left has to fight a coalition (or, Devil's Brew) now of Republicans and 3rd Way Democrats. Tierra_y_Libertad Oct 2014 #111
that's it exactly. As soon as Obama and the rest of the DINOs support Sanders instead of PHARMA, Doctor_J Oct 2014 #132
Only because it refuses to form its own coalitions. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #134
So, the Democrats should form coalitions with the Left instead of the quasi-Republican "moderates". Tierra_y_Libertad Oct 2014 #142
That depends on what the left wants to do, doesn't it? True Blue Door Oct 2014 #150
Unfortunately, the party seems very comfortable with it's right wing pals and beneficiaries. Tierra_y_Libertad Oct 2014 #158
The Democratic Party leadership will align with the left True Blue Door Oct 2014 #170
The left will align itself with the Party when it proves itself a reliabale friend Tierra_y_Libertad Oct 2014 #187
The left isn't in a position to cop that attitude. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #217
If the Left is so "ineffective" why does it get blamed when the Democrats lose? Tierra_y_Libertad Oct 2014 #229
Best of the best,TBD and you Wellstone ruled Oct 2014 #112
Yes, Wellstone was definitely one of the last humanist titans in the federal government. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #135
You mean like the way we punished Liz Warren and Bernie Sanders for being effective legislators? pa28 Oct 2014 #114
Can you support the claim that Warren and Sanders are effective legislators? True Blue Door Oct 2014 #136
Sure. pa28 Oct 2014 #204
They certainly contribute in ways where individual work is involved. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #218
Who owns the media in Europe? nt valerief Oct 2014 #120
I don't know. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #137
Really, your whole argument boils down to, 'I hate you whiny, lazy hippies'. Marr Oct 2014 #129
Who hates liberals more - Limpballs or the BOG? Doctor_J Oct 2014 #133
Tough call is right. Marr Oct 2014 #144
Laughable, alternate universe accusation. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #141
Is this really all you've got? Just grade school whining? Marr Oct 2014 #143
Read the damn OP. Pay particular attention to the concluding summary. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #147
Oh, I read it. And again, you're only whining-- in the summary, too. Marr Oct 2014 #149
Utter nonsense. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #172
Let's start with that one then. Marr Oct 2014 #188
You nailed it. And in return you're getting very little discussion. wyldwolf Oct 2014 #140
Humoring idiots is the cross liberals bear for protecting the weak. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #145
+ a million Number23 Oct 2014 #156
Over a half century of demonization of 'communists' and 'socialists' Erich Bloodaxe BSN Oct 2014 #161
More passing the buck. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #174
Uh huh. So this was just flame bait. Erich Bloodaxe BSN Oct 2014 #176
Pure non sequitur. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #179
If you actually mean that Erich Bloodaxe BSN Oct 2014 #180
The left bears a lot of responsibility for right-wing victories. Denying that would be dishonest. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #190
Why should anyone take this seriously? You offer no evidence for anything you say. Vattel Oct 2014 #162
Please, offer an example of something you dispute. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #175
One word: Race Kingofalldems Oct 2014 #165
Yes, as sickening as it is to realize. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #177
Palmer raids, McCarthyism, political assassinations, COINTELPRO from without deutsey Oct 2014 #173
Because it's content with the excuses provided by history and the status quo. True Blue Door Oct 2014 #178
This is such garbage. Starry Messenger Oct 2014 #181
Still nothing but a pantload. 99Forever Oct 2014 #191
Why? Simple Spider Jerusalem Oct 2014 #195
"European countries are much more homogeneous". Dead wrong. Yavin4 Oct 2014 #202
Yes, they are. Spider Jerusalem Oct 2014 #206
You know...you should publish this. It speaks truth to me...if not "truth" at least reality. nt kelliekat44 Oct 2014 #198
The European left is effective because Harmony Blue Oct 2014 #199
To break it all down ONE reason: Blue_Tires Oct 2014 #200
The American Left does not want to do the hard work of consensus building Yavin4 Oct 2014 #203
Here is why the American left is not as strong as the European lefty. JDPriestly Oct 2014 #208
This post is preposterous with the rise of the ultra-nationalists in the EU. joshcryer Oct 2014 #209
I'm trying to point that out, pretty much, and getting the "Well but it's a continuum" argument in MADem Oct 2014 #222
The EU hasn't been "more progressive" since Brazilian beef. joshcryer Oct 2014 #224
Points! MADem Oct 2014 #233
Three! Words! Tarheel_Dem Oct 2014 #210
The US has a far weaker labor movement and a 99% seriously divided by racism eridani Oct 2014 #211
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world.. Fumesucker Oct 2014 #220
I suppose if we simply define what would be considered center-right everywhere else in the western Douglas Carpenter Oct 2014 #223
Because the right wing here in America is in charge, Jamastiene Oct 2014 #226
Wanna buy a bridge to nowhere? 50 grand down, with a no money back Zorra Oct 2014 #228
Your op and responses show..... NCTraveler Oct 2014 #230
Got it almost completely right whatthehey Oct 2014 #232
K&R Jamaal510 Jun 2015 #235
Well it seems you insist on pushing your agenda on what you think a liberal/leftist is so.. Kalidurga Jun 2015 #236
This message was self-deleted by its author Maedhros Jun 2015 #237
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