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Babel_17

(5,400 posts)

31. "someone in a country without permission" isn't going to cut it, imo

Tue Apr 2, 2013, 06:48 PM

Apr 2013

The writer of that piece really danced around this hard to write about issue but that was the only terminology for referring to people, not their actions, he could come up with.

That is inadequate imo. "someone in a country without permission" won't be viable.

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‘Illegal immigrant’ no more [View all] Starry Messenger Apr 2013 OP

So what's the appropriate noun to describe these people? ZOB Apr 2013 #1

Probably not "these people"... LooseWilly Apr 2013 #2

Sensitive much? ZOB Apr 2013 #17

"Obviously" ... now who's being much-sensitive? LooseWilly Apr 2013 #43

I don't look to "Tropic Thunder" for language lessons. ZOB Apr 2013 #49

Obviously you don't look to "Tropic Thunder" for language lessons... and it shows. LooseWilly Apr 2013 #54

If you drive without an operator's license, you ARE an "illegal driver". ZOB Apr 2013 #55

If you read "speed" as "drive without an operator's license" I can see why you insist on simplicity LooseWilly Apr 2013 #64

Speeding does not make you an "illegal driver". Murder does not make you an "illegal immigrant". ZOB Apr 2013 #65

It looks like ZOB won't be back anytime soon. Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #66

I tried to show him the wisdom of "Tropic Thunder"... but he wouldn't listen LooseWilly Apr 2013 #70

I don't think people are quite his thing. Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #71

I can't wait for the news media to start reporting on... alp227 Apr 2013 #78

Uninvited Extended Stay Guest NightWatcher Apr 2013 #3

A little wordy, but as good a name as any, I guess. ZOB Apr 2013 #19

Yes. Iggo Apr 2013 #51

"So what's the appropriate noun to describe these people?" UnrepentantLiberal Apr 2013 #52

ICE still uses that term & "illegal alien", while DHS uses "unauthorized immigrant" alp227 Apr 2013 #77

More gobbledegook so we will all sound like politicians campaigning, with the effect that no one can RC Apr 2013 #4

Or not have to read racist news stories. Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #5

What does race have to do with this? Nothing. RC Apr 2013 #9

History is passing you by. Too bad. Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #10

What are we supposed to call them? Criminals? RC Apr 2013 #11

Here's a start: Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #12

Which goes back to my original question in my first post. RC Apr 2013 #15

I think AP covers that in the rest of the story at the link. Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #18

I did read it. RC Apr 2013 #22

I guess you could email them for clarification. Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #24

This might be part of the problem. RC Apr 2013 #26

They are writing stories with better description. Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #28

Don't bother LittleBlue Apr 2013 #41

Well you would certainly know what that feels like n/t RZM Apr 2013 #42

You mean watching a small section of racist speech end? Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #45

Well, that certainly is a well reasoned comment... and ironic coming from a "historian" LooseWilly Apr 2013 #47

Gosh, six hours later and no snappy comeback. Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #72

+100. Skip Intro Apr 2013 #30

By your flawed reasoning... TroglodyteScholar Apr 2013 #7

There's always some pushback when you take away a widely used slur. Iggo Apr 2013 #67

But Immigration & Customs Enforcement still uses "illegal immigrant" and "illegal alien". alp227 Apr 2013 #79

By your logic, if I sped to get "here" then I am "not here legally", so I am "an illegal" LooseWilly Apr 2013 #57

gee, it sucks not being able to use hate speech datasuspect Apr 2013 #81

Yeah, so instead of using simple descriptive words, we use long gobbledegook sentences RC Apr 2013 #83

Good! "Illegal" should not be used to describe a person whether they have broken driving laws pampango Apr 2013 #6

Yes. The depersonalizing term is connected to the rise of hate crimes against Latinos. Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #8

Seems like a half measure StrayKat Apr 2013 #13

It's part of a broader change to their entire Stylebook. Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #16

Well, it sort of does. StrayKat Apr 2013 #20

That would be cool. Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #23

How about ... Babel_17 Apr 2013 #25

I'm not sure. StrayKat Apr 2013 #33

Editors in the media, from college newspapers to ... the AP, use the stylebook as Law LooseWilly Apr 2013 #48

How about, "Unconfirmed" Babel_17 Apr 2013 #14

They go into detail at the end on what terminology they intend to use Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #21

"someone in a country without permission" isn't going to cut it, imo Babel_17 Apr 2013 #31

I'm not sure what to tell you. Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #34

No problem, and thanks for posting this thread (nt) Babel_17 Apr 2013 #35

My pleasure. :) nt. Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #37

I don't think it'll be a big problem for most writers... unless they're simply limited by space. LooseWilly Apr 2013 #50

Nice examples. Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #53

How about "Chris McSmith, who lives in ...... won the powerball" SoCalDem Apr 2013 #75

You present a fine point... though I wrote that lede to specifically make it a relevant point. LooseWilly Apr 2013 #76

Even tax implications are no one's business but the giver & the receiver SoCalDem Apr 2013 #80

Heh, maybe we should just do away with the media entirely and all entertain each other with lively LooseWilly Apr 2013 #82

A person cannot be 'illegal', an action can Cal Carpenter Apr 2013 #27

I agree. Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #29

The worst is when people simply say 'illegals' Cal Carpenter Apr 2013 #40

I was amazed too, I don't watch TV Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #44

If you're in a country illegally, are you actually an 'immigrant'? War Horse Apr 2013 #32

I think that it depends on how long you plan on staying. Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #36

Gotcha :) War Horse Apr 2013 #39

So they'll stop talking about illegal guns then? kudzu22 Apr 2013 #38

The first line of the story says "people" Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #46

Crack is not an action either... LooseWilly Apr 2013 #59

No matter how many times the Niceguy1 Apr 2013 #56

You'll have to take that up with AP. Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #58

and when you dont have a lot of space? Niceguy1 Apr 2013 #60

AP seems to be of the reasoned opinion that the pixels will not be too crowded. Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #61

it all boils down to Niceguy1 Apr 2013 #62

I'm sure they'll take that under advisement. Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #63

Wow. The ultimate in political correctness. Deeming a term offensive without naming a replacement. Nye Bevan Apr 2013 #68

Hmm. Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #69

It's not political correctness, in the context of the AP style guide, to "nix" a term LooseWilly Apr 2013 #73

One option would be to just use a person's name SoCalDem Apr 2013 #74