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Robb

(39,665 posts)
99. I was on a first-name basis with around 20 live-music club owners in SF in the 1990s.
Sun Feb 10, 2013, 06:35 PM
Feb 2013

BMI/ASCAP harassment came up frequently. Every one of them thought of it as a shake-down. And it went down just like the pizza place story above.

That's my 2 cents.

BMI should be paying singers to promote songs randr Feb 2013 #1
So, can we sue BMI for releasing shitty music? Uben Feb 2013 #2
So there is NO song in the BMI catalog that you like. Wow, amazing. n-t Logical Feb 2013 #12
You do understand that BMI is a copyright agency and it does not "release" songs. Walk away Feb 2013 #126
Oh please.... defacto7 Feb 2013 #133
First of all, not all composers are performers. They may only make money from their creations. Walk away Feb 2013 #171
You certainly are passionate about your position. defacto7 Feb 2013 #174
And I object to people using other people's property to make money in a ... Walk away Feb 2013 #176
You have some good points. defacto7 Feb 2013 #182
Yet more BMI bullshit! n/t RKP5637 Feb 2013 #3
Yep. Even amateurs get hit with these lawsuits. mainer Feb 2013 #4
In the late 70s, I worked at at Pizza Shop/Bar in Pgh. I was there the day.... Junkdrawer Feb 2013 #5
Someone needs to go after BMI for racketeering. RC Feb 2013 #6
I suspect BMI pays protection money too ThoughtCriminal Feb 2013 #8
You do realize that BMI is a not for profit company that represents song writers rights. Walk away Feb 2013 #128
SEE post 133 defacto7 Feb 2013 #135
See post #169 Walk away Feb 2013 #172
I picture Mozart presenting an opera in a theater, amateur musicians singing it JDPriestly Feb 2013 #154
Composers deserve to make "a little" money for their life's work???? Walk away Feb 2013 #169
I think that suing bar owners for presenting a composer's music played by amateur JDPriestly Feb 2013 #180
The artists only see pennies on the dollar. RC Feb 2013 #157
Do you think the behavior described in post 5 is OK? 2ndAmForComputers Feb 2013 #158
It does seem like a shakedown muriel_volestrangler Feb 2013 #7
Less and less and less venues for young musicians.... Junkdrawer Feb 2013 #9
not to mention that with karaoke, money has already been paid, both by the company that made HiPointDem Feb 2013 #94
Protection racket. Pay protection money or they bust up your business. nt tblue37 Feb 2013 #80
Thats exactly what it is. HooptieWagon Feb 2013 #91
That IS racketeering. defacto7 Feb 2013 #130
I have a music publishing company... GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #10
People want free stuff, even on the DU. It amazes me that people think BMI should not.... Logical Feb 2013 #11
You know the juke box isn't free. You have to pay. Cleita Feb 2013 #14
Most artists who are not on the level of Beyonce, Justin Bieber or... GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #18
Really, on the radio, the TV and the Juke Box, which most saloon owners don't own but Cleita Feb 2013 #20
Most artist are never covered during open mic night, mostly A list artist hits. Exultant Democracy Feb 2013 #81
Why should someone get to play their music with no compensation? No different than someone using.... Logical Feb 2013 #19
Because if someone uses your photo or graphic art in a book or a magazine you get paid for it. Cleita Feb 2013 #22
The band is being played to play the music. They play popular music. Thus they are making money.... Logical Feb 2013 #36
Then shouldn't the band pay instead of the bar? (nt) The Straight Story Feb 2013 #39
Logical. Sometimes you show a pretty big lack of it and this is one of these times. Cleita Feb 2013 #40
LOL, you call your rambling 'logic'? I am subjects to billboard I don't want to see... Logical Feb 2013 #44
You know what's legal is not always moral. So try again. Cleita Feb 2013 #48
And some libraries LEND CDs which is fine. But you want a band to be able to play someones... Logical Feb 2013 #53
Buh bye. Cleita Feb 2013 #59
That explains a lot. You should have led with that and saved us both a lot of time. n-t Logical Feb 2013 #85
That's exactly what they want, Cleita. Their greed has blinded them to the inevitable end of Egalitarian Thug Feb 2013 #57
I am sorry, but you have no clue... GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #49
When it comes to BMI or MCI I do know, and you know from the content of your post Cleita Feb 2013 #50
Yes, I receive royalty payments from BMI... GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #66
The fact is they can't keep track of it at that street level, so they are keeping most of the Cleita Feb 2013 #71
So, I'd be better off withdrawing my catalog... GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #73
I don't know what you should do as like with everything in this corporate Cleita Feb 2013 #74
is your catalog played by bar bands in 50-seat venues? or sung on open mic nights by joe schmoe HiPointDem Feb 2013 #142
ASCAP (American Society of Composers, Authors and Publishers) and BMI (Broadcast Music, HiPointDem Feb 2013 #113
I know, but I HAVE received royalties through BMI... GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #117
You can't play your own BMI registered music in locations that don't pay BMI... ThatCoffeeLady Apr 2015 #184
Wow! You've dredged up this over 2 year old thread... GReedDiamond Apr 2015 #185
Hello ~ ThatCoffeeLady In_The_Wind Apr 2015 #186
Exactly! HooptieWagon Feb 2013 #164
I know that pain all too well. EnviroBat Feb 2013 #165
not on open mic night barbtries Feb 2013 #102
So, those of us who can sit down a play a tune we have heard. Should we play royalties JDPriestly Feb 2013 #155
But the royalties don't go to the writer of the song being covered. HooptieWagon Feb 2013 #167
Yes, and the mostly lip-service paid to non-corporate, indie music... GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #16
what's the name of your band. I'll look for your stuff. If you don't want to post it please KittyWampus Feb 2013 #23
Most people don't come to DU for the music so I can understand why your ad didn't get a Cleita Feb 2013 #27
Yes, I agree completely with what you say here... GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #31
amateurs performing popular songs in taverns have never been subject to fees from song-publishing HiPointDem Feb 2013 #60
Do you think the behavior described in post 5 is OK? 2ndAmForComputers Feb 2013 #159
+1 graham4anything Feb 2013 #29
I'm not against musicians being paid, only when they keep getting paid over and over Cleita Feb 2013 #35
It's not about Madonna & the Stones. It's about the .99999% who you never heard of. graham4anything Feb 2013 #51
So how does making a rural bar pay a license for nothing in exchange help those musicians? Cleita Feb 2013 #54
Exactly. HooptieWagon Feb 2013 #58
Nothing in exchange? They make $$$ selling food and drinks at their place graham4anything Feb 2013 #62
The idea of owning a bar is to make money, but it's a Main Street type of operation, Cleita Feb 2013 #67
Unfortunately, it doesn't matter if they play songs in public domain. HooptieWagon Feb 2013 #106
so funny. the musicians don't get but a fraction of the price. it's mostly overhead to the money HiPointDem Feb 2013 #61
as an example-Do you give away your services for free in whatever job you do or have done? graham4anything Feb 2013 #78
the majority of song royalties go to the moneymen, not the writers. and it's the moneymen pushing HiPointDem Feb 2013 #84
Whatever. graham4anything Feb 2013 #86
wouldn't want the moneymen not to get their vig. HiPointDem Feb 2013 #88
I myself have asked at places if royalties are paid. And made a call. Because fair is fair. graham4anything Feb 2013 #97
yeah, the music mafia even tried to extort the girl scout songbook. because, you know, the HiPointDem Feb 2013 #122
What union keeps 95% of the revenue generated by its members, HooptieWagon Feb 2013 #166
Very good points, thanks...nt. GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #70
I was on a first-name basis with around 20 live-music club owners in SF in the 1990s. Robb Feb 2013 #99
OK. So, as I've requested before... GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #100
The difference here is in how you receive income compared to most dmallind Feb 2013 #173
I appreciate your reasoned, thoughtful response, which is encouraging... GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #183
I hate those people. They suck money out of bar owners for music that is even played on the Cleita Feb 2013 #13
It's not, nor ever was about copyright infringement. Initech Feb 2013 #28
This has been going on since the sixties and seventies when I was a bartender and Cleita Feb 2013 #30
How soon before individuals are hit with a lawsuit for singing while walking down the street, MadHound Feb 2013 #15
If you were making money at something like a hot dog cart for instances, they Cleita Feb 2013 #17
Henry Robbins is an idiot. I have several friends who own nightclubs & even -I- knew you have to pay KittyWampus Feb 2013 #21
Even original talent can get nailed if the BMI mafia come around and say that Cleita Feb 2013 #25
Fuck hiding behind copyright bullshit. It's about maximizing profit margins. Initech Feb 2013 #24
A quote from the linked article... GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #26
Some places operate as neighborhood bars and after you pay the help, other licenses Cleita Feb 2013 #32
The fees also apply to venues with juke boxes... GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #41
It's not affording, it's being forced to buy something you don't want Cleita Feb 2013 #47
I agree. They should be able to pay $7.12 per day. And it seems fair. Ian David Feb 2013 #38
They get paid for their music. Apophis Feb 2013 #46
I am not greedy because I expect to be paid something for my work... GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #52
I'm not saying artists shouldn't get paid. Apophis Feb 2013 #75
OK, if you say so, but... GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #83
that's how songwriters make their livings. do you work for free? spanone Feb 2013 #33
They should make money for writing songs. The artist who plays the song Cleita Feb 2013 #37
I like your response. Apophis Feb 2013 #43
why should you have to pay for the beer? it's gone through the distributor...hasn't it made enough? spanone Feb 2013 #55
Its more like paying for the beer, and then paying to use the urinal. HooptieWagon Feb 2013 #112
See my post a little down thread. HooptieWagon Feb 2013 #56
the songwriters don't get but a fraction of the price anytime their song is performed, even in HiPointDem Feb 2013 #63
Thank you. Most people who criticize BMI have yet to create anything of artistic value wtmusic Feb 2013 #69
Artistic value = money defacto7 Feb 2013 #137
there's not money in it mainly because of the dominance of corporations and organizations like HiPointDem Feb 2013 #144
Are you aware BMI is a non-profit organization? wtmusic Feb 2013 #150
bmi is the enforcement arm of the publishing industry, pure and simple. HiPointDem Feb 2013 #152
This is hilarious. wtmusic Feb 2013 #156
maybe 'publishing industry' isn't the right term; i amend it to 'corporations like time-warner'. HiPointDem Feb 2013 #175
Do you think the behavior described in post 5 is OK? 2ndAmForComputers Feb 2013 #160
What idiots--the music companies are greedy pigs and they need to be checked. MADem Feb 2013 #34
Plenty of ragtime in my neck of the woods. xmas74 Feb 2013 #64
Actually, yes. HooptieWagon Feb 2013 #82
I said "at a child's birthday party" not at a bar. MADem Feb 2013 #87
I know. Performances at home before a limited audience are exempt. HooptieWagon Feb 2013 #89
It's still asinine. Open mic nites are like amateur hour contests, without prizes. MADem Feb 2013 #90
Right on. Ed Suspicious Feb 2013 #129
BMI can go fuck themselves. Apophis Feb 2013 #42
Ha, BMI is far from the worst. Google ASCAP for a litany of thuggery. HooptieWagon Feb 2013 #45
I have dealt with BMI dsc Feb 2013 #65
Thank you for bringing some Reality into this discussion...nt. GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #68
This BMI writer thanks you for your comment. nt wtmusic Feb 2013 #72
How many songs in your chorus' repertoire? Fumesucker Feb 2013 #76
our profits are much less than that of a bar for three months it should be noted dsc Feb 2013 #79
I wasn't really thinking of profits but rather record keeping Fumesucker Feb 2013 #92
I would think a flat fee would be more appropriate dsc Feb 2013 #96
I was thinking more of live music type situation Fumesucker Feb 2013 #98
Live music falls on the performers not the venue dsc Feb 2013 #111
nope, they sue & threaten the bar owners, not the musicians. deeper pockets and more to lose. HiPointDem Feb 2013 #119
If the live group charges admission or charges the bar for playing dsc Feb 2013 #120
the bar owner hires the musicians and controls the door charge, so not sure how the band would HiPointDem Feb 2013 #132
so the band is making money for playing music dsc Feb 2013 #134
i don't know what kind of bands you're talking about, but most bar bands around here (and there HiPointDem Feb 2013 #149
so with karaoke & juke boxes you pay twice: once for the 'records/tape/digital recordings,' + HiPointDem Feb 2013 #148
Good lord. The greed is endless. Buzz Clik Feb 2013 #77
hear, hear! defacto7 Feb 2013 #138
BMI is hiring an army of barflies... Snarkoleptic Feb 2013 #93
aka 'spies' HiPointDem Feb 2013 #95
The bar I help out at a few times a week has polly7 Feb 2013 #101
Yep. And BMI/ASCAP won't sue the musicians, HooptieWagon Feb 2013 #103
That's just scary. polly7 Feb 2013 #105
They seldom go after the musicians, HooptieWagon Feb 2013 #108
I see, thank you for the info. polly7 Feb 2013 #109
$2,600.00 for a year to play anyone's songs period is actually not very much. Lint Head Feb 2013 #104
Thanks Lint Head, this is a tough crowd... GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #107
Most musicians that join bmi/ascap get *nothing*. HiPointDem Feb 2013 #115
I get *something* ... GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #116
most get *nothing*. And publishers take the lion's share. So the claim that taking dinky little HiPointDem Feb 2013 #118
OK so what else do you want me to tell you?... GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #121
"Taking dinky little music venues to court," or threatening them with such, is exactly what they're HiPointDem Feb 2013 #124
Happy Birthday is not the issue here, this is about... GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #127
you didn't debunk anything. & if a venue with 15 audience members & no liquor ain't 'dinky,' HiPointDem Feb 2013 #131
I have already received royalty payments on my BMI registered... GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #136
I made no claims about *you*. I said most get nothing, and that publishers and money men take HiPointDem Feb 2013 #139
Good night, I am tired of your total fucking bullshit... GReedDiamond Feb 2013 #141
"the long goodbye" HiPointDem Feb 2013 #145
Do you think the behavior described in post 5 is OK? 2ndAmForComputers Feb 2013 #163
But BMI is a nonprofit company (unlike ASCAP) and they have programs... Walk away Feb 2013 #177
non-profit is not synonymous with 'good'. it's actually not even synonymous with 'non-profit'. HiPointDem Feb 2013 #178
The amount varies. HooptieWagon Feb 2013 #110
+1. Good assessment. nt Zorra Feb 2013 #125
profit of $2000/night = average? hogwash. HiPointDem Feb 2013 #114
Don't pay the songwriters and musicians and they will go away. defacto7 Feb 2013 #140
actually, it's the opposite. make it impossible for local venues to host live music and musicians HiPointDem Feb 2013 #151
Those are my G, C, and D chords...pay up! Tom Ripley Feb 2013 #123
Once payment is made for use of the chords... Zambero Feb 2013 #146
Sing in the shower? Zambero Feb 2013 #143
bmi has drones for that! HiPointDem Feb 2013 #147
take a look at the place on google maps. it's a low-rent dive across the street from a cornfield. HiPointDem Feb 2013 #153
This message was self-deleted by its author 2ndAmForComputers Feb 2013 #161
In which I describe this thread. 2ndAmForComputers Feb 2013 #162
Are Jagger, Gaga and Sting even aware of this crap? SwissTony Feb 2013 #168
It's not "Mick Jagger, Sting and Lady Gaga suing SomethingFishy Feb 2013 #170
He didn't pay when he should have, and now is pretending to be shocked riqster Feb 2013 #179
you don't 'hire' for an open mike night. HiPointDem Feb 2013 #181
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