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cbdo2007

(9,213 posts)
106. 99% of the posts here don't seem to understand 401ks or pensions and how they work....
Thu Feb 7, 2013, 04:58 PM
Feb 2013

no wonder we're all fucked.

Or maybe I should just go to a board where they understand finance to actually have an intelligent discussion on this subject.

401Ks are a disaster: Column [View all] phantom power Feb 2013 OP
We will have a greater need for social security in the future than we do now because liberal_at_heart Feb 2013 #1
those folk had the rules changed on them mid-game Skittles Feb 2013 #2
my husband and I started out with a company 401(k) liberal_at_heart Feb 2013 #4
401Ks were meant to supplement pensions and social security Skittles Feb 2013 #8
The 90s boom faked ppl out Johonny Feb 2013 #18
actually 401ks were promoted so that they *could* ditch pensions. HiPointDem Feb 2013 #49
Skittles is right. They were originally meant to marybourg Feb 2013 #54
they were promoted to the general public so that pensions could be ditched. HiPointDem Feb 2013 #58
Maybe I have a longer memory than you. marybourg Feb 2013 #59
i doubt it. maybe you are just more naive. HiPointDem Feb 2013 #60
Actually personal experience, and age. marybourg Feb 2013 #68
i also have personal experience, and age. most people do, in proportion to their years. i have HiPointDem Feb 2013 #73
The reality is that many corporations that promised pensions question everything Feb 2013 #69
they purposefully bankrupted themselves in order to ditch pensions, in many cases. i can't HiPointDem Feb 2013 #72
Not so much 30 years ago sendero Feb 2013 #210
bankruptcy for profit has been going on for eons. you can see the shape of it back in the time HiPointDem Feb 2013 #221
I have the same memory as you, maryb Skittles Feb 2013 #87
That's probably because we're old enough to remember marybourg Feb 2013 #93
CORRECT! Skittles Feb 2013 #148
They were also promoted as the a portable pension approach ProgressiveProfessor Feb 2013 #196
That was how I considered my 401k. A supplement. LiberalFighter Feb 2013 #83
Exactly. The 401(k) was introduced in the 70s as a supplement for the executive class Egalitarian Thug Feb 2013 #143
Excellent point about the stagnation of wages and inability to contribute to plans suffragette Feb 2013 #204
And even those who dutifully contributed to their 401Ks saw their $$ go straight to hell at least Nay Feb 2013 #144
It sure is a big win for corporations laundry_queen Feb 2013 #3
That would be me. jonthebru Feb 2013 #5
401(k)s only work if you're an amazing prognosticator. HughBeaumont Feb 2013 #6
They only "work" if you are extremely highly paid; after all, they were set up originally duffyduff Feb 2013 #24
I don't really agree FreeJoe Feb 2013 #66
That is basically what I said. They were NEVER intended as that, duffyduff Feb 2013 #96
They are somewhat interchangeable FreeJoe Feb 2013 #99
Not in reality zipplewrath Feb 2013 #112
My experience is different FreeJoe Feb 2013 #133
I notice you said "we" zipplewrath Feb 2013 #171
I think that we basically agree FreeJoe Feb 2013 #209
Message auto-removed Icecream man Feb 2013 #213
So the solution is lose your home now so you can retire later? uppityperson Feb 2013 #215
Message auto-removed Icecream man Feb 2013 #220
OK Mr. 9 posts who joined DU yesterday..... llmart Feb 2013 #224
I don't think you meant to reply to me FreeJoe Feb 2013 #222
"Recent and near-retirees"---Wait! I thought the Baby Boomers were living the Life of Reilly on the WinkyDink Feb 2013 #7
Well, we are indeed living the good life ... JustABozoOnThisBus Feb 2013 #11
yup Skittles Feb 2013 #12
It's been a long-range plan, mon ami, from ca. 1935. WinkyDink Feb 2013 #14
Precisely Sherman A1 Feb 2013 #9
i'm kind of glad barbtries Feb 2013 #10
me too, barbtries!! Skittles Feb 2013 #13
exactly. barbtries Feb 2013 #16
Yup, die at work, that's what I say- That way, there'll be someone around to deal with it NBachers Feb 2013 #81
And once they get their hands on SS... awoke_in_2003 Feb 2013 #27
Well, if you're going the Grand Canyon route.... RagAss Feb 2013 #38
Yep that would me my inclination too.......... socialist_n_TN Feb 2013 #40
Definitely. nt awoke_in_2003 Feb 2013 #71
They are a union busting trap libtodeath Feb 2013 #15
I remember when they were introduced Lydia Leftcoast Feb 2013 #22
i remember that too. we had one of those information sessions and were supposed to choose HiPointDem Feb 2013 #50
You're aware that you can shift your investments, aren't you? brooklynite Feb 2013 #164
Now a million isn't enough spinbaby Feb 2013 #97
I remember hearing that "millionaire story" too Art_from_Ark Feb 2013 #141
I remember when they were introduced as well. Le Taz Hot Feb 2013 #190
That's about the best analogy.... ReRe Feb 2013 #35
thankfully my husband worked a union job riverbendviewgal Feb 2013 #41
And a hostage for Wall Street. moondust Feb 2013 #63
Right. dawg Feb 2013 #189
It was just another attack in the class war. Jakes Progress Feb 2013 #17
They wanted to privatize Social Security in favor of a 401(k)-style plan.... lastlib Feb 2013 #25
It doesn't matter whether we go for it or not... awoke_in_2003 Feb 2013 #29
I'm often surprised by the amount of anti-pension sentiment here on DU Ratty Feb 2013 #19
Exactly YoungDemCA Feb 2013 #21
me too, and I agree completely.... mike_c Feb 2013 #30
It shouldn't surprise you... awoke_in_2003 Feb 2013 #31
I wish I had a pension nt abelenkpe Feb 2013 #33
Well.. its because we as state taxpayers are paying for your "nice" pension.. DCBob Feb 2013 #44
Taxes paid for govt workers' compensation, of which pensions are one deferred part. Gidney N Cloyd Feb 2013 #65
I was waiting for somebody to post something like this.... Bigmack Feb 2013 #70
Hell, yes. Nevernose Feb 2013 #137
+1 Starry Messenger Feb 2013 #161
+1 nt Live and Learn Feb 2013 #199
So you've fallen for the script? Jakes Progress Feb 2013 #82
Is it also "stupid" to note that states are going bankrupt trying meet their pension liabilities. DCBob Feb 2013 #90
Yes. Jakes Progress Feb 2013 #94
Well at least you didnt directly call me stupid.. DCBob Feb 2013 #95
At least you didn't call working American's thieves. Jakes Progress Feb 2013 #103
"greedy thieves" WTF?? DCBob Feb 2013 #104
The pension obligation shortfalls are certainly a burden but the pension systems didn't cause it. Gidney N Cloyd Feb 2013 #117
Still not getting it. Or just refusing to admit. Jakes Progress Feb 2013 #121
I think there are many Democratic governors who agree with my statements. DCBob Feb 2013 #123
no, it's bullshit shanti Feb 2013 #134
DCBob, you need to understand that a pension is not a "gift" or "bonus" tblue37 Feb 2013 #150
Well there wouldnt be a problem if it worked the way you described. DCBob Feb 2013 #152
When my sister’s 3 kids were very young, from infancy to elementary tblue37 Feb 2013 #157
You've gone way past the level where you could be considered just uninformed. Jakes Progress Feb 2013 #182
The poster you are responding to JanMichael Feb 2013 #154
They fall for it or they support it. Jakes Progress Feb 2013 #183
Exactly. n/t duffyduff Feb 2013 #187
Ooooh. Yet another corporate line and lie. Jakes Progress Feb 2013 #181
People think that because they have taken a hit or that they never had a pension, duffyduff Feb 2013 #188
We were heading toward that Jakes Progress Feb 2013 #198
They are going bankrupt LondonReign2 Feb 2013 #160
That funding point it certainly true for my pension Ratty Feb 2013 #170
The part that bothers me most, though, is the lie that tblue37 Feb 2013 #191
That's simply wrong. The state pensions were funded by deferred earnings of state workers. Egalitarian Thug Feb 2013 #193
No, you're paying for a functional government... Hippo_Tron Feb 2013 #195
no i'm pretty sure it's because of something that actually causes that lancoholic Feb 2013 #206
Funding FreeJoe Feb 2013 #67
Bingo. SheilaT Feb 2013 #86
after reading this report I agree with your observatiion, I thought 401k would be good for most uponit7771 Feb 2013 #102
kick Liberal_in_LA Feb 2013 #20
LOL, I was at Data General in the early '80s when they rolled out their 401K program. It Flatulo Feb 2013 #23
k&r Starry Messenger Feb 2013 #26
401K programs are another get richer scheme for the managing organization. liberal N proud Feb 2013 #28
401Ks and Health Savings Accounts Teamster Jeff Feb 2013 #32
The road to Serfdom... kairos12 Feb 2013 #34
If/When I'm at retirement age and can't... DaveJ Feb 2013 #36
Pensions came from Unions, nuff said** MRDAWG Feb 2013 #37
"401Ks are great for me" DotGone Feb 2013 #39
Yes, 401k program sounded good on paper.. DCBob Feb 2013 #42
It doesn't work, unless you are a perfect cog in the machine. DaveJ Feb 2013 #48
Some people have done well with 401K and other retirement plans. nt bluestate10 Feb 2013 #43
and lot of people are fooling themselves Skittles Feb 2013 #45
There are basically two ways to do that. 1. Dumb luck, and 2. Learning how to manage investments. slackmaster Feb 2013 #46
3. Finding investment advisers that aren't ripoff artists, many exists if people take the bluestate10 Feb 2013 #57
+1 That's the problem...you stated it well. n/t KoKo Feb 2013 #109
and some people are doing well cause they bought the winning lottery ticket JanMichael Feb 2013 #92
I intend on working until I am 70 and then dieing shortly thereafter to satisfy the madinmaryland Feb 2013 #47
I hope you live a long happy life. DaveJ Feb 2013 #51
And what the fuck am I going to do??? Gotta pay the bills, you know. madinmaryland Feb 2013 #52
I dunno, but just sayin' DaveJ Feb 2013 #88
Thanks for reminding me how screwn I am at this point..... n't 2on2u Feb 2013 #53
K&R ReRe Feb 2013 #55
Wasn't that always the whole point? BeyondGeography Feb 2013 #56
The problem is they forced people into funds that had high fees, and not always still_one Feb 2013 #61
I guess I've been fortunate FreeJoe Feb 2013 #64
I have been fortunate mostly too, but one company I worked still_one Feb 2013 #77
I'm in the process of closing out one that was costing me about $100 per year as an annual fee slackmaster Feb 2013 #74
Most cannot rollover unless they leave the company still_one Feb 2013 #78
True. I quit that company about three years ago but hadn't paid enough attention to the fees. slackmaster Feb 2013 #79
You are correct a lot of folks when they leave a company do not still_one Feb 2013 #84
I have mixed feelings about 401Ks FreeJoe Feb 2013 #62
It bothers me a bit.... llmart Feb 2013 #75
It bothers me, the way they say it. DaveJ Feb 2013 #89
Companies could screw you out of a pension as well mythology Feb 2013 #76
Pensions only work if the company stays in business and if you work your whole career at one company FarCenter Feb 2013 #80
Another aspect, universally ignored by the proponents of this long-con, is the percentage Egalitarian Thug Feb 2013 #85
401k plans can and do work for many people, but only if they contribute. Common Sense Party Feb 2013 #91
Similar experience FreeJoe Feb 2013 #101
Problem is that just because they work some of the time doesn't mean they'll work all the time. HomeboyHombre Feb 2013 #105
But there are downsides to both of those. Common Sense Party Feb 2013 #107
Sorry, that's false. HomeboyHombre Feb 2013 #228
True, and I never said "only" for the poor. Common Sense Party Feb 2013 #229
In what universe were pensions guaranteed? ProgressiveProfessor Feb 2013 #197
A key issue that seems to be glossed over in much of this thread. n/t hughee99 Feb 2013 #214
401k worked well for me. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #98
How have you done with the latest crash though? KoKo Feb 2013 #111
This message was self-deleted by its author lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #115
Tell me the truth...Did you go into the Junk Bonds for Returns? KoKo Feb 2013 #122
I apologize, I misread my statement. My actual returns are not unlike yours < 10% lumberjack_jeff Feb 2013 #128
Thanks for your honesty in revision...I can understand.... KoKo Feb 2013 #136
You only lose when you have to sell at a loss. Common Sense Party Feb 2013 #175
Wife and I are already talking about passive retirement, this is disgusting uponit7771 Feb 2013 #100
99% of the posts here don't seem to understand 401ks or pensions and how they work.... cbdo2007 Feb 2013 #106
There are a number here that get it, so don't leave just yet. Dawgs Feb 2013 #113
DU has a forum for STOCK MARKET WATCH....there are folks KoKo Feb 2013 #142
There's nothing complicated about it for the average investor.... cbdo2007 Feb 2013 #158
Ahhhhhh yes, the venerated Stock Market Watch Thread A HERETIC I AM Feb 2013 #180
401Ks are no substitute for a pension. Every person should have a pension, period. There is no good stevenleser Feb 2013 #108
what happens when the company goes bankrupt after 10 years? cbdo2007 Feb 2013 #110
No, pensions are supposed to be independant of the company that paid into them. stevenleser Feb 2013 #114
Steve. Laws are laws. Pensions are attached to the company that provide them. bluestate10 Feb 2013 #135
Tell that to the employees of the bankrupt airlines and other companies ProgressiveProfessor Feb 2013 #194
I absolutely agree with you, but.... smccarter Feb 2013 #120
The disappearance of pension plans and the decline of Unions has gone hand in hand. bluestate10 Feb 2013 #138
Bingo smccarter Feb 2013 #147
Defined contribution plans are the biggest scams ever duffyduff Feb 2013 #140
Social Security yes. But the retirement buck stops at your own doorstep. smccarter Feb 2013 #116
With comments like those, I'm not sure you are on the right website. nt stevenleser Feb 2013 #118
Please be specific? smccarter Feb 2013 #119
And hey, when you refuse to address the real problems of America's economic woes . . . HughBeaumont Feb 2013 #124
So... you missed the point... smccarter Feb 2013 #125
You know, I re-read your reply. smccarter Feb 2013 #129
Uh, if anyone's missing America's real problem by a country mile, it sure isn't me. HughBeaumont Feb 2013 #130
Again smccarter Feb 2013 #146
Apparently, smccarter, life has been good to you and has handed you ponies and rainbows Trailrider1951 Feb 2013 #131
Funny smccarter Feb 2013 #145
Many of us took it personally because your original post in this thread was lacking in empathy stevenleser Feb 2013 #156
Point taken smccarter Feb 2013 #172
Look on the bright side: he likely is right there with ya on those drone strikes! nt Romulox Feb 2013 #159
And he is right there with you on lack of empathy, so, we're even! nt stevenleser Feb 2013 #168
Your comment makes zero sense, since YOU are the one excusing murder. Romulox Feb 2013 #178
Nope I am not, but someone without empathy wouldnt see that. nt stevenleser Feb 2013 #179
Utter gibberish. In the past I expected better of you. Romulox Feb 2013 #184
Says the person who accuses a majority of DUers of supporting murder stevenleser Feb 2013 #186
try reading your own posts? lancoholic Feb 2013 #205
You missed the point of my post... smccarter Feb 2013 #227
Most are expecting to work part time until they die on the job Warpy Feb 2013 #126
KICK! patrice Feb 2013 #127
wait shanti Feb 2013 #132
This assumes they even have a job that they can afford to retire from duffyduff Feb 2013 #139
I bet most of us are looking at the $120k number and thinking 'I wish'. Matariki Feb 2013 #149
Another huge privatization failure. aquart Feb 2013 #151
This is an incredibly misleading headline... brooklynite Feb 2013 #153
Except... meaculpa2011 Feb 2013 #155
Brooklyn Heights... brooklynite Feb 2013 #163
Understood... meaculpa2011 Feb 2013 #167
Plan on dying at your fucking desk, pole, mine shaft, restaurant, forest, canyon workplace. lonestarnot Feb 2013 #162
really? shanti Feb 2013 #200
Look again. I was referring to those not retired yet. lonestarnot Feb 2013 #223
your post was not clear about that shanti Feb 2013 #225
The idea that 401ks are beyond the wit of most workers is elitist claptrap. dmallind Feb 2013 #165
Excellent advice! meaculpa2011 Feb 2013 #169
Oh, please. The things are a complete fraud. duffyduff Feb 2013 #173
Nonsense. I know hundreds of average people who will have hundreds of Common Sense Party Feb 2013 #174
It's the same amount FreeJoe Feb 2013 #211
It's not that 401(k)s are "beyond wit" . . . . HughBeaumont Feb 2013 #176
7%, 20 years, $400/month FreeJoe Feb 2013 #208
But I thought the Dow was going to hit 36,000 under Dubya Dirty Socialist Feb 2013 #166
It did! But they forgot to mention it was 36,000 Indian Rupees stevenleser Feb 2013 #177
The fact is things are so bad because of 401k's, not in spite of them. raouldukelives Feb 2013 #185
This journal entry seems fitting for this discussion . . . HughBeaumont Feb 2013 #192
I am still not through the entire thread of your journal entry.... llmart Feb 2013 #212
The disaster was predicted by the left Warpy Feb 2013 #201
It's up to you Icecream man Feb 2013 #202
A 401K can get you a long way. FreeJoe Feb 2013 #207
I haven't had a good laugh in years. duffyduff Feb 2013 #217
You misunderstood my post FreeJoe Feb 2013 #219
Most people don't make enough money to even BEGIN to save enough duffyduff Feb 2013 #216
Message auto-removed Icecream man Feb 2013 #218
Wow this thread was linked to by Atrios. trumad Feb 2013 #203
You have a choice of a Pension OR a 401K HockeyMom Feb 2013 #226
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