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Response to cbrer (Reply #38)

Sun Jan 20, 2013, 10:34 PM

39. "Technology got us to this place."

 

Yes, this place. Approaching 400ppm atmospheric CO2, on our way to catastrophic climate change, and still starving 25,000 people a day at the apex of agrarian civilization.


I have every reason to believe it can get us out.

We have no reason to believe something that has historically aided the system in growth and energy consumption will begin to reduce energy consumption.


We have the technology now. Right now. To convert 33% of our power use to solar.

Which would allow us to export the rest of our fossil fuels, after using what we need to do the "green shift"


We could also follow Brazils example of using 75%ethanol instead of gasoline.

Do you realize the environmental impact of clearing out rainforests to plant switch grass? It can take centuries to pay back that carbon debt. We have decades


Talks were happening before NASA got chopped, to research putting a solar belt around the earth

How are we going to power the manufacturing of that (including the extraction of the required resource)? That'll pretty much kill the camel before she births out her green baby.


Our nation and it's adherent political realities, make it almost impossible to pursue these goals.

Its not just your nation. How about China & India, and everyone in Africa that wants a fridge and a two car garage?


The will to succeed does NOT exist.

Im not sure if it matters if it does. The will to preserve industrial society and protect the environment may be absolutely incompatible scientifically speaking.


But waiting for solid proof before we act is bullshit.

Production on faith, IMO, is bullshit. Did you know there are actually plans that do not require more production and growth? Thats where I'd put my chips.


It's not magic

Its a bit magical to think that technology will allow us to promote full equality while reducing all the developed nations per capita emissions to 7 tonnes a year (75% reduction), while still promoting economic growth, without further degrading the ecosystem from emissions and resource extraction. And to accomplish this (at least the reduction in emissions) all within the next 20-30 years before warming is out of are control. Thats magic.


The will to succeed is what's missing from the equation. All other factors are present.

See, this is where the techno-cult rhetoric picks up, while ignoring all the basic facts. We can't have a techno-shift without production that releases further emissions and creates immediate carbon debt. There are no scientifically viable plans to 1) promote global equality, 2) promote growing economies 3) reduce world energy consumption to "safe" levels, by the end of the century. You might as well pray.

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