General Discussion

graham4anything

(11,464 posts)

22. We need 100% unity and let them fight their civil war

Wed Dec 5, 2012, 04:56 PM

Dec 2012

unlike in the past, elections are 24/7/365

and the democrats need unity

at least the Warren fans want a female president. So we are united in that.As that is what will be happening.

As they are all starting their camapign best we do too, especially it would be good to have a Captain on the 2014 team.

BTW, if Mass. were to field a candidate, Deval Patrick would be more likely, but that would be for VP as it will be a woman next time.

It takes a Clinton to beat a Bush.And it will take Chicago leading the way. Hope Axelrod and Plouffe will be convinced to come back for another Presidential race.

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

188 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

Why Hillary cannot and should not win in 2016 [View all] Whisp Dec 2012 OP

As wonderful as she may be, she is old school politics. randome Dec 2012 #1

There's also something disturbing about XemaSab Dec 2012 #153

I agree nt fadedrose Dec 2012 #177

Me Too. Seems Like Royal Lineage ProfessorGAC Dec 2012 #184

Thank You. I agree 100% lalalu Dec 2012 #2

Well, looks like the "Warren or no one" movement begins now. wyldwolf Dec 2012 #3

Nope. Warren is one I think I know best at this point in time. Whisp Dec 2012 #9

I hope not. I think the support for Warren in 2016 is premature. Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #14

Depends who the Repukes put up ... Auggie Dec 2012 #159

If this Brave New World you speak of will doom her in 2016...it should have doomed her in 2008 joeybee12 Dec 2012 #4

Hillary lost the 2008 primary because of her vote for the Iraq War blueclown Dec 2012 #5

There is plenty of debate on why she lost in '08 wyldwolf Dec 2012 #7

Are you denying that the Iraq War vote didn't play a major role in the reason why she didn't win? blueclown Dec 2012 #17

Unless you have some solid evidence to the contrary, yes. wyldwolf Dec 2012 #20

Solid evidence - the large focus on the War in Iraq and Afghanistan blueclown Dec 2012 #28

Providing your opinion is not empirical evidence wyldwolf Dec 2012 #44

It isn't my opinion that Hillary supported the war when was being authorized blueclown Dec 2012 #58

Yes it was an important issue but not THE reason she lost wyldwolf Dec 2012 #59

People preferred other candidates is one reason.... fadedrose Dec 2012 #131

Well, of course. That is the case in any primary for any election in any year. wyldwolf Dec 2012 #138

Michigan's Primary of 2008 was anything but normal... fadedrose Dec 2012 #160

Reasoning isn't evidence. Reasoning is important, but it's not empirical data. Bucky Dec 2012 #77

I know the guy who writes that blog and he's pretty a pretty sharp character. amandabeech Dec 2012 #123

Exit polls aren't evidence of the importance of an issue? blueclown Dec 2012 #143

I like your avitar of LBJ. Same as mine. graham4anything Dec 2012 #11

I like it, but I really like the shot of LBJ with some long flowing hair! Bake Dec 2012 #23

Yeah. I would love to get a sweat shirt with that picture on it. graham4anything Dec 2012 #55

Aw hell, post the pic! Bake Dec 2012 #57

Since you insist (LOL). I have it as my screen wallpaper now graham4anything Dec 2012 #61

Hillary lost for several reasons, one of which was her vote for the Iraq invasion. Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #12

Of course, when you lose, you run an "ineffective campaign" blueclown Dec 2012 #19

Like all politicians (Obama included) she told several lies during the campaign, a la being the Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #34

o no, not this 'both sides do it' Anderson Cooper stuff! Whisp Dec 2012 #40

Read carefully what I wrote. All politicians "exaggerate" if not lie. Maybe "lie" is too much, Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #49

okay, no such whoppers. n/t Whisp Dec 2012 #62

By ineffective campaign, he means the fact that she had no strategy for after Super Tuesday Hippo_Tron Dec 2012 #115

...also because she endorsed mandated health insurance leftstreet Dec 2012 #24

The president, then Senator Obama, was dishonest about mandates during the campaign. Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #36

I happen to think Obama is an honest person Whisp Dec 2012 #42

The point is that he was adamantly opposed to mandates. Now he is adamantly for them. Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #45

The President also said that he would renegotiate NAFTA. amandabeech Dec 2012 #124

Without her ridiculous vote for the Iraq War, there never would have been a Barack Obama. nt aaaaaa5a Dec 2012 #72

The blood is still drip, drip, dripping from her hands. No sentient human being will coalition_unwilling Dec 2012 #136

Well then you can help give 2016 to Jeb Bush! Thanks! Walk away Dec 2012 #169

Oh, FFS, as if Hillary is the only Dem capable of winning in 2016. Right coalition_unwilling Dec 2012 #182

I don't believe that. Barack Obama's success was a result of his own merit, and a little luck. Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #180

Thank you. I will never forgive her for that. lindysalsagal Dec 2012 #188

As a supporter of Barack Obama before he even ran for the Senate RomneyLies Dec 2012 #6

Now see, I was preparing a long rebuttal to the OP but you did nicely in two lines. wyldwolf Dec 2012 #8

I forget the actual number, but hair's breadth is not one of them. Whisp Dec 2012 #13

The final delegate count from Real Clear Politics was Obama -2229.5 and Clinton - 1896.5 RomneyLies Dec 2012 #26

ok, in numbers, yes, it's pretty close, but Whisp Dec 2012 #35

But Clinton padded her numbers at the end after Obama had already switched to GE mode. ieoeja Dec 2012 #43

then there was that Michigan, Florida and one other state... where it was agreed not to count them Whisp Dec 2012 #68

That's exactly how it went. Hillary led the fight to exclude those 2 states. aaaaaa5a Dec 2012 #78

this is the kind of stuff she can't talk her way out of Whisp Dec 2012 #96

Could you imagine what a GOP super-pack would do with this. aaaaaa5a Dec 2012 #99

Not to mention, Pres. Obama will most likely endorse Hillary, guaranteeing her the nomination. JaneyVee Dec 2012 #64

Obama will be in a tough spot of Biden and Hillary run. nt aaaaaa5a Dec 2012 #79

I would not mind if Joe Biden made history himself- Hillary45/BidenVP graham4anything Dec 2012 #87

It takes a Clinton To be a Bush. Last thing we need is another Dukakis like scenerio graham4anything Dec 2012 #10

I agree.... winning in 2016 is all! nt Bigmack Dec 2012 #15

nobody has "earned" a nomination not coming for 4 years nt msongs Dec 2012 #16

We need 100% unity and let them fight their civil war graham4anything Dec 2012 #22

If Hillary is going to run, I hope she has already been quietly talking to Axelrod and Plouffe RomneyLies Dec 2012 #29

+1 aaaaaa5a Dec 2012 #80

I think the Obama team works/worked well is because of the chemistry Whisp Dec 2012 #89

is there a part of -THERE WILL BE A DEMOCRATIC PRIMARY IN 2016 -- that you don't understand? n/t antigop Dec 2012 #47

+1000. antigop Dec 2012 #30

I don't like this kind of stuff. It's presumptious. Feels like we're being railroaded by partisans. patrice Dec 2012 #130

One don't like opinions on a political discussion board where people give opinions??? graham4anything Dec 2012 #134

ah, yes, the same "inevitability" meme n/t antigop Dec 2012 #149

cut the "inevitability" meme. OK? People are sick of it. THERE WILL BE A 2016 PRIMARY. nt antigop Dec 2012 #32

Hillary Clinton has not earned anything. She has to ask for our votes. We make that decision Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #52

Funny thing is, the public is only calling Hillary. graham4anything Dec 2012 #65

That's crazy. The public wanted Hillary because they thought she was better than Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #73

That is what I said. She would have won had it not been for President Obama entering the race graham4anything Dec 2012 #81

Um, dude, Obama hasn't "backed" anyone. THERE WILL BE A PRIMARY IN 2016. n/t antigop Dec 2012 #90

I think it's mostly Clinton surrogates that are calling Hillary to run. Whisp Dec 2012 #75

+++1 patrice Dec 2012 #129

I think that the Noble committee will be very reluctant togive away amandabeech Dec 2012 #125

I'm ABC - Anybody but Cuomo liskddksil Dec 2012 #18

Roger that. KamaAina Dec 2012 #39

I agree about Andrew. And Let's Go Mets. They signed Wright for years. Now it's Dickey's turn graham4anything Dec 2012 #88

If she does run democrattotheend Dec 2012 #21

She needs Axelrod and Plouffe running it or at least advising it. graham4anything Dec 2012 #27

I can definitely see Roberts leaving the court if there is no conservative majority. n/t RomneyLies Dec 2012 #31

Hillary is highly respected and has a lot of support among rank and file Democrats. yardwork Dec 2012 #25

For cying out loud, Obama hasn't even started his second term yet. This is ridiculous. n/t antigop Dec 2012 #33

+1,000!!! I think I now understand why this is happening. Dividing Democrats! Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #38

Until about 2015. This is all pointless speculation. randome Dec 2012 #51

Yep! It's also designed to distract us from focusing on the battles that we need to fight Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #56

so true, Liberal. Spot on. n/t antigop Dec 2012 #92

then ask the media why this is happening. Whisp Dec 2012 #60

Liberals are almost as likely to fall prey to Corporate Media narratives and memes as the cons. Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #85

if you mean unite around Hillary45 100% agree. BTW- I was most certainly NOT a fan in 2008. graham4anything Dec 2012 #71

we are NOT uniting around Hillary. We should unite around Pres. Obama right now. antigop Dec 2012 #93

The goal is to keep President Obama's agenda winning for decades to come,no retreat from it graham4anything Dec 2012 #100

is there a part of -THERE WILL BE A DEMOCRATIC PRIMARY IN 2016 -- that you don't understand? n/t antigop Dec 2012 #109

the formalities will be done, like they were this year graham4anything Dec 2012 #111

it's a PRIMARY -- not a coronation. Got it? N/t antigop Dec 2012 #112

you are the only one disputing it, not me. graham4anything Dec 2012 #116

there you go again...the "inevitability" meme... nt antigop Dec 2012 #118

People said Obama was not going to win in 2008 and 12 graham4anything Dec 2012 #119

ah,yes, the same meme...she's the only one....it's hers. The Dems will decide who the nominee is antigop Dec 2012 #120

and the repubs will the same graham4anything Dec 2012 #121

still the same "inevitability" meme...there's no one else. Just her. n/t antigop Dec 2012 #145

Thanks for you efforts with this! She's ONE good candidate. This is starting to look like a cult of patrice Dec 2012 #132

Disingenuous posts usually do get more overthetop as the exchanges continue.... blm Dec 2012 #157

I was a fan of Dennis K., then John Edwards (*sigh*). I didn't come 'round to Obama until the very Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #110

Thank you. And Elizabeth Warren has been a senator for about five minutes. Chorophyll Dec 2012 #66

Actually, technically I don't think she has been sworn in as a Senator yet. nt aaaaaa5a Dec 2012 #82

Good point! Chorophyll Dec 2012 #114

if she runs MFM008 Dec 2012 #37

Too early still, but your points aren't persuasive Spike89 Dec 2012 #41

yes, delegates. ty I will change. n/t Whisp Dec 2012 #69

I disagree with your second point. Obama has been the most vetted candidate and politician Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #183

I'm not so sure we're ... 99Forever Dec 2012 #46

it's ridiculous..Obama hasn't even started his second term yet and this crap has already started. nt antigop Dec 2012 #48

He had 4 years. People are ready to move on n/t leftstreet Dec 2012 #53

and he has four more to go. His second term hasn't even started. n/t antigop Dec 2012 #94

No one's expecting anything spectacular from him leftstreet Dec 2012 #107

no, it's the surrogates who are pushing for a new horserace. n/t antigop Dec 2012 #113

Who are these "people" you speak of? The president is sitting on a very high approval rating. Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #142

Landslide? Lowest voter turnout since 2004 leftstreet Dec 2012 #155

Link or Lies. I'll go with the latter. Blacks and Hispanics stood in lines for hours upon hours. Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #178

Are you able to access the Internet? leftstreet Dec 2012 #185

you are absolutely right, but it is free speech, no matter what the bs content it contains still_one Dec 2012 #162

it may be free speech, but you have to question what the real agenda is. nt antigop Dec 2012 #166

Absolutely, however we really need to focus on now and the next four years still_one Dec 2012 #167

there are a lot of issues we need to focus on now -- Medicare, SS, budget, etc. n/t antigop Dec 2012 #170

We need to focus on now and the next *TWO* years! Liberal_Stalwart71 Dec 2012 #181

Hillary said she wasn't planning on a run in '16 anyway. AverageJoe90 Dec 2012 #50

"Am not planning" does NOT equal "Will not run". Bucky Dec 2012 #76

where there are Clintons, there is hype. Whisp Dec 2012 #150

She switched parties because her fellow Republicans were rude to her at the 1968 RNC. ieoeja Dec 2012 #54

Yes, because Hillary always crumbles when "the boys pick on her." Chorophyll Dec 2012 #67

Being the first random thought to pop out of one's head doesn't make it "reason number one" Bucky Dec 2012 #74

Fine. How about ... because she is a neo-lib founder of the DLC that took this country near ruin? ieoeja Dec 2012 #83

See? Don't you feel better about yourself now? Bucky Dec 2012 #106

Is 2016 too soon to push for a progressive nominee for President? It has been 40 years after all. Douglas Carpenter Dec 2012 #63

The Iraq War vote has always been my main problem with HRC. Warren DeMontague Dec 2012 #70

I think Hillary wants to be President. aaaaaa5a Dec 2012 #84

heheh. Whisp Dec 2012 #91

I think the Clintons are hoping they can knock out other Dems before the primary starts. aaaaaa5a Dec 2012 #101

2008 taught them not to rest on their laurels, that's for sure. Whisp Dec 2012 #102

I wonder if anyone is talking to Axelrod and Plouffe? aaaaaa5a Dec 2012 #103

I had a reply to that in #89, pasting it here: Whisp Dec 2012 #105

Hillary the Harpie ... that was the drum beat that was played out by both parties, in one way or the libdem4life Dec 2012 #86

We'll see IN 2016 who will win the primary. It's not a coronation, it's a primary. n/t antigop Dec 2012 #95

Hillary would be one of the most qualified people to ever run for the office. MrSlayer Dec 2012 #97

I hope you are right. aaaaaa5a Dec 2012 #104

It's the 21st century..we need to back away from the "it's xxxxxx's "turn" mentalilty SoCalDem Dec 2012 #98

Enough of 2016 IDemo Dec 2012 #108

The Hillary hate continues!!! center rising Dec 2012 #117

It's not hate. People just don't like the presumption. Don't like having a candidate patrice Dec 2012 #133

I love and respect her goclark Dec 2012 #141

nice post, Patrice. Spot on. n/t antigop Dec 2012 #146

I have to disagree with the old guard theory liberal_at_heart Dec 2012 #122

Very seldom do 4 years of one party follow 8 years of that same party. amandabeech Dec 2012 #126

you really need to check history..the universal healthcare fight in this country started long before antigop Dec 2012 #147

ooh, sorry I guess I used the wrong term liberal_at_heart Dec 2012 #163

I think 2016 will NOT be 2008 in many ways. Hillary always learns and improves. Tigress DEM Dec 2012 #127

Now that's a good thought - Warren as AG. Whisp Dec 2012 #128

Hilliary may be our best shot veganlush Dec 2012 #135

Uh, no. Warren Religion Dec 2012 #137

I'm one of the few people not willing to take a position either way davidpdx Dec 2012 #139

absolutely, David. You have to wonder what the real agenda is here, don't you? n/t antigop Dec 2012 #148

The Howard Dean campaign was the first campaign to effectively use the internet... Earth_First Dec 2012 #140

okay, I stand corrected. Whisp Dec 2012 #152

Very true davidpdx Dec 2012 #186

I'm sorry, but if Hillary is the best Dem candidate for 2016, I'm voting for her.... OldDem2012 Dec 2012 #144

Never said I was a critic davidpdx Dec 2012 #187

She wont be my first choice. ForgoTheConsequence Dec 2012 #151

Brian seems like a good guy. Whisp Dec 2012 #154

Yeah I think he has a lot of working class appeal. ForgoTheConsequence Dec 2012 #156

And what a magNAMINOUS PSA this is. You're just all heart! MotherPetrie Dec 2012 #158

She will be the nominee, and she will win no matter what you want still_one Dec 2012 #161

ah, yes..she's the one...the "inevitability" meme n/t antigop Dec 2012 #164

EW 2016! lonestarnot Dec 2012 #165

Couldn't agree more Carolina Dec 2012 #168

Holy Fucking Shit... Jeff In Milwaukee Dec 2012 #171

ask MSNBC and all the rest to do that. Whisp Dec 2012 #172

So they put a gun to your head.... Jeff In Milwaukee Dec 2012 #173

if you have a problem with my OP I recommend you alert on it. Whisp Dec 2012 #175

I know this may piss some off but... bamacrat Dec 2012 #174

If I recall this correctly - Congress voted to give Bush the power to declare war IF there were WMD djean111 Dec 2012 #176

If she runs, I'll support her... cynatnite Dec 2012 #179