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Mon Oct 22, 2012, 07:50 AM

Lance Armstrong Is Stripped of His 7 Tour de France Titles

Source: NYTimes

The International Cycling Union announced on Monday that it will not appeal the United States Anti-Doping Agency’s ruling to bar Lance Armstrong for life from Olympic sports for doping and for playing an instrumental role in the team-wide doping on his Tour de France-winning cycling squads.

That decision to waive the right to take Armstrong’s case to the Court of Arbitration for Sport, the highest court in sports, formally strips Armstrong of the Tour titles he won from 1999-2005. The Amaury Sport Organization, the company that organizes the Tour de France, will erase Armstrong’s name from its record books.

...

Christian Prudhomme, the race director of the Tour, has said the organization would not give the victories to the runners-up at the races Armstrong had won because so many of those riders have been linked to doping as well. He said those Tours simply would have no official winner.

The World Anti-Doping Agency now has 21 days to decide whether it will appeal the ruling. If it does not, Armstrong’s hotly contested case is over.

Read more: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/23/sports/cycling/armstrong-stripped-of-his-7-tour-de-france-titles.html?_r=0



Unless WADA decides to appeal the UCI's decision, it's now official: Lance Armstrong is the winner of zero Tour de France titles.

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Reply Lance Armstrong Is Stripped of His 7 Tour de France Titles (Original post)
DanTex Oct 2012 OP
naaman fletcher Oct 2012 #1
kayakjohnny Oct 2012 #6
lalalu Oct 2012 #12
kayakjohnny Oct 2012 #16
lalalu Oct 2012 #32
DanTex Oct 2012 #79
lalalu Oct 2012 #88
DanTex Oct 2012 #98
lalalu Oct 2012 #102
DanTex Oct 2012 #105
lalalu Oct 2012 #106
DanTex Oct 2012 #109
roguevalley Oct 2012 #72
Bo Oct 2012 #111
cstanleytech Oct 2012 #130
Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Oct 2012 #37
naaman fletcher Oct 2012 #41
DanTex Oct 2012 #82
wilt the stilt Oct 2012 #114
Retrograde Oct 2012 #86
lalalu Oct 2012 #9
PatrynXX Oct 2012 #63
byeya Oct 2012 #80
Major Hogwash Oct 2012 #83
Trivium Oct 2012 #99
cliffordu Oct 2012 #100
BigDemVoter Oct 2012 #110
Arugula Latte Oct 2012 #113
darkangel218 Oct 2012 #2
Duppers Oct 2012 #19
darkangel218 Oct 2012 #21
sarcasmo Oct 2012 #54
Bo Oct 2012 #68
wilt the stilt Oct 2012 #115
snooper2 Oct 2012 #36
adigal Oct 2012 #43
seabeyond Oct 2012 #3
RedstDem Oct 2012 #23
muriel_volestrangler Oct 2012 #31
Javaman Oct 2012 #74
wilt the stilt Oct 2012 #116
closeupready Oct 2012 #4
cleduc Oct 2012 #5
cosmicone Oct 2012 #7
CBGLuthier Oct 2012 #8
closeupready Oct 2012 #65
lalalu Oct 2012 #10
darkangel218 Oct 2012 #13
lalalu Oct 2012 #15
darkangel218 Oct 2012 #18
lalalu Oct 2012 #24
darkangel218 Oct 2012 #28
lalalu Oct 2012 #30
cosmicone Oct 2012 #35
lalalu Oct 2012 #39
DanTex Oct 2012 #45
lalalu Oct 2012 #46
DanTex Oct 2012 #49
lalalu Oct 2012 #57
DanTex Oct 2012 #66
lalalu Oct 2012 #67
DanTex Oct 2012 #69
lalalu Oct 2012 #89
DanTex Oct 2012 #95
lalalu Oct 2012 #103
DanTex Oct 2012 #108
roguevalley Oct 2012 #73
lalalu Oct 2012 #90
cosmicone Oct 2012 #50
darkangel218 Oct 2012 #55
lalalu Oct 2012 #59
RedstDem Oct 2012 #20
lalalu Oct 2012 #26
djg21 Oct 2012 #40
lalalu Oct 2012 #42
darkangel218 Oct 2012 #52
lalalu Oct 2012 #60
marmar Oct 2012 #17
lalalu Oct 2012 #29
Dawgs Oct 2012 #33
lalalu Oct 2012 #34
djg21 Oct 2012 #38
adigal Oct 2012 #44
Nye Bevan Oct 2012 #47
cali Oct 2012 #51
sarcasmo Oct 2012 #56
_ed_ Oct 2012 #112
Frank Cannon Oct 2012 #11
calimary Oct 2012 #97
MrScorpio Oct 2012 #14
Lars77 Oct 2012 #22
Nye Bevan Oct 2012 #48
Lars77 Oct 2012 #64
Boabab Oct 2012 #25
Franker65 Oct 2012 #27
sarcasmo Oct 2012 #53
byeya Oct 2012 #81
sarcasmo Oct 2012 #92
slackmaster Oct 2012 #58
darkangel218 Oct 2012 #61
slackmaster Oct 2012 #62
randome Oct 2012 #87
proverbialwisdom Oct 2012 #70
Javaman Oct 2012 #71
roguevalley Oct 2012 #76
Javaman Oct 2012 #77
Art_from_Ark Oct 2012 #118
Javaman Oct 2012 #119
jsr Oct 2012 #75
proverbialwisdom Oct 2012 #78
closeupready Oct 2012 #93
AndyTiedye Oct 2012 #84
humblebum Oct 2012 #85
closeupready Oct 2012 #94
Safetykitten Oct 2012 #91
humblebum Oct 2012 #96
DanTex Oct 2012 #101
budkin Oct 2012 #104
Supersedeas Oct 2012 #107
taught_me_patience Oct 2012 #125
elbloggoZY27 Oct 2012 #117
dmallind Oct 2012 #120
LanternWaste Oct 2012 #121
dmallind Oct 2012 #123
Locut0s Oct 2012 #122
andym Oct 2012 #124
Dubster Oct 2012 #126
Prometheus Bound Oct 2012 #127
Prometheus Bound Oct 2012 #128
jsr Oct 2012 #129

Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 07:52 AM

1. They can say that all they want,

 

but we all know he is the best cyclist ever.

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Response to naaman fletcher (Reply #1)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:03 AM

6. I disagree...

1
Eddy Merckx



Eddy Merchx was born in Belgium in 1945 and became the best road bicycle racer the world has ever seen. He won the Tour de France 5 times in 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972 and 1974, the Giro D’Italia 5 times in 1968, 1970, 1972, 1973 and 1974 and the Vuelta a España once in 1973. Merckx also won the Tour de Suisse once, Paris-Nice 3 times, Dauphné-Libéré once, Paris-Roubaix 3 times, Liège-Bastogne-Liége 5 times and the World Road Race Championship 3 times. Eddy Merckx is also one of only five riders to win all three big stage races during their career, the four others are: Jacques Anquetil, Felice Gimondi, Bernard Hinault and Alberto Contador.
Read more at http://listverse.com/2009/05/08/top-10-best-road-cycle-racers-of-all-time/


This list puts Lance at #9 on the all-time list. I'm not sure where he belongs on it. But I do think Eddy was the stronger and more prolific winner, and he did so without all the technical and doping help.

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Response to kayakjohnny (Reply #6)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:13 AM

12. Hank Aaron heard the same

 

nonsense about his record and Babe Ruth. It was personal and racist rants by people with an agenda. Racism isn't involved with Armstrong but it smells of a personal vendetta.

It seems people have problems accepting change.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #12)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:23 AM

16. It's not my opinion alone... This list puts Lance at #5. But still has Merckx as the best.

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Response to kayakjohnny (Reply #16)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:46 AM

32. Everyone is entitled to their opinion.

 

It's just many people cannot accept change.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #32)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 11:01 AM

79. What does Lance Armstrong have to do with "change"?

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Response to DanTex (Reply #79)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 12:54 PM

88. Did you read the previous posts?

 

It was about a disagreement over who is the greatest cyclist. I stated there are people who still can't accept Hank Aaron's record because they can't accept change. There are some people who can't accept records being broken by new people.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #88)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 01:29 PM

98. "There are some people who can't accept records being broken by new people."

Are you kidding? So why would these people would choose Lance from the whole world of sports to "not accept"? Why aren't they rejecting Michael Phelps?

The racism faced by Hank Aaron and others is a whole different thing.

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Response to DanTex (Reply #98)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 02:38 PM

102. Maybe you missed it but some people wanted to strip Phelps for

 

smoking a joint. Then after the Olympics there were some trying to strip him of his medals because some Advertising photos were released a few days early. Something he had nothing to do with and I thought that was also a witch hunt by sore losers. It was all over the news and some people were really pushing to enforce it. Phelps had to get an attorney.

http://www.complex.com/sports/2012/08/michael-phelps-could-lose-medals-from-2012-summer-olympics-because-of-leaked-louis-vuitton-photos

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Response to lalalu (Reply #102)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 02:54 PM

105. I don't remember anyone wanting to strip his medals for smoking a joint.

Of course, stripping the titles of a man who was ran a decades-long doping ring, who not only doped himself during every single one of his victories, but also coerced his teammates to dope in order to remain on the team is a whole different story.

I guess your theory is that all athletes are subject to "witch hunts" from "sore losers" so we should just ignore the sworn testimony of 25 witnesses, the positive tests, and the rest of the evidence?

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Response to DanTex (Reply #105)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 02:57 PM

106. They wanted to penalize Phelps.

 

I guess you are also going to claim they didn't want to strip him of his medals over the ads? You raised Phelps as an example and I proved you wrong.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #106)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 03:13 PM

109. Whoever "they" is, "they" obviously didn't actually get very far in their anti-Phelps vendetta.

If you hadn't noticed, Phelps still has his medals, and nobody is challenging his records. He is widely hailed as the greatest swimmer ever.

It probably has to do with the fact that there isn't 1,000 pages of evidence demonstrating that he systematically took performing enhancing drugs and forced others to do so throughout his career.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #12)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 10:49 AM

72. eleven people plus docs. he is guilty or he would fight it

He doesn't deserve a defense if he wont defend himself. He cheated. That makes him the worst racer ever

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Response to lalalu (Reply #12)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 04:12 PM

111. He survived a 2 year DOJ investigation and passed over 500 drug tests.

Its a witch hunt....no one can pass that many drug tests and not be found out.
Unless LANCE is a MAD CHEMICAL SCIENTIST GENIUS as well.

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Response to Bo (Reply #111)

Tue Oct 23, 2012, 11:34 PM

130. OH? What if its a new drug the tests arent designed to detect or if its one the body

cleans out fast?
I am not familiar with how drug testing is done in the lab which is why I asked rather than automatically assume that its all a frame job.

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Response to kayakjohnny (Reply #6)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:13 AM

37. Mercx was busted for doping once as well.

Look it up though I don't think his was quite as extensive as Armstrong.

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Response to kayakjohnny (Reply #6)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:24 AM

41. Ok fair enough

 

I don't know much about cycling, I just know that the fact is Lance beat all his peers, who were also doping.

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Response to naaman fletcher (Reply #41)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 11:27 AM

82. It's not quite that simple.

To say that the playing field is level because they all dope is incorrect. Not everyone responds in the same way to PEDs. Not everyone had as sophisticated and intensive a doping program as Armstrong and his USPS team. Not everyone is willing to take the risks involved with this level of doping. And so on.

Armstrong was the best at cheating. But not the best cyclist.

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Response to DanTex (Reply #82)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 05:58 PM

114. He's the best of his time.

he beat Ulrich and Pantini and they were doping. NoW I think Mercx is the best of all time and I have been watvhing racing since the seventies. Cycling has always had doping.

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Response to kayakjohnny (Reply #6)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 12:29 PM

86. Another vote here for Merckx

Armstrong only did the Tour de France, conserving himself by skipping the other big-name races. Merckx was an all-rounder.

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Response to naaman fletcher (Reply #1)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:06 AM

9. I agree 100%

 

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Response to naaman fletcher (Reply #1)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 10:12 AM

63. yep.

what I've dubbed the next Shoeless Joe Jackson. ahem as in they banned him from baseball and took their money but still played like he should.

Lance I don't know there is no proof. But was still banned for life..

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Response to naaman fletcher (Reply #1)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 11:22 AM

80. What a crock. One of the biggest cheats ever and a disgrace to the sport according to the

 

sanctioning bodies.

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Response to naaman fletcher (Reply #1)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 11:36 AM

83. Absolutely!

No matter what they say, Armstrong won the Tour 7 freakin' times.

And he beat cancer!
3 times!

Oh gosh, I guess that doesn't count!

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Response to naaman fletcher (Reply #1)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 02:09 PM

99. he is a doper and a cheat, glad to see him stripped

 

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Response to naaman fletcher (Reply #1)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 02:12 PM

100. Nope. The cannibal reigns supreme....

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Response to naaman fletcher (Reply #1)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 03:21 PM

110. If he's the best cyclist ever. . .

Why in the fuck did he cheat and take banned drugs and coerce his team mates to lie for him?

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Response to naaman fletcher (Reply #1)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 04:35 PM

113. No, Peewee is.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 07:53 AM

2. Good. He was a fake.

Time for him to get a real job.

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Response to darkangel218 (Reply #2)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:24 AM

19. nasty much?

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Response to Duppers (Reply #19)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:28 AM

21. I have no respect for cheats and thieves.

He " stole " a lot of money by stealing those titles. And also he let down a lot of people who believed in him.

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Response to darkangel218 (Reply #21)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:55 AM

54. +1

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Response to darkangel218 (Reply #21)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 10:32 AM

68. I THOUGHT HE PASSED OVER 300 DRUG TESTS....

what are the odds?

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Response to darkangel218 (Reply #21)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 06:01 PM

115. watch cycling much?

they all cheated and they even have a monument for a guy on Alp D'uez for dying from drugs.

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Response to Duppers (Reply #19)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:10 AM

36. I'm sure lancy will be okay in the morning...

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Response to Duppers (Reply #19)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:27 AM

43. why is it nasty to speak the truth?

The man was a cheat and a liar, and gave false hope to a lot of people who now may lose that. We don't have any idea of the harm he may cause in the future. He is scum.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 07:54 AM

3. way to ruin 7 yrs of other peoples hard work by cheating. truly disgusting. i have no respect

for a cheat.

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #3)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:30 AM

23. you're right about that

as long as those other cyclist were playing by the rules, which I doubt unfortunately.

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Response to RedstDem (Reply #23)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:46 AM

31. I don't think anyone will be named as the winner for those 7 years

That was what the Tour de France director proposed before today's decision, anyway:

Tour de France Director, Christian Prudhomme said there should be "no winner" of the Tour for each of the seven years where Armstrong won if the decision to strip him of his victories is upheld.

http://www.thisdaylive.com/articles/uci-to-reveal-armstrong-drugs-response/128405/


So there is an implication they don't know if any of them were obeying the rules.

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Response to muriel_volestrangler (Reply #31)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 10:53 AM

74. The issue at hand is...

they all dope.

Anyone who believe differently is either very naive or willfully so.

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Response to RedstDem (Reply #23)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 06:03 PM

116. Ha Ha ha

others playing by the rules. Pantini and Ulrich were caught doping.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 07:57 AM

4. I don't know what's worse - a quitter or a cheater.

He's kind of both, IMO. Good decision.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 07:58 AM

5. WADA was run by Dick Pound

He and they have been very adversarial against Armstrong. WADA won't appeal the ruling unless it would further bury Armstrong. The report the USADA put together is pretty overwhelming and very damning. It's all over except the crying.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:04 AM

7. I wish he were publicly tarred, feathered and

made to ride his bike along the route of Tour de France in that state.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:06 AM

8. When does he give back all the money he stole?

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Response to CBGLuthier (Reply #8)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 10:17 AM

65. A lot of sports bettors are probably pissed off about this.

But I don't think he has the SLIGHTEST intention of giving a DIME back to anyone.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:11 AM

10. This is nothing but a personal vendetta.

 

It reminds me of the Salem Witch Trials where they bring in a bunch of hysterical people to accuse a person. No facts, just personal stories to use for a conviction.

I was never into the sport and was not a fan of Armstrong. I do think he did some great things and is a great athlete. What is not great is the McCarthyism style of this agency.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #10)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:16 AM

13. I think is more than " personal stories " to prove he dopped. n/t

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Response to darkangel218 (Reply #13)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:20 AM

15. Where is there more?

 

There isn't and that fact has been obscured by "stories". Armstrong passed more drug tests than any other cyclist. Are you going to tell me that he is a chemical genius who can outsmart any chemist this agency can find around the world? Really?

This is a similar to a witch hunt. I also believe that one day this agency will be the one investigated and issuing apologies. There is something very dishonest and predatory about their actions. It smells.

I have nothing in this personally and it won't make a difference in my life. I just don't like seeing these types of things. It is wrong no matter if it happens to someone rich or poor.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #15)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:23 AM

18. Then how come he is not " defending " himself?

Any inocent person would do that, but he isn't.

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Response to darkangel218 (Reply #18)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:36 AM

24. That sounds just like the Salem Witch trial.

 

Actually he has numerous times and was tired of this circus.

They had no evidence so they hounded him. That is wrong.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #24)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:42 AM

28. Oh please...

The truth has come out. He was not an honest player. Just because others were doping didn't mean he had to do it himself.
He dissapointed A LOT if people.

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Response to darkangel218 (Reply #28)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:44 AM

30. Where is there proof he doped?

 

There is none. Just stories and innuendo. Those are the only facts.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #30)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:06 AM

35. Only extremely deluded people would overlook

the entirety of evidence and out of person-worship declare someone innocent.

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Response to cosmicone (Reply #35)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:15 AM

39. Only vicious people attack and convict on innuendo.

 

The "entirety of evidence" is nothing but stories. It seems we fail to learn from history. Armstrong will survive and this has nothing to do with worshiping or liking him. It is about what is right and wrong. This is wrong whether it is done to someone rich or poor or someone liked or disliked.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #39)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:30 AM

45. Since when is sworn testimony of 25 witnesses "nothing but stories"?

I think you need to look up the word "innuendo" in the dictionary, because direct eyewitness testimony and innuendo are entirely different things.

Of course, on top of the witnesses, there are also the positive tests for cortisone and EPO, the financial records, etc.

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Response to DanTex (Reply #45)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:35 AM

46. Yes, because "eyewitness" testimony

 

from a large group of people has been proven historically to be accurate . There are inconclusive tests, not any that would stand up in court. This is a witch hunt.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #46)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:51 AM

49. So are you saying that all 25 eyewitnesses are lying under oath?

You know, in a court of law, a case with 25 eyewitnesses testifying under oath would be considered strong.

Also, what makes you think the tests are inconclusive and wouldn't stand up in court? Is that what Armstrong's lawyer said? If you are actually interested, here is an interview with a sports doctor discussing Armstrongs six positive EPO samples from 1999:
http://nyvelocity.com/content/interviews/2009/michael-ashenden

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Response to DanTex (Reply #49)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:59 AM

57. Historically people

 

have been convicted on many eyewitnesses testifying against them. Later we have found in many cases it was motivated by anything but the truth and now are viewed as travesties of justice. This interview is not proof, it is an opinion. I do not know if Armstrong is guilty or innocent but I do know this is the wrong way to convict anyone.

The actions of these agencies and the willingness of people to accept it is frightening. If people want to accept this as justice then that is their opinion and right. I just hoped that we had moved past such things and it is my fault for believing it was possible.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #57)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 10:17 AM

66. How do you feel about, say, Jerry Sandusky? Another witch-hunt victim?

As far as I know, the case against him was based purely on eyewitness testimony, which according to you is worthless. Is it "frightening" to you that he is now in prison?

Also, the interview I posted is the opinion of an expert. The evidence itself is six of Armstrong's urine samples from the 1999 Tour de France which contained EPO in them. I mean, you were asking for physical evidence in the form of test results, and here you have it.

Finally, what is wrong with the way that Armstrong was convicted? They gathered 1,000 pages of evidence, including 25 eyewitnesses, lab test results, financial records, etc. They gave Armstrong a chance to have his case heard before an arbitration hearing -- the same kind of arbitration hearing that every other cyclist accused of doping gets, and a hearing that a US Judge declared satisfied all of due process requirements, including the right to appeal, etc. -- but Armstrong turned that down.

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Response to DanTex (Reply #66)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 10:23 AM

67. Actually Sandusky admitted to his actions.

 

He admitted showering children and inappropriate touching. He even apologized to the mother of one child. Sandusky just could not accept the fact that his actions were not harmless and went beyond boundaries. So it was not based on eyewitness testimony only.

So now Armstrong is comparable to a pedophile? This is getting ridiculous.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #67)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 10:34 AM

69. Umm... Sandusky pleaded not guilty and continues to maintain his innocence.

He did not admit to child abuse. He was convicted based on eyewitness testimony. There was no physical evidence. That was your standard. Just like Armstrong, Sandusky blames the whole thing on a witch hunt/conspiracy.

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-jerry-sandusky-20121009,0,2935489.story

BTW, if you really are trying to stand up for "due process" and against witch hunts, it is completely preposterous for you to take some statements that Sandusky made to the media as an admission of guilt. He has very clearly proclaimed his innocence in court, and if your standard is physical evidence only, then Sandusky walks (but Armstrong is still guilty).

Also, as should be obvious, I'm not comparing Armstrong to a pedophile, I'm comparing the standard of proof used in the two cases. You are apparently willing to accept eyewitness testimony in some cases but not others. I wonder why that is. If anything, you should be a lot more concerned about Sandusky, because while Armstrong just lost his titles and sponsors, Sandusky actually went to prison.

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Response to DanTex (Reply #69)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 12:58 PM

89. He admitted to actions that resulted in his conviction.

 

Sandusky did admit committing certain acts and that is a fact. Your denial sounds as lame as Sandusky's. He was convicted based on things he admitted to that were then tied to testimony by his accusers.

BTW, I can bet you Penn State won't be permanently banned from participating in football.

I am not concerned about Sandusky but I find it strange you are.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #89)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 01:20 PM

95. No he didn't. You are unable to defend your position without making false claims.

Sandusky did not admit to child rape, he denied it, with the same amount of vigor that Armstrong has denied doping. He was convicted of rape based entirely on eyewitness testimony of others, the same kind of evidence that was used for part (not all) of the case against Armstrong.

The fact that you are not concerned about Sandusky demonstrates that your defense of Lance Armstrong has nothing to do with concerns about a witch hunt or due process. You simply want to defend Lance, and you are digging for whatever excuse you can find. If you actually believed that eyewitness testimony was unreliable, you would also be defending Sandusky (and any number of other people who have been convicted based on witness testimony).

ETA: this should be obvious, but I'm not actually defending Sandusky. I'm just pointing out the double standard of yours when it comes to eyewitness testimony.

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Response to DanTex (Reply #95)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 02:43 PM

103. Is there something wrong with you?

 

Of course he would not admit to rape because he thought he did nothing wrong. Obviously you and Sandusky think a grown man playing "tickle monster" with a child in a shower is OK. Fortunately sane people don't. He admitted actions that normal people know is sexual abuse of children. He doesn't see it that way because he is a pedophile.You raised the issue of Sandusky so you really are not paying attention to your own posts.

Also, you should read again. My issue is with the way this was handled and it was wrong. The only person making this personal is you.

You did not point out anything and all you have done is make yourself look silly and defend Sandusky.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #103)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 03:10 PM

108. Sorry, painting me as a pedophile sympathizer doesn't help your case.

Sandusky did not admit to rape. He admitted to something like "horseplay" -- I don't feel like getting graphic, so I'll assume you understand the key differences between horseplay and rape.

More importantly, of course, he admitted to nothing during the trial, because he didn't even testify. So whatever he said to a reporter makes no difference. He was convicted of rape based on eyewitness testimony. The same kind of testimony that made up (part of) the case against Lance Armsrong.

And, not surprisingly, his attorneys tried to argue the same sorry "conspiracy" defense that you are putting up. That's what all guilty people say when there are dozens of witnesses testifying against them under oath. However, like you, they couldn't present any evidence of a conspiracy. Which is why Sandusky was found guilty, and why Armstrong was banned and had his title stripped.

Here's a serious question. Do you really believe that all convictions that are based on eyewitness testimony should be overturned?

Why is the Lance Armstrong case special?

You haven't explained your issue with the way it was handled. It was handled the same way as any other doping case. Arbitration, with option to appeal to the CAS. The process all cyclists agree to be governed by when they become professionals, and the process that a US Judge found provided for the necessary Due Process requirements of the constitution.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #67)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 10:53 AM

73. no.you are being silly. not every event is a conspiracy

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Response to roguevalley (Reply #73)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 12:58 PM

90. That was said about every conspiracy before it was exposed.

 

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Response to lalalu (Reply #46)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:52 AM

50. We know you're into hero worship

and ignoring "sworn testimoy" where people state under oath and penalty of perjury the FACTS!

Have fun in your alternate universe.

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Response to cosmicone (Reply #50)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:56 AM

55. lol!! n/t

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Response to cosmicone (Reply #50)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 10:01 AM

59. So now you think you "know" me?

 

If anyone is delusional and has a grandiose view of themselves it is you. You think you know someone because they disagree with you? That is pomposity and ignorance to the max.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #15)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:27 AM

20. It is some sort of vendetta

he never tested positive, and still they take away his win's. why in the world do we bother drug testing then?!
this whole drug testing thing has gotten way out of hand. I remember the days before all this BS.

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Response to RedstDem (Reply #20)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:38 AM

26. That is what bothers me the most.

 

He never tested positive and so they just used stories to convict him. I find it scary that they can get away with this.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #26)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:20 AM

40. Full of S%^T!

Again, you are wrong. You are buying into the LA PR hype. He tested positive for corticosterioids in 1991, and had a team doctor back-date a prescription so he could obtain a Therapeutic Use Exemption. He made a $125,000 donation to the UCI (Nike allegedly paid another $500,000) allegedly to avoid another questionable result. Retained samples tested using emerging testing technology also were suspect for EPO use.

Stop making this crap up. You have no clue what you are talking about.

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Response to djg21 (Reply #40)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:26 AM

42. The first sign that someone is losing

 

is when they engage in personal attacks. Your post is full of "allegedly" and you sound a bit hysterical. More proof that for some of you this is more a personal issue.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #42)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:54 AM

52. Personal attacks?

So far you're the only person on here engaging in that.

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Response to darkangel218 (Reply #52)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 10:03 AM

60. Once again you ignore proof.

 

I did not apply personal attacks to any poster. I attacked the actions of the agencies. Learn the difference.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #10)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:23 AM

17. So all the cyclists who've come forward, the French officials who'd suspected him for a long time...


.......... the U.S. anti-doping agency and the Cycling Association are engaged in a massive conspiracy against Lance Armstrong?

Did you read the report that was released a couple of weeks ago?


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Response to marmar (Reply #17)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:42 AM

29. Yes, and there was zero proof of

 

doping. It was all innuendo and stories.

The same accusations use to be made about people convicted in similar ways. Gee, you mean the whole village is in cahoots to convict you of being a witch? Gee, you mean the whole congress and American government is in cahoots to convict you of being a communist? Gee, you mean the whole French government is in cahoots to tarnish and imprison you Alfred Dreyfus?

In all cases the answer was yes. It is not as farfetched as you think. People with personal vendettas can have powerful allies.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #10)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:57 AM

33. You obviously don't know what you're talking about. You should never comment on cycling again. n/t

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Response to Dawgs (Reply #33)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:02 AM

34. Wow, so your response is to shut me down because

 

I point out they have no factual proof? They can convict Armstrong on stories only but any dissenting voices asking for proof and facts are to be silenced? This is just the type of mentality I am referring to.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #10)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:14 AM

38. If you have no idea what you're talking about, you probably shouldn't comment.

You admittedly never followed the sport. I presume that you never read the USADA report or the 800 pages of affidavits and other documentary evidence? This was no witch hunt, and you should stop buying in to the failed Pharmstrong PR effort.

There is irrefutable proof that Pharmstrong perpetrated perhaps the largest fraud in sports history. It's not only the fact that he used PEDs, but his bullying tactics and his coercion of teammates into also using PEDs.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #10)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:29 AM

44. So to call a doper a doper is a personal vendetta?

What about honor? Fairness? Truth? Avoiding lying and cheating for personal glory?

Yes, a personal vendetta. Sure.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #10)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:46 AM

47. Yeah, they did the same thing to Jerry Sandusky.

No DNA or physical evidence. Just a bunch of stories.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #10)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:52 AM

51. bullshit. there was simply massive and clear evidence.

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Response to lalalu (Reply #10)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:57 AM

56. Really? His team blew the whistle on him and it's a witch hunt?

Last edited Mon Oct 22, 2012, 01:09 PM - Edit history (1)

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Response to lalalu (Reply #10)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 04:34 PM

112. I bet you think Mark McGwire was clean too.

And Barry Bonds. Worship of sports idols is so childish and it makes me sick. This guy made millions being a total fraud.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:11 AM

11. Fuckin' shame.

As someone who thinks our society worships sports figures to an absolutely ridiculous extent, and who thinks that with the billions and billions of dollars in stake in pro sports, cheating goes on to a much, MUCH greater extent than we can ever imagine, I can't say I give two shits about Lance Armstrong. Maybe after all his endorsement and media deals dry up, he can console himself by buying himself a new Schwinn at Sears. Maybe he can even clothespin a playing card into the spokes.

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Response to Frank Cannon (Reply #11)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 01:28 PM

97. Can't argue with you about the worship of sports figures. I think it's ridiculous also.

I don't follow sports, and I'm about as athletic as the next snail you see sliming its way across the sidewalk. Lucky enough to marry a guy who didn't have the sports gene. Our kids were into karate instead of the usual school sports - at which they did not excel. So it just hasn't been part of my life. It was actually kind of a rebel pleasure NOT to be involved in - what's it called? Pop Warner or something? Whatever it is for kids' baseball or softball, and kids football or whatever - I don't even know, really. We were just so completely out of it in that regard.

I hate how the whole competition thing leads to such insanity - with parents fist-fighting each other in the stands and this killer competitive shit that is taught in school athletics. I hate how the big money and the hero-worship in this country always seems to go to lunkheads who can do nothing more than throw a ball or run fast or hit something (or someone) instead of to teachers, scientists, Nobel Prize-winners, and peace activists. Total weirdo here, I know. Probably, in many people's eyes, downright un-American. I think our priorities are just so cock-eyed sometimes. But I live with geeks and nerds and our daughter was the great student and our son was the music kid in school and distinguished himself that way. I remember how, in his graduation-class's yearbook, one of the candid shots of him was out on the playground. In the background you could see kids playing and balls bouncing and stuff going on, and there he was, standing there noodling around with his guitar that he brought to school with him sometimes.

I just don't get the hero worship of sports and sports figures. It's never made much sense to me. What's to worship? Abnormally-enlarged musculature? Pituitary cases? Sheer physical mass? We really have to throw such obscene amounts of money at that? It makes other people happy so I'm okay with it, but for me, it's a big fat "meh..."

So Lance Armstrong fell off his exalted bicycle seat. Yawn. When you hero-worship someone, chances are strong that they still have feet of clay just like everybody else. And it's YOU who winds up getting hurt the most. Especially when they cheat, as he evidently did according to the case that's been presented. Frankly, I don't like him for the cavalier way it appeared he treated his women. Sure threw poor Sheryl Crow over rather rudely. As I recall, he did that to his wife, too, some years earlier. Bruce Fucking Jenner did that to his wife after he made it big following his Olympics Decathlon win. And she'd been there for him when he was a nobody, through all the tough times and the long arduous training and she bore his children and held down the fort and kept the faith, and when his ship comes in, BOOM! Their marriage is over and here come the bimbos. SCHMUCK. He deserves how he looks now! So does der Gropenator, for that matter.

I'm always bemused during Super Bowl season and the finals of whatever sport it is or whatever championships there are of this or that. Super Bowl Day for us has always meant a great time to go shopping or something, because everybody's home watching and obsessing the game. And it makes no sense to me to have to sit through the game just to see the commercials.

That said, dear DU brothers and sisters, it's just ME and my weirdness. Go celebrate your sports and have a great time! I won't be there with you, which means there'll just be more room for how you want it!

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:18 AM

14. It's hard out here for an Armstrong nt

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:28 AM

22. They should have had a doping amnesty for all these old guys

Just about every one of Armstrons compeditors have admitted to it.

It's completely obvious Armstrong was doped too. Almost his entire team was, and the sporting director admitted to them using it. But also people like Jan Ulrich. Have you seen how Lance destroyed Ulrich in the mountains? Ulrich had no chance.

But if you have been training every day since you were a kid, then you find out that every top rider is using this stuff to win, you have three options.

1. Quit
2. Enter clean, never race for the big bucks, big contracts and never be famous or win anything.
3. Do what the others do.

Doping is like an arms race, a game of prisoners dillemma. Only when everyone are completely sure the others arent cheating will cheating stop.

They should have just given all the older guys amnesty, the entire sport was complicit in it anyway.

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Response to Lars77 (Reply #22)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:48 AM

48. So if everybody does it, it's OK?

Interesting perspective.

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Response to Nye Bevan (Reply #48)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 10:14 AM

64. You cannot apply todays standards on yesterdays cyclists.

I was merely explaining how cheating works and how to get rid of it. With transparency. Several teams are now publishing all their testing online so everyone can monitor the different values. This means that other cyclists feel like they do not have to cheat to compete with them.

Back in the old days everyone did it, so the playing field was even in a way. Instead of retroactively punishing them, they should have had an amnesty. But it would've had to happen in the beginning, not half way when some were punished. Now they all will have to be punished and several generations of riders and results tarnished.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:38 AM

25. Armstrong's legacy needs a thorough re-examination.

Now that his longstanding defense that he didn't take PEDs has been shredded, its time to start looking at the documented cases of blatant intimidation against anyone who dared question him over the years.

There have been lawsuits, reputations ruined, and much more. I think that a careful examination of what Armstrong has actually been all about will cast him in a much less favorable light.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:40 AM

27. A pity, but correct decision

Really, it was such an amazing story, sad its ended like this. For me, there's no choice and its the best possible move.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 09:55 AM

53. Good! Now if baseball would strip Sosa, Bonds, McGwire and the rest of the roid bunch it would

be a great day.

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Response to sarcasmo (Reply #53)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 11:26 AM

81. Agree. Baseball needs to get serious about PEDs and rid the sport of cheats.

 

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Response to byeya (Reply #81)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 01:08 PM

92. 61 in 61 still the record.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 10:00 AM

58. All our heroes are bastards

 

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #58)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 10:04 AM

61. spigotty ones?

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Response to darkangel218 (Reply #61)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 10:05 AM

62. They leak and drip and drive us insane with their noises

 

All night.

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #58)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 12:46 PM

87. All 'heroes' are human beings.

Some of us forget that. It's best to admire someone but I don't see the case for putting someone on a pedestal. Everyone fails at some point. It's human nature.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 10:46 AM

70. AND... he's probably no longer running to be governor of Texas.


http://74.208.199.156/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1585:lance-governor&catid=14:first-person-stories&Itemid=200006

BREAKING NEWS: Armstrong to Run for Governor of Texas

Written by Bob Cullinan
Friday, 01 April 2011


We now know why Lance Armstrong really retired.

In an early-morning announcement today on the steps of the Texas state capitol in Austin, the seven-time Tour de France winner declared himself a candidate for Governor of the state of Texas, just six weeks after his second retirement from the sport of professional cycling.

"I have a deep abiding love for the people and the potential of this state and this country," Armstrong said, "And when I see Governor Rick Perry threating to pull Texas out of the United States, I simply can not sit back and let that happen."

Armstrong went on to say that he will initiate a petition to recall Perry, who was elected to a third term in November of 2010. Perry's governorship is set to expire in early 2015, but Armstrong vowed to make sure Perry does not serve-out his full term.

"Rick Perry has made Texas the laughing stock of America, with his rants and raves against the Health Care Reform Act, and his threats of secession," Armstrong said. "Because of my work with the Livestrong Foundation, and my dedication to fighting cancer across America, I feel it is my duty to challenge Governor Perry's ignorant, narrow-minded view of how we Americans should treat and take care of one another."

If the recall effort is successful, Armstrong believes he can fill the void left by the absence of Perry. "I know Texas...Texas knows me...and I can assure you that as your Governor, I will make the health of all Texans my number one priority. And I will do it in a way that preserves our allegiance to the United States of America."

Armstrong would not say whether he would run for Governor as a Republican or a Democrat, chosing instead to say, "I will run as a Texan. That's all you need to know."

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 10:48 AM

71. So what is the take away from all this?

Armstrong is banned because he wasn't as clever as the other bikers in hiding his doping.

So they ban him for being stupid.

Folks, they are all doping. If you honestly believe that only armstrong is doping in a high profile, high money, high marking, professional sport, I have several bridges I want to sell you.

Here's my other post on this subject...

The dark side of corporate sport sponcorship...
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=1567986

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Response to Javaman (Reply #71)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 10:56 AM

76. no one likes him. hes mean to others.

Sanctimonious. His bad treatment of others won him no silence and no defenders

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Response to roguevalley (Reply #76)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 10:59 AM

77. he certainly didn't help himself.

Guys I knew that trained with him intimated that he was very full of himself.

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Response to Javaman (Reply #77)

Tue Oct 23, 2012, 04:42 AM

118. Having spent some time in racing in my teen years,

it seemed to me that just about everyone I met in racing circles was "very full of himself". 

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Response to Art_from_Ark (Reply #118)

Tue Oct 23, 2012, 08:11 AM

119. There is that too. nt

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 10:54 AM

75. The organized scam by the spandex clowns is over

hopefully.

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Response to proverbialwisdom (Reply #78)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 01:18 PM

93. They're the only ones.

Denial is sad, particularly here.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 11:38 AM

84. TDF Can't Find Anyone to Award His Titles To, Because they ALL Did It

All this attempt to vilify Armstrong for what every cyclist on the tour was doing seems rather arbitrary.

His real crimes were

1. Not being French.

2. Doing a lot more good in the world (his cancer work) than any other pro cyclist in living memory.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 12:06 PM

85. Apparently the entire sport has become corrupted and needs to be labeled as such.

 

The doping obviously runs deep and if their testing methods cannot detect properly, what good are they.

On a side note, it would be interesting to see if Armstrong's drugging held any promise for cancer treatment. That would be one good thing that came from this entire mess.

As for now, the entire sport is a farce.

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Response to humblebum (Reply #85)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 01:19 PM

94. If all cyclists dope, TV coverage/sponsorship should end

pronto. That is NOT what we should be teaching our children.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 12:59 PM

91. Well of course this is a huge smear campaign against a conpletely innocent person.

 

This is just a coordinated effort to bring him down. He is innocent as a newborn baby.

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Response to Safetykitten (Reply #91)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 01:24 PM

96. I thought that at first, too, but there is just too much to deny. However,

 

he is not alone and the entire sport needs to be investigated from top down.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 02:35 PM

101. Update: SCA Promotions wants its $7.5M back.

http://espn.go.com/olympics/cycling/story/_/id/8537796/texas-insurance-firm-asks-lance-armstrong-repay-75-million-bonuses

A Texas insurance company said Monday it is demanding the return of $7.5 million in bonus money paid to dethroned cyclist Lance Armstrong.

On Monday, after the International Cycling Union (UCI) announced that it would strip all of the Tour De France titles from Armstrong based on the report of his use of performance-enhancing drugs by the U.S. Anti-Doping Agency, a representative for the company confirmed to ESPN.com that it would now ask for the money back.

"The bonus that was owed was based on the premise that Lance Armstrong was the winner of the Tour De France," said SCA's lawyer Jeffrey Tillotson. "He is no longer the official winner, so it would be improper for him to keep those funds."

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 02:46 PM

104. Seriously depressing... I was a huge fan... watched almost all those tours

Makes me kind of sick to my stomach. 7 straight titles... gone.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 03:08 PM

107. Does this mean that Miguel Indurain (the modest champion) is the greatest ever?

Unlike other Tour champions, Miguel was a modest and humble competitor and rarely stepped into the limelight.

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Response to Supersedeas (Reply #107)

Tue Oct 23, 2012, 06:29 PM

125. LOL

Indurain was the biggest doper there was.


It's perfectly natural for a "clean" 6'2" 170lb guy to hang with the best climbers in the world during the height of the EPO era.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Mon Oct 22, 2012, 08:15 PM

117. What a Con Job

 

Lance Armstrong is a victim of hypocrisy and a real con job perpetrated by his enemies in the bicycling world. It has never been proven that Lance took performance drugs over so many years.

What should be investigated is the French Sponsors and Tour De France Officials.

United States television should black out the race in 2013. I refuse to watch this abomination.

We as a Country have failed to stop the illicit use of Drugs and have lost the War.

Decriminalize and treat this scourge as a health epidermic.


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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Tue Oct 23, 2012, 12:04 PM

120. Ah the puritan hand-wringing over obvious chemical assistance

Next we'll have people shocked - shocked I say - that Mr Olympia uses HGH, and yet certain that all his competition simply eat lots of protein.

The farce is not the doping - it's the absurdity of pretending that doping is not universal at that level.

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Response to dmallind (Reply #120)

Tue Oct 23, 2012, 01:16 PM

121. I suppose it is rather convenient in this day and age to label

I suppose it is rather convenient in this day and age to label a desire, a wish, and an expectation of sportsmanship and honor to " puritan hand-wringing..."

I.e., 'the convenience though is not the labeling, it's the absurdity of rationalizing chemical assistance.'




Yet I'm the first to concede that our personal expectations of humanity in general are most probably set at two very different levels.

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Response to LanternWaste (Reply #121)

Tue Oct 23, 2012, 05:00 PM

123. Desire? Perhaps valid. Expectation? Naive in the extreme, and repeatedly shown to be so.

Yes it would be fine if the only differentials in athletic performance were those granted by nature and hard work. But that doesn't give us any real reason to believe that this is so, and certainly no reason to be blind to obvious indications that it is not so.

There is no superiority of character in expecting that which is clearly demonstrated to be false, or feigning surprise and disappointment at the next demonstration in a long long series. There is only a rather transparent attempt to exaggerate disapproval and establish a moral high ground. It's somewhat analogous to parents who (hopefully only pretend to) think their teenager is always honest and polite and never swears, and remains ignorant of sex.

Elite athletes in any sport that generates significant personal rewards will seek a performance boost via chemistry. Feel free to wish it were otherwise, but it's disingenuous to pretend that it is otherwise.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Tue Oct 23, 2012, 02:52 PM

122. Here's what professional cycling needs to do. Draw a line in the sand and invalidate EVERYONE'S...

medals and records before this date. Don't take away their medals, just say ok we are resetting the record books at 0. All previous records and titles now no longer count (place an asterisk next to any mention of them in the history books, "earned before the reset"). Then going forward promise even tougher punishment, make it stick and make it fair. If one person in a team dopes the whole team / country is out no matter what. Ban them from all professional sport no matter the type. Doesn't matter what the others did or did not do. It's simple Mathematics from Game Theory. You have to make the potential losses if caught so large that they outweigh the potential gains if not caught.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Tue Oct 23, 2012, 05:19 PM

124. Cheating and lying are fine as long as you're not caught

That is the current American cultural standard. Lance Armstrong was a hero, and a winner until his cheating was discovered.

Here is a Yahoo comment on Armstrong:
"Everybody loves a winner. And apparently it is just fine and dandy to cheat-- unless you get caught in which case you're persona non grata. And its not just sports. Big Business is renowned for rewarding backstabbing, lying, idea stealing, cheating, brown-nosing etc. Take a look at the satirical "How to Succeed in Business Without really Trying" from the early 60s. This carries over to politics as well. In all cases, lip service is given to honesty, but winning apparently justifies breaking all the rules."

Look at Mitt Romney. He is lying at the same level as Armstrong cheated and doing it with impunity.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Tue Oct 23, 2012, 06:48 PM

126. Spam deleted by gkhouston (MIR Team)

 

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Tue Oct 23, 2012, 11:02 PM

127. What an asshole.

He knows he cheated, everyone knows he cheated and he knows that everyone knows he cheated but he still denies it.

I wonder if he has an ounce of self-respect left.

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Tue Oct 23, 2012, 11:14 PM

128. The apology Lance Armstrong will never give

The apology Lance Armstrong will never give
By Bruce Arthur, Postmedia News October 23, 2012 7:22 PM

.....I was a triathlon champion as a teenager, and I was the world road race champion at 21, and I came to Europe and watched Miguel Indurain pedal away from me like I was a kid. That was the 1994 Tour de France. He kicked my ass.

Then everybody started to kick my ass. EPO came in, and guys were so much stronger, so much faster. I could win one-day races, but I wasn't the greatest climber, and I had to withdraw in three of my first four attempts at the Tour; the other time, I finished 36th.....

....there are some things I'm sorry for. I'm sorry I ran Christophe Bassons, one of the sport's truly noble men, out of the Tour in 1999 for daring to say that you couldn't reach a top 10 at the Tour without doping. I'm sorry for attacking Frankie and Betsy Andreu for being in the hospital room with me in 1996 when I admitted to the doctors that I had used EPO, testosterone, growth hormone, cortisone and steroids. I'm sorry I sued our former soigneur, Emma O'Reilly, who wouldn't back down from the truth.

I'm sorry I called her a prostitute, and a drunk.

I'm sorry for attacking journalists like David Walsh and Paul Kimmage, who is still being sued by the UCI in what is as unconscionable a lawsuit as even I've ever seen. I'm sorry I told Christian Vande Velde to dope or get dropped from the team, and I'm sorry I allowed David Zabriskie to dope, because he got into cycling to escape his drug-addict father, the way I used it to pedal away from my absent father and my abusive stepfather and the emptiness of Plano, Texas. I'm sorry David broke down and cried the night he agreed to go against everything he believed in.

I'm sorry for sending a text message to Levi Leipheimer's wife Odessa after I found out he was testifying that said, "Run, don't walk." I'm sorry I threatened to blackmail Greg LeMond. I'm sorry for painting Floyd Landis as an unbalanced lunatic, and for telling Tyler Hamilton in an Aspen restaurant that I would make his life a living hell. I'm sorry that the International Cycling Union is so warped that its president, Pat McQuaid, called Landis and Hamilton "scumbags" on Monday. I'm sorry he was following my lead.....

Read more: http://www.ottawacitizen.com/sports/apology+Lance+Armstrong+will+never+give/7435491/story.html#ixzz2ABN73PPO

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Response to DanTex (Original post)

Tue Oct 23, 2012, 11:19 PM

129. Lance Armstrong is the Bernie Madoff of charities

I'm glad he's a celebrity against cancer, because most celebrities are in favor of cancer.

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