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Thu Feb 9, 2012, 11:57 AM

So Iran is our new “Enemy.” Are we going to fall for this crap again?

Too many Americans bought, and still buy, the WMD crap regarding Iraq.

Too many Americans bought the “War on Terror.”

And today, too many Americans are buying the lie that Iran presents a nuclear threat.

Is it about oil – again? Is it about some pipeline the oil companies want to build? Is it just one more convenient distraction from our real enemies?

Let’s get real. Our enemies are right here at home. They have names like Exxon/Mobil, Wall Street, Citibank, the GOP and … well you get the idea.

Does any rational person really believe that Iran is a threat to us, or for that matter, a threat to Israel?

The Iranian leaders are not insane. They know that their use of a single nuclear weapon (if they ever got one) would result in the total annihilation of their country. You want insane? Look homeward.

The whole “Iranian Thing” is total bullshit. If you have a different opinion, let’s hear it.

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Arrow 51 replies Author Time Post
Reply So Iran is our new “Enemy.” Are we going to fall for this crap again? (Original post)
Cyrano Feb 2012 OP
Dreamer Tatum Feb 2012 #1
ronnie624 Feb 2012 #31
arcane1 Feb 2012 #34
MattBaggins Feb 2012 #2
RKP5637 Feb 2012 #5
KurtNYC Feb 2012 #39
RKP5637 Feb 2012 #3
Blue Owl Feb 2012 #4
Tierra_y_Libertad Feb 2012 #5
RKP5637 Feb 2012 #27
Rex Feb 2012 #7
Cyrano Feb 2012 #10
Rex Feb 2012 #30
KurtNYC Feb 2012 #40
Rex Feb 2012 #49
xchrom Feb 2012 #8
limpyhobbler Feb 2012 #9
tjwash Feb 2012 #11
Eddie Haskell Feb 2012 #38
Autumn Feb 2012 #12
gratuitous Feb 2012 #13
KansDem Feb 2012 #14
MichaelMcGuire Feb 2012 #33
tabatha Feb 2012 #15
JustABozoOnThisBus Feb 2012 #16
Puzzledtraveller Feb 2012 #17
zbdent Feb 2012 #18
tabatha Feb 2012 #19
Mr Dixon Feb 2012 #20
Cyrano Feb 2012 #23
aquart Feb 2012 #21
Hawkowl Feb 2012 #22
socialist_n_TN Feb 2012 #24
KamaAina Feb 2012 #25
Puzzledtraveller Feb 2012 #26
Cyrano Feb 2012 #29
sabrina 1 Feb 2012 #28
tabatha Feb 2012 #35
Eddie Haskell Feb 2012 #36
Hell Hath No Fury Feb 2012 #32
greytdemocrat Feb 2012 #37
flexnor Feb 2012 #41
flexnor Feb 2012 #42
woo me with science Feb 2012 #44
flexnor Feb 2012 #45
woo me with science Feb 2012 #47
woo me with science Feb 2012 #51
flexnor Feb 2012 #43
NNN0LHI Feb 2012 #46
spanone Feb 2012 #48
flexnor Feb 2012 #50

Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:00 PM

1. So they're as gentle as kittens, huh?

Um, OK.

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Response to Dreamer Tatum (Reply #1)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:33 PM

31. Comparatively speaking, they are.

They don't bomb and invade other countries, and they're incapable of leveraging economic coercion against others. Next to a genuine aggressor -- The U.S. or Israel, as examples -- they do indeed appear as kittens.

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Response to Dreamer Tatum (Reply #1)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 01:22 PM

34. Yes, that's exactly what the OP is saying

Nice try

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:00 PM

2. Yet the drums of war will beat on

All the "moderates", or all the people who don't know their ass from a hole in the ground; will fall for it hook line sinker as they always do.

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Response to MattBaggins (Reply #2)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:02 PM

5. And the profiteers will prepare to line their pockets with more $$$. n/t

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Response to MattBaggins (Reply #2)

Fri Feb 10, 2012, 09:52 AM

39. Support for Iraq war did not go above 50% until AFTER we bombed Baghdad

People aren't as stupid as your post alleges but unfortunately it doesn't matter what the American public thinks about starting yet another war. C'est la vie -- c'est la guerre.

Three things that will happen in 2012:

- Hillary Clinton replaces Biden as VP (at DNC)
- US goes to war with Iran (September/October)
- Obama re-elected easily (Nov)

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:00 PM

3. Well said!!! n/t

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:02 PM

4. The MIC's got a gleam in its eye...

Looks like a big ol' dollar sign...

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:02 PM

5. What would the MIC do for money if there were no bogeymen?

Last edited Thu Feb 9, 2012, 03:41 PM - Edit history (1)

“The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary.” H.L. Mencken

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Response to Tierra_y_Libertad (Reply #5)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:29 PM

27. Exactly! This all reminds me so much of the cold war ... the communists

are in the country, the Russians are coming, the Russians are coming.

Now, granted, there are very distinct threats in the world, but often this stuff is made of the MIC wanting job security and big bucks. As said, we are menaced with an endless series of hobgoblins.

That said, I have no problem with nation defense, but often it's overblown IMO.

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:02 PM

7. New? LOL! Not even close.

Iran has ALWAYS been our enemy (google Great Satan), who here does not know that? NOW, does that mean we are going to have a war with Iran? Of course not, that is silly talk.

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Response to Rex (Reply #7)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:06 PM

10. Okay, nothing new here. But they've been conveniently brought to the forefront -- again.

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Response to Cyrano (Reply #10)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:32 PM

30. For political points...no doubt.

But we both know Obama is not going to start a war during an election year. Only a madman would do something like that imo.

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Response to Rex (Reply #7)

Fri Feb 10, 2012, 10:05 AM

40. the MSM "news" ad campaign for the US vs. Iran war has already begun

The question is not if but when. The PTB has had this on their calendars for about 10 years.

Look at the major bullshit they are hitting us with:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203920204577197421440415962.html

They can't even make up good lies for this one -- Iran is Shiite and Aryan, AQ is Sunni extremists and Arab.

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Response to KurtNYC (Reply #40)

Fri Feb 10, 2012, 02:46 PM

49. Well we know when it comes to war

telling the truth and getting facts right are not America's strong point.

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:05 PM

8. SHHHHH!11 -- we have drones to buy! nt

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:05 PM

9. rec. nt

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:07 PM

11. ...

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Response to tjwash (Reply #11)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 01:44 PM

38. Iran dropped the petro dollar.

That makes them a threat to the US empire and MICkey Mouse.

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:08 PM

12. We don't even have to fall for it. The media and politicians

will pound the drums and push for it just like Iraq .

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:08 PM

13. Being a threat to the U.S. has nothing to do with it

If Iran would just be reasonable, and hand over all that oil of ours they're sitting on, things would be nice and peaceful. For now. If they can't be reasonable, we'll just kill a few million of their citizens, declare the deceased as post hoc "militants" or "terrorists," and absolve ourselves of any war crimes or crimes against humanity.

Surprisingly, this nonsense actually passes for logic in the minds of some people.

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:08 PM

14. Of Bush's "Axis of Evil"--Iran, Iraq, North Korea--why haven't we invaded North Korea?

Because they really do have WMDs.

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Response to KansDem (Reply #14)


Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:09 PM

15. ***************** Five reasons why an attack on Iran will not work - Leon Panetta *****************

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:10 PM

16. Unless Syria beats them to it ...

But yeah, without Iraq, we need a new enemy.

Shock & Awe, Baby! Go, MIC!

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:10 PM

17. I hope not

the national anxiety level will be ratcheted up again, we do not need that, it's already made us cynical and at each others throats.

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:10 PM

18. It's amazing that George W. Bush didn't win the Presidency with Iran as his running mate ...

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:11 PM

19. *** !!! Throwing cold water on the war on Iran furnace, Obama has thus sent an important !!! ***

Equally important in Obama's five-minute interview, meaningfully inserted in the pre-Super Bowl television coverage watched by hundreds of millions around the world, was his admission that he did not "see any evidence" that Iran had the "intentions or capabilities" to mount a terror attack on US soil, thus contradicting last week's congressional testimony by James Clapper, head of US intelligence community, who accused Iran of engaging in such terror plots.

Throwing cold water on the war on Iran furnace, Obama has thus sent an important signal to Iran and the rest of the world that shows a more serious commitment on his part to engage in diplomacy with respect to Iran and its nuclear program.

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Middle_East/NB08Ak01.html

*** PLEASE STOP WITH THE BEATING OF THE WAR DRUMS FOR IRAN *** THERE WILL BE NO WAR ***

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:16 PM

20. Hold on

Side note: Understanding that you have issues with Propaganda for War, however I would like to warn you to that your illusion of freedom of speech is false, and recent articles suggest that you will be placed on a watch list with Rants like this. Recommend you speak the truth of the devils in a low, hushed voice among friends and not the entire internet. Just a suggestion.

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Response to Mr Dixon (Reply #20)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:25 PM

23. Given some of my past rants, I may already be on their watch list

Nonetheless, if we don't speak up, who will? The alternative -- silence -- is total surrender. And that is unacceptable.

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:23 PM

21. Iraq & Afghanistan taught that we WILL invade non -nuclear nations on trumped up charges.

Iran got the message.

Seems to me that covert assistance to #iranelection survivors would be more helpful.

And I applaud the carefully-targeted assassinations that someone or other has been using to keep Iranian casualties to a minimum.

The war profiteers are worried about their bottom line. Other than that I see no reason for gearing up to fight Persians...except possibly to make Arab allies more cheerful.

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:24 PM

22. We have ALWAYS been at war with central Asia!

 

Perpetual war since 1941.

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:25 PM

24. I was in a resturant yesterday and they had Faux Noise on.......

and there was a LONG segment about the Irani "threat" featuring a former Ambassador to Isreal (?). The sound was off, but you could hear the wardrums anyway.

Fuck it. I'm OVER imperialist aggression worldwide. Of course I've been over it for 40 or 50 years now.

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:27 PM

25. Oceania was at war with Eastasia.

Oceania had always been at war with Eastasia. Quite half the posters had the wrong faces on them. The agents of Goldstein had clearly been at work.

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Response to KamaAina (Reply #25)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:28 PM

26. Exactly!!

Thats what its beginning to feel like. Scary.

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Response to KamaAina (Reply #25)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:30 PM

29. Okay, KamaAina. It's obvious you don't like "Big Brother." Beware of room 101.

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:29 PM

28. 'Are we going to fall for this again'?

This time it's going to be even easier than Iraq. At least then, Progressives were not fooled. But look around and you will see the same arguments about the 'evil' torturer in Iraq made by Bush supporters, already coming from some on the left. And the right will remain silent mostly except to say that Demcorats 'waited too long' or whatever way they can find to use it politically, as there is never a war that kills 'ragheads' they would not support.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #28)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 01:26 PM

35. Who is spewing the crap. NOT Panetta, NOT Obama. Last I checked, they were in charge.

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Response to sabrina 1 (Reply #28)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 01:33 PM

36. Amen.

We've got believers right here in River City.

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 12:36 PM

32. "Are we going to fall for this crap again?"

Not me. But then again, I don't have a man-crush, so I am seeing perfectly clearly.

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Thu Feb 9, 2012, 01:40 PM

37. The naiveté, it burns!!!! n/t

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Fri Feb 10, 2012, 10:11 AM

41. In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence

 

Until the latest of our world conflicts, the United States had no armaments industry. American makers of plowshares could, with time and as required, make swords as well. But now we can no longer risk emergency improvisation of national defense; we have been compelled to create a permanent armaments industry of vast proportions. Added to this, three and a half million men and women are directly engaged in the defense establishment. We annually spend on military security more than the net income of all United States corporations.

This conjunction of an immense military establishment and a large arms industry is new in the American experience. The total influence -- economic, political, even spiritual -- is felt in every city, every State house, every office of the Federal government. We recognize the imperative need for this development. Yet we must not fail to comprehend its grave implications. Our toil, resources and livelihood are all involved; so is the very structure of our society.

In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the militaryindustrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist.

We must never let the weight of this combination endanger our liberties or democratic processes. We should take nothing for granted. Only an alert and knowledgeable citizenry can compel the proper meshing of the huge industrial and military machinery of defense with our peaceful methods and goals, so that security and liberty may prosper together.

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Response to flexnor (Reply #41)

Fri Feb 10, 2012, 10:19 AM

42. Eisenhower was getting at the definition of 'our survival'

 

everyone's perspective is biased by their own situation and interests. some more altruistic, some more selfish, but it's still true

what eisenhower was getting at, was that as more and more people depend on military spending, and that economic influence gained a louder and louder voice, that 'our surival' could mean 'the pentagon's survival', even if it were at the expense of the nation's survival

for many individual citizens, this has already come true, if they died in a war that could have been avoided, but was chosen for military spending interests

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Response to flexnor (Reply #41)

Fri Feb 10, 2012, 10:32 AM

44. World War III, when it happens,

"We must never let the weight of this combination endanger our liberties or democratic processes. We should take nothing for granted." -Eisenhower, 1961

Thank you.

World War III, when it happens, will be all about consolidating political and financial power for the one percent. It will be about driving entire nations into debt, restructuring political systems to assume control of nations and global resources, and subjugating a global workforce.

Our Democratic structures are already under attack.




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Response to woo me with science (Reply #44)

Fri Feb 10, 2012, 10:38 AM

45. 'The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist. '

 



"In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the militaryindustrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist. "

coming from a 5 star general (all time highest rank) and current outgoing republican president, that was a breathtaking statement

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Response to flexnor (Reply #45)

Fri Feb 10, 2012, 02:41 PM

47. +1000

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Response to flexnor (Reply #41)

Fri Feb 10, 2012, 05:43 PM

51. K&R

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Fri Feb 10, 2012, 10:27 AM

43. In 'The Fog of War' Robert Mcnamara said '1.Empathize with your enemy'

 

doesnt mean you have to agree with them, of 'sympathize' with them

it just means you have to consider what it must be like to be in their position

he's not some 'peace-nic' he was the vietnam era sec of defense

in the case of Iran, it means hundreds of nuclear missles in Israel pointed at you, and they claimed that you said you would 'wipe them off the map', (when you actually said 'the regime would vanish from the pages of time' much like the soviet union - but russia was hardly 'wiped off the map'). Additionally, they see a wold where nuclear powers are in 'The Club' and everyone else gets walked on. India rattled it's sabre with nuclear missile tests in the 1990s, and Clinton handed them the computer industry as 'soft influence' (thank's Clinton, I didnt need that career anymore)

1.Empathize with your enemy
2.Rationality will not save us
3.There's something beyond one's self
4.Maximize efficiency
5.Proportionality should be a guideline in war
6.Get the data
7.Belief and seeing are often both wrong
8.Be prepared to re-examine your reasoning
9.In order to do good, you may have to engage in evil
10.Never say never
11.You can't change human nature

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Fri Feb 10, 2012, 10:46 AM

46. The Iranian leaders. Who is the actual top Iranian leader?

President Ahmadinejad? Ayatollah Khamenei?

Who is in charge and who do we contact to negotiate with in the event of a crisis?

I am not really sure myself.

Don

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Response to Cyrano (Original post)

Fri Feb 10, 2012, 02:42 PM

48. iran has been on our shit list for a long time...

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Response to spanone (Reply #48)

Fri Feb 10, 2012, 03:00 PM

50. and we've been on theirs since 1953

 

when we veto'd their democratic election

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