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Wed Dec 19, 2012, 02:58 AM

 

Chained CPI: If my heating bill goes up & I stop heating my house, my bill didn't really go up.

I just "chose" not to heat my house, capish?

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Reply Chained CPI: If my heating bill goes up & I stop heating my house, my bill didn't really go up. (Original post)
HiPointDem Dec 2012 OP
Ed Suspicious Dec 2012 #1
Luminous Animal Dec 2012 #2
HiPointDem Dec 2012 #3
Scuba Dec 2012 #22
HiPointDem Dec 2012 #24
closeupready Dec 2012 #44
JDPriestly Dec 2012 #4
Pretzel_Warrior Dec 2012 #5
DefenseLawyer Dec 2012 #6
graham4anything Dec 2012 #7
HiPointDem Dec 2012 #8
graham4anything Dec 2012 #10
HiPointDem Dec 2012 #11
graham4anything Dec 2012 #23
HiPointDem Dec 2012 #25
Fumesucker Dec 2012 #26
graham4anything Dec 2012 #33
spooky3 Dec 2012 #59
tama Dec 2012 #56
graham4anything Dec 2012 #57
tama Dec 2012 #60
DetlefK Dec 2012 #13
pecwae Dec 2012 #14
graham4anything Dec 2012 #27
MannyGoldstein Dec 2012 #36
frylock Dec 2012 #43
graham4anything Dec 2012 #50
1monster Dec 2012 #16
graham4anything Dec 2012 #28
canoeist52 Dec 2012 #42
graham4anything Dec 2012 #53
WinkyDink Dec 2012 #30
EOTE Dec 2012 #34
tazkcmo Dec 2012 #52
plethoro Dec 2012 #9
graham4anything Dec 2012 #29
WinkyDink Dec 2012 #32
progressoid Dec 2012 #12
grahamhgreen Dec 2012 #41
annabanana Dec 2012 #15
jtuck004 Dec 2012 #17
HiPointDem Dec 2012 #18
jtuck004 Dec 2012 #21
Faryn Balyncd Dec 2012 #19
eShirl Dec 2012 #20
graham4anything Dec 2012 #31
HiPointDem Dec 2012 #35
eShirl Dec 2012 #39
sendero Dec 2012 #38
eShirl Dec 2012 #40
sendero Dec 2012 #37
meow2u3 Dec 2012 #45
madfloridian Dec 2012 #46
meow2u3 Dec 2012 #48
leftstreet Dec 2012 #47
No Compromise Dec 2012 #49
Cleita Dec 2012 #51
tama Dec 2012 #54
HiPointDem Dec 2012 #55
tama Dec 2012 #58

Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 03:03 AM

1. Only an economist...

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Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 03:11 AM

2. If hotdogs become too expensive, I can choose to go to a soup kitchen!

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Response to Luminous Animal (Reply #2)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 03:13 AM

3. if medical bills get too high, i'll just remove my own tumor -- or maybe have the neighbor do it!

 

no problem! diy! self-sufficiency!

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Response to HiPointDem (Reply #3)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 07:05 AM

22. Charter hospitals, staffed not by real doctors and nurses, but by folks who just want to try it.

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Response to Scuba (Reply #22)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 07:11 AM

24. it's a logical extension of the 'five weeks' training & you can be a teacher!' theme. surgeons will

 

probably need a couple of months, though...

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Response to HiPointDem (Reply #3)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 01:51 PM

44. Choosing to laugh here rather than cry.

Feels better. Freedom of choice. Why can't poor people choose to laugh at poverty, too? See how that works? That's freedom.

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Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 03:30 AM

4. We live in Southern California and have a relatively small house, but we only heat the front part

of it already. We live frugally and make ends meet.

Cutting the COLA will really hurt seniors in the Northeast and other cold areas of the country. This is not acceptable.

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Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 03:33 AM

5. Yeah. Their illogic is astounding. Old people buying cat food instead of tuna is a substitution--noy

 

Trading for inferior product!! Reusing catheters at home is a choice to recycle--not a forced choice based on rising prices.

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Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 03:43 AM

6. Amazing

This bit of cynical right wing trickery should be mocked and scorned, yet it's the President who has now given it legitimacy. Unbelievable.

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Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 03:48 AM

7. Wrong analogy. If you drink coffee and don't go to Starbucks, you can still drink coffee.

 

and rates go up and down.

and 10 years from now is a long time.

With a robust economy, those working who are 50s now, will be able to save 10.50 a month to offset a little tax increase.

Who said those in the future would not be taxed different?

Of course, those who worked 50 years ago got 1/2 the money in salary they get now
Because money now is different

BTW-back then, only one person in a household worked mostly, and more people had jobs because all the kids were drafted and out of the work force

Now we have 2 workers in a family, and all kids needing jobs

Things don't remain constant

But people seem to like to whine and forget trivial things like that.

So instead of Starbucks, drink a can of soda, for the price of 1 starbucks, you can have 12 pacs of soda and get the caffine one needs to survive

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #7)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 03:51 AM

8. bullshit. the average SS benefit is $1200 a month, & 1/3 of recipients rely on SS for 90% or more

 

of their income. do you think they're all sipping starbucks lattes?

2/3 rely on it for half or more of their income.

no matter what the economy does, SS will still be using chained cpi if this goes through.

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Response to HiPointDem (Reply #8)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 04:08 AM

10. Why is there an obesity problem in America?

 

Because people like to feel good at the moment and buy and buy and buy and buy

Why are so many people missing Twinkies now that they are gone
Because they like the immediate pleasure those gave, even though it caused them to get fatter and fatter and fatter

They liked to get get get whatever they wanted to get that pleasure

Yes, they work hard and all. But they played harder.

What is the difference between boomers as kids and the kids who now have boomers for parents aging faster and faster?

Most boomers knew they were getting a pot of gold some day from their parents, who of course over indulged us/them from day one.

anything and everything they wanted was attained

and they relied on their parents for leaving them a pot of gold to live the rest of their life on.

Then they started getting those riches. Except, instead of saving for the future, they like most LOtto winners spent it all on more Twinkees and instant gratifications that they wanted.

Social Security is nice to have. But it wasn't meant to be an end all.


Wish we had what France had, but of course, most people think France sucks because they are told that.
But France doesn't have a social security system. NONE.

instead, they automatically have a retirement, that was paid for with more taxes than we pay while working, but along with their free health care and other great stuff, have retirement money being that they aren't so freakin' fat from eating Twinkies

The irony is- the French are called Lazy.
No, they are not lazy, they work as hard as anyone.
They just are happy
Because they have wellness both inside and out
And they pay through the nose a bit more in taxes than we do
But only when working

If ill or retired, then they don't have to worry.
But imagine the uproar if we went to their tax system

It's not instant gratification until one at any age gets sick. Then they see the system kick in perfectly(or as near to perfect as one can get and nothing is absolute).

btw, giving up a twinkie or cup of Starbucks a day, and saving the couple of bucks a day goes a long way to having a great bank account by the time you retire.

Of course, not doing that then, leads to problems later.
And it's not anything another $100 a month helps much of.(or $100 less.)
That is just what about 3 bucks a day.

That won't even get you a cup of coffee at Starbucks.

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #10)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 04:13 AM

11. yeah, seniors are fat, therefore we can steal the money they paid into SS during their working

 

lives.

boomers were indulged as children (albeit they already paid for their parents' SS & their own), therefore they deserve to eat catfood in their old age.

the new voice of the kinder, gentler, democratic party.

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Response to HiPointDem (Reply #11)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 07:10 AM

23. Could it be you are only thinking of yourself? Me, I am for higher taxes for all but the poor

 

so down the road we have more achievements.

I would stand for 20%, 30% more taxes now, to live better later

Would you?

Do you know how government works?
It works on money.

Money from taxes. No other way but taxes.

It's a catch-22
You can't raise taxes then they whine about cutting back

It has to remain constant so I hereby want more taxes and the say, first $50,000 can be tax free. But everyone gotta pay the taxes. And zero means zero across the board. So throw out that retrogressive tax response.

And for all the carping over the 1%(whomever they are???People stereotype bankers, yet Walmart has more money than any banker does and has ruined more lives than any banker)
At least people on Wall Street who work 9 to 5 make a decent wage. Walmart makes billions and pays zippo. I am tired of stereotypes.

So, do you agree, all those between the ages of working til retirement pay more now
get back tenfold later.
Except for the poor.

BTW-why doesn't the poor whine? Why does only some in the middle whine?
The poor have it a zillion times harder, yet they don't whine.

There is a reason for that.

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #23)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 07:12 AM

25. you must be a mole working against the democrats, your arguments are so bad.

 

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #23)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 07:12 AM

26. You are for higher taxes on the poor too, sales taxes are among the heaviest taxes the poor pay

And I know for a fact you are pro-raising sales taxes because we have discussed that before.

Hell, you actually think progressive income taxes are socialism.

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Response to Fumesucker (Reply #26)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 07:29 AM

33. no, as I said those making under $50,000 don't pay any tax, across the board

 

so no.

But how do you think your street gets the snow removed? Mr. Osmosis comes to town and does it?

And you are misquoting what I said anyhow- I am for the same tax on the internet that one would pay in a retail store. If I shop at Macy's and buy whatever, that should be the same tax online. It is costing states billions collectively not having that money.
There is no reason for the internet to be tax free.

You go to say a Office Max and buy any item, why should it be tax free online?
That is gaming the system, and puts mom and pop out of business as they can't compete.
Only Walmart makes out because of well, they game the system everywhere.

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #33)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 05:32 PM

59. If Office Max operates in your state, you DO pay sales tax when you order OM stuff online.

Even if you never, ever shop in the brick-and-mortar store.

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #23)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 05:13 PM

56. How government works?

 

It taxes you to fund enormous imperialistic military machine to rob other nations and paramilitary police force to keep local people controlled e.g. when they demonstrate against corruption and destruction of environment and livelihood of future generations.

David Henry Thoreau called for civil disobedience and refusal to pay taxes to fund imperialistic wars. SS to my understanding is not a tax, but more like mutual fund.

And btw a real government of and for the people would create money - if that was considered necessary - by paying citizen salary to each citizen, not externalizing the money creation to private banks and fractional reserve banking to make practically all citizens debt slaves to private capital.

PS: poor don't whine because they show the finger or just ignore your politicians.

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Response to tama (Reply #56)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 05:24 PM

57. NO to anarchy. and Obama's REAL fans love what he is doing in total and not based on one wedge

 

If only people back in 1968 realized what they were doing by ditching him when he would have won against Nixon instead of tossing him aside over the war.

Everything else he did was the greatest. And the war would have happened to anyone and everyone else anyhow.

Don't make the same mistake again.

If life can become perfect, then SS won't even be needed to live a perfect retirement

and YES, I would want a system like France. Only pay when you can work, get all the benefits when you can't. Carry it forward one for all and all for one.

I don't much like class warfare, because the poorest of the poor get hurt more than the middle class, because the middle class has more to start off with (broadly of course, individual circumstances vary).

And you can get rid of all the rich, but then what???
Who will one blame if the rich are gone and the same problems exist.
The rich do not have enough money to make a difference in what is needed

(like a many billion dollar infrastructure across America, bridges, roads, railroads again
with jobs and jobs and jobs for all, and financed say by bonds
There is a novel concept

(like they had War Bonds in the past)

But Obama can't snap his fingers, he isn't a dictator
(and remember when Bush said that? You know something ironic enough, he was correct that one time)

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #57)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 05:36 PM

60. Re class warfare

 

whether you like it or not, the upper classes are waging it to became and remain upper classes. Your only choice is to pick side or try to stay out of it as best as you can.

Rich people etc. bosses - the point of "anarchy" is that without them to blame and/or worship you would have to start taking personal responsibility&freedom and think and feel by yourself, grow up, find self confidence and grow a spine. Easier said than done, sure, but what are we here for if not to learn and grow as human beings?

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #10)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 05:18 AM

13. Because people buy cheap, unhealthy crap?

It's easy: healthy food is too expensive.

grain-musli vs. sugary cornflakes
fruits vs. chocolate
dried fruits and roasted nuts vs. potato chips
a handful of vegetables for a soup vs. a pizza
the tasty, rich meat of an animal that was allowed to roam vs. the bland meat of an animal that was caged its whole life
...

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #10)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 05:28 AM

14. You didn't really say that did you?

Twinkies, the French and Starbucks have nothing to do with our social security. Nice to have? Nice to have? Do you not realize that SS has become the only income many seniors have? Just $3 makes a hell of a difference when you have very little to start with.

Your post is stone cold.

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Response to pecwae (Reply #14)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 07:12 AM

27. But nobody is touching today's seniors money. That is the red herring in these hate Obama threads

 

It is down the road

So people today have the opportunity to adjust.

And, yeah, Jeb Bush will be getting you alot more.
How's that Nader 2000 thing work out for you?

And I will stand for more taxes now for everyone over the first $50,000 because taxes are how government works, and thanks to Ralph Nader the gov't went bankrupt because of 9-11
which would not have happened had Al Gore been President. But last I looked on my placemat, neither he nor John Kerry were pictured, thanks to Ralph Nader.

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #27)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 08:08 AM

36. Social Security was designed to prevent poverty in the elderly

IIRC, poverty among seniors was down to 5%, but is growing again. It will grow more as the COLA is cut simply to help the wealthy, and with further dismantling.

Social Security is a backstop - but that backstop is becoming increasingly insufficient.

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #27)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 01:48 PM

43. are you a current recipient of social security benefits?

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Response to frylock (Reply #43)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 03:06 PM

50. nope. So I am not already covered by it not starting now.

 

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #10)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 05:47 AM

16. Why do so many poor people struggle with weight problems? Because good nutritional food

costs more than the empty calorie foods, that's why.

I know that the quality of the foods I've been buying with my paycheck have gone down, down, down, even as the price has gone up, up, up. I used to be able to buy quality foods for half of what I'm paying for groceries now, like I used to be able to do, but it wouldn't be enough to feed my family for half the month.

You really don't know what you are talking about. Starbucks coffee? No. Not even McDonald's coffee.

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Response to 1monster (Reply #16)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 07:17 AM

28. That's why I do love Mike Bloomberg & what he has done to reframe health care in NYC

 

of course you all whine about that liberal from Boston and call him names of all sort

but what he did has will continue to make major strides in wellness
(let alone his gun stances)

but keep calling good people the 1%.

I myself don't drink coffee at all. I drink diet soda. Get my caffeine at about 25cents a can on sale almost every single week (but not at Walmart which does not discount soda).

I wonder who was the first person that made the word taxes bad.
Too bad that was never repudiated. Because all the good things we ever have, come from taxes.

The government would be better off pricing everything with no variation.

BTW-why not reign in doctors and give them a salary, or set price for everything, mandated by the federal gov't?

With wellness, there are less bills, more money in pocket.

Wish we had France's system. It works. Well. And they don't have social security at all.
But they have a fine retirement.

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #28)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 11:02 AM

42. Diet soda has been implacated as a cause for the drop in empathy levels.

Makes just as much sense as what'cher sellin'.

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Response to canoeist52 (Reply #42)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 03:25 PM

53. lol

 

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #10)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 07:25 AM

30. The 55,000 Boomers who died in VietNam thank you. The rest of us in our 60's don't do Starbucks.

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #10)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 07:32 AM

34. I've seen a lot of stupid, heartless posts here, but yours might take the cake.

Americans are so fat we can afford to fuck over our seniors! Mind numblingly offensive AND stupid. Throw in some mindless pablum about guns and you'll have hit the trifecta of stupidity.

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #10)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 03:21 PM

52. Hmmm...

10.00 x 32=320 x 4=1280 before taxes. I haven't had a Twinkie since I was in high school. Guess I'm rich!

BTW, $3.00 is my daily food budget.

Not whining, not complaining, that's just my reality. It's the folks I know that are worse off than me I fear for.

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #7)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 03:58 AM

9. Total baloney. We've had ultra low interest rates for a long time. Once they take off and inflation

 

rears its head, that chained CPI will kill thousands. Switch from Starbucks to coffee? This is what you've gotten out of the chained CPI methodology? Jesus...Get a calculator that does present value quotes and start using comparisons between real CPI and chained CPI rates for 20 years.

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Response to plethoro (Reply #9)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 07:19 AM

29. Well, what about my health insurance? Gone up 15% every year for 20 years, except for last 2

 

because of President Obama.

It is $3000.00 a month

(yet those that whine are paying like $100 to $200 a month and theirs may go to $250...
forgive me if I don't feel sympathetic as they take that benefit tax free from a corporation or biz that they also put down for being the 1%, while those without a company or corp. pay thousands a month and a deducatable on top of that for a family.

My health care should be $200 a month, and I could bank $2800 a month every month.
Yet you don't see me whining.

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #29)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 07:25 AM

32. You're plain nuts. Call Blue Cross for REAL rates.

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #7)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 04:48 AM

12. Except that most already don't go to Starbucks.

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #7)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 08:51 AM

41. Since SS does not add to the deficit - WHY IS IT ON THE TABLE?

easier to cut cororate loopholes or wars.

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Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 05:35 AM

15. Yup.. And those trips to the ER?

just another choice

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Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 06:02 AM

17. The SS FAQ says there are 38 million beneficiaries 65 or older. Avg check in Oct 2012 is $1132.

We should increase that, it's not enough. Instead people try to live thusly:

Rent $500
Utils $200
Food $300
Transportation and Misc $100
The balance might go in fees paid to banks to keep or use your money.

Most people who haven't tried it would have a hard time with that much sudden deprivation.

It is a daily way of life for 13 million people that $1132 is the only thing between them and freezing to death, alone, in the dark. Or burning their place down, and sometimes killing themselves, when they try to stay warm by burning paper in kitchen oven when the power goes out.

Chaining the payment to CPI would further deprive those people, our neighbors, who would find cuts of $20 or $30 then later a few hundred in an already inadequate budget. Some find occasional assistance from varying sources that may or may not be there month-to-moth. And sometimes they are never there.

On average, of the crowd getting social security checks, that's 1 in every 3, or 46% if you just count those who are unmarried.

Is it our intention that people live like animals?

Clint Eastwood was in a movie called the Dead Pool, where a list was made of the hoped for dead. But Clint Eastwood lives in a silly play world. He talks to chairs.

These are real people, real moms and dads and kids. The ones who lived and worked and labored in this country for the past 40 years, no matter their contribution, with an expectation of some peace of mind. That's what a Democrat promised them we would work for in 1932, iirc.

Their pain is going to be very real, before they see an early death due to lack of nutrition, exposure, lack of medical care - all things we can prevent as easily as we can insure that Jamie Dimon take home tens of millions a year with taxpayer dollars, I am quite sure.

What kind of rot does there need to be in a person's spirit to deprive us a little more? How could someone be such a coward that they would let a 13 million of us, our brothers and sisters shiver in their dark, cold rooms while they pay $40 billion a month to the wealthy so their mortgage-backed assets won't decrease in value?

Well, at least there's the Internet. So when they have to rely on private charity like people did under Hoover, it won't work any better.(It was really bad if you were black, btw).

Maybe someone will do live interviews (hey, there's 13 million possible stories, should be some good ones, eh?) Live interviews about the impact on their lives.

And maybe give them a free picture of that Press Secretary guy (he reminds of the Harry Potter character, but then I never saw that movie either). He was talking about the need for shared sacrifice this afternoon. I'm sure that would stimulate a lively discussion. They could even keep the picture, in case they need to heat a can of beans.

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Response to jtuck004 (Reply #17)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 06:06 AM

18. if 1/3 of people were getting a social security check that would be over 100 million people.

 

i agree with the general sentiment expressed, though.

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Response to HiPointDem (Reply #18)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 06:50 AM

21. Meant to say 1 in 3 of that population - fixed it. Thank you. n/t

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Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 06:32 AM

19. ...you just "upgraded to natural air conditioning"

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Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 06:40 AM

20. Can I switch from switch from baloney to shit sandwich

and call it recycling

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Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 07:25 AM

31. Again, this isn't affecting any one retired now, therefore the whining is misplaced.

 

and by the way, most people did not live to retirement age when this first started, therefore they paid into the system but got nothing out of it, allowing others to get those people's.

With longer life span, it eats into system.

and again, last I looked, I did not see a bill passed at all.

The President has nothing to do with things anyhow

It's the congress that does. Why blame him for what they will sign?

It's the end of the world, vs. $50.00.

Alot bigger issues, like 100% amnesty/citizenship which directly will lead to more democrats in the southern states and better congress shortly so that they can pass even better stuff

but first we have to get there.

and those whining that they won't vote for democrats, well, jees, that makes so much sense, don't it??? (I am being ironic). NO it doesn't.
You are just hurting yourselves doing that, and hurting everyone who does vote for democrats.

After all, you claim to all love Bernie Sanders and the other few you claim to love, but who do you think voted them into office??? It wasn't the tea party or republicans you know.

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #31)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 07:56 AM

35. but it *will* affect people who are retired now, & people soon to retire, and basically everyone

 

who does retire. basically most workers in the US.

yeah, it's wayyyyyyy more important to get that amnesty so we can get more democratic voters in the south. getting more democratic voters is wayyyyy more important than WHAT DEMOCRATS DO ABOUT POLICY.

you must be a mole. the way you argue is guaranteed to turn people off the party, not generate enthsiasm for it.

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Response to HiPointDem (Reply #35)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 08:17 AM

39. That's right; it will affect everyone receiving Social Security now and in the future. n/t

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #31)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 08:15 AM

38. Social Security...

.. is funded for DECADES TO COME from the current and past revenues from the payroll deduction. There is NO REASON WHATSOEVER to mess with SS.

Medicare is another story but that is not what the chained CPI nonsense is all about.

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Response to graham4anything (Reply #31)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 08:18 AM

40. Did you get your talking points mixed up?

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Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 08:13 AM

37. The "hedonics" and other crap..

.. used to calculate the CURRENT CPI are a joke, they just want to add a new punchline.

I astounds me that word is Obama is ok with this.

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Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 01:58 PM

45. If human food is too expensive and I decide to live on cat food, the price of food went down

If cat food gets too pricey and I decide to starve, I "chose" not to eat. Then someone will find my body in my house.

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Response to meow2u3 (Reply #45)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 01:59 PM

46. Exactly, and the COLA went down because you couldn't afford human food.

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Response to madfloridian (Reply #46)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 02:01 PM

48. In other words, the Chained CPI is a vicious circle

designed to put us all in economic chains. It punishes people for economizing on their personal finances.

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Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 02:00 PM

47. DURec

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Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 02:26 PM

49. I get your point- but everyone's bills would drop drastically if we stopped Koch brothers

 

We need to Stop Koch and Goldman Sachs from ripping us all off
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022030269

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Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 03:08 PM

51. I haven't heated mine in three years. Of course I live in CA but it's been down to

forty this week. It's not a way to live though.

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Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 05:01 PM

54. Capish

 

and your ecological footprint went down, capish?

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Response to tama (Reply #54)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 05:04 PM

55. my ecological footprint will also go down when i die of hypothermia. what's your point?

 

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Response to HiPointDem (Reply #55)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 05:28 PM

58. TPTB speak Growth! Growth! Growth! in public

 

but (though there is no doubt much denial and dogmatic blind belief also in those circles) in private discussions and in terms of realpolitik they realize that the days of growth based of fossil capitalism are pretty much over. So they ride the beast of consumer society that abhors to be told the truth and also like to keep their class society prerogatives as long as they can -> "austerity".

Which zero (or negative) sum game in terms of historical dialectics spells out increasing social and class polarity, as people of the globe can less and less afford the parasitic upper classes. And in terms of global balance sheet, American and European OECD countries are the upper class parasites racing towards the bottom to meet Chindia etc. somewhere in the middle in terms of energy consumption etc.

That's the big picture, short and crude (pun intended).

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