defacto7
defacto7's JournalGees... the world has gone to hell
stupid completely gone to hell.
There's no affection left on the planet... it's either stand behind bulletproof glass or it's sex. There's nothing left of human caring. Defend , defend, defend, sue, sue, sue, fear, fear, shoot, shoot... Sometimes I see humanity's end looming just because we have lost the ability to care lost in a blur of fear. Damn the infinitesimally small bunch of perverts that have started it, damn the lawyers who have promoted it, damn the money that feeds it, and double damn the stupid that has taken over humanity.
I suppose in a way
as long as we retain and participate in our memory of our loved ones they are immortal as far as we are concerned. Like the words of Epicurus... "Death does not concern us, because as long as we exist, death is not here. And when it does come, we no longer exist." So to think in terms of our consciousness being the "only and all" we can know and our memories being the substance of our past experience, it's not a far reach to see ourselves and others as eternal... at least for the moments that we live.
I'm no economist.. but,
What makes us feel like the US debt means anything? at all? that is has any effect in the long haul except fear of it? We still have a debt for the Civil War that is unpaid but it has become insignificant due to the expansion of the US economy since then. Our problem is not with our debt to China or anyone else, our problem is a stagnant economy. Turn the economy loose through government program stimulus and the debt becomes a non contender at home or abroad. In that scenario, China needs us more than we need them, same with SA.
The debt is a smoke screen for fear mongering by the GOP which plays into their gutting of the US government and economy for the enrichment of corporations and other power structures... and in some extreme cases, to bring on a BS religious Armageddon.
Well, that's what I see.
Anger at what this country has become is not something to
be ashamed of. I understand your use of the word bigotry; I'm not sure it's the right word but you say what you feel. I feel a lot of anger and resentment toward those who have taken in selfishness and apathy thus basically destroying what America was meant to be from the beginning... free from tyranny, free from religious persecution, free to pursue happiness, and justice for all. That original foundation is crumbling underneath us and the feeling I have from that condition has no words I can express.
All we can do is fight and sometimes we must fight even when we know nothing will return. We just fight because it's right and we fight for our children and the future of humankind.
To believe or not to believe... it's a helluva question for some.
Our group has a small but interesting clientèle of people from across the board who share an interest in searching and sharing their views concerning belief and non-belief. Some of us have come to a conclusion that there is no deity or that we just don't know but we all share a quest for reality thinking. Sometimes we succeed and sometimes we fail but the end result is to learn from each other and form a community of searchers not bound to certain ideological positions that are taken for granted in other groups and forums. When we are able to build that community we also form a place to blow off steam in acceptance and understanding without repercussion. I think that is the reasonable outcome for any safe haven group.
Every once in a while, the Atheist and Agnostic group is visited by users who take positions that are contrary to it's ideals. Their positions are so virulent and accusing it makes me wonder why they are participating at all. They usually aren't trolls so to speak, they may be long term members of DU and also at times hosts of their own groups or even members of MER-T. It's been puzzling me for a while since it makes no sense that they intrude in this group as if they're trying to reform it or the subject. But now, I think I have figured out something, and I'll be the first to admit it's just conjecture on my part and may be bull shit but it's a possible answer to the dilemma of the disrupting nature of those who are compelled to "visit" and only contribute negative undercutting of it's constituents and their subjects.
Characteristics:
1. They claim at some time to be atheist, agnostic or non-believers.
2. Their points are baited with non-factual information about the commenter or the comment.
3. Their points are worded for the most effective disruption of the thread or a person.
4. They at some point resort to clear and outright personal insults based on bias without material reason.
5. They usually defend a religious point of view with a belligerent attitude.
5. They always project their own insults on the commenter; they blame to commenter for their own acts.
I think the issue is with their non-belief and actually, I don't think they are non-believers or agnostics at all. I think they want to be, wish to be, try to be, but they haven't reconciled their own fear of not believing and have a bent on defending any contrary position toward belief and religion in general. It may be they feel that vindicating or defending the beliefs they left or doubt will somehow relieve the guilt of being unable to relinquish those doubts. That would explain the extreme, untruthful and even hateful nature of their hit and run tactics and over the top anger geared to disrupt rather than reasoning together for the goal of understanding and conclusion.
This is a great place to share humor, angst, frustrations, ideas, information or anything that is in the spirit and interest of this group and I hope it does not meet the fate of other highly visible and disruptive groups who have no interest in reasoning with respect but rather cater to the reduction of all decent for the express purpose of decent alone.
I welcome any comments from those who participate in the spirit and good will of the A&A group and it's constituents but those who are bent on undercutting in A&A should just go back to the religion group or wherever it is you find your camaraderie.
These people have suffered enough
to earn the right to learn from the mistakes of the past and rise above the destruction by way of reality, not be encouraged to follow the way of the deception that stole their right to reason and kept them from advancing to a point where responsibility could replace mysticism. That responsibility could give them the means to protect themselves from such an event.
I wouldn't for a moment belittle them or degrade their humanity by encouraging false hope at the cost of knowledge and fact based hope. There's no contest there.
Absolutely.
Most average computer users have the unrealistic notion that computers are magic and should work just "because". They don't know the serious technical nature of the beast, the difference between hardware, software, networking and all the totally different languages they speak or can speak, and how that has to be choreographed with data from thousands even millions of different sources... THEN translated into a form that they, Mr. and Mrs. John Q. Public, can make common sense of. The people who do know or have at least the impression of the complexity are on three sides: those who are able and are trying to make the system work, those who are patient because they understand, and those who use the ignorance of the public to undermine the process for political gain. Which one do you think has the easiest job?
People have no idea what the system is made of. They play their "angly birds", write their email and do Facebook trusting that the system and it's lords will make it work.... and that is a very dangerous.
Education is sorely lacking. Lackadaisical attitude and childish demand are legion.
(Sorry for the goofy language. I write that way when I get pissed) 
It's easier to change your conscious logic
than to change thousands of years of mythological practice. That has bound to have made some genetic changes in our brains' evolution. People do "think" they see and hear things all the time and those things are very real to them. Others around them may want to see what they see, and it's a rather regular human characteristic to play along to the point of actually thinking you do see or hear those things when you actually do not. People in social groups that have strong rules or social boundaries don't want to be left out of the pack and being left out can be the biggest tool of those in control.
We need to practice reason, logic and facts... that practice can finally become a truth that helps distinguish the difference between reality and myth... then the demons and visions will disappear... and that would be the best thing that could happen to humanity.
And this is no small country...
315+ million population used to the easy life, at least easy relative to the rest of humanity, with the convenience of a seemingly and mistakenly untouchable religious culture.
The OP's premise is all well and good under logical, reasonable conditions. The democracy of the US has been successful, could have been more so, and may still be, under logical and reasonable conditions. What is happening to undercut our democracy is not the weakness of the constitution or the weakness of the administrative powers or the incapable disjointed congress, it's the weakness of it's people both in government and the general population to have been duped by a scheme to destroy it. How do you destroy a government? a democracy? You look for the human weaknesses and accentuate them slowly over time.
Our weaknesses? Our weaknesses are our strongest points turned inside-out:
Our advantage as human beings has been our ability to think... degrade that till we are a nation of dumb. Another advantage has been our ability to adapt.... accentuate greed and we become a nation incapable of reasonable compromise, empathy and civility. An advantage? Our ability to imagine and create.... twist that into impassable, unchangeable dogma that demands the world to see their imaginary vision as fact, indeed the demand to accept their belief or die, and you foster the inability to learn, to be incapable of learning. This is what has happened to us as a nation. We have become dumb and numb. We have become unable to see each others needs, joys, hopes, pain. We have become a nation burdened and drugged by the irrational.
We are not following the good natures of humanity, we have succumbed to our ancient nature which has made our government, our democracy, and ourselves as humans vulnerable. We are becoming incapable of expanding on our greatest advantages.
Personal rantette on the usefulness of religion.
I've become more convinced today with Syria on our minds that religion is and always has been ultimately an instrument to give people a comfort that allows them to die in battle for their leader and church without worrying about death. To glamorize death, to have an eternally perfect unimaginable happy place to look forward to if they perform their services unto death for their leaders. Of course if they fail... well.... there's always HELL! And there's always that warm feeling you get when you know you have helped send your enemy to suffer eternal damnation. They are the bad ones you know.
It's still happening today even in the enlightened west. Sometimes more subtle... a different angle... but it's still the same.
Religion ruins an otherwise decent planet.
Profile Information
Name: Defacto7Gender: Do not display
Hometown: Portland, OR
Home country: not sure anymore
Current location: depends on which proxy I'm using
Member since: Wed Aug 1, 2012, 01:44 AM
Number of posts: 13,485
