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VIDEO. Thanks, I love Carl Sagan and agree with him...

The choices didn't fit. But I'd say no, it won't.

DISCLAIMER: I am not Catholic, nor have I ever been one. I do not attend their church, know their prayers or understand the heirarchical nature of their organization. They would likely not consider me a 'real' Christian, but I don't mind. Some I have known have proven to be worthy friends and allies in causes I care about.

But the RCC can't become liberal or progressive in the social sense, despite good policies and actions. Regarding abortion, their position will not change, just as their position on the death penalty, euthanasia and extended medical care for prolonging life when a person is terminal.

The positions expressed are that the timing of all of those events are in God's hands and man should not interfere with that process. They do not approve of the termination of a disabled child or euthanasia to end the suffering of terminally ill persons. They do not want to see the disabled at birth starved to death, in order to spare the cost of their care.

There may be exceptions to all of this, as I only know what I read in the news of several kinds and those I know who have advocated in defense of care for the vulnerable.

Women dying from the issues in a pregnancy is natural and not an excuse for terminating the life of the child, or so it's been claimed. There may be variations on this, but I think that's the gist of their philosophy.

That all that can be done to save a life that is not terminal, save abortion, is okay. This has resulted in some evil being done.

IIRC, the last Pope to die was allowed to pass with no heroic measures to prevent his death, so they kept firm.

In the past, they protested the death penalty, nuclear weapons, the SOA and the wars consistently.

Nor will their positions on emigrants, education or health care change, but they will continue to push for more privatization of social services to bring them the needed funds for what they consider their mission, AFAIK.

Here is a link on the surprising positions of the Catholic church in Saltillo, Mexico regarding gays, lesbians and legalizing abortion. The Pope said regarding homosexuals, he has no right to judge them:


Good night.

I've always hated media conversations that have gone on decades - way back - on acceptable levels of

unemployment in this country. All said by smart alecs who are employed.

It's one of the most brutal forms of class warfare there is, to deny the energy and talent of those willing and able to work. It is dehumanizing and tells them that but for the luck of a straw vote they had no say in, they are to be discarded.

For those who have jobs, it's a constant source of fear as the existance of the unemployed is fertile field for bigotry and accepting discrimination against those without work and divides people. It's a potent threat to the survival of anyone who is not the beneficiary of inheritance or aren't in the investor class.

Reagan said while running for the office of president:

'A recession is when your neighbor loses his job. A depression is when you lose yours...'

The emotional point he is making there, that is true. He was attacking Carter based on semantics, not being upfront about the actions of his sponsors, the fossil energy companies who were determined to get Carter out of office because of his energy plan:

National Energy Program Fact Sheet on the President's Program.

April 20, 1977


They manufactured a crisis to make Carter's policies seem ineffective. The GOP also manufactured a huge PR campaign of right wing religion, homophobia, sexism, and racial bigotry. They opposed employing minorities in jobs held by white men for the most part. Carter's policies on civil rights in that area were changing the face of work environments and equality was going up and not down. They decided they had to stop him since inequality is how wealth is transferred from one group to another in a game of winners and losers. But there is never any peace.

Reagan made a permanent loss of jobs for millions of Americans in the working class and attacked unions all the way through his tenure. Meanwhile, the media joyfully sang the chorus of 'Greed is Good.'

The pundit class had their cavalier assessment of the necessity of people being kept unemployed for controlling inflation. But they were only speaking for Wall Street. This is in contrast to the policies of President Roosevelt:

Chasing Full Employment

By LOUIS UCHITELLE - February 12, 2006

President Franklin D. Roosevelt put full employment on the table in 1944, declaring that having a job was a basic human right. During World War II, the nation actually achieved full employment. And twice since then, Congress has considered bills that would have guaranteed a job at decent pay for every adult who wanted work. That doesn't mean everyone; lots of people don't want to work. But in a society that legislated full employment, the government would be the employer of last resort if the private sector came up short of good jobs for those who wanted them.

These are radical concepts today. Fear of another depression prompted the first debate, in the mid-1940's, and a steep recession contributed to the second, in the mid-1970's. Both bills, as finally enacted, failed to achieve their original goal. And as inflation rose in the late 70's, government shifted to fighting it, often at the expense of employment.

The old-timers who tried to legislate full employment saw it not as a desirable market phenomenon - the spinoff of a robust economy - but as a civil right, on a par with the right to vote. That is still the view of a few economists, including Amartya Sen at Harvard, whose writings on famine, poverty and other injustices won him the Nobel in economics in 1998.

"I know that people get scared of inflation and Wall Street is a natural ally in this fear," Mr. Sen said. "But the real costs of unemployment are very high. Having a job confers not only income, but social recognition and self-respect, which comes with having the sense of being wanted by society..."

A lot more on competing views of economics at the link here:


i will say it again; there is great profit to be made off the dehumanization and theft of wealth from others. We cannot have a just society without addressing the root causes of inquality.


One among many:

I like that little piece of poetry, regardless, and am stealing it.

Although I like this one, too:

What Is Life?

What is life?
It is the flash of a firefly in the night.
It is the breath of a buffalo in the wintertime.
It is the little shadow which runs across
the grass and loses itself in the sunset.

~ Attributed to Crowfoot (ca 1830-1890), chief of the Canadian Blackfoot tribe.

I do live in that community. It's the one Michio Kaku said we should have from 0:51 to 1:26:

When I see the 'nothing can be done' or 'they are all powerful' talk I know I am speaking to a person who has internalized this on an subconscious level, the conservative view, although they are not conservative in their awaked conscious. We have been drowning in this media environment for years.

Kaku talks about those who say that violence is 'just human nature.' That belief gives power to conservatives. I consider not voting or getting involved as that belief causing them to surrender.

There are few things in life as aggravating as trying to work these things out in a public sphere and face to face when confronted with this mindset, which I feel expresses both the worst of the LEOs and anti-LEOs beliefs about society and 'human nature.'

There is a better way, but not voting or refusing to get involved is accepting, unconsciously, being a victim. When I read such words as 'kill the pigs' that is the same camp as a conservative, IMHO.

Employing the methods of violence don't make life better, they only defer the solution to the problem. It's a huge failure, a last resort. A free, democratic society is a preventative medicine to that.

As far as making OPs go, I usually don't. as I get several requests. If you or anyone wants to use any thoughts I share to make one, feel free. Life if short, share the ideas.

BTW, I posted that video earlier, just because of that concept. Here it is, it long since disappeared off the page in V&MM:


Not much interest. Should I have posted it in GD?

Her targets are liberals, progressives and Democrats. Said that proved they are incapable.

Now, if they just would vote the *right way* they should be *allowed.*

Give up the freedom to think. We already told you what to think, but you didn't obey. Therefore, you are unqualified to vote!

This thread needs a dose of the truth. Tired, but still as needed as ever!

This is what they really believe. I have a more ominous version, but prefer this classic from 2009. Sorry if you've seen me post it before...

+1. Only thing is, if the voters are all gloom and doom, they'll get away with it.

Not voting or refusing to dirty oneself with local politics is not a neutral act. It is a subservient one to things going on that more involved communities do not tolerate.

If the majority believe government can never work for them and don't vote or vote a very narrow interest, they get exactly that. The We the People government is not us and them, it is We. They reflect our values.

If we don't fight hard enough for the things we stand for, at some point we have to recognize that we don't really stand for them.

~ Paul Wellstone

And using the generic 'you' in this rant, not specic to you, DUer:

Don't like the police?

Get into your community groups or visit the police and their supporters to find out what is going on. Don't wait until things go to hell. I mean it, go to the police station and talk. Tell them you're concerned about the path being taken and let them know you can't vote to fund such things from tax money, or explain to you why it was deemed legal by them. You may find that they did it with good intent, or they were being assholes.

They are the tools of the legislature and governor and follow whatever they are told they can do. This was obviously not a spur of the moment decision. It was planned out and all the medical people agreed to do it. Why?

Talk to legislators about why these things are legal. They make the law. Are they ignoramuses who don't care?

Let you know you do.

Don't approve of medical 'professionals' abusing a citizen the way is being done in NM?

Go to the hospital board meetings, find out who is paying for this, confront them for being tools.

Don't like the creationists putting their religion into public school cirriculum, the dumbing down of the coming generation by lack of history on labor, civil rights and the real history of this country, editing text book for wingnuttery?

Run for school board. We all know that wingnuts never miss a chance to get into office, and they show up at all the PTA and other meetings to push agendas.

Nothing's written in stone, not the New Deal or other programs. You can't count on the past to make your future. You got to be there.

And prepare yourself to deal with the wingnuts and shady characters since they'll be there with bells on and you have to deal with what is in place if you community has been asleep at the wheel.

It may show a person a lot about why things are not just dealt with by fiat from Washington, D.C. You may have to work with people you think are very wrong. While you are there, you will be forced to park your own ego. They think they and their ideas are as good as you think yours are.

Understand that the more deeply you hold your ideals, the more you are morally obligated to be pragmatic... Idealism without pragmatism is just a way to flatter your ego.

- Barney Frank

Why should theirs be the only voice?

Don't like the housing or the homeless situtation?

Run for planning board or attend those meetings for the public posted as 'land use actions' that come up since the developers will be there. Why not work to influence them?

P. S. Anyone who thinks these mundane things don't make a difference is kidding themselves. They create the basis of society.

Excuse me, I had to

Thought for a moment this would be another video I saw as the Rust Belt's eulogy:


Here in northeast Ohio
Back in eighteen-o-three
James and Dan Heaton
Found the ore that was linin' Yellow Creek
They built a blast furnace
Here along the shore
And they made the cannonballs
That helped the Union win the war

Here in Youngstown
Here in Youngstown
My sweet Jenny I'm sinkin' down
Here darlin' in Youngstown

Well my daddy worked the furnaces
Kept 'em hotter than hell
I come home from 'Nam worked my way to scarfer
A job that'd suit the devil as well
Taconite coke and limestone
Fed my children and make my pay
Them smokestacks reachin' like the arms of God
Into a beautiful sky of soot and clay

Here in Youngstown
Here in Youngstown
Sweet Jenny I'm sinkin' down
Here darlin' in Youngstown

Well my daddy come on the Ohio works
When he come home from World War Two
Now the yard's just scrap and rubble
He said "Them big boys did what Hitler couldn't do."
These mills they built the tanks and bombs
That won this country's wars
We sent our sons to Korea and Vietnam
Now we're wondering what they were dyin' for

Here in Youngstown
Here in Youngstown
My sweet Jenny I'm sinkin' down
Here darlin' in Youngstown

From the Monongahela valley
To the Mesabi iron range
To the coal mines of Appalachia
The story's always the same
Seven hundred tons of metal a day

Now sir you tell me the world's changed
Once I made you rich enough
Rich enough to forget my name

And Youngstown
And Youngstown
My sweet Jenny I'm sinkin' down
Here darlin' in Youngstown

When I die I don't want no part of heaven
I would not do heaven's work well
I pray the devil comes and takes me
To stand in the fiery furnaces of hell

Not sure which song makes me cry more, probably Springsteen's. Thanks for memorializing the men who lost their lives doing their job to take care of their families. A lot history is written around the Great Lakes.

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