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Waiting For Everyman

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Member since: Mon Jun 23, 2008, 12:17 PM
Number of posts: 7,857

About Me

My namesake... http://youtu.be/GgXzWhexJh0 ... If I were asked to recommend only one political / history book it would be this one... http://www.amazon.com/Treason-America-Anton-Chaitkin/dp/0943235006 ... Treason in America: from Aaron Burr to Averell Harriman, by Anton Chaitkin. I do NOT endorse all of the views by Chaitkin external to this book, nor all of his actions, nor all of his associations, but I DO highly recommend this book. It is one every US citizen and everyone interested in its history should read. It it well written, meticulously sourced, and it is eye-opening -- even for those who consider themselves already knowledgeable. If you have not read it before, you need to read it, it is need-to-know information, and what it has to say is not going to be found in many places, if anywhere, else. That is my tip for whoever is passing by.

Journal Archives

Politico: Pols, pundits weigh in on NSA report

This is a photo gallery, but the mix of opinions on this is worthwhile to see, and some DUers might not be able to go to a page that has pics.


“In digital era, privacy must be a priority. Is it just me, or is secret blanket surveillance obscenely outrageous?” Al Gore tweeted.

“This is yet another example of government overreach that forces the question, ‘What sort of state are we living in?’ There is clearly a glaring difference between what the government is doing and what the American people think they are doing,” Sen. Dean Heller (R-Nev.) said in a statement.

“I’m glad the NSA is trying to find out what the terrorists are up to overseas and in our country,” Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.) said on the Fox News show, “Fox & Friends.”

“As far as I know, this is the exact three-month renewal of what has been in place for the past seven years. … This renewal is carried out by the under the business records section of the Patriot Act. Therefore, it is lawful. It has been briefed to Congress,” Sen. Dianne Feinstein (D-Calif.) said.

“Why they would need that much data puzzles me. It just seems strange that they would collect all of that only to, I’m sure, drill down on certain aspects later on. That was a surprise and raises some questions that I think we ought to answer,” said Sen. Jeff Flake (R- Ariz.) to MSNBC’s Chris Jansing.

“This type of secret bulk data collection is an outrageous breach of Americans’ privacy. I have had significant concerns about the intelligence community over-collecting information about Americans’ telephone calls, emails and other records,” said Sen. Jeff Merkley (D-Ore.) in a statement.

“I’ve been a supporter of FISA and the FISA court process, but it does seem to me that on all fronts, the Obama administration is more expansive and aggressive — from drones to phone records — than the Bush administration,” Sen. Roy Blunt (R-Mo.) said.

“This is nothing new. This has been going on for seven years … every member of the United States Senate has been advised of this. To my knowledge, there has not been any citizen who has registered a complaint. It has proved meritorious because we have collected significant information on bad guys, but only on bad guys, over the years,” Sen. Saxby Chambliss (R-Ga.) said.

“I think if what you’re trying to do is avoid the kind of terrorism that occurred in Boston or the kind of terrorism that almost occurred in Times Square a couple years ago, I am for whatever it takes as long as it’s restricted to the National Security Agency and doesn’t get involved in looking for criminal behavior or other kind of things,” Newt Gingrich, speaking to CNN’s Piers Morgan.

“When is it legitimate to gather this private information on citizens and collect, extort, and use it? That is going to be a conundrum for lawyers and policymakers going forward because technology is driving this right now. Our ability to gather so much information on individuals and store it on something as big as a microchip really changes the way we do this. That moral point, that ethical question is going to be permeating throughout this discussion going forward,” said former RNC Chairman Michael Steele to MSNBC’s Thomas Roberts.

“Within the last few years, this program was used to stop a terrorist attack in the United States. We know that. It’s important. It fills in a little seam that we have, and it’s used to make sure that there’s not an international nexus to any terrorism event that they may believe is ongoing in the United States,” Rep. Mike Roger (R-Mich) said.

“Drone strikes. Wiretaps. Gitmo. Renditions. Military commissions. Obama is carrying out Bush’s 4th term, yet he attacked Bush for violating the Constitution,” Ari Fleischer, George W. Bush’s press secretary, said.

“The United States should not be accumulating phone records on tens of millions of innocent Americans. That is not what democracy is about. That is not what freedom is about,” Sen. Bernie Sanders (D-Vt.) said.

“Never thought I would agree with Al Gore but in the case of the #NSA he’s right. The secret blanket surveillance is obscenely outrageous,” Rep. Lee Terry (R-Neb.) tweeted.

“Civil liberties are incredibly important in this country and to have a FISA court basically give a perpetual court order of telephone records …I think it goes against what this country is founded on.” Sen. Jon Tester (D-Mont.) said on MSNBC.

“The American people have a right to know whether their government thinks that the sweeping, dragnet surveillance that has been alleged in this story is allowed under the law and whether it is actually being conducted. Furthermore, they have a right to know whether the program that has been described is actually of value in preventing attacks. Based on several years of oversight, I believe that its value and effectiveness remain unclear,” Sen. Ron Wyden (D-Ore.) said.

“The National Security Agency’s seizure and surveillance of virtually all of Verizon’s phone customers is an astounding assault on the Constitution. After revelations that the Internal Revenue Service targeted political dissidents and the Department of Justice seized reporters’ phone records, it would appear that this Administration has now sunk to a new low,” Sen. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) said.

“I do not believe the released FISA order is consistent with the requirement of the Patriot Act. How could the phone records of so many innocent Americans be relevant to an authorized investigation as required by the Act?” Rep. Jim Sensenbrenner (R-Wis) said in a letter.

“We believe this type of program is far too broad and is inconsistent with our nation’s founding principles. We cannot defeat terrorism by compromising our commitment to our civil rights and liberties,” Prominent Democrats including Rep. John Conyers (D-Mich.), Rep. Jerry Nadler (D-N.Y.) and Rep. Bobby Scott (D-Va.), on the House Judiciary committee said in a joint statement.

“Everyone should just calm down and understand this isn’t anything that is brand new. It’s been going on for some seven years. And we’ve tried often to try to make it better, and we’ll continue to do that,” Sen. Harry Reid (D-Nev.) told reporters.
Posted by Waiting For Everyman | Mon Jul 1, 2013, 02:04 PM (0 replies)

Russ Tice says the 1% may be using NSA to blackmail politicians on the 99%'s side.

Also anyone who has a say over the NSA itself, or the interests of the 1%

Most of the political figures who matter have been wiretapped and profiled by NSA. Not only them, but their staff; not only in D.C., but in their home districts. He didn't say specifically, but it follows that their families wouldn't be excluded from that.

He said this practice is systemic, and the ones he knows about personally are naturally only the tip of the iceberg. He elaborated on those he knows of from his own direct knowledge, to give us an idea of the kinds of people NSA is focusing on. Below is the list of those that he happened to mention in this interview. (He did say there were more he could name, but the interview went on to other things.) First he spoke in general of job categories, then he named some names, including Barack Obama in 2004. Yes, he knows that, he held the wiretap in his own hand and saw it with his own eyes:

journalists and news agencies
high-ranking military officers

members of Congress - Senate and House, both parties, especially those on the Intelligence Committees, Armed Services Committees, and Judiciary Committees

congressional staff
judges, 1 on the Supreme Court; 2 former FISA court judges
State Department officials
Executive Branch, including in the White House
anti-war groups
civil rights groups
US international corporations
Banks and financial firms
NGO's like the Red Cross

He names some by name

Barack Obama in 2004
Hillary Clinton
Sen. Diane Feinstein
Sen. Orrin Hatch
Sen. Patrick Leahy
Sen. Carl Levin
Rep. James Saxton
Rep. Peter Hoekstra
Rep. Tom Davis
Sen. Henry Waxman
Sen. Jay Rockefeller
Sen. John McCain
Sen. Evan Bayh
Gen. Colin Powell
Gen. Eric Shinseki
Gen. David Petraeus

He said that the one Supreme Court judge he saw an order for was Alito, but that his coworkers still inside the NSA say that all 9 have been tapped.

He is very worried about the opportunity NSA has to blackmail political figures, in fact he says that is principally why he became a whistlblower. The capability is certainly there, which is a problem in itself.

Going by what we have seen, of good people such as POTUS changing their positions against the interest of the 99%, this would explain a lot. It is entirely likely that we have not just a situation of money buying people off, but of the Surveillance State blackmailing those who can't be bought.

I think back to the very first news story after PO was elected, and it was the one about Jesse Jackson Jr. being arrested through a wiretap. I think it's possible that could have been meant to be a message to PO. I don't know that it's a fact (of course) but it is possible, that such blackmailing is going on. And the fact that it's possible, is a problem. The potential for blackmail has always been recognized as a security risk. Now we have that to the nth degree within our own government.

Below is Tice's interview from June 19th a few weeks ago. I'd post it from a different source but Tice said that other outlets have been afraid to have him on, and have even backed out of his recent scheduled appearances at the last minute. I started the video at 45 minutes in, where he starts talking about what's in this post and it continues to the end of the tape. But the whole thing is worth listening to. This man knows, and what he's saying is no joke.


Edit: apparently the link won't start where I wanted it to, so just go to 45:50 to find where he begins talking about this subject.
Posted by Waiting For Everyman | Mon Jul 1, 2013, 09:08 AM (2 replies)

Look up some info on Thin Thread and Stellar Wind

(National Security Agency whistleblower William Binney ) estimates the NSA has assembled 20 trillion "transactions" — phone calls, emails and other forms of data — from Americans. This likely includes copies of almost all of the emails sent and received from most people living in the United States.

WILLIAM BINNEY: Well, after some of the laws they passed, like the PATRIOT Act and their secret interpretation of Section 215, which is—my view, of course, is same as Tom Drake’s, is that that gives them license to take all the commercially held data about us, which is exceedingly dangerous, because if you take that and put it into forms of graphing, which is building relationships or social networks for everybody, and then you watch it over time, you can build up knowledge about everyone in the country. And having that knowledge then allows them the ability to concoct all kinds of charges, if they want to target you. Like in my case, they fabricated several charges and attempted to indict us on them. Fortunately, we were able to produce evidence that would make them look very silly in court, so they didn’t do it. In fact, it was—I was basically assembling evidence of malicious prosecution, which was a countercharge to them. So...

AMY GOODMAN: Do you believe all emails, the government has copies of, in the United States?

WILLIAM BINNEY: I would think—I believe they have most of them, yes.
WILLIAM BINNEY: Actually, I think the surveillance has increased. In fact, I would suggest that they’ve assembled on the order of 20 trillion transactions about U.S. citizens with other U.S. citizens.
WILLIAM BINNEY: Right. And I think it’s to silence what’s going on. But the point is, the data that’s being assembled is about everybody. And from that data, then they can target anyone they want... That, by the way, estimate only was involving phone calls and emails. It didn’t involve any queries on the net or any assembles—other—any financial transactions or credit card stuff, if they’re assembling that. I do not know that, OK.


the last page of a 4 part Democracy Now interview which starts here:

There are programs now that build that metadata into profiles, and those profiles are being used to concoct charges against anyone the PTB want. It is being done NOW. If that isn't a problem as some see it, then I don't what is. And if that isn't surveillance, then the word has been redefined.

No way in hell is there probable cause for 20 trillion transactions.
Posted by Waiting For Everyman | Sun Jun 30, 2013, 12:47 AM (2 replies)


Lots of alternatives there. Check it out.

Also here - Electronic Frontier Foundation. (See "Surveillance Self-Defense" along the right hand side.)
Posted by Waiting For Everyman | Thu Jun 27, 2013, 01:13 PM (2 replies)

Those are some good questions, but no, I hope he escapes

and I hope there are more whistleblowers after him. Until the Surveillance State apparatus is repealed, actions like Snowden's will be necessary to stop the damn thing.

No, I'm not paranoid about saying so. There was a time when I would've been though, I understand that feeling. I am one who has dealt with harassment from that angle, every so often, ever since the Nixon years, and I long ago stopped buying its "bogeyman" image -- I know from my own direct experience that 'they' are cowards, and not very bright. At this point, I think I have simply outlived the pod that was on my back. But if they care to play again, I know how it moves, I know what it looks like, and I know what to do about it. I no longer have anything to lose, except myself, and I'm an 'old lady' now. I'm left from it with nothing but a story, which is too complicated to tell, even if I wanted to -- which I don't. Even if I did want to, I know that no one would believe it anyway (only those who have dealt with it too, and they don't need telling). So there has been an impasse for a long while now, and I expect it to stay that way. But I couldn't care less if it doesn't. It has already wrecked my life, and there is nothing more that it can do, nothing that I care about.

And I'll tell you something funny -- I'm one of the most patriotic people on this board. It isn't the government that did this to me, but a criminal element within it. And I'd like nothing better than to see that rooted out. Maybe not in my lifetime, but I believe someday it will be.

Posted by Waiting For Everyman | Tue Jun 25, 2013, 10:28 AM (0 replies)

How to know if a relationship is right.

Sometimes it can happen that when a certain two people are together, each one is a bigger person, a better person, than either of them is separately. There really are some like that. It's not a fairy tale -- just rare.

If you find the person who makes you feel that way -- not by browbeating you or anything like that, but by inspiring you just by who they are -- to find the "best self" you didn't know was in you... that's the right person. That's "as good as it gets" in this life.

(p.s. I'm not a guy, but gender doesn't make a difference.)

Loving You Makes Me a Better Man

Sung by Vince Gill, lyrics by Rodney Crowell.

Loving you makes me a better man
There's things I don't know how to do
But you make me think I can

I've got a long way to go
But I know what I know like the back of my hand
Loving you makes me a better man

I've been wrong, more than I care to say
Time after time I've been lost
Just couldn't find my way

You shed a light on a path through the night
Leading right to the side where I stand
Loving you makes me a better man

I made mistakes, didn't have what it takes
Just to walk out, leave it alone
I've got a long line of heartaches that followed me home

Time goes on and I watch it disappear
I've got a mind of my own
Now that I have you near

You came to me and it's easy to see
There's a line that I've crossed in the sand
Loving you makes me a better man
Loving you makes me a better man
Posted by Waiting For Everyman | Tue May 28, 2013, 12:35 PM (2 replies)

Judgement of the Moon and Stars (Ludwig's Tune)

No tongue in the bell
And the fishwives yell
But they might as well be mute
So you get to keep the pictures
That don't seem like much
Cold white keys under your fingers
Now you're thinking
"That's no substitute
It just don't do it
Like the song of a warm body
Loving your touch"

In the court they carve your legend
With an apple in its jaw
And the women that you wanted
They get their laughs
Long silk stockings
On the bedposts of refinement
You're too raw
They think you're too raw
It's the judgement of the moon and stars
Your solitary path
Draw yourself a bath
Think what you'd like to have
For supper
Or take a walk
A park, a bridge, a tree, a river
Revoked but not yet cancelled
The gift goes on
In silence
In a bell jar
Still a song...

You've got to shake your fists at lightning now
You've got to roar like forest fire
You've got to spread your light like blazes
All across the sky
They're going to aim the hoses on you
Show 'em you won't expire
Not till you burn up every passion
Not even when you die
Come on now
You've got to try
If you're feeling contempt
Well then you tell it
If you're tired of the silent night
Jesus, well then you yell it
Condemned to wires and hammers
Strike every chord that you feel
That broken trees
And elephant ivories
Posted by Waiting For Everyman | Thu Mar 14, 2013, 06:51 AM (1 replies)

I know.

I'm very grateful for the hospitality of the Loungers, but I'm also very bummed and feel that most of us Metazens got a raw deal because of a few (who should've just been suspended from Meta if need be). I don't believe in criticizing behind anyone's back, so there it is...


This does suck lemons, I have to say. I'm probably going to go back to mostly lurking soon, and I really didn't want to or plan to do that. But I don't feel like I have much to say about anything, after being treated like this. Transparency to blackout; democracy to dictatorship really isn't ok with me. We're just s'posed to go on posting and pretend like this didn't happen? Well I can't do that.

If somebody gets mistreated now, we don't even know it. (I happened to see a clue to an instance of that in the Lounge today -- but not enough to know what it's about, as it has to be now.) We can't even agree with each other or support each other in what happens to us here because we aren't allowed to know about it. All the bad stuff is merely invisible now, and that doesn't solve a thing, it makes it worse because it gets pretty much of a free pass without general awareness of it. It just isn't ok with me.

And the worst of it is... the people who behaved the worst on Meta are the most glad that it's gone... and that pisses me off.

I like the site a lot, I like the admins a lot, and I like most of you guys a lot. But this was wrong, wrong, wrong. Sorry, I don't get treated like this and just say, "please, sir, can I have some more".

ETA: link fix
Posted by Waiting For Everyman | Sat Mar 9, 2013, 06:06 PM (5 replies)

I realize that you are the owners of the site.

But do you really think it's ok to treat people the way you have this week? Do you really think it's any better than the bad behavior in Meta?

I don't, at all. This was extremely rude, and unnecessary to do this way. There wasn't even any serious attempt made to reform Meta, by changing its rules or SoP. There was no input at all from posters beforehand. There was no input from you as to what you didn't like about it, or wanted to see changed. There was no announcement made of what was going on, or why. Posters don't even have access to their posts in a read-only format.

I am in the minority, clearly, but I'm sure I'm not the only one who feels very run-over by this. And the only recourse we're left with after being treated this way, is to come to this group hat-in-hand to line up one at a time like school children. There's no forum even left to us where any objection or reaction of any kind can be discussed, because "no whining about DU" has been added to all the forums' SoP's. Frankly, I think that makes it a very heavy-handed and cold-blooded thing to do. It comes off as a smack in the face and STFU.

I doubt this will make any difference but I had to say what I think. I don't think you admins are bad guys, on the contrary, but I think this was a really bad action you took. I'm really sorry it was done.
Posted by Waiting For Everyman | Sat Mar 9, 2013, 09:40 AM (1 replies)

Truth be told

and this is my opinion only.

On the last day there was a thread up, in which a certain faction was getting its ass handed to it. Not by attacks, but by people notably refusing to get in it with them. Right in the middle of that dragging on (@ 8 hours with few replies), Meta went down. So... whatever. They say they're so happy it's gone, and imo that is why. They were imploding (and that might have been a good thing for DU, who knows). It appeared to me that the effect of taking away Meta just then, rescued them (or saved face) in the nick of time.

Just one opinion for 2 cents. And I'll leave it at that, hereafter.

(ps, Yes I do agree that Meta was a train wreck, but I also think a couple of rule changes could've mostly fixed that. But it is, what it is, gone is gone.)
Posted by Waiting For Everyman | Fri Mar 8, 2013, 04:55 PM (0 replies)
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