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Voice for Peace

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Member since: Mon Jul 16, 2007, 10:08 AM
Number of posts: 12,092

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Zimmerman Trial - waiting for a verdict, here are jury instructions:


If you find Trayvon Martin was killed by George Zimmerman, you will then consider the
circumstances surrounding the killing in deciding if the killing was Murder in the Second
Degree or was Manslaughter, or whether the killing was excusable or resulted from justifiable
use of deadly force.
Posted by Voice for Peace | Sat Jul 13, 2013, 10:20 PM (0 replies)

and from your point of view, how do you explain

the silence that follows the shot; the
absence of hoarseness in Zimmerman's voice?

My speculative opinion is that both
of their voices might be on that tape.

If Zimmerman attempted to detain Martin
in any way, and Martin responded aggressively,
maybe Zimmerman panicked when it became
a physical fight, it suddenly got real, and he
is a big chicken, so he started yelling for help.

He somehow got his gun. Or he already had
his hand on it, which is what I believe, from the
moment he left his car.

This is only my imaginative speculation and
I wasn't there nor am I on the jury. I
know you know that already.

Trayvon started screaming for his life, and

Because to me, it sounded like there were
two different types of yelling on that tape.

I consider Zimmerman depraved.
He could have pled involuntary manslaughter
right at the start, taken some responsibility
or showed some remorse. Might not
even have done jail time.

Instead he lied and lied, and his team of
experts and lawyers distorted the story until
Trayvon was on trial instead of him.

Instead he concocted a fabulous tale which is simply
unsupported both by forensics and many of the
witnesses. He is a fool.

That's why in my own mind it went from being
manslaughter to second degree. The post-
event activities & statements attest to ill
original intent.
My opinion only.
Posted by Voice for Peace | Sat Jul 13, 2013, 01:40 PM (0 replies)

Zimmerman Trial - Frederick Leatherman post on defense closing arguments.


Does anyone know which photo he's speaking about
and does anyone recall seeing this part of the
defense closing?

(Comment in the comment section from Leatherman)

Mark O’Mara’s closing was quite possibly
the worst argument that I have ever witnessed.
At times he seemed almost incoherent.

The worst part of it occurred when he showed Trayvon’s
death photo to the jury and tipped it so that Sybrina
Fulton could see it.

She left the courtroom.

Deliberate or accidental?

I don’t believe he had to show the photo to support
or illustrate his argument, so I have decided that
he did it deliberately with malice aforethought.

His defining characteristic throughout this case has
been to use motions as a vehicle to disclose private
information about Trayvon Martin and to falsely
accuse Bernie de la Rionda of discovery violations
to conceal his failure to exercise due diligence in
performing his job.

I shudder with disgust when I hear his name or the
sound of his voice.

John Guy’s rebuttal was sublime. He blew me away
and that is not easy to do.

Posted by Voice for Peace | Sat Jul 13, 2013, 11:17 AM (9 replies)

please go outside to the sidewalk, find a stranger,

and ask him to bash your head just once into the
sidewalk. Just one time, hard, so that you fear for
your skull breaking open.

Then take a look at the back of your head. You
might want to have a friend standing by with
an ambulance.
Posted by Voice for Peace | Sat Jul 13, 2013, 10:23 AM (1 replies)

8 signs you are really a cat



# 4 is "nobody is ever sure you like them"

Posted by Voice for Peace | Thu Jul 11, 2013, 08:10 PM (13 replies)

Nobody knows what went on that night, regardless of their law enforcement or legal credentials.

You are guessing just as all of us are guessing.

There is no value in demeaning others' opinions
unless they are directed unkindly at you personally.

It doesn't uplift or educate anybody, or help
people see your point of view.

Even if you have that experience, doesn't make you
an authority on this case, any more than myself.

People here are engaged in trying to understand
what happened.

Often people without the baggage of being experts
can see things more clearly than those who are
firmly locked in their I know how it is box.

Posted by Voice for Peace | Mon Jul 8, 2013, 05:53 PM (0 replies)

thank you. Zimmerman's story might be coherent and believable if Trayvon were a fucking punk

and actually, in fact, up to no good, and this was somehow
provable. But he wasn't, and therefore it's not, not even
close. So the jury has to believe that Zimmerman is
not a liar -- but he's already been blatantly proved
to be a liar, and with no apparent remorse.

I had to google the deadly weapon doctrine effect...
is this what you mean? (from Wikipedia)

Intent to commit a dangerous felony (the "felony-murder" doctrine).

Under state of mind (i), intent to kill, the deadly weapon rule applies.

Thus, if the defendant intentionally uses a deadly weapon or instrument against the victim, such use authorizes a permissive inference of intent to kill. In other words, "intent follows the bullet." ...

Under state of mind (iii), an "abandoned and malignant heart", the killing must result from defendant's conduct involving a reckless indifference to human life and a conscious disregard of an unreasonable risk of death or serious bodily injury.
Posted by Voice for Peace | Mon Jul 8, 2013, 01:59 AM (1 replies)

Zimmerman Trial Judge is no-nonsense


Debra Nelson has made a name for herself in Florida as a tough-on-defendants judge. Now her legal bearing is at the heart of one of the nation's most sensitive murder trials.

SANFORD, Fla.-- When a 39-year-old woman snatched a baby from a Florida hospital in 2008, Circuit Judge Debra Nelson wasn't swayed by the fact that the child was missing for only about an hour. She sentenced the kidnapper to 30 years in prison.

Nelson is in the spotlight again as the presiding judge in one of America's most controversial murder cases: the killing of Trayvon Martin. Her reputation among some as a tough-on-defendants judge may be transformed as she balances both sides of the emotionally charged debate about why George Zimmerman fatally shot the 17-year-old.

"Lawyers appearing before her know that her reputation is to be a law-oriented, no-nonsense judge," said Daniel Gerber an Orlando defense attorney who argued a civil case before Nelson. "We know not to cross that line."

The 59-year-old judge has lived up to Gerber's view of her throughout Zimmerman's trial by fairly dishing out orders to prosecutors and defense attorneys. Nelson often asks lawyers to get to the point and stay on subject.

..more at link
Posted by Voice for Peace | Mon Jul 8, 2013, 01:11 AM (6 replies)

where do you get less than a ten year sentence on a murder conviction?

Florida has mandatory minimum sentencing laws,
I have read, if a murder involves death of a child
(under 18) and the use of a firearm.

He could get a mandatory 25 years even just
for aggravated manslaughter.

Wikipedia: The State of Florida has a very strict minimum sentencing policy known as 10-20-Life:, which includes 10 years mandatory prison time for using a gun during a crime, 20 years mandatory prison time for firing a gun during a crime, and 25 to life mandatory prison time in addition to any other sentence for shooting somebody, regardless of whether they survive or not.
Posted by Voice for Peace | Mon Jul 8, 2013, 12:27 AM (1 replies)

Zimmerman Trial: Sufficient evidence has been introduced to support a guilty verdict.


Sunday, July 7, 2013

Good evening:

NBC’s Dan Abrams, whom I generally respect, has announced that he believes the jury will find the defendant not guilty of both murder 2 and manslaughter. Given the State’s difficult burden to disprove self-defense beyond a reasonable doubt, which he believes to be impossible since the defendant has a coherent theory of the case supported by many witnesses as well as the photographs showing the injuries to his head, he said that he does not see any way that the jury can convict him.

In reaching that opinion, I believe Abrams commits the same mistake that so many of his colleagues commit on a daily basis regarding all of the important stories and issues of the day. They assume that there are two sides to every story and each side has both strengths and weaknesses. In other words, they assume the opposing sides are roughly equally legitimate. This assumption is not based on a thorough evidence based review of the respective sides or an objective evaluation of the strengths and weaknesses of the opposing arguments.

In fact, the assumption of equivalency is a false assumption and an extremely poor substitute for investigative journalism and critical thinking.

more at link
Posted by Voice for Peace | Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:43 PM (43 replies)
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