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Gender: Male
Hometown: Eastern North Carolina
Home country: United States
Current location: Eastern NC
Member since: Wed Dec 1, 2004, 03:09 PM
Number of posts: 11,545

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Semiautomatic is the default civilian mode of fire, and doesn't come anywhere near cyclic rate.

Most slowfire target shooting is done with semiautos, and about 75% of the civilian market is semiauto. It doesn't matter how hard you squeeze the trigger, it is only going to fire one shot until you release the trigger and pull a second time.

Even a slow-cycling automatic weapon shoots much faster than anyone can pull a trigger, and since you have to wait for the trigger reset it is physically impossible to shoot as fast as an automatic weapon even if you install a mechanism not limited by the constraints of the human hand. Good shooters with a civilian gun and practice can get splits down into the low teens for a few shots, but that's not including the aim time required to actually hit, and most people's splits run 0.15 or above even without aiming, slowing as more shots are fired. By comparison, an automatic weapon can lay down ten to twenty shots per second for as long as ammunition holds out, or can fire bursts or sweeps with a single pull of the trigger.

A semiauto may be "rapid fire" if your basis of comparison is a bolt-action optimized for lethality at extreme range, but not if your basis of comparison is a typical civilian rifle, pistol, revolver, or repeating shotgun. Pretending otherwise hurts your cause, IMO.

This phrase:

"Semi-automatics have only two purposes. One is so owners can take them to the shooting range once in a while, yell yeehaw, and get all horny at the rapid fire and the burning vapor spurting from the end of the barrel. Their other use---their only other use---is to kill people."

That could be a very jaded representation of full auto. If it were intended to be a description of civilian guns that fire once and only once when you pull the trigger, on the other hand, then it is either ignorant, intentionally deceptive, or wacky. Semiautomatics (aka self-loaders) account for about 75% of the civilian gun market and for the majority of sport shooting, after all.

Perhaps Mr. King should stroll down to Van Raymond's in his own home town and see what his neighbors actually buy, before implying they are a bunch of sexually deviant rednecks.

You're projecting, but I suppose that explains a lot of your stances on the issue.

I have had a CHL since the mid '90s, but I don't carry for "swagger". I carry a Smith & Wesson Lady Smith, for what that's worth. If you want "swagger", go get a leather jacket and a Harley.

As to the item discussed in the OP, it's a phenomenally bad idea because it is apparently exaggerated enough to "print" so all your idiot friends can see the lump, but gives you zero capability in the unlikely event you ever actually needed it.

It's kind of like blasting exaggerated, cartoonish turbo and blowoff-valve sounds from your car's sound system, and about as effective.

Apparently he doesn't know what a semiautomatic *is*.

Probably 75% of guns sold annually are semiautomatics. Most .22 squirrel rifles are semiautomatic. The pistol your local peace officer carries on her hip is a semiautomatic.

I think he is confusing semautomatic (non-automatic) civilian guns with automatic weapons, and as a writer he should damn sure know better than that.

Isn't that what the gun control movement, at its core, is all about?

"I am quite surprised by the number of people who favor actual violence to stop imagined potential violence"

Isn't that what the gun control movement is, distilled to its essence? I don't see too many proposals that they aim to enforce voluntarily. Ultimately, most prohibitionists suggest that those who choose not to comply with their views must be taken down and forcibly disarmed, imprisoned, or shot, do they not?

You are free not to own them; I choose differently.

"Only rule required.....you do not need a gun. No gun, no checklist, no death."

If you don't like guns, you are free not to own them. I and 80+ million others choose differently. As long as we are mentally competent adults with clean records, we have the right to make that choice for ourselves, thanks.

The four rules of gun safety, for those who need to be reminded:

(1) Always treat a gun as if it is loaded.
(2) Never point a gun in an unsafe direction. (If you say "But it's OK, it's unloaded", see Rule 1.)
(3) Keep your finger off the trigger unless you are on target and ready to shoot. (If you say "But it's OK, it's unloaded", see Rule 1.)
(4) Always be sure of your target and what is beyond it. (If you say "But it's OK, it's unloaded", see Rule 1.)

Ummm, rifles are the least misused of all weapons...

"The carnage proves it."

You are aware that rifles are the least misused of all weapons in this country, yes?

Murder, by State and Type of Weapon, 2013 (FBI)

Total murders...................... 12,253
Handguns............................ 5,782 (47.2%)
Firearms (type unknown)............. 2,079 (17.0%)
Clubs, rope, fire, etc.............. 1,622 (13.2%)
Knives and other cutting weapons.... 1,490 (12.2%)
Hands, fists, feet.................... 687 (5.6%)
Shotguns.............................. 308 (2.5%)
Rifles................................ 285 (2.3%)

The trend in rifle homicide is down, even though the AR-15 platform has been the most popular civilian rifle in the United States for many years.

Rifle homicides, 2005-2013 (from FBI Uniform Crime Reports 2005-2013, Table 20, collated):

2005: 442
2006: 436
2007: 450
2008: 375
2009: 348
2010: 358
2011: 323
2012: 302
2013: 285

Anyone who is fighting to outlaw the most popular rifles isn't going after "gun violence", they are going after lawful ownership.

Because they *are* handguns.

Exceedingly clunky and harder to conceal than a regular handgun, and harder to hit anything with, but functionally and ballistically the same as a Glock or a Smith & Wesson 9mm, firing the same ammunition at the same rate of fire as any other double-stack civilian 9mm pistol.

FWIW, Intratec went out of business in 2001 due primarily to poor sales. The guns were interesting looking, but they had a reputation for jamming and I don't think they were ever very popular.

Because the law firm doesn't seem to understand civilian firearms or the PLCAA?

Or perhaps they have swallowed the falsehood that an AR-15 is a "weapon of war", rather than a non-automatic civilian .22 centerfire that 40+ companies make that has been the top selling sporting rifle in the United States for many years.

At some point, someone is going to stand up in court and point out that 75% of firearms on the U.S. civilian market work *exactly* like the AR-15, that .223 Remington is the least powerful of all common centerfire rifle calibers, and that rifles are the least misused of all firearms (all rifles combined account for only 2.5% of U.S. murders, per the FBI).

I believe the full text of the filing can be found here:

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