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Fri Apr 5, 2013, 08:54 PM

Thread to discuss sexism and misogyny you encounter on DU.

This discussion thread is pinned.
I think it's important that we have a safe place to discuss examples of sexism and misogyny we encounter on DU.

To support one another, gain strength from one another and learn from one another.

It will also help to keep it all in one space.

Please use good judgment when posting. We have some fans who like to troll the group and make alerts to get posts hidden.

Be respectful, and factual. Focus on the example of sexism and misogyny, not the poster.

I'll be creating and pinning a new thread and lock the old when it's needed.

link #1 located here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1255&pid=18979

link # 2 located here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/125519322

Jury, please do not hide this thread. Feminists should be able to have a safe place on DU to discuss sexism and misogyny they are encountering on DU. This is a safe haven group, for likeminded members. If people don't like it here, they have the right to trash the group and forever we will be out of sight for them. We get a lot of trolling. Thank you for your consideration.

Boston Bean

173 replies, 46120 views

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Arrow 173 replies Author Time Post
Reply Thread to discuss sexism and misogyny you encounter on DU. (Original post)
boston bean Apr 2013 OP
Texasgal Apr 2013 #1
boston bean Apr 2013 #8
TDale313 Apr 2013 #2
boston bean Apr 2013 #9
haikugal Apr 2013 #3
boston bean Apr 2013 #13
haikugal Apr 2013 #16
BainsBane Apr 2013 #4
Z_I_Peevey Apr 2013 #5
boston bean Apr 2013 #6
Tien1985 Apr 2013 #7
boston bean Apr 2013 #10
BainsBane Apr 2013 #11
seabeyond Apr 2013 #12
Arcanetrance Apr 2013 #14
boston bean Apr 2013 #15
seabeyond Apr 2013 #17
BainsBane Apr 2013 #18
chervilant Apr 2013 #19
MadrasT Apr 2013 #21
chervilant Apr 2013 #22
MadrasT Apr 2013 #23
chervilant Apr 2013 #24
BainsBane Apr 2013 #25
chervilant Apr 2013 #28
BainsBane Apr 2013 #31
chervilant Apr 2013 #33
BainsBane Apr 2013 #34
redqueen Apr 2013 #29
chervilant Apr 2013 #20
BainsBane Apr 2013 #26
chervilant Apr 2013 #27
BainsBane Apr 2013 #30
chervilant Apr 2013 #32
BainsBane Apr 2013 #35
chervilant Apr 2013 #36
BainsBane Apr 2013 #37
gaspee Apr 2013 #93
BainsBane Apr 2013 #97
gaspee Apr 2013 #101
seabeyond Apr 2013 #103
BainsBane Apr 2013 #107
seabeyond Apr 2013 #109
gaspee Apr 2013 #91
BainsBane Apr 2013 #38
Texasgal Apr 2013 #39
BainsBane Apr 2013 #40
Texasgal Apr 2013 #41
seabeyond Apr 2013 #42
redqueen Apr 2013 #43
MadrasT Apr 2013 #44
seabeyond Apr 2013 #45
boston bean Apr 2013 #46
seabeyond Apr 2013 #47
redqueen Apr 2013 #56
Arcanetrance Apr 2013 #49
seabeyond Apr 2013 #53
Arcanetrance Apr 2013 #55
seabeyond Apr 2013 #58
MadrasT Apr 2013 #59
ancianita Nov 2013 #146
sigmasix Apr 2013 #83
BainsBane Apr 2013 #84
MadrasT Apr 2013 #48
boston bean Apr 2013 #50
MadrasT Apr 2013 #51
boston bean Apr 2013 #52
MadrasT Apr 2013 #57
seabeyond Apr 2013 #60
MadrasT Apr 2013 #61
seabeyond Apr 2013 #62
MadrasT Apr 2013 #63
seabeyond Apr 2013 #64
BainsBane Apr 2013 #65
redqueen Apr 2013 #66
seabeyond Apr 2013 #54
LanternWaste Apr 2013 #124
BainsBane Apr 2013 #67
DURHAM D Apr 2013 #68
BainsBane Apr 2013 #73
TDale313 Apr 2013 #76
BainsBane Apr 2013 #78
TDale313 Apr 2013 #80
mercuryblues Apr 2013 #69
DURHAM D Apr 2013 #70
Kurovski Jan 2014 #158
MadrasT Apr 2013 #71
seabeyond Apr 2013 #74
DURHAM D Apr 2013 #72
seabeyond Apr 2013 #75
DURHAM D Apr 2013 #79
BainsBane Apr 2013 #82
BainsBane Apr 2013 #77
seabeyond Apr 2013 #81
Post removed Apr 2013 #89
DURHAM D Apr 2013 #85
boston bean Apr 2013 #87
seabeyond Apr 2013 #86
Exultant Democracy Apr 2013 #88
DURHAM D Apr 2013 #90
redqueen Apr 2013 #92
gaspee Apr 2013 #94
redqueen Apr 2013 #95
seabeyond Apr 2013 #99
redqueen Apr 2013 #105
Whisp Apr 2013 #111
gaspee Apr 2013 #100
seabeyond Apr 2013 #102
redqueen Apr 2013 #106
ancianita Nov 2013 #148
Shivering Jemmy Apr 2013 #110
redqueen Apr 2013 #113
Shivering Jemmy Apr 2013 #115
redqueen Apr 2013 #116
ancianita Nov 2013 #147
redqueen Nov 2013 #151
ancianita Nov 2013 #152
seabeyond Apr 2013 #98
seabeyond Apr 2013 #96
applegrove Apr 2013 #104
seabeyond Apr 2013 #108
ismnotwasm Apr 2013 #112
redqueen Apr 2013 #114
ismnotwasm Apr 2013 #117
BainsBane Apr 2013 #118
redqueen Apr 2013 #122
BainsBane Apr 2013 #119
hlthe2b Apr 2013 #120
seabeyond May 2013 #125
BainsBane Apr 2013 #121
smirkymonkey Apr 2013 #123
Bennyboy May 2013 #126
redqueen May 2013 #127
Gravitycollapse May 2013 #128
MadrasT May 2013 #129
seabeyond May 2013 #130
ancianita Nov 2013 #149
boston bean May 2013 #131
redqueen May 2013 #132
seabeyond May 2013 #134
seabeyond May 2013 #133
ancianita Nov 2013 #150
redqueen May 2013 #135
BainsBane May 2013 #136
redqueen Jun 2013 #137
Lunacee_2013 Jun 2013 #138
redqueen Jun 2013 #139
redqueen Jun 2013 #140
NuclearDem Jul 2013 #141
BainsBane Sep 2013 #142
Squinch Sep 2013 #143
mzteris Mar 2014 #161
BainsBane Sep 2013 #144
BluegrassStateBlues Oct 2013 #145
Sheri Nov 2013 #153
boston bean Nov 2013 #155
Sheri Nov 2013 #156
seabeyond Nov 2013 #154
Gravitycollapse Dec 2013 #157
BainsBane Mar 2014 #159
redqueen Mar 2014 #160
mercuryblues Apr 2014 #162
intaglio May 2014 #163
intaglio May 2014 #164
whathehell May 2014 #165
theHandpuppet May 2014 #166
BainsBane Jun 2014 #167
ellenrr Jul 2014 #168
theHandpuppet Aug 2014 #169
redqueen Aug 2014 #170
intaglio Aug 2014 #171
SunSeeker Sep 2014 #172
YoungDemCA Nov 2014 #173

Response to boston bean (Original post)

Fri Apr 5, 2013, 09:02 PM

1. Thank you BB.

Thank you for pining this. Thank you for being such a gracious host as well.

It's time for us to call this crap out. I am with you.

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Response to Texasgal (Reply #1)

Fri Apr 5, 2013, 10:02 PM

8. Solidarity!

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Fri Apr 5, 2013, 09:15 PM

2. Thank you for reopening/pinning this thread.

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Response to TDale313 (Reply #2)

Fri Apr 5, 2013, 10:03 PM

9. Your welcome TDale. Thanks for showing your support!

Much appreciated!

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Fri Apr 5, 2013, 09:15 PM

3. Yeah!

You go girl!! WTF?

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Response to haikugal (Reply #3)

Fri Apr 5, 2013, 10:10 PM

13. Hey-o haikugal!

Good to see you around thems there/here parts!

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Response to boston bean (Reply #13)

Fri Apr 5, 2013, 10:19 PM

16. (((hugs)))

Back at ya...I've seen this kind of thing all too often on the web in political forums over the last year. Don't let em get you down.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Fri Apr 5, 2013, 09:17 PM

4. Edited

I rethought the issue and I think it's better not to draw attention to their games.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Fri Apr 5, 2013, 09:19 PM

5. BB, I admire you.



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Response to Z_I_Peevey (Reply #5)

Fri Apr 5, 2013, 09:50 PM

6. Oh Z_I_

I'm a bit shy when it comes to compliments like that, I don't see myself or anything I've done to be especially admirable. thank you, though, for the kind words and thoughts! It's Duers like you who we don't hear too much from, but seem to get it and support members like myself, who make it all the more worthwhile.

Please come in the group and join us more often.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Fri Apr 5, 2013, 09:55 PM

7. Good on you Boston Bean!! Nt

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Response to Tien1985 (Reply #7)

Fri Apr 5, 2013, 10:04 PM

10. Hey Tien! Thank you for all of your support!

Your voice is important and a pick me up when we feel beat down!

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Response to Tien1985 (Reply #7)

Fri Apr 5, 2013, 10:05 PM

11. Tien rocks!

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Fri Apr 5, 2013, 10:06 PM

12. "discuss sexism and misogyny you encounter on DU." all of today, in so many ways. nt

 

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Fri Apr 5, 2013, 10:11 PM

14. I'm glad to see you started this thread again personally I try to be an ally however imperfect

I hope the people who have been going alert crazy decide to piss off and let the group exist in peace

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Response to Arcanetrance (Reply #14)

Fri Apr 5, 2013, 10:19 PM

15. Hi-o Arcane!

Thanks for stopping in and showing your support.

Believe me there aint a one of us that are perfect in this group. Me probably having the most imperfection!

Your support means more than you know!

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Response to boston bean (Reply #15)

Fri Apr 5, 2013, 10:23 PM

17. ya, but each of us are certainly perfectly imperfect.

 

just sayin'.

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Response to Arcanetrance (Reply #14)

Sat Apr 6, 2013, 12:05 AM

18. Wouldn't that be great

Imagine getting so bent out of shape over something they don't even have to read if they want to. I've heard some say take that post to HOF where we don't have to see it. Then they poke around HOF looking for stuff to be OUTRAGED about. Yeah, I used the O word.

Thanks for your support Arcanetrance.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Sat Apr 6, 2013, 09:13 PM

19. Have you seen the thread about Bernie Sanders

on Bill Maher's show, looking like he was "grabbing the tits" of Huff Po's "Millennial Bimbo"? A woman posted this drivel, and my alert got 5-1 to leave it.

The poster responded to my concerns by calling me "honey" and "silly."

Furthermore, have you noticed that Femen protests are "brave" and daring, but the protests of DU feminists are attempts to tell others how to protest, or are representative of puritanical "outrage" about women baring their breasts?

It seems to me that those who seek to diminish DU feminists are growing ever more derisive and divisive -- striving to be "right" or to have the last word. Sad that Skinner hasn't revised the TOS...

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Response to chervilant (Reply #19)

Sat Apr 6, 2013, 10:02 PM

21. That was disappointing.

And yes, I agree that the attacks on DU feminists are getting more vehement and more frequent. It's kind of amusing because they are really starting to look like they are coming unhinged. The attacks are way out of proportion to the perceived offenses.

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Response to MadrasT (Reply #21)

Sat Apr 6, 2013, 10:06 PM

22. The woman who attacked me just started

ANOTHER thread, calling me a "word nazi."

A jury voted 3-3 to keep it...

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Response to chervilant (Reply #22)

Sat Apr 6, 2013, 10:12 PM

23. Boo hoo. Got called out for using "tits" and "bimbo".

Oh, the horror. Oh, the oppression. I can hardly stand it.

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Response to MadrasT (Reply #23)

Sat Apr 6, 2013, 10:37 PM

24. Yeah, but

I'm a "word nazi" now, and I need to "get a life."

Is it me, or are the personal attacks increasing?

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Response to chervilant (Reply #19)

Sat Apr 6, 2013, 11:31 PM

25. that's cause you keep your clothes on

everyone knows it's not real feminism if you are fully clothed.

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #25)

Sun Apr 7, 2013, 08:16 AM

28. AND, 'everyone' knows

that all feminists on DU are shrill, puritanical, dried-up ol' prunes -- aka The Sisters of Perpetual Outrage!

(I forgot to mention the consistent use of absolutes herein below ...)

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Response to chervilant (Reply #28)

Sun Apr 7, 2013, 03:29 PM

31. I wonder if I'd have more credibility

If I announced I post while topless?

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #31)

Sun Apr 7, 2013, 06:16 PM

33. Oh, lord!

Does that mean I'll have to confess that I post wearing my jammies?

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Response to chervilant (Reply #33)

Sun Apr 7, 2013, 06:31 PM

34. that's a given

everyone posts in jammies.

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Response to chervilant (Reply #19)

Sun Apr 7, 2013, 09:15 AM

29. Feminists calling women bimbos...

I guess it shouldn't be too surprising.

Thanks for speaking up.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Sat Apr 6, 2013, 09:56 PM

20. Will wonders never cease?

A jury voted to hide the last personal attack against me in the aforementioned thread. I have a list of twenty names that will go on my IL when I've finished my OP re: sexism on DU.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Sat Apr 6, 2013, 11:33 PM

26. I proposed a cease fire

with some of our friends and got banned for my efforts. However will I carry on?

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #26)

Sun Apr 7, 2013, 08:10 AM

27. Having witnessed

most of this brouhaha (I've bookmarked several OPs to reference in my own OP about sexism and misogyny on DU), I've noticed the following:

~specific DUers are being maligned and their posted comments misrepresented.

~an identifiable few routinely show up to post derisive, defensive screeds.

~most of these specific nabobs have little or no knowledge of feminism, sexism or patriarchy.

~attempts to recommend books or articles are ignored or ridiculed.

I would like to think that the members of DU are better educated, have superior critical thinking skills, and are capable of discussions without snarks, sarcasm or personal attacks. I'm finding that this is not so.

I've left once before because of the malicious and relentless sexism and misogyny (and what does his inaction say about Skinner?!?), but I intend to stay and counter the worst offenders -- diplomatically and supportively...at least until it becomes clear that all attempts are fruitless.

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Response to chervilant (Reply #27)

Sun Apr 7, 2013, 01:44 PM

30. I missed your OP

and I did search for it yesterday. Can you provide me a link?

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #30)

Sun Apr 7, 2013, 06:14 PM

32. I haven't written it yet.

Every time I think the vitriol has run its course, someone else posts a provocative OP. I will most assuredly let you and many others know.

(I thought the person who just ridiculed "today's women" had a feminist bent, but apparently I was mistaken...)

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Response to chervilant (Reply #32)

Sun Apr 7, 2013, 06:34 PM

35. if you're waiting for it to stop

you'll never post. It ain't stopping.

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #35)

Sun Apr 7, 2013, 07:44 PM

36. I was referring to the unbridled

fascination with Femen's breasts, which I'm sure will run its course soon, given Femen's sparse numbers and our species' short attention span.

I must say I find it disheartening that so many women are participating in the derision meted out to certain DUers, and the derogation of feminism.

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Response to chervilant (Reply #36)

Sun Apr 7, 2013, 07:46 PM

37. that's how it always goes

Last edited Sun Apr 7, 2013, 08:27 PM - Edit history (1)

around here. A lot of women are invested in male approval, even when it's only virtual. Of course some simply disagree, as is their every right. Disagreement, however, doesn't explain the vitriol.

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #37)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 12:31 PM

93. My theory

Is that deep down in that place within ourselves that most people don't acknowledge until they are silent and still and thoughtful, they *know* that they've chosen a path of repression and collaboration with the P and are fighting an inner battle with themselves to repress that knowledge. Or they could be totally shallow people with no deeper intellect or self-awareness and are only reactive. Could go either way...

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Response to gaspee (Reply #93)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 01:52 PM

97. my explanation is simpler

Some just don't like other women. They've been taught to seek male approval, and to do that they feel they need to turn on other women. I imagine everyone has encountered women like that offline.

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #97)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 02:18 PM

101. I was going to go there

But thought it might get too long and contemptuous. We all know women who say - I don't get along with other women. Or to men - I'm not like *those* women. I'm cool. I think we all know women like that. And again, I try to find it in me to empathize with them and think about the culture that drove them to that attitude rather than think of their collaboration with the P for their own gain.

I have nothing but disdain for the collaborators but I try to moderate my own thinking on it because I am self-aware enough to know that it's only my own rebelliousness and refusal to conform that makes me think that way. I make my life harder by refusing to conform to societal expectations of what female is - even in the small stuff. Giving an inch would make my life easier but living with myself harder.

I subject myself to needless ridicule by refusing to "do" female drag. Was subjected to it at lunch yesterday, actually.

My choice, with eyes wide open.

Luckily, I'm almost past the age where men (and women) think they have the right, no the duty, to comment on my attractiveness to the male of the species.

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Response to gaspee (Reply #101)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 02:24 PM

103. i did it when i was younger. why would i want to be a part of the oppressed. then i grew up

 

got smart. and said fuck that. lol

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Response to gaspee (Reply #101)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 03:01 PM

107. That is what I find most perplexing

the women who openly collaborate in sexism. While I explain it on a surface level, I don't really understand it. I know it's the result of socialization. I've never been someone who doesn't like the company of other women, so I can't really understand where they are coming from. They generally justify their attacks by claiming the feminists they dislike don't like men, yet don't seem to have an awareness of how much they appear to dislike other women. I've even seen some defend rape apologists or actively engage in rape apology themselves.

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #107)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 04:26 PM

109. steinem quote i like.

 

So it seems that women, just as other oppressed groups, often perpetuate the same prejudicial thoughts or behavior that they’ve experienced in a way to separate themselves from the oppressed group and be accepted as part of the positive majority. Competition is formed in order to be ingratiated to those in positions of power or those seen as possessing positive characteristics. And yet, Steinem explains, when an opportunity is created for the sharing of experiences, a sense of community emerges. A sense of sisterhood, if you will.

http://engenderingequality.wordpress.com/2011/11/14/sisterhood/

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Response to chervilant (Reply #36)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 12:27 PM

91. Some people deal with

oppression by becoming collaborators. It's nothing new and I try to feel sorry for them rather than hating them. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. Some of them don't even recognize their own oppression. Again, nothing new under the sun, right?

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #38)

Sun Apr 7, 2013, 08:20 PM

39. Like I said in another thread

someone is really bent outta shape over our little group.

Pathetic.

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Response to Texasgal (Reply #39)

Sun Apr 7, 2013, 08:24 PM

40. I'd like to see someone

draw this (and her other hidden OP) to Skinner's attention. Call it posting while feminist. I'm not the best messenger at the moment, so I don't feel I can do it myself.

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #40)

Sun Apr 7, 2013, 08:28 PM

41. I don't know if that will even help

It seems that Skinner doesn't give a rats ass.

I say we just continue, post again and again.. screw them. Nobody is forcing anyone to come and read in HOF. This is obviously someone with an ax to grind.

I say fuck it, continue on!

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 02:47 PM

42. this whole thread.

 

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022635878

a perfect example how femen is not about feminism flashing tits at Berlusconi and putin. flashing putin for the women that are working to have to endure hours of tit jokes from the men. both Berlusconi and putin sneering and ridiculing the women in dismissive and demeaning manner putting women in their place.

so fuckin effective.

then, the men that cheer femen, do not even consider the uncomfortable and hostile environment the rest of the women have to work in because of this one demonstrator. fuck the women, right?

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #42)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 03:17 PM

43. Wow, yeah, I bet Putin surely changed his mind about whatever that day.

And probably many of Putin's supporters were also convinced of whatever argument that young woman was making. With her boobs.


To see someone on DU say about Putin, "THIS is a leader!"


“We knew it was coming. You should thank the Ukrainian girls for helping you promote the fair,” (Putin) said.

Yeah, this method of 'protesting' is surely effective.

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #42)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 03:19 PM

44. The picture was hilarious *and* a perfect example of why Femen is utterly ridiculous. n/t

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Response to MadrasT (Reply #44)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 03:26 PM

45. putin objectifying the woman, being the alpha male he is, giving femen what they want.

 

and the rest of the day, the women continually without voice cause of tit jokes. must they join in on the tit jokes, laugh along with them, show their tits to be heard?

i get the initial reaction to funny.... of putin. but, .... he is a creep and ALL of meriks power of voice was suck out and given to putin in this one little flash.

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #45)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 04:03 PM

46. It just shows how ridiculous some persons reactions were to

women who felt this may backfire.

Well, hell it did back fire, and now it's all one big ole damn joke about boobies!

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Response to boston bean (Reply #46)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 04:31 PM

47. liten up. just a joke. ya... as it fuckin effects and impairs women, BUT

 

wtf

i really am liten'n up. i get the joke, probably beyond more than sees it at the surface. i do think it funny. and how in your fuckin face in less than a week.... funny.

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #47)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 05:30 PM

56. What is really stunning to me is the willful ignorance.

'But see! People are talking about the protest now!'

Um, no. They're talking about Putin's supposedly amusing face. Or her boobs. No one is talking about the message, except in the effort to prove there actually is one.

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #42)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 05:08 PM

49. I'm in this thread conversing now and it amazes me how all these people

Can't see the sexism in front of their eyes or even coming out of their own headw

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Response to Arcanetrance (Reply #49)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 05:20 PM

53. they saw it before. they see it now. and they will see it next time.

 

purposely obtuse. or simply pretending otherwise.

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #53)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 05:28 PM

55. It annoys me as a male I'm not sure how you deal with it

I mean why do I have to be antisex and antinudity to think these protests aren't effective and do more harm than good

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Response to Arcanetrance (Reply #55)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 05:30 PM

58. a lie. just another lie created. you have an issue with boobs. clearly, every post,

 

has defined what the issue is.

this is a lie. it is used to dismiss and silent the argument. god forbid any of these discussions actually have to do with what is being discussed.

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Response to Arcanetrance (Reply #55)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 05:32 PM

59. It's a tactic used to make objectors seem unhip, backward, and dare I say it...

..."conservative".

It's a lame smear tactic.

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Response to Arcanetrance (Reply #55)

Wed Nov 6, 2013, 10:30 AM

146. It's not that you don't have to be antisex, etc., to think they're not effective; it's just that

without supportive suggestions about what "effective" really is, that constructive thought simply feeds into the more contemptuous critics of that protest. Absent Big Lawyers, Guns and Money, it's just that oppressed groups have to protest in their own way.

Well-intentioned criticism stated from the relative security of a non-oppressed (officially, anyway) group members on how 'best' to do it would be more helpful. It doesn't mean you have to think a certain way; it just means that you could bear witness, give some moral support even if you don't agree with the means; or take your cues from women about how they want to go about getting what equalizes their institutional, financial or social status.

Women continue to try what has worked, sometimes not worked; and recently, women, along with Occupy, are bearing the brunt of militarized male led conservers of power.

Women tend to be ignored, whether dressed or not, when they protest...might as well go for high visibility on the world stage. The theater of it helped. Contempt and ridicule are short-sighted responses. Russian liberality about sex and gender will come the way it has in most other countries -- with jail, public punishment, etc. -- but eventually.

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #42)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 02:16 AM

83. in the dark

I dont keep up with news much so I know nothing about the femen "movement" and it's intellectual grounding. I understand that they bare thier breasts as part of the protest, but what are thier stated ideals? What are they trying to open people's hearts and minds to?
Do they have a rational for the use of nudity as part of thier attempts to garner attention and sympathyzers for thier movement?
This not an attempt at snarking or anything~ I'm genuinely interested.

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Response to sigmasix (Reply #83)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 02:49 AM

84. The best explanation I've seen

Was from someone who posted in this group arguing that FEMEN's point was to demonstrate that women's bodies shouldn't be a site for determining male honor. I can't remember the poster's name but he has an Ohio state flag as his avatar.

Muslim women have objected to FEMEN's focus on veiling and asserted that their clothing is not their business. FEMEN is anti-religion and anti-Islam in particular. Their messages tend to be very basic: "fuck the Qur'an, fuck dictatorship," etc. They marched into a women's conference and told the participants they talk too much. Many on this site outside of HOF love FEMEN, but I'm not sure they could tell you what the women are protesting.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 05:08 PM

48. Oh the irony....

We're "spun up" and only created this thread to get other people to alert "for us". Or some such nonsense.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1114&pid=7720

Pure projection in an effort to diminish women and make them seem paranoid and hysterical and not empowered to handle their own shit.

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Response to MadrasT (Reply #48)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 05:09 PM

50. uh... I must be out of the loop

what are the new rules on alerting?

Meant so much to me, according to others, I guess I should know.

Can anyone fill me in?

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Response to boston bean (Reply #50)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 05:10 PM

51. I have no idea WTF he is talking about.

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Response to MadrasT (Reply #51)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 05:11 PM

52. LOL! HAHAHAH!

But it was important, veeery important.

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Response to boston bean (Reply #52)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 05:30 PM

57. Well shit.

We both must have missed the last Convocation of the Sisterhood of Perpetual Outrage (where they apparently discussed these horribly restrictive new alerting rules and concocted this thinly veiled plot to get other people to alert for us, and then, um, somehow beamed you subliminal suggestions to create the thread for that purpose).

I hate it when I miss a Convocation. Ruins my whole week.

But I love it when people project so far that their conclusion actually leaves the solar system.

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Response to MadrasT (Reply #57)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 05:39 PM

60. i even brought the wine. i was the only that showed. hence, .... all my wine induced posts the

 

other night

meh

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #60)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 05:41 PM

61. It's my birthday. I might engage in some PUI later, LOL.

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Response to MadrasT (Reply #61)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 05:47 PM

62. i will join you, i think. if pui means wine, lol

 



and happy bday to you.

you look excellent in that number

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #62)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 05:54 PM

63. "Posting while Under the Influence"

I am partial to a nice Arrogant Bastard, myself.



"Liquid Arrogance"

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Response to MadrasT (Reply #63)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 06:03 PM

64. I knew you were an arrogant bastard kinda gal...

 

See how funny and that is even withou the booze. I crack me up

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Response to MadrasT (Reply #61)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 06:22 PM

65. not nearly as perilous

as posting while feminist.

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Response to MadrasT (Reply #57)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 07:01 PM

66. "project so far that their conclusion actually leaves the solar system"


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Response to MadrasT (Reply #48)

Mon Apr 8, 2013, 05:27 PM

54. it would be interesting for skinner to let us know what group gets the most alerts.

 

this is what is disgusting me. making shit up out of nothing. absolutely nothing.

the least he could do is act like it might possibly be a guess, or assumption, or result of, instead of a fact that is the purpose of this thread.

all about the dumb.

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Response to MadrasT (Reply #48)

Mon Apr 29, 2013, 02:10 PM

124. The usual suspects in that thread wonderfully illustrating an obtus

The usual suspects in that thread wonderfully illustrating an obtuse, trout-brained, sub-literate denial of the obvious.



"projection in an effort to diminish women and make them seem paranoid and hysterical..."
Between you and me, the only hysterical paranoia is embedded in that thread.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Tue Apr 9, 2013, 06:11 PM

67. Our "allies"

find great humor in the gang rape and suicide of a 17 year old girl. Tell me again how we are on the same side?

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #67)

Tue Apr 9, 2013, 07:22 PM

68. Only one of them posted.

The other allies stay out of a thread so they can get called to jury duty.

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Response to DURHAM D (Reply #68)

Tue Apr 9, 2013, 09:18 PM

73. Apparently.

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #67)

Tue Apr 9, 2013, 10:49 PM

76. So disgusted by that.

Not a hint of compassion for the poor girl. Just an excuse to piss on the mean ole feminists. Really disturbing.

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Response to TDale313 (Reply #76)

Tue Apr 9, 2013, 10:52 PM

78. People can at least see their true colors.

In their own words.

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #78)

Tue Apr 9, 2013, 11:09 PM

80. Very true. n/t

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Tue Apr 9, 2013, 08:15 PM

69. stuff like this gets a pass

At Mon Apr 1, 2013, 07:32 PM you sent an alert on the following post:

Judge Questions Fairness Of Citigroup's Tits - Reuters/HufPo
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022600924

REASON FOR ALERT:

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate. (See <a href="http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=aboutus#communitystandards" target="_blank">Community Standards</a>.)

YOUR COMMENTS:

really? why was "tit" put in the subject line, if not to offend.

JURY RESULTS

A randomly-selected Jury of DU members completed their review of this alert at Mon Apr 1, 2013, 07:39 PM, and voted 1-5 to LEAVE IT ALONE.

Juror #1 voted to HIDE IT and said: I vote hide for false expectations
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: When did we become so easily offended...and I am a 60 year old woman. Good grief..
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: Just suggest that they take the word "tits" out. OK?
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given

Thank you.

This was allowed to stand. The only one that said to hide was because of false expectaions. Oh, and the admonishment to ask that they take the word out. Like someone who purposely does something to be offensive will all of a sudden see the light if I ask nice enough? WTF.WTF do "tits" have to do with a banking story? The word is not even in the actual title of the article. The poster purposely inserted it there.

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Response to mercuryblues (Reply #69)

Tue Apr 9, 2013, 08:47 PM

70. But then this gets a 5-1 Hide

At Tue Apr 9, 2013, 08:03 PM an alert was sent on the following post:

Because she's bitch that's why.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2643160

REASON FOR ALERT:

ALERTER'S COMMENTS:

Doubling-down on sexist slur (bitch).

JURY RESULTS

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Tue Apr 9, 2013, 08:39 PM, and the Jury voted 5-1 to HIDE IT.

Juror #1 voted to HIDE IT and said: No need for sexist language
Juror #2 voted to HIDE IT and said: So many children, so few adults on DU. If Maraya was born in 1969 they are old enough to know better.
Juror #3 voted to HIDE IT and said: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to HIDE IT and said: No explanation given
Juror #5 voted to HIDE IT and said: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: Bitch, bitch, bitch, bitch,
bitch, bitch, bitch, bitch,
she's a stupid bitch,
Kyle's mom's a bitch and she's
such a dirty bitch!

Not sure what to make of Juror #6.

Note: This was not my alert - I was on the jury.

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Response to DURHAM D (Reply #70)

Wed Jan 15, 2014, 07:57 PM

158. Juror#6 is quoting from a movie musical about censorship

http://www.rogerebert.com/reviews/south-park-bigger-longer-and-uncut-1999


"...Key plot point: The deaths of Terrence and Phillip would be the seventh sign of the Apocalypse, triggering Armageddon. It's up to the South Park kids to save the world. All of this unfolds against an unending stream of satirical abuse, ethnic stereotyping, sexual vulgarity and pointed political commentary that alternates common sense with the truly and hurtfully offensive.

I laughed, as I have reported. Sometimes the laughter was liberating, as good laughter can be, and sometimes it was simply disbelieving: How could they get away with this? This is a season when the movies are hurtling themselves over the precipice of good taste. Every week brings its new surprises. "


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Response to mercuryblues (Reply #69)

Tue Apr 9, 2013, 08:49 PM

71. I have "tits" in my keyword trash list

Anyone who needs to use that in a thread title is just doing it for attention and this ensures that I will not be seeing it or feeding their need at all

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Response to mercuryblues (Reply #69)

Tue Apr 9, 2013, 10:35 PM

74. this poster is having a good little hoot over this. what dinner skinner lecture whisp about?

 

surely we do not object to differing opinion?

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Tue Apr 9, 2013, 08:50 PM

72. Another good hide - 4-2

At Tue Apr 9, 2013, 08:17 PM you sent an alert on the following post:

Seriously sick shit. Those rapists should be locked up for a decade or so. Fuck them.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2644122

REASON FOR ALERT:

YOUR COMMENTS:

gheez louise. Poster trying everything possible to blame females for the rape and resulting death. Blame the mothers? Really?

A randomly-selected Jury of DU members completed their review of this alert at Tue Apr 9, 2013, 08:29 PM, and voted 4-2 to HIDE IT.

Juror #1 voted to HIDE IT and said: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given
Juror #3 voted to HIDE IT and said: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given
Juror #5 voted to HIDE IT and said: Yikes.
Juror #6 voted to HIDE IT and said: But nothing. You seriously need to grow up. You sound like a woman hating neanderthal, someone that belongs on Free Republic. Your vendetta against people here at DU surrounding the issue of sexism and misogyny has completely clouded your judgment. In no way is your post appropriate. If you need to say these things so badly do it somewhere else but give this young lady the respect she deserves. Shame on you.

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Response to DURHAM D (Reply #72)

Tue Apr 9, 2013, 10:38 PM

75. loved jury 6. i was curious about this one. i do not even bother. assuming they have consent to

 

behave however they like.

i was glad to see this hide.

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #75)

Tue Apr 9, 2013, 11:00 PM

79. I thought long and hard before I sent the alert

because I was afraid it might come back 0-6 to leave. It was a nice surprise for a change.


ETA: If this is sent to a jury please do not believe the compulsive Alerter who states that call outs are not allowed. They are allowed and are posted all of the time on DU3. Thank you.

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Response to DURHAM D (Reply #79)

Tue Apr 9, 2013, 11:15 PM

82. The one that amazed me

Is the hide on the snarky comment to me. It didn't occur to me to report that.

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Response to DURHAM D (Reply #72)

Tue Apr 9, 2013, 10:51 PM

77. That is a good one, and surprising

It's hard to keep track of conflicting arguments. Supposedly we hate sex and the naked body and that's why some of us aren't over the moon for FEMEN. But then it's a woman's responsibility to not dress provocatively in order to avoid being raped. Sl** is not a gendered term because it applies to men as well as women (despite the fact no one shames men that way). Then the fact a girl is shamed by her rapists is the fault of mothers because they must be just like feminists on this site. So the true guilty party is not rapists but women--that's the one commonality in all the tortured arguments.

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #77)

Tue Apr 9, 2013, 11:13 PM

81. ya. this. lol. nt

 

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Response to DURHAM D (Reply #72)


Response to boston bean (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 09:40 AM

85. A good 6-0 Hide

And out of respect to those with learning disabilities, I won't repeat it.

Skinner and Earl need to get their shit together and make election season rules permanent or this site...

Start with the feminist clique on here that digests any material bashing a man through their unkempt cunts and regurgitating it through their loud, shrill mouths.

Then you should show nadin "I've had over 9000 careers" brzezinski the door, lowering the quality and credibility of the site with each bullshit thread.

Don't forget to move on to the hack89s and slackmasters of the site in the dungeon, constantly pushing their NRA propaganda. They are people I wouldn't mind disappearing into a black helicopter labeled DHS.

And for those constantly critical of the President, no matter how positive the news:


http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022646773

Profile here - http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=profile&uid=284540

ETA: Poster has been banned by EarlG -

Apr 10, 2013 Reason: Sexist.




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Response to DURHAM D (Reply #85)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 11:31 AM

87. about time.

too bad, he had to knock them upside the head with the misogyny before finally deciding to recognize it.

This just goes back to our concerns not being taken seriously. And by them, I mean juries, Duers, and admin. I mean, we have all known about this creep for sometime. Yet he's been allowed to wreak havoc against feminists on DU for months. No one listening or trying to understand.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)


Response to boston bean (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 12:02 PM

88. Karl Rove does a jig each time we fan the flames of our internal discord. Divide and conquer,

turn the poor white against the poor blacks and the women against the men. Make the women think they have more in common is the Sandberg's and Clinton's of the world then they do with the guy down the block.

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Response to Exultant Democracy (Reply #88)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 12:10 PM

90. I am not sure I understand your post.

I was sort of following along until the "Sandberg/Clinton" part. Perhaps you are suggesting that the right wing disruptors on DU are part of a Rove Ratfucking plan.

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Response to Exultant Democracy (Reply #88)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 12:28 PM

92. Women vote for Democrats more reliably than men.

http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/10/21/gender-gap-near-historic-highs/

So ... yeah.

Maybe these issues should be treated more seriously, and not treated like an afterthought.

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Response to redqueen (Reply #92)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 12:43 PM

94. I vote D in spite

Of the sexism on both the left and the right. If I had to make my choice on women's issues, I would never vote. Sexism on the left is just as common as sexism on the right, but usually (though not always) a kindler, gentler sexism. On the left, you don't get people coming out and saying that a woman belongs in the home under the control of her male owner (be it father, spouse or brother.) On the left, you just get attitudes that say the same thing while thinking they are enlightened. Not so virulent or in your face, but still harmful.

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Response to gaspee (Reply #94)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 12:56 PM

95. I've heard many feminists say that, where sexism and misogyny are concerned,

Last edited Thu Apr 11, 2013, 02:24 PM - Edit history (1)

the difference between the left and the right is in how the boot should be positioned on our necks. (something like that anyway)

To one group, we're private property, to the other, public. Neither considers women full human beings because society as a whole doesn't consider women to be full human beings.

To see how endemic this is just consider rape, or revealing pictures.

In the context of rape, women are assumed to have given consent. We have to prove we said no. We have to prove we didn't want it. It is assumed that, as a default position, we wanted it. Public property.

In the context of revealing pictures, women are expected to take all the blame when such pictures are distributed. Whether they're given or stolen, the idea that they will/should be shared is taken as a given. It is assumed that women should simply accept the blame for even having been photographed that way, or taking such photographs. Contrast that with someone telling a secret. If I tell you a secret, and you tell someone else, does anyone else chide me for telling secrets? And tell me I could expect no different? No. All the blame and shame goes on the person who betrayed my confidence.

But when it comes to the idea of women's bodies, different rules come into play. Whether our physical selves, or simply images, the default setting is: public property. (And this also plays in the abortion 'debate' - our bodies are treated like a policy position. Our very healthcare is a chit to be debated, restricted, and bargained with.)

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Response to redqueen (Reply #95)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 01:57 PM

99. To one group, we're private property, to the other, public.

 

love it. and it perfectly explains it. thanks

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #99)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 02:56 PM

105. I should give a hat tip to the many radical feminists

who have clarified and crystallized this point over the years.

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #99)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 07:03 PM

111. yeh, that's a pointy one for sure.

 

fits so well. wow.

Public property: 'Liberal' men think they should be able to fuck freely in front of an ice cream store, if you disagree and think that private things like that should be kept private, well then you are a dried up prudeprune that hates sex. That women should be hung up on meat hooks so the men can walk by and choose like they would at a butchers. After all, that is the ultimate in 'freedumbs' isn't it? And the women, they like it, don't be silly.

Private property: The chattel days where men decide what freedoms women should have. This is happening right now, back to the stone age for the RW and what they are doing to women.

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Response to redqueen (Reply #95)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 02:01 PM

100. Pretty much exactly

And men on the left think they are doing a favor by being "allies." And expect a cookie for it. Like it's so big of them. Fuck that. Be an ally in deed and action - like treating women as full human beings. Adjusting language when requested. So simple but so far beyond the apparent mainstream that it receives violent reaction on a supposed left board.

Men on the left, IMO, killed the feminist movement of the 60's/70's with the 80's backlash. It wasn't just conservatives who voted for Ronnie Raygun and Thatcher and their ilk. That was the people who considered themselves liberals who decided the minorities and women just wanted *too* much. I guess it was too much to ask of them to think of their partners as people and equals and not as another minority group wanting a "handout" or "special treatment." They wanted all the benefit of women's empowerment (think sex) without any of the change in thinking that comes along with that. Along with women owning their own bodies and freely choosing their sexual partners came the expectation that women wouldn't be punished for that. But men on the left are just as invested in slut shaming and controlling women's actions through collective threats of sexual violence. Because it's all still about men.

I consider myself a radical feminist. Much too radical for many. But what's so radical about that?

Why I consider myself a radical feminist: I would like society to move beyond the binary thinking of male vs female and think of human. But to get to that point, there's a lot of privilege that needs to be discarded. But to even point out privilege is to be "radical" - just look at the reaction to wholly mainstream feminist thought that gets posted here. I guess privilege, to paraphrase, will have to be ripped from their cold, dead hands.

And before anyone alerts, dead from the passage of time, not anything else. It's going to take the dying off of the Archie Bunker types WHILE AT THE SAME TIME changing the thought patterns of society.

The way to change the thought pattern of the younger generation is to be loud and to change the way people think. And that includes language. Language is thought. And if that's through those of us on the radical fringes being vilified and hated by those refusing to change, all the while, providing a new way of thinking to those coming up - well, that's the way it will have to be.

Just think back on what was acceptable even 20 years ago in other areas - the way language has changed alone will turn into change in ways of thinking. In ways of being.

So when someone says - hey, the President pointing out someone's appearance is not professional. Well, maybe someone watching and reading hadn't though about it, but now, giving it some thought, realizes - yeah - only women are subjected to that. Now, what they may not get is that it's because women's only value used to be (and still to some extent does) reside in her attractiveness to men, and not in herself. And that is changing . But to point out her attractiveness, or lack thereof, is unprofessional because of that... I think that leads to change.

So I accept the charge of radical and I will continue to point things out because the status quo only changes when we MAKE it.

Sorry to go off on a riff - just caught my attention



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Response to gaspee (Reply #100)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 02:18 PM

102. and THIS is why i love your voice and wanted to give you a shout out in the thread that was locked.

 

this should be its own OP. excellent points all the way thru. and your TONE even sounded so reasonable, mellow, laid back and gentle'ish, lol.

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Response to gaspee (Reply #100)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 02:57 PM

106. Please don't ever apologize for going off on riffs like that.

I love that riff.

And yes, radical feminists are getting fed up with being sidelined, marginalized, demonized, etc. There's a reason that shit goes on, and we are saying ENOUGH.

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Response to gaspee (Reply #100)

Wed Nov 6, 2013, 11:05 AM

148. Yep! I'm a radical feminist, too! Stay tough! It gets attention!

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Response to redqueen (Reply #95)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 06:30 PM

110. Interesting point about presumed consent.

Is there a tension between systemic presumption of innocence and justice for victims of rape?

If so what is the solution do you think?

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Response to Shivering Jemmy (Reply #110)

Thu Apr 11, 2013, 01:47 PM

113. False dichotomy.

The conflict is not between the presumption of innocence and justice for rape.

The conflict is between the way these crimes against women are treated vs. the way almost every other crime (if not every single one) is treated.

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Response to redqueen (Reply #113)

Thu Apr 11, 2013, 03:56 PM

115. I hear what you are saying

So you're talking about the social reaction to claims of "I just got robbed" vs. "I just got raped." In the former case social bias presumes that the claimant is telling the truth (regardless of legal status) while in the latter not so much. Right?

I wasn't clear on your context and your reply makes a lot of sense.

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Response to Shivering Jemmy (Reply #115)

Thu Apr 11, 2013, 04:27 PM

116. Exactly.

It sends a very clear message.

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Response to redqueen (Reply #95)

Wed Nov 6, 2013, 11:03 AM

147. Yes, yes, yes...and for reasons that have now disappeared from most males' consciousness.

The basis of property -- control and manhood -- is an historically male dominated concept.

That's why I think it's important that we start suggesting readings for those who fall into these presumptuous thought traps. These days, the history of half the planet -- the recovery of which is ongoing -- is largely unknown to large numbers of them.

I like to assume that male language isn't consciously sexist -- since there are no consequences for it, most of the time -- simply group reinforced; and that, if reasoned with, they come around to understand better the hidden thought structures that allow them or their brothers their careless thinking-turned-policy.



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Response to ancianita (Reply #147)

Wed Nov 6, 2013, 12:51 PM

151. I like to think so, too.

But we have been trying to reason with the people on this site for years, and it's like talking to a brick wall.

I now think there's only time to talk to people who haven't enthusiastically championed patriarchal values (and there are a SHIT TON of people here who are deeply committed to championing those values).

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Response to redqueen (Reply #151)

Wed Nov 6, 2013, 12:57 PM

152. One thing I learned teaching hs, you need to realize that your influence ripples across people

and time. You've been here and can see change or the lack of better than I. But I've learned that there's also the probability that we hardly see the results of our efforts immediately, and that they go off more than they come back in big and small ways. Many men's hearts and minds are changing, and thus there's less unconscious, self-indulgent groupthink kicking around. But we have no real way of measuring that, do we, except over time. I'm going to keep paying attention now.

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Response to gaspee (Reply #94)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 01:54 PM

98. yup... man issue, not a party issue. nt

 

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Response to Exultant Democracy (Reply #88)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 01:52 PM

96. mmmm. some man calling us a C word has nothing to do with it? nt

 

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 02:45 PM

104. I‘ve not experienced it on the DU. I guess

I am lucky but I find the whole DU to be a safe place.

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Response to applegrove (Reply #104)

Wed Apr 10, 2013, 04:16 PM

108. good for you. we were just called the c word today, and shrills. so we are not experiencing du

 

the same as you are.

but, i am glad it is a safe place for you.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Thu Apr 11, 2013, 01:36 PM

112. I trashed two threads last night

One, the OP openly admitted intentionally starting a flame bait thread using rape stats--a rehash of the same old shit of attempting to minimize the prevalence and impact of rape.

The other a particularly disgusting use of the disabled to 'discuss' sex workers. I have to say that last one troubled me--these things usually don't--it could have been a great topic, a much needed discussion on the ways the disabled are perceived. What troubled me was the blithe unconcern for the disabled. As health care worker, I felt the ignorance and unconcern was also dangerous, as disability comes in many forms and in some cases would need medical advice prior to engaging in any type of sex much less procuring the 'expertise' of a sex worker. I didn't get into that though.

My point(s) were, even though the article featured a female client, sex workers are overwhelmingly female, the disabled are not exactly rolling in funds required for the services of a 'sexologist', and sex workers themselves work in a dangerous circumstances.

One the OP gave me an strong enough indication that the thread was sexist flame bait, I trashed it.

I don't mind reasonable discussions, I don't expect to be agreed with all the time, but I dislike disingenuous posts that are little more than an attempt at a cover for rape apologist, and a denial of what the life of an average worker is really like.


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Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #112)

Thu Apr 11, 2013, 02:35 PM

114. The endless flogging of one set of statistics about rape is enough reason to ignore.

I'm glad the men (and it is almost always men) are so comforted by those statistics.

I've had my experiences, and I have two daughters. I'm not about to shut up about rape.


As for the other, as soon as someone describes sex with another person as a "need", you know it's pointless to attempt reasoned discussion.

And regardless, many disabled people are able to find partners without paying to use them as masturbatory aids, so this portrayal of them as uniquely unlovable is just ugly.

There are lots of people who for one reason or another have trouble finding a romantic partner. The issue isn't helping the disabled, its legitimizing the idea that buying sex is acceptable.

And demagoguing the issue by conflating a desire for intimacy (genuinely understandable) with a desire to have someone else facilitate an orgasm for you (LOL) is, IMO, sick.

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Response to redqueen (Reply #114)

Thu Apr 11, 2013, 06:54 PM

117. I read another view of the issue

That actually discusses that root problem, which is HOW those who aren't within 'abled' standards are perceived as 'non-sexual' therefore undesirable. Again, part of patriartical control of sexuality and desirability. which is, in essence sexual repression. Aside from fetishizing, who is addressing that?

I did read an article that addressed a couple of my medical concerns, as autonomic dysreflexia in quads, with 'trained sex workers'--quite expensive, and male- gendered oriented.

Not a solution. The disabled are a vulnerable population often in poverty.

To see the issue used that way was extemely sick.

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Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #117)

Thu Apr 11, 2013, 07:10 PM

118. You were so restrained

I couldn't even tell you were pissed off.

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Response to ismnotwasm (Reply #117)

Sat Apr 13, 2013, 02:33 PM

122. Hardly anyone is addressing that.

Where is the money to be made?

It really is sick and disgusting that people would demagogue the issue using disabled people. I know many in loving relationships. But hey, why bother ourselves with reality where there's an agenda to be pushed?

I wish more people would think about why some work so hard not to see the agenda behind dumbassery like this. Did you see the article about human trafficking in Germany? Where prostitution is legal? Which is supposed to magically make human trafficking less of an issue? Except in reality it doesn't? It's sad that liberals have such an enormous blind spot where this shit is concerned. Billions of dollars and organized crime just kind just fade into the background.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)


Response to boston bean (Original post)

Sat Apr 13, 2013, 09:19 AM

120. A very revealing juror comment....

The jury decision to hide this post 4:2 was reassuring, but this one juror comment-- justifying their decision not to hide-- certainly underscores our concerns regarding what message is being received by some posters. I'm just going to post that one comment:

At Sat Apr 13, 2013, 07:00 AM an alert was sent on the following post:

Beaver Street.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2663038

REASON FOR ALERT:

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate. (See <a href="http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=aboutus#communitystandards" target="_blank">Community Standards</a>.)

ALERTER'S COMMENTS:
Rude, disruptive, sexist.

JURY RESULTS

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Sat Apr 13, 2013, 07:05 AM, and the Jury voted 4-2 to HIDE IT.


Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: Yes, a little juvenile, but typically this is tolerated on DU. Skinner himself has been known to yuck it up over the word "MILF".


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Response to hlthe2b (Reply #120)

Thu May 9, 2013, 09:28 PM

125. isnt that interesting. and yes, i have heard this excuse used for sexist slurs. but wow. thanks

 

for the post.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Sat Apr 13, 2013, 11:19 AM

121. Now we don't have a rape culture

If women were subject to the same level of violence as the Congo, then there might be a problem.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Wed Apr 17, 2013, 09:34 PM

123. Thanks for this! I have been getting kind of depressed about this shit lately.

I am happy for the support, sometimes I don't comment because I am so disheartened I can't think of anything to say. But I really appreciate all of you who come on here and fight for us. Thank you!

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Thu May 9, 2013, 10:20 PM

126. Man, you chicks really got your panties in a bunch now, don't ya?

 

Sarcasm meter on.......

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Response to Bennyboy (Reply #126)

Fri May 10, 2013, 03:10 PM

127. Another batch of noxious examples this week. nt

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Fri May 10, 2013, 08:06 PM

128. I was booted from a thread on masculinity...

Supposedly by a troll with several zombie accounts.

I said that I didn't think people should talk about subjects for which they have little or no formal education or experience. This was specifically against someone who claimed to know that sexual identity and gender identity were innate.

Furthermore, I was ganged up on for saying that masculinity was inherently violent. Which it is. The masculine ethos is one of aggression and physical confrontation as well as the repression of any sort of loving or vulnerable emotional displays.

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Response to Gravitycollapse (Reply #128)

Sat May 11, 2013, 08:06 AM

129. This is not a meant to be reincarnation of Meta. IMO your comment doesn't belong here.

This is a "Thread to discuss sexism and misogyny you encounter on DU".

Your comment is not really discussing sexism or misogyny encountered on DU.

In some way, your comment may actually be perpetuating sexism on DU, because without quite a lot of exposition, saying "masculinity is inherently violent" can be seem to be a sexist statement.

If someone stated that "femininity is inherently warm and nurturing" I would go through the fucking roof with smoke coming out of my ears.

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Response to MadrasT (Reply #129)

Sat May 11, 2013, 10:55 AM

130. i just saw the Op. i am not gonna do the little dance for him, he is demanding of us.

 

how many people, including those that will jump on that OP have stated aggression is inherently male.

i do not agree. i argue. and i know you do, too.

but, i am not playing bonobos game.

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #130)

Wed Nov 6, 2013, 11:20 AM

149. Isn't there an approach to these claims of essentialism that doesn't just depend on consensus or

the stance of "personal correction?"

For instance, can't we just provide research, or book titles (with exerpts, even) that show how essentialist claims of both sexes are false? Can't we provide some applications of those sources out in the world that don't appear as anomalies?

It seems that the "inherent" arguments get too personal too fast, and a quick, fact/authority-based apprising of that argument with evidence that squashes it might go a long way toward changing male minds in DU.

It seems like women here in the History of Feminism would do that as a first response. Then, if there's another alert-worthy post, go for it.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Sat May 11, 2013, 11:35 AM

131. Here is another example:

OhAndOneMoreThing (1 post)

145. The subspecies of human known as "Progressive Whinyassus" never does either.

Last edited Sat May 11, 2013, 11:23 AM USA/ET - Edit history (1)

The extremists that are allowed a voice here on this site are dragging it down.

HiPointDem, redqueen, MotherPetrie, Fire Walk With Me, seabeyond, brentspeak, MannyGoldstein, and cali are the types of people that Skinner should purge from this site once and for all. They aren't worth the cost of the paper their entitlements are printed on if it were to be used to wipe several obese women's fat (just to hear some shrieking from the "History of Feminism") asses.

You are petulant children that are lucky enough the President even considers you every now and then, but in reality you aren't worth enough to chew the gum stuck to his shoe.

P.S. Don't bother trying to link this account to my main account. I've never logged onto DU from this location, as I am out of town. Just know that there are several of us that discuss that list of cretins in length in private messages.


Obviously,this is an active Duer, that set up a sock to spout this bs.

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Response to boston bean (Reply #131)

Sat May 11, 2013, 11:56 AM

132. LOL... my god they are such cowardly little shitpebbles!



Here's another couple of snippets from a glaring example, which was smartly deleted, but only after he had his ass handed to him repeatedly. I hope he understands now how fucked up his comment actually was.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2825212

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Response to redqueen (Reply #132)

Sat May 11, 2013, 12:13 PM

134. there is a newbie poster in there that does not sound progressive, nor they belong on du.

 

i didnt read the thread, until you provided the link.

all that makes me a bit sick. and very sad.

i am really not in a place right now, where i see so clearly how men feel about women.

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Response to boston bean (Reply #131)

Sat May 11, 2013, 12:03 PM

133. i think administration would tell us, this is all in our head. really, there are not these obsessed

 

women hating men on du causing us problems.

hmmm.

lol

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Response to boston bean (Reply #131)

Wed Nov 6, 2013, 11:22 AM

150. Wow.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Wed May 15, 2013, 06:24 PM

135. TIL that women's boobs are analogous to cars at a car show.

And that by "displaying" said boobs, people are inviting others to have an opinion about them.

This bit of genius level insight was of course cloaked in 'I'm talking about this, not that!' disingenuousness, but when an OP is about that, then.. well, yeah.

And as anyone with an IQ above 50 knows, we all get to have opinions. And therefore that the point is about something besides simply the fact that men have opinions about boobies.

But by pretending you're too stupid to understand such incredibly simple context, you can get away with all kinds of dishonest bullshit. Which comes as a shock to absolutely no one, of course.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Tue May 28, 2013, 01:23 AM

136. "Misandry"

Apparently misandry now means insisting women have a right to decide who they have sex with. If a woman argues no means no, she's a misandrist, since that gets in the way of the man's right to have sex with whomever he wants whenever he wants. Prosecuting men for rape is also misandry because it provides "special protections" for rape victims. When rapists are male, they need protection from women who think they have the right to choose who they want to have sex with.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Sun Jun 16, 2013, 12:32 PM

137. This thread in GD is full of it.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023009387

And I'm really starting to wonder how long before enough people notice, so that acceptance of this shit starts to change.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Tue Jun 18, 2013, 09:10 PM

138. I'm a little bit confused about all the alerts I've seen here lately.

I read some of the threads in the men's group (I don't post anything there, I just read, it feels too much like a boy's club and I feel like I shouldn't even be reading it) and they're complaining about the same thing. Alerts on posts that don't break the rules and trolling. Is there some kind of alert war going on?

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Thu Jun 20, 2013, 04:37 PM

139. TIL: Only female parents influence their daughters' clothing choices.

Also, if women complain about people who engage in blaming rape victims for being raped, that's sexist.

Also, girls/women who get drunk have to accept at least some responsibility for being raped.


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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Fri Jun 21, 2013, 09:20 PM

140. whores, sluts, hookers, streetwalkers... people are having a fucking field day in GD

And almost no one at all is saying jack fucking shit about it.

Time for a long fucking break from this misogyny loving forum.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Wed Jul 10, 2013, 11:47 PM

141. Some thinly-veiled misogyny in GD about Carlson and Hasslebeck

 

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023220832

I don't really like either of them myself, but is attacking their appearance really necessary?

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Thu Sep 26, 2013, 02:53 AM

142. First jury service on gender under the new rules was a success

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1018486916

Can we hope this bodes for things to come? Might people take jury service more seriously under this new framework?

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #142)

Sat Sep 28, 2013, 03:57 PM

143. Oh my god. What thought process could have decided it would be cool to post that OP?

Even if it's just blatant flame bait, it's pretty disturbed. A child's toy, no less.

Ugh.

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #142)

Sun Mar 23, 2014, 08:22 PM

161. OMG - trigger warning?!?

I clicked on your link. Not sure what I was going to see. Saw a link to the Locked post and stupidly clicked. I nearly hyperventilated before I could figure out how to get it off my screen.

Aren't threads locked for a freaking reason?!?!? WHY are they still VIEWABLE??? Doesn't do much to zap them if they're still there.

What sick fk came up with that anyway? And - well - I could look no further, but please tell me whoever the hell posted it was banned for life. And reported to some authority somewhere as a potential offender. (Of course, I'll probably get called "hysterical" by somebody on DU for my post.)

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Mon Sep 30, 2013, 08:58 PM

144. This shows how little women are valued


At Mon Sep 30, 2013, 08:50 PM you sent an alert on the following post:

He is the teabaggers' bitch.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=3755013

REASON FOR ALERT:

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

YOUR COMMENTS:

It is insulting to women to use sexist words on this site.

JURY RESULTS

A randomly-selected Jury of DU members completed their review of this alert at Mon Sep 30, 2013, 08:56 PM, and voted 1-5 to LEAVE IT ALONE.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: I understand the emotion, but he is the tea party's bitch in that he is the breeder of their ideas.
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given
Juror #4 voted to HIDE IT and said: A bitch is a female dog, not a human being.
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Thu Oct 24, 2013, 03:14 PM

145. Thought you might be interested in this.

 

"If women want equal treatment then they have to accept equal blame when they fuck up."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023913069#post47

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Fri Nov 15, 2013, 12:31 PM

153. good idea.

thanks for this thread.

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Response to Sheri (Reply #153)

Sat Nov 16, 2013, 08:31 PM

155. Welcome to HoF. Hope to see you around!

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Response to boston bean (Reply #155)

Wed Nov 20, 2013, 01:18 PM

156. thanks for the welcome.

i'm a major lurker, but i love this group, and i hope i can contribute more.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)


Response to boston bean (Original post)

Fri Dec 27, 2013, 01:58 AM

157. Yet another honest post hidden by MRA trolls.

It seems whatever they post is immune. But whatever we post is hidden immediately.

AUTOMATED MESSAGE: One of your posts has been hidden by a DU Jury
Mail Message
At Thu Dec 26, 2013, 11:08 PM, an alert was sent on the following post:

Women can't discuss feminism on DU because it's infested with pigs.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4234117

REASON FOR ALERT:

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate.

ALERTER'S COMMENTS:

Enough already! Stop this please jurors. Read the SOP.

JURY RESULTS

A randomly-selected Jury of DU members completed their review of this alert at Thu Dec 26, 2013, 11:21 PM, and voted 6-0 to HIDE IT.

Juror #1 voted to HIDE IT and said: This one's marginal to me, on the edge of excessive.
Juror #2 voted to HIDE IT and said: This has indeed gone too far. Gravitycollapse has been spouting insults with impunity for far too long. Hide this.
Juror #3 voted to HIDE IT and said: Voting to hide because I believe this person to be a repeat troll.
Juror #4 voted to HIDE IT and said: We lately have seen quite a flurry
Of posts full of gender-based fury
But if this one's not hidden,
Then DU's over-ridden
With folks who should steer clear of juries.
Juror #5 voted to HIDE IT and said: No explanation given
Juror #6 voted to HIDE IT and said: Rules, on DU, you cannot refer to other
members as pigs. It won't fly. Hide.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Wed Mar 5, 2014, 11:20 PM

159. That this post of mine was alerted on

and got two votes to hide seems a pretty clear case of not only sexism but seeking to silence efforts to point out endemic sexism.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4614033

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Response to redqueen (Reply #160)

Mon Apr 7, 2014, 11:27 AM

162. holy smoley

that is obnoxious. the poster knows all of that in less than 500 posts. seems fishy that a new member can assume so much about another poster.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Fri May 2, 2014, 03:45 PM

163. Just got jury duty

about this post
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4899598

ALERTER'S COMMENTS

See replies 15 & 26 - "a situation where you can be accused of rape" is SO wide ranging INCLUDING false accusations (believe it or not) that this post is insensitive, over-the-top victim-blaming.

I'm sorry, you gotta call this what it is, just as bad as "don't get put in a situation where you can be raped."

There should be no tolerance for victim-blaming on DU.

Result 5-2 leave it,

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Thu May 8, 2014, 05:08 AM

164. In the Willow Smith posing with a guy on a bed thread

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024921775

There is a lovely example of an MRA abuse happy to enable abuse. My reply to his post which was titled Uhm, if they aren't jealous rageaholics who don't trust their spouse, why would... is below. If you look at his post there is a minor trigger warning

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4924056

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Fri May 16, 2014, 09:08 AM

165. If you want to counter sexism on DU, just go over to GD where

poster Dipsy Doodle is serving up the word "cunt" for laughs. I tried to educate

him on the differences between the use of that word in the UK and the US,

but he doesn't seem interested. I alerted on him. I'd appreciate it if you or anyone on HOF

could call him out. Thanks.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Sun May 25, 2014, 02:40 PM

166. I don't know whether I'm more disgusted or discouraged

There's more blatant, in-your-face misogyny and homophobia on DU than I can EVER recall in my 12 years here. Threads worthy of the worst of FR which should have been immediately deleted, yet the posts being alerted on and deleted are those of women who've had the audacity to take umbrage at crap being thrown in their faces.

DU has never been what I would consider "woman friendly" but this situation has gone 'round the bend and I no longer have any faith in the jury system.

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Response to theHandpuppet (Reply #166)

Thu Jun 19, 2014, 09:13 PM

167. Yep

That is exactly how it is. We even had an OP sympathizing with a fucking mass murderer's overt and homicidal misogyny.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Sat Jul 12, 2014, 05:39 AM

168. what is the point of discussing sexism and misogyny among the people who experience it?

we all know it exists. it's not like we need proof.
why not do something about it, instead of talking about it in a group which is shut off from the very people who need to know about it?

(sincere questions, not being rhetorical)

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Mon Aug 4, 2014, 09:42 PM

169. Jeezil Pete, what's with all the woman-bashing trolls lately?

Sheesh, you can't even post a thread to HoF anymore without having to swat away the trolls who have apparently signed up just to descend on this forum. This is getting ridiculous.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Sat Aug 23, 2014, 10:31 AM

170. In a thread about why some men rent prostitutes,

several people have thrown out the answer that 'they're paying them to go away afterward'

Only one person called out that reasoning as misogynistic.


Several people have posited that all women are prostitutes, and the only difference is the price.

No one called these comments out, but I did call a couple out out this morning.


There's more in there. Of course. I thought maybe more people would see it and call it out overnight. Of course that didn't happen.

Misogyny isn't an issue on this site, don'tchaknow?

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Sun Aug 24, 2014, 06:50 AM

171. Another person spouting MRA foolishness

in this post http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025431416#post25

I did give a short reply.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Mon Sep 8, 2014, 02:13 AM

172. A DUer tells me feminists cause sex crimes because they repress sexuality.

Last edited Mon Sep 8, 2014, 02:46 AM - Edit history (1)

Another tells me that the only reason feminists object to a very degrading, pornographic depiction of Spiderwoman on a comic cover is because they don't want men enjoying the female form.

Both in one sexism-laden thread.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1017&pid=213190

Neither were hidden.

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Response to boston bean (Original post)

Fri Nov 28, 2014, 09:45 PM

173. Any Assange thread...

...is bound to get its fair share of misogyny from posters angrily defending their hero.

Exhibit A: http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=5884568

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