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Fri Sep 7, 2012, 09:05 PM

Sooo Obamacare will be repealed, and Pre-existing Condition Seniors will be given a Voucher/Coupon?

To go and buy insurance on the open Market? So what if insurance Companies don't want to insure these folks....
considering that without Obamacare in place, denying them coverage would be quite alright?

Does this sound as much of a nightmare Death Panel situation as could be, or is it just me?

19 replies, 1836 views

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Reply Sooo Obamacare will be repealed, and Pre-existing Condition Seniors will be given a Voucher/Coupon? (Original post)
FrenchieCat Sep 2012 OP
Systematic Chaos Sep 2012 #1
zbdent Sep 2012 #2
Hippo_Tron Sep 2012 #3
eridani Sep 2012 #13
Hippo_Tron Sep 2012 #16
eridani Sep 2012 #19
abumbyanyothername Sep 2012 #4
Proud Liberal Dem Sep 2012 #6
Avalux Sep 2012 #5
cr8tvlde Sep 2012 #7
cr8tvlde Sep 2012 #8
JRLeft Sep 2012 #9
davidn3600 Sep 2012 #10
Telly Savalas Sep 2012 #15
Bernardo de La Paz Sep 2012 #11
Brother Buzz Sep 2012 #12
november3rd Sep 2012 #14
progressivebydesign Sep 2012 #17
meow2u3 Sep 2012 #18

Response to FrenchieCat (Original post)

Fri Sep 7, 2012, 09:07 PM

1. Anything not single payer is destined to become a nightmare.

The only question is to exactly what order of magnitude.

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Response to FrenchieCat (Original post)

Fri Sep 7, 2012, 09:15 PM

2. wait until the vouchers are "established" ...

and then the Republicans start in with "Why are we spending money 'we don't have' on vouchers???" CUT ...

The ironic thing is, I have three "RW" 'bagger acquaintances ... and with my new job, I'll probably be funding their health care (I'm probably making more than all three of them combined ... I pass by two of them every day ... outside the gas station, smoking their money away ...)

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Response to FrenchieCat (Original post)

Fri Sep 7, 2012, 11:59 PM

3. Ryan claims they will set up an exchange for seniors, much like the ones for Obamacare

So he claims it's not technically "on the open market". What want to know is - who the fuck is going to participate in the exchange?

The fact is that it's simply not possible to make a profit selling insurance to even otherwise perfectly healthy people over the age of 65, because the risk is just too high. Elderly people tend to have costly medical problems, that's just a statistical reality. For a bunch of people who talk so much about how they understand business, they sure as hell don't seem to grasp that simple business reality.

That's the entire reason we established Medicare in the first place. The free market can't provide a national defense, it can't provide roads and bridges, and it can't provide medical care for millions of geriatric patients. So like any civilized society should, we have the government step in and do it.

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Response to Hippo_Tron (Reply #3)

Sun Sep 9, 2012, 02:48 PM

13. Unfortunately, Ryan has touched on one of the main problems with ACA

--namely, that it will work only for relatively healthy populations. Even there, the "free market" does a shitty job--it just isn't as obvious because of the lower absolute numbers of really sick people.

But remember, even though seniors cost a lot more in terms of total spending, the same percentages hold as in younger populations. 5% of the population of each demographic accounts for 50% of all costs, and 15% for 85% of all costs. That is why if Medicare is good enough for grandma, it's good enough for everybody.

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Response to eridani (Reply #13)

Sun Sep 9, 2012, 10:47 PM

16. I agree 100%, though the ACA is an improvement over what we have now

Romney even said it himself when he went over to Israel and noted how great it was that they only spend 8% of their GDP on health care whereas we spend almost 20%. The way we deliver health care in this country is unsustainable, in no small part thanks to our ridiculous private insurance system.

The ACA is a bandage and as I've stated before I think it's a much needed bandage, but it's not a permanent solution. Sooner or later, the only viable options will be a single payer system (or something similar) or the Republican get sick and die option.

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Response to Hippo_Tron (Reply #16)

Mon Sep 10, 2012, 03:00 AM

19. And I think that will have to be done at the state level.

It happened that way in Canada, and I think it can happen here. Particularly given the fact that ACA allows for state experimentation.

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Response to FrenchieCat (Original post)

Sat Sep 8, 2012, 12:03 AM

4. Republicans have changed their tune lately

"Repeal Obamacare" has morphed into "Repeal and Replace Obamacare."

Me thinks the internal polling is showing something.

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Response to abumbyanyothername (Reply #4)

Sat Sep 8, 2012, 12:15 AM

6. Yeah but replace it with what?

That's the $10K question. Wonder if they ever filled up that blank piece of paper they wanted to start over on over 2 years ago?

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Response to FrenchieCat (Original post)

Sat Sep 8, 2012, 12:08 AM

5. My mom and I had a conversation about this just about an hour ago!!

She is 68, and spend a good part of career as an insurance specialist; she knows the details like crazy. Her friends, many of who retired from the state, get Medicare (80%) and then their state insurance (20%). They pay nothing.

My mom has explained to them that if Romney is elected and guts Medicare; seniors will be given vouchers to buy private insurance. So, these women will have to find something to replace the 80% from Medicare. They all have pre-existing conditions; so chances are they wouldn't be insurable, or, would end up paying a crapload for ins.

Without my mom telling them this, they didn't have a clue, and may have voted for Romney.

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Response to FrenchieCat (Original post)

Sat Sep 8, 2012, 12:21 AM

7. Let's call it what it is ... Health Care Coupons ... Clip and Save

Betty Crocker, Republican Queen.

Watch the "cost" for health care to start to come down significantly. I remember the shock over $50 bandaids in hospitals...many years ago and it's worn off. It's a market. The costs soared significantly higher and faster than any inflationary influence and it will come down because Obama ended the automatic Gravy Train. Call it the Rick Scott (R-FLA) Medicare Fraud Case Effect. They fined his hospital company (HCA) and put him out of a job, then elected him Governor. There's just no getting past those crafty Republicans.

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Response to FrenchieCat (Original post)

Sat Sep 8, 2012, 12:24 AM

8. Obamacare vs. Romneydoesn'tcare...from one of the DNC speeches.

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Response to FrenchieCat (Original post)

Sat Sep 8, 2012, 12:38 AM

9. A right wing friend of mine stated that, that is the free market at work. He said the market should

determine whether you are covered or not. He would then go on to state: "There is always the emergency room. And if you have a catastrophic illness you will probably die in 6 months anyway." He followed it up by saying: "It is better than mooching off of the government". I asked him: "What if you got sick?" He said: "I would die, therefore I would not have to pay, and then he left." The right wing mind is sick. He believes he is a moderate republican.

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Response to FrenchieCat (Original post)

Sat Sep 8, 2012, 03:00 AM

10. The issue I have with the whole debate is neither party has a long-term solution

ACA only helps the symptoms for a little while, but it does not cure the problem. That problem is the cost of healthcare in this country is astronomical and its going to get worse.

Did you read the story of the woman in Arizona that got charged $80,000 to get anti-venom for a scorpion bite? The pharmaceuticals are out of control.

Both parties are clueless on how to solve this...

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Response to davidn3600 (Reply #10)

Sun Sep 9, 2012, 08:46 PM

15. While this is certainly true

the affordable care act's minor symptom treatment is a stark contrast to GOP proposals which all make the problem significantly worse.

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Response to FrenchieCat (Original post)

Sat Sep 8, 2012, 01:39 PM

11. Obama needs the House and the Senate. nt

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Response to FrenchieCat (Original post)

Sat Sep 8, 2012, 01:49 PM

12. Take two tax cuts, roll back some regulations and call us in the morning.

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Response to FrenchieCat (Original post)

Sun Sep 9, 2012, 03:16 PM

14. Idiots

How can they propose something like this in an election year, and expect to win?

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Response to FrenchieCat (Original post)

Sun Sep 9, 2012, 11:33 PM

17. Actually, No. Etch-a-sketch time. Romney's Spokesperson has already WALKED BACK the statements.

Apparently Romney misspoke at his pre taped, planned, interview today. Romney is apparently back in the "free market" camp regarding health insurance. So no... no pre existing conditions anymore.

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Response to FrenchieCat (Original post)

Sun Sep 9, 2012, 11:52 PM

18. How Couponcare will work (or not work)

Seniors and disabled individuals will be forced to clip coupons to buy insurance the insurance companies refuse to offer because of pre-existing conditions.

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