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Mon Dec 31, 2012, 08:07 PM

For many in California and New York - these are the blue states with generous donors -

$250 is not wealthy. I don't have problems with the $450. Won't affect my household one way or the other..

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Reply For many in California and New York - these are the blue states with generous donors - (Original post)
question everything Dec 2012 OP
virgogal Dec 2012 #1
bemildred Dec 2012 #2
Yavin4 Dec 2012 #3
gto Dec 2012 #4
Lucky Luciano Dec 2012 #9
alcibiades_mystery Dec 2012 #5
NYC Liberal Dec 2012 #6
gto Dec 2012 #7
question everything Dec 2012 #8

Response to question everything (Original post)

Mon Dec 31, 2012, 08:09 PM

1. Huh?

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Response to question everything (Original post)

Mon Dec 31, 2012, 08:15 PM

2. I can assure you that $250K/year is quite well off even in California.

People do manage to spend it all, but they have to work at it.

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Response to question everything (Original post)

Mon Dec 31, 2012, 08:18 PM

3. I've Lived in San Francisco, Los Angeles, and New York

In every city, $250K is considered a great salary, and you are considered well off.

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Response to question everything (Original post)

Mon Dec 31, 2012, 08:29 PM

4. 250 isn't rich.

It's a lot but it's nowhere near "rich".

top 1%

New York City area - $908,000
San Francisco Bay Area - $588,000
Boston Area - $529,343
Washington DC area - $513,000
Los Angeles area - $466,895

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2012/01/15/business/one-percent-map.html

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Response to gto (Reply #4)

Mon Dec 31, 2012, 11:18 PM

9. Wow $908K just to make it to top 1% in NY.

In Manhattan south of 96, you probably gotta clear 1.3MM or so in that case. I got a ways to go I guess. I definitely think 250 is not that much.

I think I feel that way because a lot if those incomes can very easily here today and forever gone tomorrow. If you have 250k in a typical 20-30 year career at the same company like a lot of middle middle class people do with decent job security, it might feel like more.

However, if you are battling the wars you gotta battle in those kinds of jobs and switching jobs for promotions and other legs up - while relying very much on stochastic bonuses and loads of uncertainty every year, the 250 may not feel like very much - even 500 you will have to be careful with since it can all evaporate suddenly while you have massive bills to pay.

I know lots of people who used to make 500k all the way to a couple bucks in their last year have now been SOL for a couple years - will they ever get their game back? At what point do they cave in and bail outta the city and take that 100k job in Charlotte or something. Hard to do.

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Response to question everything (Original post)

Mon Dec 31, 2012, 08:43 PM

5. As somebody who grew up in New York City, I remain mystified by this argument

I can assure you that my family never made anything close to that. Nobody I knew made anything close to that. Nobody in my classes in the New York City Public School I attended made anywhere close to that. Maybe a few of the rich kids in high school, but there weren't many. I'd be willing to bet that $250,000 household income remains something like top 10% of NYC incomes, meaning 90% don't make that.

The argument makes it sound like everybody's running around New York struggling on $250,000. If you make $250,000 a year in the neighborhood where I grew up, you are fucking well off. Fine, you're not 'rich." But you ain't struggling, either. This whole argument relies on most people not knowing these cities or having some weirdo television/Hollywood representation of these cities floating around in their heads. Most people in New York City have nowhere near a $250,000/year income, and if you do, you're not struggling. You might not have a penthouse apartment, but you're not taking a second job for damn sure.

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Response to alcibiades_mystery (Reply #5)

Mon Dec 31, 2012, 09:32 PM

6. Median household income in NYC is around $70-75K per year.

So I agree with you. I don't know where the idea that $250,000 is not at the very least upper middle class in the city. Sure, that $250K isn't going to go as far as it might somewhere else, but that just means you might have a nice apartment in a high-rise in a good neighborhood instead of a large house with a yard out in the 'burbs or the country.

New York is much larger than Manhattan, which is what I think people are thinking about. Most people here don't live in Manhattan. They live in places like Astoria (median income $45K), Bushwick (median income $30K), Bed-Stuy (median income $35K), etc.

Manhattan: Median income is $70K
Queens: Median income is $57K
Brooklyn: Median income is $45K
Staten Island: Median income is 78K
Bronx: Median income is $36K

http://envisioningdevelopment.net/map

Like I said, yes it's more expensive so your dollar isn't going to go as far as it might somewhere else, but most people are not making big bucks.

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Response to question everything (Original post)

Mon Dec 31, 2012, 09:43 PM

7. Not only the boroughs,

The entire metro area.

You're counting very poor inner city places like Bronx that are much poorer than USA average. Hardly anyone's ideal of middle-class living.

Median Family Income

Brookville, New York $454,909
Chevy Chase Village, Maryland $300,001
Hidden Hills, California $275,690
Hunters Creek Village, Texas $261,401
Muttontown, New York $260,490
Oyster Bay Cove, New York $240,289
Kenilworth, Illinois $247,000
Mission Hills, Kansas $243,553
Plandome, New York $241,667
Munsey Park, New York $237,321
Belle Meade, Tennessee $232,500
The Village of Indian Hill, Ohio $231,161
Bannockburn, Illinois $226,875
Cherry Hills, Colorado $226,552
Lloyd Harbor, New York $221,667
Los Altos Hills, California $218,922
Barton Creek, Texas $214,625
Woodside, California $214,310
Castle Pines, Colorado $213,929
Lake Success, New York $209,583
Scarsdale, New York $208,750
Chappaqua, New York $207,747
River Hills, Wisconsin $207,031
Rolling Hills, California $205,417
Old Westbury, New York $205,278
Piney Point Village, Texas $205,221
South Barrington, Illinois $205,035
Somerset, Maryland $204,792
Sands Point, New York $204,286
Hillsborough, California $202,292
Winnetka, Illinois $201,650
Bunker Hill Village, Texas $201,250
Glencoe, Illinois $201,050
Chevy Chase, Maryland $200,966
Travilah, Maryland $199,414
East Hills, New York $198,750
Great Falls, Virginia $197,446
Rancho Santa Fe, California $197,446
Roslyn Harbo, New York $194,464
Plandome Heights, New York $192,188
Upper Brookville, New York $192,188
Clyde Hill, Washington $192,000
Hewlett Harbor, New York $190,000
Flower Hill, New York $188,482
Bedford, New York $187,634
Clarkson Valley, Missouri $186,875
Atherton, California $185,000
Fox Chapel, Pennsylvania $184,423
Dellwood, Minnesota $183,750
Mountain Lake, New Jersey $181,938
Southlake, Texas $181,930
Golden's Bridge, New York $181,339
Darien, Connecticut $181,019
Shavano Park, Texas $180,795
West University Place, Texas $180,551
Head of the Harbor, New York $179,792
Black Diamond, Florida $179,500
Highland Park, Texas $176,375
Laurel Hollow, New York $176,250
Roslyn Estates, New York $176,250
Wolf Trap, Virginia $173,411
Darnestown, Maryland $172,452
Essex Fells, New Jersey $172,159
Bronxville, New York $171,319
Kiawah Island, South Carolina $170,521
Palos Verdes Estates, California $170,068
Millburn, New Jersey $169,678
Medina, Washington $169,196
Yarrow Point, Washington $169,167
Blackhawk-Camino, California $169,052
Portola Valley, California $168,750
Loyola, California $168,125
Alpine, New Jersey $167,917
Monte Sereno, California $167,417
Piedmont, California $167,014
Barrington Hills, Illinois $165,901
Larchmont, New York $165,375
Hawthorn Woods, Illinois $165,139
Briarcliff Manor, New York $164,000
Rollingwood, Texas $163,167
Alamo, California $163,117
Upper Saddle River, New Jersey $162,679
Kensington, New York $162,604
North Caldwell, New Jersey $162,422
Nissequogue, New York $162,188
Orinda, California $160,867
Orchard Lake Village, Michigan $160,714
Kildeer, Illinois $160,643
San Marino, California $160,481
Long Grove, Illinois $160,169
Brookmont, Maryland $159,856
Lattingtown, New York $147,750
Montara, California $158,675
Coto de Caza, California $158,670
Glen Ridge, New Jersey $158,173
West Lake Hills, Texas $157,910
Potomac, Maryland $157,738
Rolling Hills Estates, California $157,730
Ho-Ho-Kus, New Jersey $157,656
Del Rio, California $157,500
Lake Bluff, Illinois $157,469
McLean, Virginia $156,943
Great Neck Estates, New York $156,563
Huntington Bay, New York $156,250
North Key Largo, Florida $156,250
Franklin Lakes, New Jersey $154,018
Diablo, California $153,750

And the area is already very high taxed

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Response to gto (Reply #7)

Mon Dec 31, 2012, 10:12 PM

8. Thank you. Fascinating.

Thank you for a well conducted research.

And welcome to DU. I am sure your research ability will contribute a lot to DU.

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