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Sat Dec 29, 2012, 11:20 PM

Since I've been a member of DU ...

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by Rhiannon12866 (a host of the Politics 2014 forum).

I've always prided myself in the fact that DU was a fact-based community ... A place where speculation always took a back seat to fact.

As of late, I've noticed a plethoria of hair on fire posts indicating that President Obama (and/or the Democrats) intend to savage the poor, elderly, the disabled and veterans with this Chained CPI proposal. But each and every one of these Chained CPI posts, completely ignore the fact that the seminal Chained CPI proposal, exempted the poor, elderly, the disabled and veterans.

Can we, as a community, please refrain from promoting this patently false narrative?

If not, then, DU clearly has become a place that is closer to the sites that we used to mock as fact-less; than the place I joined.

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Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 26 replies Author Time Post
Reply Since I've been a member of DU ... (Original post)
1StrongBlackMan Dec 2012 OP
Hoyt Dec 2012 #1
MADem Dec 2012 #2
jberryhill Dec 2012 #3
freshwest Dec 2012 #7
Gman Dec 2012 #6
MADem Dec 2012 #16
backscatter712 Dec 2012 #11
marybourg Dec 2012 #22
MADem Dec 2012 #23
loyalkydem Dec 2012 #4
1StrongBlackMan Dec 2012 #8
loyalkydem Dec 2012 #10
Gman Dec 2012 #5
1StrongBlackMan Dec 2012 #9
mzmolly Dec 2012 #12
freshwest Dec 2012 #13
question everything Dec 2012 #19
freshwest Dec 2012 #25
graham4anything Dec 2012 #14
BlancheSplanchnik Dec 2012 #15
freshwest Dec 2012 #24
Rosa Luxemburg Dec 2012 #17
SunSeeker Dec 2012 #18
Pirate Smile Dec 2012 #20
cer7711 Dec 2012 #21
Rhiannon12866 Dec 2012 #26

Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Original post)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 11:27 PM

1. Full agreement. But I expect more of same as Obama tries to navigate us through deep chit.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Original post)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 11:27 PM

2. I think some of that nonsense is "divide and conquer" games.

Some people like to stir the pot....especially if the pot is full of shit!

Then they sit back, and rub their hands together with childish
glee.

Imagine having such a big L loser life that your thrill of the day is getting your jollies that way! Pathetic--no lives! Pitiful...!

Nothing wrong with debating issues and highlighting differences, but bullshitting to drive a point home is suggestive of a weak to nonexistent argument.

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Response to MADem (Reply #2)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 11:29 PM

3. +1

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Response to jberryhill (Reply #3)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 11:35 PM

7. +1

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Response to MADem (Reply #2)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 11:35 PM

6. There are people here who stir to divide just for the sake of doing so

and with no constructive end in mind. They like the chaos.

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Response to Gman (Reply #6)

Sun Dec 30, 2012, 12:13 AM

16. That's my sense of it, too. nt

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Response to MADem (Reply #2)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 11:54 PM

11. The word is despair-trolling.

And we're seeing a lot of it here.

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Response to backscatter712 (Reply #11)

Sun Dec 30, 2012, 12:25 AM

22. I call them the "indignation delegation" and although I'm a lefty

myself, this tendency to selective vision and agitation has always kept me away from leftist organizations. It's nothing new, 1Strong. Been around as long as there's been an American left.

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Response to backscatter712 (Reply #11)

Sun Dec 30, 2012, 12:30 AM

23. It's not even subtle. Very fast and loose with opinions presented as facts, too, I notice! nt

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Original post)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 11:32 PM

4. I'm afraid not

the anti- President Obama people won't allow it. When I run into them, I just ignore them. It's made the place easier to deal with.

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Response to loyalkydem (Reply #4)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 11:46 PM

8. I would far rather ...

Those of us that don't like these folks to point out their B.S., linking to where they have been called out on their B.S.

The B.S.ers can continue when one posters calls them on thier B.S.; but I can't imagine they will continue if everyone called them out by posting to the original call out post. I doubt their ego will allow them to be called out.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #8)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 11:52 PM

10. You are a better person than me sir.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Original post)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 11:34 PM

5. LOL! Welcome to DU!

situation normal.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Original post)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 11:48 PM

9. Oh, yeah ...

I expect this thread to sink faster than a 1920s, gulf coast skimming mobster.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Original post)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 11:56 PM

12. K and

R.


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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2012, 12:01 AM

13. The place is dumbing down. Often reads like a RW site that depends on emails for facts.

I'd post a very clear and detailed article on the CPI that backs what you said and explains what Pelosi meant, but it would not be read. If you want, i'll send it to you by PM, but such articles don't get responses here. So I won't bother.


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Response to freshwest (Reply #13)

Sun Dec 30, 2012, 12:16 AM

19. Please, re-post. We often miss many important posts

if we don't catch them when posted, and if there are many other posts that move up.

I would like to know more about this topic and you seem to be quite knowledgeable.

Thanks

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Response to question everything (Reply #19)

Sun Dec 30, 2012, 12:37 AM

25. Actually. I have not posted it. Other long pieces that refute the pitchforks are ignored.

As 1 Strong Black Man says, they won't listen to reason. When I found the article I was overjoyed. I was going to ask the webmaster for permission to put it here in full.

Then I saw the same lies repeated over and over and decided this was not th place for it. I put it aside and will post the link for it, as I have not asked permission to post it in its entirety. It will be a long, but concise read by people who are actually up to this and working on it.

I just into another post calling Obama a liar and that he and the Democats are refusing to tell us their pla to destroy the social safety net a minute ago so I'm taking a break. All that profound knowledge from someone hasn't been here for two weeks, has no link or profo, but he jsut has that evil Obama done pat, don't you know?

I'll be back tomorrow. Someone also wants me to PM them the article as well. It's from a site that doesn't tolerate the despair trolls, they are too buys getting things done for the people. Later.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2012, 12:02 AM

14. BRAVO!!! BRAVO!!! BRAVO!!! BRAVO!!! BRAVO!!!

 

the mob like atmosphere lately reminds me of the million conspiracy theories during the Clinton years.
follow those breadcrumbs and all you get is a sack of Bush

which the repubs are hoping to foist on us yet again in four years

I think this is not coincidental, it takes a mob to ruin everything with one false person in the mob inciting others.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2012, 12:13 AM

15. im glad and grateful for the clearer heads around here,

Because sometimes the despair-trolls get to me too.

They sometimes sound so credible and they often seem to think cynicism indicates unique and advanced intelligence.

There's a certain kind of self-aggrandizement in the attack attitude....it usually needs to see the small picture and pick it apart as a sign of righteousness.

Because there is more to keep track of than I can keep track of, I really appreciate the people here who can see the larger picture and who remind me that change comes slowly and in politics, requires a lot of "playing the game" in order to beat the game.

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Response to BlancheSplanchnik (Reply #15)

Sun Dec 30, 2012, 12:30 AM

24. +1,000

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2012, 12:16 AM

17. K & R

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2012, 12:16 AM

18. K&R

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2012, 12:21 AM

20. Kick & Recommend

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2012, 12:24 AM

21. Senator Bernie Sanders: Statement of Dec. 19, 2012 on Chained CPI

STATEMENT BY SENATOR BERNARD SANDERS ON THE CHAINED-CPI

December 19, 2012

Let me begin by thanking the American Legion; the Veterans of Foreign Wars; the Disabled American Veterans; the Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America; the Paralyzed Veterans of America; the Blinded Veterans Association; and the many other veterans’ organizations who are here this morning and who have spoken out on this issue. Some of the full statements from the veterans’ organizations are available here today.

We are here today to tell the White House and the leadership in Congress: do not balance the budget on the backs of disabled veterans who have lost their arms, legs, and eyesight defending our country.

Do not balance the budget on the backs of the men and women who have already sacrificed for us in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Do not balance the budget on the backs of the wives, husbands, and children of those who have made the ultimate sacrifice.

And, do not balance the budget on the backs of the men and women who served our country in World War II, the Korean War, and the Vietnam War, and other conflicts by cutting Social Security benefits.

Do not adopt the so-called chained-CPI.

My Republican friends and some Democrats have said that lowering Cost-Of-Living Adjustments (COLAs) through the adoption of a chained-CPI would be a “minor tweak” in benefits.

But, let’s be clear: for millions of disabled veterans and seniors living on fixed incomes, the chained CPI is not a minor tweak. It is a significant benefit cut that will make it harder for permanently disabled veterans and the elderly to feed their families, heat their homes, pay for their prescription drugs, and make ends meet. This misguided proposal must be vigorously opposed.

Supporters of the chained-CPI want the American people to believe that the COLAs that disabled veterans, senior citizens, and the surviving spouses and children who have lost loved ones in combat are too generous.

That is simply not true. In two out of the last three years, disabled veterans and senior citizens did not receive any COLA. And, next year’s COLA of 1.7% is one of the lowest ever. Lowering COLAs even further through the adoption of a chained-CPI would be an absolute disaster.


This nation has made a commitment to our military and our veterans: if you get permanently disabled defending this country, if you get seriously wounded in battle, we will always be there for you. The Veterans Administration will provide you with the disability compensation benefits you need to live in dignity and those benefits will keep pace with inflation.

Today, more than 3.2 million disabled veterans receive disability compensation benefits from the Veterans Administration.

Under the chained CPI, a disabled veteran who started receiving VA disability benefits at age 30 would have their benefits cut by more than $1,400 at age 45; $2,300 at age 55; and $3,200 at age 65.

I challenge anyone who supports a chained-CPI, to go to Walter Reed. Visit with the men and women who have lost their legs, lost their arms, lost their eyesight as a result of their service in Afghanistan or Iraq. We made a promise to these veterans. Cutting their COLA’s would be reneging on those promises and we cannot let that happen.

We have also made a commitment to the surviving spouses and children who have lost a loved one in battle by providing them with Dependency Indemnity Compensation benefits that average less than $17,000 a year.

Like many of my colleagues in the Senate, I have attended the funerals of brave soldiers killed in both Iraq and Afghanistan.

I remember telling their grieving spouses and young children that our country would never forget their sacrifice and loss. It would be absolutely immoral to cut the very modest benefits they receive by adopting a chained-CPI.

Further, we have made a promise to every American: Social Security will be there for you in your old age, or if you become disabled. And, those benefits will also keep up with inflation.

Today, over 9 million veterans receive Social Security benefits; and more than 770,000 veterans receive Social Security disability benefits. We’re talking about those who served in World War II, the Korean War, the Vietnam War and many others.

Under the chained CPI, average seniors who retire at age 65 would see their Social Security benefits cut by about $650 a year when they reach 75 and more than $1,000 a year once they turn 85.

We simply cannot renege on the promises we have made to our nation’s veterans by cutting the very modest benefits that they have earned. That’s exactly what the chained-CPI would do and that is exactly why it does not belong in deficit reduction.

And, let me be very clear: the American people strongly support the position we are advocating for today, including the AARP, the AFL-CIO, the National Committee to Preserve Social Security and Medicare and many other groups representing senior citizens, working families, and the disabled.

In poll after poll, including one that appeared just yesterday in the Washington Post the American people have been extremely clear: do not cut Social Security, do not cut Medicare, do not cut Medicaid benefits, and do not lower COLAs.

It’s time that Congress and the White House listened to the people who have put their lives on the line defending this country and to the American people.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Original post)

Sun Dec 30, 2012, 12:42 AM

26. Locking, sorry, this is a Meta thread, about DU and DUers.

The SoP for Politics 2012 states it's for discussions of US politics, elections and campaigns. Please consider reposting in Meta. Thanks!

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