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Mon Dec 24, 2012, 05:51 PM

Newspaper Publishes Gun Owners' Names and Addresses

A newspaper in New York has received a wave of criticism from its readers after publishing the names and addresses of all of the individuals with handgun or pistol permits in its coverage area.

Hundreds of residents in New York's Westchester and Rockland counties were surprised to find their names and addresses listed on a map posted by The Journal News on Sunday. Users can click any dot on the map to see which of their neighbors has a permit for a gun.

The map sparked more than 500 comments from readers within a day of its appearance on the website, many of them voicing outrage at the paper's decision to make the information public.

"This is CRAZY!! why in the world would you post every licensed gun owner information?? What do you hope to accomplish by doing this. This is the type of thing you do for sex offenders not law abiding gun owners. What next? should i hang a flag outside my house that says I own a gun? I am canceling my subscription with your paper today!!!" said commenter Curtis Maenza.

More at: http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/abc-blogs/newspaper-publishes-gun-owners-names-addresses-215214269--abc-news-topstories.html

42 replies, 3524 views

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Reply Newspaper Publishes Gun Owners' Names and Addresses (Original post)
Zorro Dec 2012 OP
Recursion Dec 2012 #1
cantbeserious Dec 2012 #3
Recursion Dec 2012 #7
cantbeserious Dec 2012 #9
MightyMopar Dec 2012 #6
Recursion Dec 2012 #8
CTyankee Dec 2012 #16
cantbeserious Dec 2012 #2
RomneyLies Dec 2012 #4
cantbeserious Dec 2012 #10
DonViejo Dec 2012 #12
MightyMopar Dec 2012 #5
JDPriestly Dec 2012 #28
Kolesar Dec 2012 #33
JDPriestly Dec 2012 #37
LiberalFighter Dec 2012 #11
newblewtoo Dec 2012 #14
JDPriestly Dec 2012 #29
ProgressiveProfessor Dec 2012 #13
Scuba Dec 2012 #15
CTyankee Dec 2012 #17
DFW Dec 2012 #18
NutmegYankee Dec 2012 #38
SouthernDonkey Dec 2012 #39
LiberalFighter Dec 2012 #19
jenmito Dec 2012 #20
realgreen Dec 2012 #26
Marcia Brady Dec 2012 #34
jenmito Dec 2012 #36
xtraxritical Dec 2012 #21
Superbot Dec 2012 #22
JDPriestly Dec 2012 #30
Lugnut Dec 2012 #23
Aristus Dec 2012 #24
otohara Dec 2012 #40
Aristus Dec 2012 #41
otohara Dec 2012 #42
Kablooie Dec 2012 #25
David__77 Dec 2012 #27
Iggo Dec 2012 #35
still_one Dec 2012 #31
Historic NY Dec 2012 #32

Response to Zorro (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 05:53 PM

1. An editor in Roanoke VA did this a few years ago

Ended up "outing" a woman who was hiding from her violent ex-husband.

Consequences aren't always what we intend.

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Response to Recursion (Reply #1)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 05:59 PM

3. So One Address In Error Is Justification For All the Carnage That Guns Have Wrought on Society

I don't buy the argument.

If I feel the need to protect myself from Gun Owners, I would like to know who they are before I put myself in jeopardy.

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Response to cantbeserious (Reply #3)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:04 PM

7. What argument?

I wasn't making one, I was remembering an unintended consequence of the last time somebody did this.

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Response to Recursion (Reply #7)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:06 PM

9. By Default An Argument Was Made - Unintended Or Otherwise

eom

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Response to Recursion (Reply #1)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:01 PM

6. Any links or proof?

 

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Response to Recursion (Reply #1)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:21 PM

16. but if he knows she's got a weapon, isn't that a deterrent?

And also, did no one tell her that her having a weapon was public information?

You can't have this thing both ways, you know...

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Response to Zorro (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 05:57 PM

2. According To The NRA And Gun Apologists That Should Be The Safest - Err Most Dangerous -

Part of the world!

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Response to Zorro (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:00 PM

4. It's public information

 

Gun ownership has consequences.

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Response to RomneyLies (Reply #4)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:08 PM

10. Yes - Let's Use The Public Information Constructively To Provide A Public Safety Benefit For Society

eom

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Response to RomneyLies (Reply #4)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:14 PM

12. Yeah! What's the big deal? Public records...

have been made real public. Good for the newspaper

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Response to Zorro (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:01 PM

5. But the gun enthusiasts say guns keep us safe, they always brag about them scaring bad guys away

 

You would think the gun enthusiasts would want to publically brag about having guns at their residences like they do on the internet.

I would hope they also out gun dealers. Gun pushers lives need to be made miserable.

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Response to MightyMopar (Reply #5)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 04:09 AM

28. It is kind of funny.

The real gun fanatics claim that the Second Amendment right to have a gun is supposed to permit them to defend themselves against an errant government.

But of course the government is the one entity that best knows and needs to know who has guns. If a gun is involved in a crime and is found, the government, the police, need to be able to trace the gun.

So gun-owners don't want privacy to keep the information that they own a gun from the government. That argument fails.

They also claim that they want privacy so that criminals won't steal their guns from them. But they could avoid having their guns stolen if they simply did not have them in the first place.

I can understand why a person living in the country in an isolated part of the US where the sheriff is slow to respond to calls for help needs a more powerful gun than just a hunting gun. But then making the fact that person has an arsenal public might be as important to that person's defense and the defense of his neighbors as having the gun in the first place.

There are arguments pro and con on this. But I would really like to know which of my neighbors have guns. I would like to know in case I want them to help me in some situation. I would like to know because if I don't like them, I want to know to stay away from them, not to park in front of their house, not to tell them to turn down their music if they have a drunken party on a Saturday night and I can't sleep. I want to know for my own protection. Because people with guns are a danger to me. And if you have a gun, you could be a danger to me. I deserve to know which of my neighbors might be a danger to me or my kids or grandkids.

If, in your paranoid world, you feel you need guns, that is your problem. If I know that you feel you need guns, you should at least give me enough information so that I can make my decision about how I deal with you.

Fair is fair, isn't it? You have your gun. I know you have it. We stay out of each other's hair.

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Response to JDPriestly (Reply #28)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 06:39 AM

33. Your "longest paragraph" describes the drunk poacher next door

He sets off bombs/fireworks, drinks a lot, and has load parties.
He bragged that he "told off the judge" last time he was in court on a firearms charge.

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Response to Kolesar (Reply #33)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 01:29 PM

37. It occurred to me that responsible gunowners might let elderly neighbors or neighbors

with young children likely to explore or get into trouble that they have a gun. That might be a way to get assistance to people or warn people without having your name published. I would not have any reason to know the name of a gunowner living across the city from me. But it would be good to know the names of those neighbors near my house who have guns.

If you really believe you have guns for protection, wouldn't you want to protect others?

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Response to Zorro (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:12 PM

11. You would think the non-gun owners would be the ones upset

since everyone that intends to commit a crime would now know which homes would be safe for them to do what they want.

And the gun owners would be happy because anyone trying anything would have second thoughts about doing it knowing there is someone with a gun in the home.

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Response to LiberalFighter (Reply #11)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:27 PM

14. Right you are in that

Ipso facto they have created two camps, one armed the other not. Those looking to steal guns will know where to look. When the owner's away the crooks can play whichever side of the street they prefer but if they are looking for guns their odds have just improved.

However if the burglar uses the information and wanders into a home with a pump shotgun it could be a fatal mistake.

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Response to LiberalFighter (Reply #11)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 04:10 AM

29. I don't have a gun because I really don't have much to protect other than my own person

and I don't think anyone would risk a life prison sentence to harm me where I live.

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Response to Zorro (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:25 PM

13. And some wonder why so many oppose mandatory registration...

This is LEO only kind of data and be restricted accordingly. We restrict access to tax records as well, this is little different

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Response to Zorro (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:50 PM

15. Here in Wisconsin the Urinal/Sentinel published a searchable database of names and addresses....

... of citizens who signed a "recall Walker" petition. Their intent was malicious, and it worked. Numerous signers were hassled by pro-Walker thugs.

Did the NY paper disclose a reason for publishing the names of gun owners?

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Response to Scuba (Reply #15)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:23 PM

17. I would hope it would be to inform citizens, if they, like me, wish to know who in my

neighborhood might have guns. If I were a parent of a young kid, I wouldn't want him/her going to the house of a friend where a gun was present and I would inform their parents of my decision...

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Response to Scuba (Reply #15)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:24 PM

18. The newspaper acted to harass the people it identified

The purpose of the gun list was to protect people from the ones it identified. Two completely different motives.

The Wisconsin paper seems to have achieved its goal. The New York paper not as much.

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Response to DFW (Reply #18)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 02:01 PM

38. Highly doubtful it was to protect.

First, there is no proof the individuals own firearms, and even then, it isn't anyone's business. These people are not criminals and this information was released to be misused. I saw several posts yesterday advocating firing people who are gun owners and shunning them from friendship. Both are proposed misuse of this information.

Might as well publicly release the names of Democrats in the South. By the logic of some here it obviously wouldn't be misused...

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Response to NutmegYankee (Reply #38)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 03:59 PM

39. Amen!

You don't have to be a gun owner to have a license to carry a concealed weapon. It's not against the law to own a gun. If you live in rural Mississippi, Arkansas, Alabama, and I'm sure in most states rural areas, you don't have a police force. You MIGHT have a sheriff, or a constable who covers a sizable area. It could take hours for them to respond to a call. Seriously, those of you who rail against owning guns for ones own protection....you really DON'T have a clue obviously. Just my opinion. The extremist Tea Partyers of the left are as much of a detriment to the Democratic party as the the Tea Party has been to the Republican party. I do not think a majority of Americans seriously support a total gun ban, or repealing the 2nd Amendment. I'm a lifelong Democrat. I do not.

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Response to Scuba (Reply #15)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 08:19 PM

19. I hope the Sentinel loses subscriptions

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Response to Zorro (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 11:59 PM

20. I found out that the family almost across the street from me owns a gun from this map. n/t

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Response to jenmito (Reply #20)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 03:25 AM

26. Time to move

 

Could the dangerous person be liable for hurting property values by making your street more dangerous and thus less desirable? Time for a lawsuit.

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Response to realgreen (Reply #26)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 09:57 AM

34. "Dangerous person?"

Just because he/she owns a dangerous item, that doesn't make the owner dangerous.

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Response to realgreen (Reply #26)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 01:14 PM

36. Nope.

Nothing wrong with a family on our quiet street owning a gun. It doesn't worry me at all.

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Response to Zorro (Original post)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 12:13 AM

21. I'm sure it only identified a small portion of the guns in that town. Many are bought at shows

 

and not registered, I'm sure.

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Response to Zorro (Original post)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 12:16 AM

22. I don't think I like this idea

 

With all the stolen guns in America, this is like an open invitation to criminals looking for a friday night special. Once the home owners leaves for work, the criminals break in to steal the guns. I don't agree with advertising what a homeowner might have in his/her home.

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Response to Superbot (Reply #22)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 04:13 AM

30. Not if you don't have a gun.

We had a burglary. The only thing that was stolen was an old gun we had and never used.

I'm glad it is gone. The police found it later. We did not bother to get it back.

We bought it during the 1992 riots in LA. Never needed it. We have good neighbors. Worth far more than an arsenal of guns.

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Response to Zorro (Original post)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 12:41 AM

23. I don't understand what the problem is.

My husband owns about eight or nine long guns and three handguns. All the rifles and shotguns and two handguns have been in his locked gun cabinet and not fired for about 30 years. He takes one handgun that he recently purchased with him when he goes out on the ATV for his own protection. There's a coyote den not far from the back of our property and bears are sighted regularly in this rural area. I don't think he cares if the public knows he owns these guns because most of our neighbors own guns too.

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Response to Zorro (Original post)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 02:56 AM

24. Fuck 'em. If they have guns, we have a right to know.

Freedom isn't free, right? Isn't that what you gunners are always saying?...

_ _|_,

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Response to Aristus (Reply #24)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 12:43 AM

40. I Wouldn't Want My Kid In House

With guns!

I had some creepy neighbors once and my kid was over there on occasion to play with their boys. When I found out they had guns...my son was never in there house again.

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Response to otohara (Reply #40)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 12:56 AM

41. Good for you. You did the right thing.

Did they know why your son no longer came to visit?

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Response to Aristus (Reply #41)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 10:19 AM

42. Yep

I blew a gasket when I found out.
I was glad to see them move.

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Response to Zorro (Original post)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 03:13 AM

25. Why is that info generally available?

Car registration info is fairly difficult to get because of the Driver Privacy Protection Act.
If there is no need to know, it's not generally available and that's as it should be.

Legal hand gun ownership should be the same.
If there is a crime and the owner's weapon is suspected of being involved the info should be made available.
Maybe even if your child visits someone's house you should be able to find out if he possesses guns or not because you may not want a child playing in a house that has guns available.

But the info should not be made available en masse to just anyone.


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Response to Zorro (Original post)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 03:58 AM

27. This is fucking terrible.

And I hope that it sparks new protections to make these records more private, as with car registration.

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Response to David__77 (Reply #27)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 11:55 AM

35. Yes. Gun registration should be just like car registration.

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Response to Zorro (Original post)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 05:34 AM

31. I wonder if that is legal. These are not public figures

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Response to still_one (Reply #31)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 06:09 AM

32. Well under FOIL the info is available there is also a state database...

maintained in Albany by the State Police since 1936.

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