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Thu Nov 29, 2012, 08:52 PM

Obama to GOP: Iím done negotiating with myself

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2012/11/29/obama-to-gop-i-wont-negotiate-with-myself/


Obama to GOP: Iím done negotiating with myself

Posted by Ezra Klein on November 29, 2012 at 6:31 pm


Republican aides are circulating their summary of the White Houseís opening bid on the fiscal cliff. Theyíre circulating it because they believe it fleshes out Speaker John Boehnerís complaint that ďthe White House has to get serious.Ē Above all, theyíre circulating it because the president isnít offering them anything in his opening bid.

snip//

Weíre seeing two things here. One is that the negotiations arenít going well. When one side begins leaking the other sideís proposals, thatís typically a bad sign. The other is that Republicans are frustrated at the new Obama theyíre facing: The Obama who refuses to negotiate with himself.

Thatís what youíre really seeing in this ďproposal.Ē Previously, Obamaís pattern had been to offer plans that roughly tracked where he thought the compromise should end up. The White Houseís belief was that by being solicitous in their policy proposals, they would win goodwill on the other side, and even if they didnít, the media would side with them, realizing theyíd sought compromise and been rebuffed. They donít believe that anymore.

Perhaps the key lesson the White House took from the last couple of years is this: Donít negotiate with yourself. If Republicans want to cut Medicare, let them propose the cuts. If they want to raise revenue through tax reform, let them identify the deductions. If they want deeper cuts in discretionary spending, let them settle on a number. And, above all, if they donít like the White Houseís preferred policies, let them propose their own. That way, if the White House eventually does give in and agree to some of their demands, Republicans will feel like they got one over on the president. A compromise isnít measured by what you offer, itís measured by what the other side feels they made you concede.

The GOP is right: This isnít a serious proposal. But itís not evidence that Obama isnít serious. Heís very serious about not negotiating with himself, and his opening bid proves it. Now that theyíve leaked his initial offer, the next question is obvious: Whatís their offer?

53 replies, 8467 views

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Arrow 53 replies Author Time Post
Reply Obama to GOP: Iím done negotiating with myself (Original post)
babylonsister Nov 2012 OP
libdem4life Nov 2012 #1
xtraxritical Nov 2012 #12
libdem4life Nov 2012 #13
GatorLarry Nov 2012 #36
libdem4life Nov 2012 #41
ballaratocker Nov 2012 #48
IDoMath Nov 2012 #2
BainsBane Nov 2012 #6
BlueStreak Nov 2012 #20
NYtoBush-Drop Dead Nov 2012 #22
TalkingDog Nov 2012 #39
IDoMath Nov 2012 #40
AnotherMcIntosh Nov 2012 #3
babylonsister Nov 2012 #5
AnotherMcIntosh Nov 2012 #8
robinlynne Nov 2012 #24
liberal N proud Nov 2012 #4
wtmusic Nov 2012 #14
robinlynne Nov 2012 #25
liberal N proud Nov 2012 #30
wtmusic Nov 2012 #35
GatorLarry Nov 2012 #37
Vincardog Nov 2012 #44
freshwest Nov 2012 #7
LiberalFighter Nov 2012 #9
rhett o rick Nov 2012 #10
silverweb Nov 2012 #11
sheshe2 Nov 2012 #19
silverweb Nov 2012 #28
lunatica Nov 2012 #32
Faryn Balyncd Nov 2012 #15
ProudProgressiveNow Nov 2012 #16
high density Nov 2012 #17
wake.up.america Nov 2012 #18
libdem4life Nov 2012 #43
Ikonoklast Nov 2012 #23
patrice Nov 2012 #21
MotherPetrie Nov 2012 #26
Scootaloo Nov 2012 #29
GatorLarry Nov 2012 #38
Vincardog Nov 2012 #45
Tarheel_Dem Nov 2012 #27
lunatica Nov 2012 #31
Pryderi Nov 2012 #33
tomp Nov 2012 #34
babylonsister Nov 2012 #46
tomp Dec 2012 #52
Filibuster Harry Nov 2012 #42
babylonsister Nov 2012 #47
Filibuster Harry Dec 2012 #53
Vattel Nov 2012 #49
Up2Late Nov 2012 #50
tclambert Nov 2012 #51

Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 08:55 PM

1. Aha. The New Obama = the once again elected 2nd term Obama. Deal with it.

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Response to libdem4life (Reply #1)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 10:16 PM

12. Geithner put $400 billion in cuts to "health care spending" (Medicare) on the table.

 

I don't want to burst your balloon but here...
<snip>
The only new spending cuts in the plan would come from administration proposals curbing health care programs by $400 billion over the coming decade and modest cuts from non-health programs like farm subsidies and cutting Postal Service costs and through higher fees on airline tickets. The plan would also boost spending by extending unemployment benefits for the long-term jobless, deferring looming cuts to Medicare payments to physicians and helping homeowners refinance "underwater" mortgages..
<snip>

Here's the link.

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Response to xtraxritical (Reply #12)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 10:46 PM

13. Thanks for the reminder, balloon intact. No one said he was a Liberal.

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Response to libdem4life (Reply #1)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 10:54 AM

36. "Deal with it . . ."

I can't express how happy I've been to remind Republicans of their arrogant, condescending remark following the 2004 Election.

"WE won! You lost! Deal with it!"

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Response to GatorLarry (Reply #36)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 03:01 PM

41. Was that where it came from ... who knew???? :)

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Response to GatorLarry (Reply #36)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 05:45 PM

48. Overindulging in Schadenfreude isn't a positive thing.

However, remembering those jackasses in 2004 makes it somewhat acceptable.

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Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 08:55 PM

2. AT LAST!

 

It's about freaking time.

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Response to IDoMath (Reply #2)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 09:27 PM

6. No shit

That was the number one thing that pissed me off about the President. I am SO glad he learned his lesson!

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Response to BainsBane (Reply #6)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 11:34 PM

20. In the next day or two, Obama needs to make it clear

he is perfectly fine letting this stuff all expire on Jan 1. The deal they can get today is better than the deal they can get in January because:

a) Obama has more Senators and more Representatives on his team then

b) The public will be screaming about the tax cuts ending

c)It is actually a lot easier to visualize straightforward solutions after the clock has expired.

On that last point, after the Bush cuts expire, it becomes very simple. "Do you want to to help out 98% of the people or don't you. Your move."

On the sequester, "OK, those arbitrary cuts are a done deal. If you don't like that, then you come to me with specific proposals for tweaking it. Otherwise we live with the arbitrary cuts."

On the debt ceiling "Are you feeling lucky, punk?"

On shoring up the entitlements, "Show me a plan that extends the solvency without cutting any benefits. If you don't want to play ball, we'll just keep it exactly where it is."

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Response to BlueStreak (Reply #20)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 11:57 PM

22. Excellent post!

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Response to IDoMath (Reply #2)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 11:49 AM

39. I hate being one of those people who bitches about what people should'a done, but

He should'a been this guy from the start.

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Response to TalkingDog (Reply #39)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 12:09 PM

40. Me, too but

 

This one has been driving me nuts from the beginning.

We both went to law school. We've both taken tons of CLEs. Did he never take an hour in negotiation strategies? This should be elementary stuff for someone at his level.

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Response to babylonsister (Original post)


Response to AnotherMcIntosh (Reply #3)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 09:22 PM

5. You are never happy, are ya. nt

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Response to babylonsister (Reply #5)


Response to babylonsister (Reply #5)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 11:58 PM

24. Obama may or may not do the right thing this time. He should do NOTHING until Jan 1. That makes

our position much stronger. There is no fiscal cliff.

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Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 09:19 PM

4. I like the way he is dealing with them at this point.

That line could be historic if it drives the republicans to cave.

The republicans are afraid of themselves at the moment, they know they are between a rock and a cliff. The cliff looks better to them than whatever Grover is threatening worth them. Do the jump or face the wrath of a single blackmailer?


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Response to liberal N proud (Reply #4)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 10:49 PM

14. I don't.

I want him to walk into Boner's office and tell him, "There's going to be a tax hike on the wealthiest Americans. The people have spoken. You can either get on the train or miss the train, but if you miss the train and drag the country down with you, you will regret it."

Then go to the American people and repeat what he told Boner. "We can move this country forward, or we can move it backward. We're done playing games."

Next step? Stand his ground, no matter what. It just might be time to break the back of the Republican Party, and if they make enough people start suffering it can happen.

This is where Obama's leadership, where his mettle will be tested.

We're. Done. Playing. Fucking. Games.

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Response to wtmusic (Reply #14)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 11:58 PM

25. YES. No neogtiaitng before January 1st. Then negotiate.

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Response to wtmusic (Reply #14)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 07:00 AM

30. Isn't that kind of what he is doing with this line: "Iím done negotiating with myself"

Plus it is a buck stops here kind of statement laying it all on the GOP if they don't move, then they are responsible.

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Response to liberal N proud (Reply #30)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 10:39 AM

35. Now is the time for Obama to attack

...no holds barred. Anger and ultimatums are appropriate.

If not he will be in the weakened position of responding to Boehner's attacks. That's what has happened previously and what has resulted in concessions for Democrats.

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Response to wtmusic (Reply #35)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 11:00 AM

37. I disagree . . .

I don't think the president should lower himself to name-calling with the Speaker of the House.

I think the President should maintain the high ground, remind everyone the last election was a mandate, keep beating the drum that he's ready today to extend tax-cuts to 98% of Americans and the only thing standing in the way are Republicans who want to take care of the upper 2% instead of the 98%.

Keep it simple. Don't let the Orange Man muddy the water.

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Response to GatorLarry (Reply #37)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 03:16 PM

44. What "name-calling with the Speaker of the House" are you talking about? Standing our/his

ground and demanding the OP do the thing they were elected to do?

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Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 09:33 PM

7. Learning is something Obama has always advocated. The GOP's masters love the stupid ones.

They also hid behind the door when brains were offered.

So it's inevitable that they will be crying like babies now.

Grow up!

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Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 10:01 PM

9. The only way to deal with Republicans when there are too many chickens in the coop.

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Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 10:09 PM

10. You cant negotiate with terrorists. Republicans are terrorists. nm

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Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 10:14 PM

11. ReTHUGs don't change.

Their version of "new ideas" is to rephrase the same old same old.

Their idea of "negotiating" is to stall, obstruct, and obfuscate.

They're flunkies for their corporate masters -- otherwise, nothing but brats and bullies. Time to treat them accordingly, Mr. President.

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Response to silverweb (Reply #11)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 11:28 PM

19. Please proceed Mr. President! n/t

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Response to sheshe2 (Reply #19)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 05:13 AM

28. :)



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Response to sheshe2 (Reply #19)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 07:21 AM

32. +1

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Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 10:52 PM

15. +1

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Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 10:53 PM

16. K&R nt

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Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 11:05 PM

17. Why did it take the White House four years to figure this out?

Starting in the middle only means we end up somewhere on the side of the GOP. We've seen it time and time again.

I'm glad they're finally figuring out how to properly deal with these idiots.

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Response to high density (Reply #17)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 11:20 PM

18. Exactly. Anyone been to the Grand Basar in Istanbul?

The gentleman asks, "how you give me for this rug?"

The proper response is, "how much do you want for that?"

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Response to wake.up.america (Reply #18)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 03:06 PM

43. The dealer will knock on the back door and say... "I'll give you $___ for all of these rugs."

Now, let's talk. I'm liking this new tack of our Prez.

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Response to high density (Reply #17)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 11:57 PM

23. Because the administration first thought they were dealing with rational people.

The problem is, as we all know, that deranged people took over the Republican Party.

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Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 11:42 PM

21. K&R !

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Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 12:11 AM

26. The only issue for me is, how much of the store is the president going to give away in the end?

 

Not quoted in the article excerpted above is this statement: "It calls for $1.6 trillion in taxes and only $400 billion in new entitlement spending cuts."

So Obama is already offering "only" $400 billion in new entitlement spending cuts.

How high is he willing to go to screw over old people and sick people in order to spare rich people?

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Response to MotherPetrie (Reply #26)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 05:45 AM

29. Because of course, he's absolutely bound to "give away the store"

There are no other options, ever. He's a shifty, untrustworthy, lazy, good-for-nothing motherfucker and we should ALL be ashamed to have him as our president!

...Or so DU's "progressives" would have us believe.

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Response to MotherPetrie (Reply #26)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 11:03 AM

38. What???

Any solution HAS to involve both spending cuts and increased revenues.

The President is offering a package with 4:1 increased revenue over spending cuts and you find that to be a sign he's going to "screw over old people and sick people in order to spare rich people"?

Sorry . . . but, wow!

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Response to GatorLarry (Reply #38)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 03:22 PM

45. Any solution HAS to involve both spending cuts and increased revenues. emPHAsis on the

wrong SYLabol.

Any solution has to involve MAJOR increases in revenues along with
reasonable spending cuts primarily in the Military.

Why start on the wrong foot?

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Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 12:47 AM

27. Thank you Mr. President. nt

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Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 07:17 AM

31. "If Republicans want to cut Medicare, let them propose the cuts."

"If they want to raise revenue through tax reform, let them identify the deductions. If they want deeper cuts in discretionary spending, let them settle on a number. And, above all, if they donít like the White Houseís preferred policies, let them propose their own."

This is exactly what I wanted President Obama to do!

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Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 07:57 AM

33. It's a Constitutional issue. Budgets originate in the House. Doesn't Boehner and the repugs

believe in the Constitution?

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Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 08:49 AM

34. sycophantic bullshit/obamhype

i'm not at all optimistic about obama's ability or even his desire to protect the non-rich. I think he has convinced himself that certain things are inevitable when in fact they are not. I think that is part and parcel of being an american politician-you buy into the system, but the system is the problem.

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Response to tomp (Reply #34)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 04:58 PM

46. Then you haven't been paying attention, or you're

being willfully blind to Obama's desire to work for us. Whatever; sorry to disappoint.

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Response to babylonsister (Reply #46)

Sat Dec 1, 2012, 09:12 AM

52. your view, my view....

i'd say talk to me in four years but i'm sure whatever happens you will support obama.

i'm always open to supporting him and i will be happy to eat crow if things turn out well. but my view is based on paying attention to politics over the course of a lifetime and in my lifetime the democratic party has been part of the problem. that is a bedrock fact to me based on long observation. i don't know how you missed it with all your paying attention and all.

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Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 03:04 PM

42. Correct me if I am wrong but Didn't Boehner get 90% of what he wanted last time these

negotiations took place. Now it's time for OUR guy to get 90% -- right?

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Response to Filibuster Harry (Reply #42)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 05:04 PM

47. You call getting the credit rating of the US downgraded a win?

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Response to babylonsister (Reply #47)

Sat Dec 1, 2012, 08:00 PM

53. not me. That was not a win for our country but Speaker Boehner obviously thinks so.

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Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 06:03 PM

49. Fuck the Republicans

Obama is older and wiser and I am cautiously optimisitc that he will be effective in fighting his asshole opponents.

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Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 06:12 PM

50. No kidding.

And I must say, It's about time, Keep it up!

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Response to babylonsister (Original post)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 06:43 PM

51. If Republicans don't like this offer, make the next offer even less appetizing for them.

Make them sorry they didn't take the first offer. Make them beg to get back to the first offer.

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