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Tue Jan 24, 2012, 03:23 AM

Does anyone else notice how censored it seems to have become..

I used to love DU because we were so different from freeperland and now I find myself getting sick of not being able to say anything without being alerted on. I worry about expressing myself now and I even wonder how long it will be before we can no longer say what we want here.

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Reply Does anyone else notice how censored it seems to have become.. (Original post)
Ecumenist Jan 2012 OP
get the red out Jan 2012 #1
OneGrassRoot Jan 2012 #2
Ecumenist Jan 2012 #5
OneGrassRoot Jan 2012 #10
MorningGlow Jan 2012 #3
Missy Vixen Jan 2012 #4
Ecumenist Jan 2012 #6
Missy Vixen Jan 2012 #7
Ecumenist Jan 2012 #9
BlueIris Jan 2012 #15
NuttyFluffers Jan 2012 #16
Cleita Jan 2012 #8
kimmerspixelated Jan 2012 #18
Peregrine Took Jan 2012 #11
Ricochet21 Jan 2012 #12
bigmonkey Jan 2012 #13
Lucinda Jan 2012 #14
WolverineDG Jan 2012 #17

Response to Ecumenist (Original post)

Tue Jan 24, 2012, 08:35 AM

1. Slim pickin's

There seem to be slim pickin's so far as threads anymore as well, and I mean overall, not just in groups. I think there's a lot of timid posting now. It's like you need to make sure you post within a narrow view of liberalism or get alerted on, rather than just being civilized, at least that seems to be a perception many have. I can deal with civilized, fitting in a little pigeon hole not so much.

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Response to get the red out (Reply #1)

Tue Jan 24, 2012, 09:26 AM

2. There also seems to be personality conflict issues...

Granted, that's always been present, but with the jury system, there seem to be a lot of alerts and general nastiness based on past personality conflicts rather than specific posts.

I have lousy memory retention -- -- so I just can't recall most posters' histories regarding how they've posted and interacted here at DU. But others have excellent memories, and it seems this is coming into play in the interactions, or lack thereof. I witnessed this in my limited jury experience, and it's why I declined to be involved any further.

The jury system feels very cliquish, even though I don't believe that was the intention; it's just playing out that way, and perhaps it will evolve beyond that stage.

Personally, I don't have much desire to engage in a public forum that invites snark, trolls and stalkers at this time, and right now both DU3 and ASAH specifically seem to have that potential more than ever. Plus, I don't have much to say. Period.

But that could change at any moment.

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Response to OneGrassRoot (Reply #2)

Tue Jan 24, 2012, 11:26 AM

5. It's changing DU...for the worse and I'n sick and tired of getting alerted on for certain comments.

Both time I've been alerted on it's been because of tmy reaction to the violent sexual abuse of children by women. Certain types seem to believe that no matter what a woman does, (I am female), there is no negative word to be said about them. The latest was a w32 yo woman who was babysitting a 5 year old girl and SEXUALLY ABUSED HER WHILE STREAMING IT LIVE!! I was sexually abused by my babysitter hen I was 5 years old for a complete year!!

I reacted as anyone would in my shoes, I believe. The nest thing I know, I find out that I was alerted on. I know what you mean about the cliquish nature this site seems to have I said that she should die and save us money in incarceration because there's no doubt about what she did. I'M SICK OF FEELING THIS WAY

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Response to Ecumenist (Reply #5)

Tue Jan 24, 2012, 11:47 AM

10. I just don't know about DU3 at large...

I think mysticalchick and the other hosts are going to be devoted to helping this space once again be a space of positivity and support.

In DU2 the conflict/confrontation type of energy infused throughout the rest of DU rarely infiltrated ASAH. For different reasons, DU3 didn't start off that way.

Maybe it can get back to being that space. I honestly don't know. Public message boards, in general, are a dicey proposition when you share anything that is personal or sensitive in any way. Someone seems to pounce, no matter what is posted.

I really haven't posted much at all. I also don't recognize many of the names since the site upgrade. The site just isn't familiar to me now...very odd.

Anyway, to you and everyone else.



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Response to Ecumenist (Original post)

Tue Jan 24, 2012, 10:00 AM

3. I've noticed more viciousness overall

I haven't been alerted on yet (I don't think, anyway--how does one find that out?) but I have been posting way less than I used to because of the general nastiness pervading the main forums. Sure, there have always been DUers who will get their nose out of joint even over the most innocuous of posts, but for some reason on DU3 that behavior seems to have multiplied a hundredfold. I've even seen it in the Lounge!

So that's been preventing me from posting even harmless comments--I tense up, just KNOWING that someone is going to take it the wrong way and attack. I don't need that kind of shit in my life, frankly!

I'm curious to know what about DU3 has made that kind of behavior increase. Coincidence? Were DUers just trending that way and it happened to coincide with the switch to DU3? Or is something about DU3 encouraging people to engage in self-righteous "thou hast offended me, miscreant!" flamewars?

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Response to MorningGlow (Reply #3)

Tue Jan 24, 2012, 10:28 AM

4. I'm floored at the stuff I'm reading re: bigger forums and jury alerts

>Were DUers just trending that way and it happened to coincide with the switch to DU3?<

I'm sorry to be so cryptic. If there's another place ASAH'ers are meeting these days, please point me to it through PM.

It's been coming for a long, long time. Plus, this is the "honeymoon" period.

I'm also reminded of Blue Iris' prediction when DU3 was rolled out. I know in my heart she's right.

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Response to Missy Vixen (Reply #4)

Tue Jan 24, 2012, 11:27 AM

6. What did she say regarding DU3? The alerting is getting ridiculous...

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Response to Ecumenist (Reply #6)

Tue Jan 24, 2012, 11:38 AM

7. Shorter version: It will not be successful

Blue Iris, if this is not a correct paraphrase of your comments, I apologize in advance.

Maybe I'm just having a bad day, but I do not have a good feeling about what's going on re: marked lack of civility and perma-alerts at all.

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Response to Missy Vixen (Reply #7)

Tue Jan 24, 2012, 11:46 AM

9. That's what it seems to be. I also don't understand why we have to nervous to

discuss things like UFOs etc but others who believe differently can discuss them and be denigrating. I just answered a thread that was exactly that and what the OP said was absolutely wrong. She was laughing at Buzz Aldrin who noted that He, as he descended to the Moon, was an alien and how he was a loon when he said that.

I told here what he meant, as it was clear to anyone with 2 dried brain cells at the back of their cranium.

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Response to Missy Vixen (Reply #7)

Wed Jan 25, 2012, 01:02 AM

15. That is a correct paraphrase of what I predicted.

Longer version: I predict a huge drop in activity and donation revenue for this site as the result of The Change. The reasons for this are many, including the fact that everyone's enjoyment of DU has been on the decline for a while, and the nightmare that is the jury system will make it worse. Even Skinner admitted that DU3 might not "work" (he admitted this in the Ask the Administrators forum on the Old Site.)

Other developments may include an upset in "leadership"/ownership of this site. I think this may happen as the result of a big scandal affecting the Democratic Party that could reflect badly on DU's owners.

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Response to BlueIris (Reply #15)

Wed Jan 25, 2012, 04:45 AM

16. heh, i get that latter part too.

but remember, cryptic happy horse shit lets you ride the carousel longer to try for the brass ring.

circles and circles and circles... how they share meaning in one little word.

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Response to Ecumenist (Original post)

Tue Jan 24, 2012, 11:43 AM

8. It seems to be the price of fame.

I believe the alerters are doing it deliberately so we can't express ourselves. Give it time. I think the jury system might work in the long run. I have served several times and was able to neutralize many nonsense alerts. It seems there are still enough progressive DUers that outnumber the others that might turn things around.

On edit: I should have read the posts above before commenting. I have seen the personal vendetta thing going on and yes, it seems the same alerters are going in full steam. But, the good news is that it's getting easier to identify who did the alerting. Give the jury system a chance. I believe it will work in the long run.

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Response to Cleita (Reply #8)

Wed Jan 25, 2012, 06:27 PM

18. Sounds like a positive

idea. Give it time, yes.

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Response to Ecumenist (Original post)

Tue Jan 24, 2012, 12:41 PM

11. Doesn't seem like as many responses/posts as they used to get.

When I check in various times through the day - it seems the headlines haven't changed as much as they used to do.

I wonder if a lot of old DU'rs dropped out with the change.

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Response to Ecumenist (Original post)

Tue Jan 24, 2012, 01:21 PM

12. 10-4

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Response to Ecumenist (Original post)

Tue Jan 24, 2012, 01:22 PM

13. I'm always amazed at how some people immediately gravitate toward manipulating any system.

It doesn't matter what the system is, some subset of folks go right for it. It's not a motivation I share, so it always surprises me.

I think one of the problems with this new system is that it provides more opportunities for that subset of folks to attempt manipulations, whether they are successful or not. The old system put the burden on the mods to sort those folks out and deal with their activity - now that "infrastructure" burden is on all of us. I can kind of see the point of the new system, but it may indeed be too idealistic to work in practice.

Still, having your post hidden is not as catastrophic as having it deleted. People can still see it if they wish.

I guess, on the whole, I'm in the "hoping for the best" category.

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Response to Ecumenist (Original post)

Tue Jan 24, 2012, 03:17 PM

14. No I really don't.

I understand that you have had problems and there may be people looking to cause trouble for you with alerts, so your OP reflects your experience, but overall, more is allowed to stand than before. I've been watching the process from the inside in the hosts forum, and the intent of the system is good. If you violate the SOP that we all agree to when we sign up, it will get censored. Other than that, if your posts fit within the statement of purpose for the forum or group in which you post, the hosts can't touch it.

And even the jury system doesn't get posts removed, only hidden, so nothing is deleted anymore unless the poster removes it themselves.


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Response to Ecumenist (Original post)

Wed Jan 25, 2012, 08:50 AM

17. Alerted on in here?



Nope. I find DU3 to be a much nicer, open place. DU2 had so many cliques, each with their own pet mod, that if you ran afoul of one of them, they'd bully-swarm you & get their buddy to delete all your posts, even if you did not violate any rules. Or they'd post stuff that blatantly violated the rules, because they knew their buds were on duty & wouldn't delete or lock their posts for hours until the next shift.

As for being alerted on for posting unpopular views, I don't think you have anything to fear. Here's the results of a recent jury I was on. I strongly disagreed with the post, but it didn't violate any rules. I was not the only juror to point that out to the alerter. (I was Juror #3 & the results came in pretty quickly)


At Thu Jan 19, 2012, 04:38 PM an alert was sent on the following post:

Maybe there's a plan to change it to YesHeCon.org

REASON FOR ALERT:

This post is disruptive, hurtful, rude, insensitive, over-the-top, or otherwise inappropriate. (See <a href="http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=aboutus#communitystandards" target="_blank">Community Standards</a>.)

ALERTER'S COMMENTS:

No comments added by alerter

You served on a randomly-selected Jury of DU members which reviewed this post. The review was completed at Thu Jan 19, 2012, 04:48 PM, and the Jury voted 0-6 to LEAVE IT.

Juror #1 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given
Juror #2 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given
Juror #3 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: I'm not going to hide a post just because I don't agree with it. If you alert on something, respect jurors' time and let us know why you're alerting.
Juror #4 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given
Juror #5 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: I don't like the comment, but it is not rude, hurtful, disruptive or otherwise inappropriate. I can't vote to hide a post simply because I don't like what was said.
Juror #6 voted to LEAVE IT ALONE and said: No explanation given

Thank you very much for participating in our Jury system, and we hope you will be able to participate again in the future.

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