Fri Feb 15, 2013, 11:19 AM
cbayer (146,218 posts)
“I Will Leave BSA if Discriminatory Policy Does Not Change.”
February 15, 2013 9:37am
Post by JOANNA BROOKS
Max S. is a 15 year-old member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, and he joined the Boy Scouts of America through an LDS Church-affiliated troop. He’s a member of his school speech and debate team and is working hard to get good grades so he can “get a scholarship to a good college” and study physics. Over the years, he has worked his way up to the ranks of Life Scout; in the past few weeks, he’s also confronted anti-gay discrimination within the BSA. I spoke to him to put a human face on the current debate over inclusion of LGB scouts and leaders in the BSA.
RD: I understand you’re close to getting your Eagle Scout?
MS: I only have my project and a few merit badges to go.
RD: And you have strong feelings about the BSA policy on LGBT members and leaders. Share them?
MS: I was unaware that the Boy Scouts had a policy against gay members and leaders until I learned that they were considering changing it. I was shocked. Now that they have decided to postpone the decision until May I am completely annoyed because it should not have been that hard of a decision in the first place. If they decide against allowing gay members and leaders into the Boy Scouts, I think I will leave the organization without finishing my Eagle Scout award. It would be a prestigious honor and one that I have worked hard on but I don't want my name attached to an organization that does not honor the choices of others and feels so differently than I do on the issue. I feel like it is a discriminatory policy.
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7 replies, 959 views
“I Will Leave BSA if Discriminatory Policy Does Not Change.” (Original post)
|Phillip McCleod||Feb 2013||#7|
Response to cbayer (Original post)
Fri Feb 15, 2013, 11:22 AM
trotsky (40,893 posts)
1. No mention of whether the discrimination against atheists matters to him.
That's unfortunate, but not surprising.
Response to trotsky (Reply #1)
Fri Feb 15, 2013, 12:01 PM
d_r (4,673 posts)
2. I do not support the descrimination against atheists
and when this battle is won I will push for change.
But honestly the two do not equate.
both are bigotry. both are exclusionary. both are unfair.
one is based on a biological difference that makes someone who they are.
the other is based on a belief system, and that belief system is incongruent with the current belief systems of the organization.
the bsa is based on the view that you believe in something.
the bsa recognizes no single religion and allows members of any belief system, even self-defined. an atheiest could easily join the bsa by claiming to have a belief in ethical and moral behavior. or logic. or science. or humanism. those would meet the bsa requiements.
i can understand not wanting to do that. i can understand resenting the requirement.
but that does not equate with discrimination based one's biology.
Response to Goblinmonger (Reply #3)
Fri Feb 15, 2013, 02:44 PM
d_r (4,673 posts)
4. what federal dollars are you speaking of?
The pentagon has provided military land, facilities and personnel to support the jamboree (national meeting). That's the only trickle through to the Scouts I know of. I guess one could argue that they use public parks and public lands. Some local groups meet at public places like schools, so that is a trickle down of tax dollars, but even very religious groups can do that as long as the schools allow other organizations to meet there as well.
Is there some other federal funding I do not know of?
Response to d_r (Reply #4)
Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:04 PM
Goblinmonger (20,067 posts)
5. That's enough.
If the federal government gave that amount of support to an organization that did not allow blacks in, would that be OK? It's a violation of law for them to do that when they get governmental support.
Response to Goblinmonger (Reply #5)
Fri Feb 15, 2013, 09:01 PM
d_r (4,673 posts)
6. the office of faith based initiatives called
they want their charitible choice principle back.
but seriously. it is hard for me to get as upset about the bsa requiring a belief in "something" as it is to get upset about the ban of people who are homosexual from memberhip. People are boen gay. thats who they are. it is great if someone wants to have no faith. fine. but why want to join a caith based organization? again. the bsa allows any faith. including self defined personal spirituality. so if you believe in ethicws or logic or humanism or morality you can claim that as a personal beleif system. you dont have to believe in flying spaghetti monster. you could believe on science. that is your personal defined spirituality. you could believe there is no such thing s spirituality and that is your personal defined spirituality. you can believe that your beliefs are reality and thus superior to the supertitious beliefs of fools. and guess what that is yor self defined sense of spirituality.
that is just not as sympathetic as being discriminated against bc of your biology. thats my opinion.
again i dont support it or agree but i thi8nk the two are not equal.
and this point -4 that bsa recieves "federal dollars" and can not support a religioin is weak.
Response to d_r (Reply #6)
Sat Feb 16, 2013, 09:00 AM
Phillip McCleod (1,837 posts)
7. technically we're all born atheists
since overwhelmingly human beings die with the same religion into which they were indoctrinated as children. this is is the source of the 'religious indoctrination as child abuse' argument, in fact.