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Thu Jan 3, 2013, 06:32 PM

I'm actually glad to see such a fervent and dedicated gun restriction crowd on DU. Now tell me

Aside from complaining online, how many of you have actually donated $$ to the anti-gun organization of your choice.

I know you're out there because of all the screaming and hollering.

What are you actually doing besides complaining online?

22 replies, 1770 views

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Arrow 22 replies Author Time Post
Reply I'm actually glad to see such a fervent and dedicated gun restriction crowd on DU. Now tell me (Original post)
shadowrider Jan 2013 OP
HockeyMom Jan 2013 #1
gejohnston Jan 2013 #3
shadowrider Jan 2013 #5
Glaug-Eldare Jan 2013 #11
rl6214 Jan 2013 #20
sylvi Jan 2013 #22
NYC_SKP Jan 2013 #2
shadowrider Jan 2013 #4
HockeyMom Jan 2013 #6
NYC_SKP Jan 2013 #8
spin Jan 2013 #10
rrneck Jan 2013 #9
friendly_iconoclast Jan 2013 #16
jody Jan 2013 #7
jpak Jan 2013 #12
jody Jan 2013 #13
locks Jan 2013 #14
Dems to Win Jan 2013 #15
jimmy the one Jan 2013 #17
friendly_iconoclast Jan 2013 #21
Kaleva Jan 2013 #18
ThatPoetGuy Jan 2013 #19

Response to shadowrider (Original post)

Thu Jan 3, 2013, 06:42 PM

1. Baby Steps with my gun owner husband

He bought a 700 lb. safe installed in a closet instead of "having a loaded gun in every room for protection". When we are out together, he will not carry his concealed gun (permit) when I am with him. He will also not cite NRA propaganda about armed citizens to me EVER AGAIN, or try to take me to a range to shoot, or buy me an gun, pepper spray "gifts". I will REFUSE all these gifts. ACCEPT IT.

Small steps, but changing hearts and minds, and acknowledging the rights of NON-GUN people, is very much key issue. His 2nd Amendment "rights" END, where MINE begin.

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Response to HockeyMom (Reply #1)

Thu Jan 3, 2013, 06:53 PM

3. just like religion

do you respect his freedom to as much as you expect him to respect your freedom from?
These guns he gave you, anything you might want to sell to a fellow DUer?

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Response to HockeyMom (Reply #1)

Thu Jan 3, 2013, 06:55 PM

5. Those are your choices and I respect them.

One step at a time and you are apparently doing your part.

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Response to HockeyMom (Reply #1)

Thu Jan 3, 2013, 07:33 PM

11. Seems like you're learning to coexist better than I expected!

I'm happy to see that he's taking safety (and your happiness, it seems) more seriously.

Figure I'll take this opportunity to apologize for the jabs I've made in the past about your marriage. They were fruitless and immature, and DUers shouldn't treat each other the way I treated you. I'm sorry.

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Response to HockeyMom (Reply #1)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 10:04 PM

20. So I assume his 2nd Amendment "rights" BEGIN, where yours ENDS?

 

As long as your respect each others opinions, that's what really matters.

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Response to HockeyMom (Reply #1)

Sat Jan 5, 2013, 03:20 AM

22. Sounds less to me about changing hearts and minds

 

Sounds less to me about changing hearts and minds, or one right ending where another begins, than more about a husband simply trying to appease his wife. Not that there's anything wrong with that in order to keep peace in the relationship.

There are political issues I no longer discuss with certain members of my family, but it's just to keep the peace. It doesn't mean my views or convictions have changed.

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Response to shadowrider (Original post)

Thu Jan 3, 2013, 06:43 PM

2. I find this post a bit insulting and unproductive, but since you raise the point:

Your OP actually serves to raise an interesting argument.

Is it possible that some among those calling for gun control do so as a means of neglecting responsibility?

A la:

If only government would get it together, then I wouldn't have to THINK so hard about poverty, inequity, urban blight, gangs, etc.

I really have more important things to do, and, since I don't PERSONALLY want to use or own guns, this would be SO much more convenient.

That's some of what I've been kicking around for an OP.

That it takes work to solve violence, and expecting the government to do it through weapons legislation is just kicking the can down the road.

What do you think?

---

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Response to NYC_SKP (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 3, 2013, 06:53 PM

4. Interesting

Thanks for the reasoned response.

Most people, IMO, bitch and moan online, complain, call names, insist on further gun restrictions then go on their merry way knowing, in their heart, they've done something good when in fact they've done nothing.

All this OP is is (dependent upon what your definition of what "is" is) a way to see who puts their money where their mouth is.

All the complaining in the world accomplishes nothing if nothing is done to support the complaining.

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Response to NYC_SKP (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 3, 2013, 07:04 PM

6. Since I am a NYC native born and raised

and having moved to very gun lenient Florida, maybe I can answer that. It has to be a two fold process. Government AND private citizens. Do you really think NY, and especially NYC, could have the gun control laws WITHOUT the NYC/NYS citizens supporting those laws and electing those government officials? Will of the people of that area.

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Response to HockeyMom (Reply #6)

Thu Jan 3, 2013, 07:13 PM

8. The laws + the will (but absent a willingness to go even further) are not the solution.

NYC, for example, may have historically had the will and the representation to pass laws, but what I'm talking about is different.

In my view, if the community makes the commitment to do more than ask for more laws, if they instead lobby the courts to not be lenient, and insist that local law enforcement coordinate with state and federal agencies, and if they also work with NGOs and CBOs (community based orgs) to address jobs and hunger and blight and gangs and poverty, then I say THAT is what makes a difference.

Just asking for more laws to be passed is bullshit lazy. IMHO.

Here's what happened in Aurora:

Aurora murder-free for first time since 1946

Aurora made it through an entire calendar year in 2012 without a murder for the first time since 1946 and police Chief Greg Thomas says it's an indication the state's second-largest city is making strides toward erasing its dangerous reputation. "I think the safety of Aurora has definitely improved," Thomas said Wednesday. "Even today, we're still fighting this battle of perception and image, which I wish would go away."

Mayor Tom Weisner said the year without a murder is a reflection of strong policing and community collaboration against crime. "This is a very clear, symbolic statement of the great strides we've made in reducing crime," Weisner said.

He said the police department's leadership has been strengthened by efforts of nonprofit groups, social service agencies and faith-based organizations to start proactive programs and report suspicious situations.

Law enforcement strategies of community policing, coordinating with state and federal authorities to target gang members, and talking with families of teens at risk for joining gangs helped bring Aurora's yearly murder totals down over time, but Thomas said a year without a single slaying also involves an element of luck.
http://www.dailyherald.com/article/20130102/news/701029853/


.

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Response to HockeyMom (Reply #6)

Thu Jan 3, 2013, 07:31 PM

10. True. But you also have to realize that the gun laws in Florida ...

are also the will of the people in Florida.

It is also quite possible that sometime in the future "shall issue" concealed carry will be the law in NY and NYC. Since Florida passed this law in 1987 it has swept across our nation. Once again that was the will of the people in the states that passed "shall issue."



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Response to NYC_SKP (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 3, 2013, 07:30 PM

9. That's the difference between citizenship and consumerism. nt

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Response to NYC_SKP (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 3, 2013, 09:29 PM

16. You might have a point there. Passing laws with enough support is easy.

Actually doing something about, as opposed to talking about doing something about "poverty, inequity, urban blight, gangs, etc." is difficult.



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Response to shadowrider (Original post)

Thu Jan 3, 2013, 07:06 PM

7. shadowrider someone will find a pretext to alert and ban your OP. nt

 

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Response to jody (Reply #7)

Thu Jan 3, 2013, 07:44 PM

12. Alerting

request to ban has been sent.

yup



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Response to jpak (Reply #12)

Thu Jan 3, 2013, 07:56 PM

13. jpak! Other DUers were creating a tale about you committing a crime. Amazing how some people rush to

 

judgment.

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Response to shadowrider (Original post)

Thu Jan 3, 2013, 08:00 PM

14. What do you suggest?

I work hard for and support candidates I know will introduce and vote for gun control laws. Any time one of them speaks out (which isn't easy in the West) I immediately contact and thank them. I write letters to local newspapers and enlist my friends and other Democrats to do so also. I try to have good conversations with my family, especially my grandchildren, about guns and why I hope they will never own or use them. I write to families who have lost dear ones to gun violence. I send money when I can to anti-gun groups like Ceasefire (started by Tom Mauser who lost his son in the Columbine massacre).
Most importantly, I think, is to constantly work at all levels for better schools, teachers, and jobs, and against poverty, drugs, and inequality which produce despair, anger and violence. What else can you suggest?

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Response to shadowrider (Original post)

Thu Jan 3, 2013, 08:00 PM

15. Making my travel plans to go to the March on Washington for gun control Jan 26

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Response to shadowrider (Original post)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 12:37 PM

17. shall issue was never 'will of the people'

spin: {shall issue concealed carry} are also the will of the people in Florida.
Since Florida passed this law in 1987 it has swept across our nation. Once again that was the will of the people in the states that passed "shall issue."


This is baloney, total BS. Not one state had a majority of people supporting shall issue concealed carry laws. Not One. Poll after poll showed majority support did NOT want shall issue in their state. It wa REPUBLICAN legislatures which pushed through the UNWANTED shall issue ccw laws.
.. missouri about 1999 had a referendum on shall issue ccw & it FAILED by citizens voting on it, about 52 - 48%, yet their repub legislatures forced it through a couple years later (St Louis city enabled shall issue ccw in 2005 & the next year St Louis had the highest violent crime rate in america).
.. I believe Texas had the highest support for shall issue that I saw, but most polls I saw still had no majority.
.. No, shall issue concealed carry was NEVER the "Will of the People', but the will of rightwing legislatures with holier than thou mentalities. The will of the people was opposed to carrying concealed firearms.

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Response to jimmy the one (Reply #17)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 11:55 PM

21. Why then has 'shall issue' never yet been overturned?

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Response to shadowrider (Original post)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 12:51 PM

18. Writing and calling my Rep and Senators. I don't have much money.

After I made a $10 donation here, I have $13 and some change left till next Wednesday.

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Response to shadowrider (Original post)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 09:57 PM

19. What you call "complaining" is what I call "the most important part of the battle."

We didn't beat back the KKK and rampant racism by passing laws against them. Good guys won by letting everyone see their disapproval. Stetson Kennedy broke the back of the Klan by revealing to the world what a bunch of pathetic cretins they were, and then he smacked at racism with the "Frown Power" movement -- whenever someone starts spouting racist nonsense, frown to show your disapproval.

Laws prohibiting smoking in the workplace and laws prohibiting certain kinds of cigarette advrtising helped fight the smoking epidemic, but more than that, it was a general voice of millions of people saying "that shit's not cool, cut it out."

The good guys can win on the guns issue too, if we speak out about it loud, clear, and often.

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