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Wed Dec 26, 2012, 08:23 PM

 

The new and improved Feinstein AWB is here!



To the dismay of many... no outright banning, kicking down doors at 0300hrs and confiscation of currently owned firearms.

Should be interesting to see if this has any wind in its sails.


Following is a summary of the 2013 legislation:

Bans the sale, transfer, importation, or manufacturing of:
120 specifically-named firearms
Certain other semiautomatic rifles, handguns, shotguns that can accept a detachable magazine and have one military characteristic
Semiautomatic rifles and handguns with a fixed magazine that can accept more than 10 rounds
Strengthens the 1994 Assault Weapons Ban and various state bans by:
Moving from a 2-characteristic test to a 1-characteristic test
Eliminating the easy-to-remove bayonet mounts and flash suppressors from the characteristics test
Banning firearms with “thumbhole stocks” and “bullet buttons” to address attempts to “work around” prior bans
Bans large-capacity ammunition feeding devices capable of accepting more than 10 rounds.
Protects legitimate hunters and the rights of existing gun owners by:
Grandfathering weapons legally possessed on the date of enactment
Exempting over 900 specifically-named weapons used for hunting or sporting purposes and
Exempting antique, manually-operated, and permanently disabled weapons
Requires that grandfathered weapons be registered under the National Firearms Act, to include:
Background check of owner and any transferee;
Type and serial number of the firearm;
Positive identification, including photograph and fingerprint;
Certification from local law enforcement of identity and that possession would not violate State or local law; and
Dedicated funding for ATF to implement registration


http://www.feinstein.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/assault-weapons

64 replies, 7090 views

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Reply The new and improved Feinstein AWB is here! (Original post)
-..__... Dec 2012 OP
slackmaster Dec 2012 #1
-..__... Dec 2012 #3
Kaleva Dec 2012 #2
BlueStreak Dec 2012 #4
-..__... Dec 2012 #5
BlueStreak Dec 2012 #7
-..__... Dec 2012 #23
Travis_0004 Dec 2012 #6
BlueStreak Dec 2012 #8
Recursion Dec 2012 #12
BlueStreak Dec 2012 #15
Recursion Dec 2012 #16
BlueStreak Dec 2012 #18
Recursion Dec 2012 #19
BlueStreak Dec 2012 #24
gejohnston Dec 2012 #20
Pullo Dec 2012 #50
gejohnston Dec 2012 #9
krispos42 Dec 2012 #13
Recursion Dec 2012 #14
krispos42 Dec 2012 #48
Recursion Dec 2012 #10
krispos42 Dec 2012 #11
Recursion Dec 2012 #17
Clames Dec 2012 #21
Lizzie Poppet Dec 2012 #27
GreenStormCloud Dec 2012 #22
Puha Ekapi Dec 2012 #25
Abq_Sarah Dec 2012 #57
gejohnston Dec 2012 #58
Puha Ekapi Dec 2012 #26
Lizzie Poppet Dec 2012 #28
Puha Ekapi Dec 2012 #29
Lizzie Poppet Dec 2012 #30
AtheistCrusader Dec 2012 #31
rrneck Dec 2012 #32
OneTenthofOnePercent Dec 2012 #33
Puha Ekapi Dec 2012 #34
discntnt_irny_srcsm Dec 2012 #38
ManiacJoe Dec 2012 #35
bobclark86 Dec 2012 #42
Dr_Scholl Dec 2012 #36
Puha Ekapi Dec 2012 #37
PavePusher Dec 2012 #39
Puha Ekapi Dec 2012 #40
virginia mountainman Dec 2012 #41
mwrguy Dec 2012 #43
Recursion Dec 2012 #44
slackmaster Dec 2012 #45
Puha Ekapi Dec 2012 #46
Puha Ekapi Dec 2012 #47
Pullo Dec 2012 #49
spin Dec 2012 #51
Pullo Dec 2012 #52
spin Dec 2012 #53
former-republican Dec 2012 #54
friendly_iconoclast Dec 2012 #55
former-republican Dec 2012 #56
SQUEE Dec 2012 #59
JimFromTN Dec 2012 #60
oneshooter Dec 2012 #63
JimFromTN Dec 2012 #61
bobclark86 Dec 2012 #64
Callisto32 Dec 2012 #62

Response to -..__... (Original post)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 08:32 PM

1. She's Billy Jacking us again

 



AWB "Classic" barely passed in the House, and it did only after the 10-year sunset clause was added as a compromise.

A stricter ban as described doesn't stand a snowball's chance in Hell.

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #1)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 08:43 PM

3. A twist on "bait and switch"... method to the madness.

 

Propose something far reaching, then offer to sit down with the "other side", and try to reach a compromise for something more palatable.

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Response to -..__... (Original post)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 08:32 PM

2. Thanks! I signed up for the updates.

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Response to -..__... (Original post)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 08:46 PM

4. I don't see anything dealing with private sales or the gun show problem

And as part of this deal, can we get a vote on the confirmation of the ATF Director? Gee, it has only been 6 years so far.

http://articles.latimes.com/2011/sep/06/nation/la-na-atf-director-20110907

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Response to BlueStreak (Reply #4)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 08:54 PM

5. Separate issue... don't put all your eggs in one basket.

 

It will come... just not part of the same bill, and most likely from a different representative.

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Response to -..__... (Reply #5)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:05 PM

7. I don't get that

She seems like she is jumping the starting line, considering that this is what Biden is supposed to be directing.

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Response to BlueStreak (Reply #7)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:39 PM

23. She is...

 

but, it's her pet issue; always has been... always will be (McCarthy, too).

If I had to haphazard a guess... any "gunshow loophole" legislation will come from Schumer, or perhaps McCarthy.

The misdirection/sleight of hand/compromise bill doesn't necessarily have to come from her.

Whatever comes down from the Oval Office/Biden, could be offered as the 'compromise' bill.

Perhaps introduced in the House?

My personal opinion... it won't be as overreaching as Feinsteins legislation.

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Response to BlueStreak (Reply #4)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:05 PM

6. The bill won't pass anyway, so who cares what it says.

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Response to Travis_0004 (Reply #6)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:07 PM

8. Don't be so sure. The climate is changing quiclly. It makes zero sense to float a bill

that is missing the most important element. Without getting control over the private sales and gun shows, nothing else matters.

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Response to BlueStreak (Reply #8)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:12 PM

12. This affects private sales significantly

Any grandfathered weapon will require a background check, tax stamp, and permission of local law enforcement for any legal private sale.

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Response to Recursion (Reply #12)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:16 PM

15. I don't know what is in the draft bill, but I don't see in the above list

anything that would require registration and background check on private sales and gun show transactions.

It would be insane to offer a bill without that, so let's hope that is covered in the actual bill.

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Response to BlueStreak (Reply #15)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:19 PM

16. Sentence starting "requires grandfathered weapons..."

What's insane is a bill about gun crime that focuses on rifles and shotguns rather than handguns.

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Response to Recursion (Reply #16)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:26 PM

18. That seems to say

you have to get background checks for the guns you now possess, but I don't see where there are any restrictions on, for example, an insane person or felon BUYING additional weapons at a gun show. They wouldn't be able to buy a street-sweeper, apparently, but really we need to close that loophole altogether.


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Response to BlueStreak (Reply #18)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:28 PM

19. Oh, you mean for non-assault weapons?

Yeah, that's why so many people complain about this whole avenue of legislation: it's only targeting the weapons used in a very small number of crimes, and leaving the much more commonly-misused guns alone.

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Response to Recursion (Reply #19)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:47 PM

24. For ANY guns

Glocks, Lugars, whatever

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Response to BlueStreak (Reply #18)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:33 PM

20. for the same reason you can't get a machine gun or street sweeper at a gun show

it falls under NFA rules. BTW, most sales at gun shows are from FFLs, which makes the "gun show loophole" meme kind of nonsense. BTW, it isn't a even a moderate source of crime guns, according to the ATF.

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Response to Recursion (Reply #16)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 07:24 PM

50. VPC changed strategies in the late 80's

They weren't getting anywhere with the push to ban handguns, so they shifted their focus to "assault" weapons.

Even tho those firearms were rarely used in crimes comparatively, the idea was just to get some guns banned regardless, and scary looking guns seemed like low-hanging fruit. It was to be a stepping stone.

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Response to BlueStreak (Reply #4)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:09 PM

9. if only it were a different nomonee

The nomination of the Naperville, Ill., native to be top gun cop is applauded by gun-control activists, who say the 5,000-employee ATF has lost ground in its regulation of the $28 billion US firearms business, having labored under interim directors since 2006.

But the idea of an ATF director who hails from Chicago, a city without gun shops, and who has conflated black market automatic weapons with legal semi-automatic "assault-style" rifles is causing Second Amendment defenders to worry that President Obama intends to blast away at gun rights by force of bureaucracy, if not law.

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justice/2010/1119/Andrew-Traver-Is-Obama-s-choice-for-ATF-chief-an-antigun-zealot
IIRC, he had a reporter fire a full auto AK from the hip, to make a (false) point about how those are legal and flooding the streets.
http://www.nbcchicago.com/news/local/Assault-Weapons-Surge-in-City-69620227.html

Given the ATF's lack of professionalism in general, and it's EEO issues, a cesspool of sexists and racists, in particular, the last thing they need is a dishonest ideologue in charge of the place.

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Response to BlueStreak (Reply #4)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:13 PM

13. Private intrastate sales are not federal

They have to be done by the various states.

Interstate sales are regulated, though.

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Response to krispos42 (Reply #13)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:15 PM

14. The Feds take a dim view of intrastate pot sales

Though I think that like with drugs they'd have to dig leaf it with an excise that they don't grant stamps for.

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Response to Recursion (Reply #14)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 05:34 PM

48. Guns are not illegal though

The method of sale is what I'd regulated. Interstate sales must be from federal dealer to federal dealer.

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Response to -..__... (Original post)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:09 PM

10. Significantly better than the 94 law

Doesn't stand a chance in the House, but this one at least makes sense.

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Response to -..__... (Original post)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:12 PM

11. So, as predicted, the ambiguous term "assault weapon" has a moving-goalpost definition

Now, it's not two secondary characteristics, it's just one. Because THAT'S the problem.


Somebody on here said a few months ago that "no legal weapons will be confiscated". And the reply was that the definition of "legal" would shift, so it's really a meaningless statement. And... it's true.


Once again, Feinstein doesn't have the guts to come out and say "ban all semi-autos". No, no, no, she has to make the definition of "assault weapon" even more convoluted and prejudicial and useless.

And the anti-gun contingent on DU will applaud her and shove laurels up her butt and congratulate her on "taking on the gun lobby" or the "gun culture" or some shit.

SHE'S NOT SOLVING ANY PROBLEM THAT DUERS WANT HER TO ADDRESS, but she sure as hell is distracting DUers from her right-of-center history the last few years, isn't she?

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Response to krispos42 (Reply #11)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:22 PM

17. Can I still buy/make a lower receiver?

And if so, why would anyone waste time sponsoring or opposing this?

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Response to -..__... (Original post)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:37 PM

21. Pure comedy.

 

Requires that grandfathered weapons be registered under the National Firearms Act, to include: 


Reality was not required when this was being written.

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Response to Clames (Reply #21)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:51 PM

27. Oh, but think of the children!!!

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Response to -..__... (Original post)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:38 PM

22. Background investigations for tens of millions of rifles?

When will the FBI have time for anything else?

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Response to GreenStormCloud (Reply #22)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:48 PM

25. Feinstein's...

...Crime Wave Enabler bill.

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Response to GreenStormCloud (Reply #22)

Fri Dec 28, 2012, 01:10 AM

57. The summary was unclear



But I'm wondering if magazines over 10 rounds would be subject to the NFA the same as the millions of firearms proposed. That's a lot of revenue when you consider the NFA Stamp tax is $200 per item. Of course, compliance would be astronomically low, making instant felons out of millions of Americans.

I used to consider Senator Feinstein fairly intelligent. I'm sorry to see that notion disabused.

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Response to Abq_Sarah (Reply #57)

Fri Dec 28, 2012, 01:34 AM

58. I think a magizine would be an "all other weapon"

like a pistol forward grip. The tax would be five bucks.

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Response to -..__... (Original post)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:50 PM

26. Jesus Christ...

...on a crutch. They're just asking for a Rethuglican Senate in '14 and a Repuke prez in '16.

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Response to Puha Ekapi (Reply #26)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:53 PM

28. ^ So very fucking this! ^

She's a CCW permit holder, last I heard. Couldn't she have shot herself in the foot literally instead of doing it figuratively to the entire party?

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Response to Lizzie Poppet (Reply #28)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:55 PM

29. She is not...

..currently a CCW holder, though she has been in the past IIRC.

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Response to Puha Ekapi (Reply #29)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 09:58 PM

30. Ah, thank you.

Last edited Thu Dec 27, 2012, 02:15 PM - Edit history (2)

Same point though (perhaps one of her armed bodyguards could do it...). If this proposal gets a real push, it's going to cost us badly in the next election.

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Response to -..__... (Original post)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 11:12 PM

31. I'd be happy to register mine today IF

I don't have to re-register the fucking things every damn year. If it is handled like the NFA registry is now, cool beans. Recurring registry? Fuck it, I'll just sell them.

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Response to -..__... (Original post)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 11:13 PM

32. Ah.

THE ACT TO MAKE SPREE KILLERS SLIGHTLY LESS EFFICIENT.

Oh, yeah. That'll fix everything. Nice work.

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Response to -..__... (Original post)

Wed Dec 26, 2012, 11:26 PM

33. Where can I find this list of "120 specifically named firearms"?

 

Since the bayo lug and flash suppressor test is removed from the charactarisics... you need a detachable magazine and more than, or just one "evil" feature?

For example, if a gun had a detachable magazine and only a pistol grip (no other evil features)... is it an assault weapon?

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Response to OneTenthofOnePercent (Reply #33)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 12:05 AM

34. You need to pass....

....the bill to find out what the 120 specified weapons are

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Response to OneTenthofOnePercent (Reply #33)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 10:38 AM

38. re: "... is it an assault weapon?"

Ah; having to resort to Shakespeare so early in the day:
"What's in a name? that which we call a rose
By any other name would smell as sweet;"

I presume marketing has read Romeo's response:
"I take thee at thy word:
Call me but love, and I'll be new baptized;
Henceforth I never will be Romeo."

I surmise these folks work for the learned senator:

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Response to -..__... (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 03:39 AM

35. Nothing has been filed yet

according to http://thomas.loc.gov

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Response to ManiacJoe (Reply #35)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 01:35 PM

42. That's because

the session ends in less than a week and it would die. That's why her page said January.

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Response to -..__... (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 05:15 AM

36. Harry Reid is going to laugh his ass off when she introduces that.

 

n/t

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Response to Dr_Scholl (Reply #36)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 10:07 AM

37. One can hope.

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Response to -..__... (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 12:14 PM

39. "and have one military characteristic"

 

What the hell does that mean? My Grandmother's Winchester .30-30 was designed for the military, which "military characteristics" does it have?

Feinstein is a fucking slack-jawed, glazed-eyed, drooling, mouth-breather.

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Response to PavePusher (Reply #39)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 12:33 PM

40. Characteristics such as...

barrels, triggers, sights...one can see where they could potentially go with this. If there is any rational thought left in either house, this will die a quick death.

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Response to -..__... (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 12:38 PM

41. All it is for is to..

Freak everyone out, get everyone stirred up, so another senator could introduce a "watered down" AW ban, that would be a "compromise" to the Feinstein bill and pass much easier...So they can talk about how they "compromised"..

They hope...

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Response to -..__... (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 03:12 PM

43. It's a start


This would end most semi-auto gun ownership in one generation.

Not a very good timeline, but better than nothing.

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Response to mwrguy (Reply #43)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 03:34 PM

44. No, it would just require a traditional grip

Ironically the SKS would probably be fine.

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Response to Recursion (Reply #44)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 03:58 PM

45. The standard SKS-45 and the short "tanker" version are still OK in California

 

Lots of them are now officially curios or relics because they are over 50 years old.

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Response to mwrguy (Reply #43)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 04:35 PM

46. Pushing this bill...

...could usher in the Contract with America part Deux. I don't think any of us want THAT to happen. Even with the increased support for gun control in the last few weeks, the U.S. is even less gun control friendly than it was in 1994, and there would likely be a very strong backlash at the polls against elected officials who support this.

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Response to -..__... (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 04:37 PM

47. I'm still trying to wrap...

...my head around banning thumbhole stocks. I mean seriously, what sort of moron dreams this shit up?

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Response to -..__... (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 07:11 PM

49. This bill doesn't stand a chance of passage

It has everything to Feinstein's ego and self-promotion, and little to do with reducing gun violence.

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Response to Pullo (Reply #49)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 07:33 PM

51. The truly sad part is that some gun owners will decide that the NRA propaganda was right. ...

and that ALL elected Democrats do wish to ban and confiscate firearms.

How many votes will her purposed legislation cost our party in the next and all future elections and how many people will decide that they have to buy an "assault weapon" before any such legislation passes?



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Response to spin (Reply #51)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 10:24 PM

52. Its absurd. Its going to make Wayne Lapierre look precient.

The NRA is only going to grow after this. Meanwhile, the the Democratic caucuses in the House and Senate will undoubtedly shrink.

Say hello to draconian cuts to Medicaid, Medicare, and Social Security. For what purpose?

This is maddening!

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Response to Pullo (Reply #52)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 10:28 PM

53. I agree. It's very frustrating. (n/t)

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Response to spin (Reply #51)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 10:31 PM

54. "some gun owners will decide that the NRA propaganda was right"

 

That's because it's not all propaganda.

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Response to former-republican (Reply #54)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 10:48 PM

55. Rest assured, it *is* all propaganda- however 'propaganda' =/= 'completely untrue'

In fact, propaganda with some truth to it is the most effective kind. Think about it:

If someone says "Jews are, in fact, extraterrestrial lizard people" (i.e. David Icke), >99%
of the people hearing that will think, as the late Graham Chapman put it: You're a loony!

You can't say that about the "Democrats will take your guns" meme, because some
Democrats certainly want to....

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Response to friendly_iconoclast (Reply #55)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 10:57 PM

56. They don't have the votes

 

Of course you are able to disagree with this but
IMO if they had the votes and the legal standing ( big one right there)

The leadership of the Democratic party would be able to twist enough arms in the party
to have private ownership of firearms banned.

There are more members in our party that would want to see this.
Not less.......

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Response to -..__... (Original post)

Fri Dec 28, 2012, 08:45 AM

59. So ...

every Glock, Sig, XD, M&P, is now considered an Assault Weapon. This is an asinine idea and serves to actually legitimize the propaganda spewing forth from the right.I also question the Constitutionality of this, some states ban NFA items, how is that going to be handled. People on this board keep talking about common sense regulation, or that gun owners need to be reasonable, and then a proud and avowed gun grabber puts forth this. Even if it is an aim high attempt, it is now out there as a "proof" that they want all firearms out of civilian hands.

I have actually figured that AWs would end up being re-classed as an NFA item and over time have SBR'ed all my modern rifles even those with 16" and longer barrels. At current time I have 11 NFA items, and 2 pending, none are full autos and all done via trust. So that means this will have zero effect on my rifles, but it does effect most of my pistols, as I have nothing semi with < 10 round capacity. Up to now, few gun owners have done the same thing, this pretty much means that going forward, only people with means will own effective and modern firearms.
Seems less than progressive to me.

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Response to SQUEE (Reply #59)

Fri Dec 28, 2012, 09:51 AM

60. Banning firearms with “thumbhole stocks”

Does this mean that my bolt action 270 with the thumbhole stock that I use for deer hunting is an assault rifle?

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Response to JimFromTN (Reply #60)

Fri Dec 28, 2012, 11:43 AM

63. Thats right!! Not only is it a "assault rifle"

It is also a sniper rifle! Turn it in and watch it be fed into "Captain Crunch"!!!!




If it is needed.



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Response to -..__... (Original post)

Fri Dec 28, 2012, 09:58 AM

61. I'm confused

If kitchen knives kill significantly more people in this country than assualt rifles, why aren't we going after kitchen knives first? Isn't this about saving lives? Englands doing it.

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Response to JimFromTN (Reply #61)

Fri Dec 28, 2012, 11:55 AM

64. England also banned airsoft guns through the mail...

They also banned handguns so well the Olympic shooting team can't practice in England (or Scotland, or Wales).



As you can see, the ban was very helpful in the next 10 years. Oh, wait. Murders actually spiked.

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Response to -..__... (Original post)

Fri Dec 28, 2012, 11:14 AM

62. No time for legally required budget resolutions, nope....

plenty of time for liberty-crushing horseshit like this and* making sure FISA stays around, though.


*Edit

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