HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Topics » Justice & Public Safety » Gun Control & RKBA (Group) » We are going about this t...
Introducing Discussionist: A new forum by the creators of DU

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 10:09 PM

We are going about this the wrong way

What if we make the gun enthusiasts, NRA, and manufacturers responsible for a solution? In other words if you want to have the privilege of owning a gun then you (the collective you gun enthusiasts, supporters, etc) are responsible for making sure they don't fall into the wrong hands. If they can't come up with a solution to stop mass killing with these weapons, designed for killing as many people as possible, then the general manufacturing and owning of such weapons should be outlawed. Yes, I know the military will need them, they can contract out. I am talking about repealing the second amendment. If you want to own a gun then come up with a solution or lose the right. I am tired of these naysayers and the "oh we can't do anything..." or "it is too complex an issue." It is very simple solve it or lose it.

18 replies, 1734 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 18 replies Author Time Post
Reply We are going about this the wrong way (Original post)
Doodler71 Dec 2012 OP
gejohnston Dec 2012 #1
Doodler71 Dec 2012 #7
gejohnston Dec 2012 #9
Doodler71 Dec 2012 #11
Clames Dec 2012 #15
gejohnston Dec 2012 #16
kelly1mm Dec 2012 #2
Doodler71 Dec 2012 #8
discntnt_irny_srcsm Dec 2012 #10
Doodler71 Dec 2012 #12
discntnt_irny_srcsm Dec 2012 #14
AtheistCrusader Dec 2012 #17
TheMoreYouKnow Dec 2012 #18
dkf Dec 2012 #3
RegieRocker Dec 2012 #4
gejohnston Dec 2012 #6
Tumbulu Dec 2012 #5
discntnt_irny_srcsm Dec 2012 #13

Response to Doodler71 (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 10:18 PM

1. how about learning current laws

or learning the issues? Simple answers to complex issues are not solutions. That is how the real world works. Deal with it. Besides, we do offer ideas and solutions only to be dismissed as "NRA talking points."

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to gejohnston (Reply #1)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 10:40 PM

7. How about laws change all the time

It is time to put up or shut up. If it can't be made safe, you lose the privledge.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Doodler71 (Reply #7)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 10:49 PM

9. It's not a privlege

why should I pay for someone else? I didn't steal the guns and murder anyone.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to gejohnston (Reply #9)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 11:03 PM

11. Because your rights end where others begin.

In modern democratic states, a privilege is conditional and granted only after birth. By contrast, a right is an inherent, irrevocable entitlement held by all citizens or all human beings from the moment of birth.

PRIVILEGE, rights. This word, taken its active sense, is a particular law, or a particular disposition of the law, which grants certain special prerogatives to some persons, contrary to common right. In its passive sense, it is the same prerogative granted by the same particular law.
2. Examples of privilege may be found in all systems of law; members of congress and of the several legislatures, during a certain time, parties and witnesses while attending court; and coming to and returning from the same; electors, while going to the election, remaining on the ground, or returning from the same, are all privileged from arrest, except for treason, felony or breach of the peace.Chit. Com. Law, 431.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Doodler71 (Reply #11)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 11:09 PM

15. The hell they do.

 

Where do your rights end where mine begin?


Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Doodler71 (Reply #11)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 11:12 PM

16. since you are going for collective punishment of millions of innocent people

who had nothing to do with any crime, instead of the individual responsible through due process? I'm guessing the fourth and fifth amendments will be next since, using your definition, they are also privileges.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Doodler71 (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 10:19 PM

2. Not only would congress have to pass a constutional amendment to repeal the 2nd

amendment (unlikely as things stand now), then you would need to have 38 states ratify the amendment (almost impossible). Do you think that even today, if a vote were taken in congress tomorrow, that repealing the 2nd amendment would pass? Even more importantly do you really believe there are not 13 states that would refuse to ratify?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to kelly1mm (Reply #2)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 10:42 PM

8. Every major change faces impossible odds

If you want to own guns, make it safe. Otherwise you are complicit in the murders from here on out.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Doodler71 (Reply #8)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 10:59 PM

10. re: "If you want to own guns, make it safe. Otherwise you are complicit..."

You'll need 12 jurors for each of the 80,000,000 American gun owners to make that stick.

No thanks, you can try again.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to discntnt_irny_srcsm (Reply #10)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 11:04 PM

12. You underestimate me. (Nt)

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Doodler71 (Reply #12)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 11:06 PM

14. No, no no.

I never underestimate doodlers. One of them invented the autopilot. Doodled it on a dinner napkin.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Doodler71 (Reply #8)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 11:34 PM

17. Well, if you say so.

Any other commercial products you want to apply this logic to?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Doodler71 (Reply #8)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 09:19 AM

18. I already own guns

 

And they're perfectly safe. I've owned a self defense firearm of some sort for 38 years now and I've never had any part or responsibility in any firearm death or injury. Blame those who are responsible, not people like myself who have nothing to do with anything illegal.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Doodler71 (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 10:21 PM

3. What if that includes possibly intrusive mental health examinations

 

Personally I think that is where we need to be looking but I do not know what federal laws allow.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Doodler71 (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 10:23 PM

4. There is already a solution for that

 

safes and gun trigger rfid safety releases. What failed with Lanza was why the guns were not secured so that he had no access? Why did she involve him with guns in the first pplace? n regards to Loughner and Holmes why were they able to get guns with a mental condition?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to RegieRocker (Reply #4)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 10:30 PM

6. because they were not reported in the system

they were not adjudicated, the system had know way of knowing. That falls on the family and others around them.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Doodler71 (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 10:29 PM

5. Agree

The thing is- meaningful reform or they are gone. Period, end of story.

You are on the right track.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Doodler71 (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 11:04 PM

13. re: "What if we make the gun enthusiasts, NRA, and manufacturers responsible for a solution?"

You should write to the NRA and bring that up as an idea, they'll put those friendly folks over at ALEC to work on it.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread