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Tue Nov 6, 2012, 01:45 AM

Iowa Concealed Carry Permits Surge - Criminal Shootings Surge Too

Local news reports

It's been nearly two years since Iowa became a "shall issue" concealed weapons state. As a "shall issue" state, county sheriffs can only deny concealed weapons permits for specific reasons like alcoholism, mental illness or past felony convictions.

Since then, concealed weapons permits have surged. According to the Iowa Department of Public Safety, in 2010, 40,747 Iowans got permits to carry a gun. Last year, the first year under shall issue, that number skyrocketed to 102,729 Iowans.

Cedar Rapids police statistics show another alarming change; a jump in gun incidents. In 2011, there were a dozen gun-related police reports in Cedar Rapids. And so far this year, there have been 52 shootings including shot-up buildings, suicides and murders.

But, a records search shows not one of the known offenders had a gun permit. Its no surprise to gun shop owner Ernie Traugh. The violence isn't coming from the ppl with permits, we don't have to worry about that, said Cedar Valley Outfitters Owner Ernie Traugh.


That's even a bigger lie than we usually hear about the concealed carry guys being safe. It's funny how the pro-gun crowd will suspend all common sense and reason in order to claim belief in the most absurd statistics.

I cannot believe that the increase in concealed carry permits has had only an indirect affect on the increase in criminal gun incidents. I would imagine it's more direct. An indirect affect might be having their guns stolen or transferring their guns to unfit people without doing background checks. A direct affect would be when one of the concealed carry holders actually does something wrong.

To claim that not one single person committed a gun crime is absurd. The "records search" is total nonsense, for one reason, because no one is checking. When someone kills himself or another, or commits some other gun crime, no one is checking if he has a concealed carry permit unless it comes up by accident and makes the news. So, the truth is, we have no idea how many of these licensed gun owners are becoming criminals.

What's your opinion? Please leave a comment.
Cross posted at Mikeb302000

18 replies, 2231 views

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Arrow 18 replies Author Time Post
Reply Iowa Concealed Carry Permits Surge - Criminal Shootings Surge Too (Original post)
mikeb302000 Nov 2012 OP
Eleanors38 Nov 2012 #1
friendly_iconoclast Nov 2012 #2
gejohnston Nov 2012 #3
GreenStormCloud Nov 2012 #4
slackmaster Nov 2012 #5
ileus Nov 2012 #6
glacierbay Nov 2012 #7
Atypical Liberal Nov 2012 #14
sarisataka Nov 2012 #8
Remmah2 Nov 2012 #9
Common Sense Party Nov 2012 #10
PavePusher Nov 2012 #11
Clames Nov 2012 #12
Atypical Liberal Nov 2012 #13
Common Sense Party Nov 2012 #16
montanto Nov 2012 #15
rl6214 Nov 2012 #17
fightthegoodfightnow Nov 2012 #18

Response to mikeb302000 (Original post)

Tue Nov 6, 2012, 02:14 AM

1. One city. Incident increase of forty (40). Some surge.nt

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Response to mikeb302000 (Original post)

Tue Nov 6, 2012, 02:16 AM

2. So they *must* have done something criminal, even though you have no evidence of it?

That's weak even by your demonstrably low standards. BTW Mikey/Jason/baldr, I never knew you were a Colonist:

"Sergeant Colon had had a broad education. Hed been to the School of My Dad Always Said, the College of It Stands to Reason, and was now a postgraduate student at the University of What Some Bloke In the Pub Told Me."

Terry Pratchett, Jingo

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Response to mikeb302000 (Original post)

Tue Nov 6, 2012, 02:27 AM

3. how many of these increased incidents are

suicides? How are suicides relevant to CCW
What empirical evidence do you have that these statistics are absurd?
Why would the Iowa gov. fake them?
What indirect effect? There isn't any shown evidence that one has anything to do with another.

I cannot believe that the increase in concealed carry permits has had only an indirect affect on the increase in criminal gun incidents. I would imagine it's more direct. An indirect affect might be having their guns stolen or transferring their guns to unfit people without doing background checks. A direct affect would be when one of the concealed carry holders actually does something wrong.
You have no evidence to back up your first sentence, because you did not show any affect.
Your second sentence has nothing to do with CCW
There is no evidence of that in any jurisdiction. The state does check, and how would a plastic card or lack of alter someone's actions?

Ever take a class in logic or critical thinking?
http://www.theskepticsguide.org/resources/logicalfallacies.aspx
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fallacies

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Response to mikeb302000 (Original post)

Tue Nov 6, 2012, 08:35 AM

4. Every known offender is checked by police for a CCW.

It is standard police procedure and takes only a few seconds. When they enter the offenders name for a records check that is one of the things that is automatically checked by the computer. As usual you don't know what you are talking about.

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Response to mikeb302000 (Original post)

Tue Nov 6, 2012, 09:10 AM

5. ROFLMAO!

 

The "records search" is total nonsense, for one reason, because no one is checking. When someone kills himself or another, or commits some other gun crime, no one is checking if he has a concealed carry permit unless it comes up by accident and makes the news.

That's bullshit, Mike. It's trivial for law enforcement people to check to see if a person has a concealed weapons permit - They do so for every person they detain, even during traffic stops, for their own safety.

You're really reaching to try to find something negative in a news story that is purely positive with respect to the issue of concealed weapons permits. Your bias is obvious.

ETA DU Rec because Mike completely missed the point.

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Response to mikeb302000 (Original post)

Tue Nov 6, 2012, 09:17 AM

6. Ernie is correct.

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Response to mikeb302000 (Original post)

Tue Nov 6, 2012, 09:27 AM

7. Once again Mikey

 

you have no clue what you're talking about. Every time we run a name through our computer database, it will tell us everything about the person, including whether or not said person has a CC permit.
Your assertion that LE doesn't know or doesn't check to see if a person has a CC permit is just so much horseshit, it's astounding how ignorant you are on this subject.

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Response to glacierbay (Reply #7)

Tue Nov 6, 2012, 03:39 PM

14. "it's astounding how ignorant you are on this subject." Hey, he's IMAGINING.

 

Let's not challenge Mike's imagination, now, OK?

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Response to mikeb302000 (Original post)

Tue Nov 6, 2012, 09:29 AM

8. In the words of Ripley:

"Believe it... or not"

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Response to mikeb302000 (Original post)

Tue Nov 6, 2012, 10:42 AM

9. BLOG (acronym)

 

Bullshitter Lying On (the) Grid

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Response to mikeb302000 (Original post)

Tue Nov 6, 2012, 10:43 AM

10. "affect" You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

So you attribute causality to the jump in gun "incidents"? More concerned citizens took the time to fill out the paperwork and get a CCW permit, and that led, inevitably, to the increase in gun incidents? Is that what you "imagine"?

Could it not, perhaps, be the other way around? Concerned citizens see the increase in crime and violent crimes by armed criminals, and they therefore want to arm themselves for protection? Cedar Rapids has gone downhill in the past few years and the perception is that crime is much worse.

You will continue to believe what you wish, perched in your ivory Italian blogosphere bubble, but real people who live in real American cities sometimes choose to make real decisions that will help their families should a really bad situation arise.

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Response to mikeb302000 (Original post)

Tue Nov 6, 2012, 12:35 PM

11. My opinion? I think you are simply lying and looking for fights. n/t

 

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Response to PavePusher (Reply #11)

Tue Nov 6, 2012, 02:23 PM

12. Makes one wonder where the usual suspects are and why...

 

...why they aren't showing up here to support this drivel. Come on Dan, Warren, Elissonz, Fight, and others. Surely you won't leave a fellow anti-gunner hanging to (not) defend his own assertions again? Certainly vocal enough to denounce other regulars but silent for those that equate lawful gun owners to criminals and murderers and advocate expeditious use of the death penalty...

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Response to mikeb302000 (Original post)

Tue Nov 6, 2012, 03:37 PM

13. "I would imagine"

 

There Mike goes with his imagination in lieu of facts again.

How about some actual data that shows the number of people in Iowa who have CCW permits and the number of those people who commit crimes? Oh wait...

So, the truth is, we have no idea how many of these licensed gun owners are becoming criminals.

Hey! There it is! So why don't we just make shit up about it, instead?

Come on Mike. A little less imagination, a little more data.

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Response to Atypical Liberal (Reply #13)

Tue Nov 6, 2012, 04:45 PM

16. "I would imagine" ... Translation: Facts are NOT on my side, so...

I'll just pull some more nonsense out of my nether orifice.

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Response to mikeb302000 (Original post)

Tue Nov 6, 2012, 04:28 PM

15. Are you still here?

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Response to mikeb302000 (Original post)

Tue Nov 6, 2012, 10:17 PM

17. I'm going for my renewal next week here in Texas

 

And fuck anyone that doesn't like it.

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Response to mikeb302000 (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 01:23 AM

18. BRAVO MIKE!!!!!


















.

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