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Wed Aug 1, 2012, 06:20 PM

Myths and Facts About Gun Violence in America

As families in Aurora, Colorado, and across the nation grieve following the tragic shooting that left 12 people dead and 58 others injured, the Joyce Foundation and our grantees remain committed to keeping our communities safe and free of gun violence.

There are several myths circulating in the public dialogue about gun violence in America. As a foundation committed to research-based grant-making, the Joyce Foundation and our grantees are dedicated to presenting the facts about the threat of gun violence to public safety and public health:

Myth: There is decreasing public support for policy solutions to curb gun violence.

Fact: The majority of Americans support common-sense measures to prevent gun violence. For example, 86% of Americans support a measure requiring all gun buyers to pass a criminal background check, while 63% of Americans support a measure banning military-style assault weapons. In fact, even 74% of NRA members and 87% of non-NRA gun owners support requiring criminal background checks of anyone purchasing a gun. While public opinion polling by Gallup has shown decreasing support for "stricter gun laws," other polls show that Americans overwhelmingly support specific gun policy solutions.

http://www.joycefdn.org/myths-and-facts-about-gun-violence-in-america/

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Arrow 27 replies Author Time Post
Reply Myths and Facts About Gun Violence in America (Original post)
SecularMotion Aug 2012 OP
shadowrider Aug 2012 #1
Hoyt Aug 2012 #2
upaloopa Aug 2012 #3
Missycim Aug 2012 #8
Callisto32 Aug 2012 #17
Missycim Aug 2012 #19
Callisto32 Aug 2012 #24
Trunk Monkey Aug 2012 #10
NewMoonTherian Aug 2012 #13
friendly_iconoclast Aug 2012 #15
HALO141 Aug 2012 #20
baldguy Aug 2012 #16
Missycim Aug 2012 #18
krispos42 Aug 2012 #21
shadowrider Aug 2012 #25
rDigital Aug 2012 #27
virginia mountainman Aug 2012 #4
SecularMotion Aug 2012 #5
virginia mountainman Aug 2012 #6
Clames Aug 2012 #7
X_Digger Aug 2012 #11
Simo 1939_1940 Aug 2012 #22
gejohnston Aug 2012 #9
DonP Aug 2012 #12
GreenStormCloud Aug 2012 #14
sarisataka Aug 2012 #23
rDigital Aug 2012 #26

Response to SecularMotion (Original post)

Wed Aug 1, 2012, 06:21 PM

1. Joyce Foundation. Nuff said n/t

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Response to shadowrider (Reply #1)

Wed Aug 1, 2012, 06:29 PM

2. NRA, more than enough said for organisation backing guns and other right wing causes.

Even those who don't belong support NRA, and applaud their sleazy lobbying efforts.

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Response to shadowrider (Reply #1)

Wed Aug 1, 2012, 06:32 PM

3. That's a very lame reply. No facts this time? No statistics?

Remember. your intransigence is what will bring gun restrictions to your door.

You can either work with people or against them.

The NRA loses a peace of it's power every time their is mass killings like what happened twice in Colorado.


A few less right wing Justices and we have a new interpretation of 2A.

Now for more snark from the gun lobby.

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Response to upaloopa (Reply #3)

Wed Aug 1, 2012, 08:13 PM

8. Sorry aint going to happen

 

Its very rare for a USSC to over turn a ruling once stari decise (sp)? has been settled.

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Response to Missycim (Reply #8)

Thu Aug 2, 2012, 11:05 AM

17. Stare Decisis NT

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Response to Callisto32 (Reply #17)

Thu Aug 2, 2012, 11:14 AM

19. Thanks

 

spell check failed me

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Response to Missycim (Reply #19)

Thu Aug 2, 2012, 03:31 PM

24. Legal latin can be like that.

Believe me, the only reason my docs aren't all read squigglies is because I spent law school adding all the stupid legal words to my spellcheck dictionary.

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Response to upaloopa (Reply #3)

Wed Aug 1, 2012, 09:04 PM

10. The NRA loses a peace(sic) of it's power every time their(sic) is mass killings

 

Every time some authoritarian politician starts talking about gun bans gun sales got through the roof and the NRA gets more members

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Response to upaloopa (Reply #3)

Thu Aug 2, 2012, 12:34 AM

13. I think you mean more anti-gun activist justices.

Hopefully, any progressive justices we get will respect the original intent of the amendment, and not the sham the gun control lobby would have us believe.

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Response to upaloopa (Reply #3)

Thu Aug 2, 2012, 04:40 AM

15. Intransigence is what reduced *you* lot to political near-irrelevance. It works, and works well.

You want compromise? Fine. What are YOU prepared to give up?


You also forget that the NRA has only four million members- but their are eighty million gun owners in the US, and they vote at quite a high rate.

To think the NRA and the Republicans exclusively drive gun politics is a strategic error gun prohibitionists (and you ARE prohibitionists, despite the honeyed words you offer when
you think we've forgotten your history) seem intent on committing over and over again...

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Response to upaloopa (Reply #3)

Thu Aug 2, 2012, 11:31 AM

20. "your intransigence is what will bring gun restrictions to your door."

Sooo... Our refusal to willingly submit to more control is what will instigate that control. Is that it?

If that's true (and I don't believe it is) then we're fucked either way so you'll understand if I decline to willingly stick my head in that proverbial noose.


"I mean to misbehave."
~ Malcolm Reynolds

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Response to shadowrider (Reply #1)

Thu Aug 2, 2012, 06:28 AM

16. Typical RW rebuttal: Don't like the facts? Attack the source!

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Response to baldguy (Reply #16)

Thu Aug 2, 2012, 11:13 AM

18. its funny you should say that,

 

if someone posts a story from a right leaning paper you attack the source, so I guess whats good for the goose....

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Response to baldguy (Reply #16)

Thu Aug 2, 2012, 11:58 AM

21. Says the guy who derides any non-VPC source

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Response to baldguy (Reply #16)

Thu Aug 2, 2012, 05:42 PM

25. Something about pot, kettle. Hold on, I'm thinking n/t

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Response to baldguy (Reply #16)

Fri Aug 3, 2012, 08:45 PM

27. More lies, damned lies and statistics NT

 

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Response to SecularMotion (Original post)

Wed Aug 1, 2012, 07:43 PM

4. A poll that shows public sentiment on the issue of guns..



http://www.gallup.com/poll/123596/in-u.s.-record-low-support-stricter-gun-laws.aspx

Also election results tend to bear this out as well...

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Response to virginia mountainman (Reply #4)

Wed Aug 1, 2012, 07:49 PM

5. I guess you missed this

While public opinion polling by Gallup has shown decreasing support for "stricter gun laws," other polls show that Americans overwhelmingly support specific gun policy solutions.

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Response to SecularMotion (Reply #5)

Wed Aug 1, 2012, 07:54 PM

6. Bob Shrum said recently...

You can debate the reasons for the change in public opinion; remember though, that those who favored modestly tougher restrictions paid a political price even when they apparently were on the safe side of the electorate. Advocates of gun control plainly arenít there now


And he would know, he watched from the inside, as several election cycles "go away" because of gun control.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/07/24/for-obama-romney-and-america-gun-control-is-dead.html

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Response to SecularMotion (Reply #5)

Wed Aug 1, 2012, 07:55 PM

7. What other polls?

 

You mean the ones tailored by the Brady Campaign or MAIG? Credibility: you still don't have it.

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Response to Clames (Reply #7)

Wed Aug 1, 2012, 09:58 PM

11. ..by republican Frank Luntz, whose motto is, "It's not what you say, it's what people hear." n/t

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Response to SecularMotion (Reply #5)

Thu Aug 2, 2012, 12:01 PM

22. Thanks for making one of your very rare appearances in "conversations" you've started. NT

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Response to SecularMotion (Original post)

Wed Aug 1, 2012, 08:48 PM

9. the Kochs of gun control

complete with echo chamber, funding "research" and funding "constitutional scholarship" The use the same model as the right wing billionaires who fund the think tanks, buy bulk books to put scribblings by the likes of Ann Coulter on the best seller lists, and fund climate science denial.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joyce_Foundation#Organizations_funded_by_the_Joyce_Foundation

I am not saying they are the same ideologically or any such thing. They just use the same propaganda model, just not as sophisticated or as well funded as the Kochs.

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Response to SecularMotion (Original post)

Wed Aug 1, 2012, 11:01 PM

12. Who'd know more about the myths of gun violence than the Joyce Foundation?

With the millions of $ they keep spending on failed gun control organizations and research, they should be experts on myths.

Hey, it's election season, shouldn't they be launching the new American Hunters & Sportsman's Association for this year?

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Response to SecularMotion (Original post)

Thu Aug 2, 2012, 01:21 AM

14. Let's take a closer look at those myths and rebuttals.

From your link:
Myth: There is decreasing public support for policy solutions to curb gun violence.

Fact: The majority of Americans support common-sense measures to prevent gun violence. For example, 86% of Americans support a measure requiring all gun buyers to pass a criminal background check, while 63% of Americans support a measure banning military-style assault weapons. In fact, even 74% of NRA members and 87% of non-NRA gun owners support requiring criminal background checks of anyone purchasing a gun. While public opinion polling by Gallup has shown decreasing support for "stricter gun laws," other polls show that Americans overwhelmingly support specific gun policy solutions.


The NRA does not oppose background checks. In fact the NRA helped design the NICS system and the legislation. Intrastate private sales are not in the perview of the federal government and is a state issue. Private sellers can't use the NICS system due to privacy issues.

Myth: All we need to do is enforce the laws already on the books.

Fact: Gun enforcement is critical, and law enforcement agrees. But even law enforcement believes that enforcement, without stronger laws, is not enough. The guns and ammunition used by the suspect in the Aurora shooting were all legally purchased under current law Ė including a military-style assault weapon and 6,000 rounds of ammunition. Thatís because existing gun laws are riddled with loopholes and gaps. For example, a 1994 law that banned the sale of military-style assault rifles was allowed to expire in 2004.


The 1994 AWB did not ban assault weapons. It merely banned some minor cosmetic features on some guns. That the Batman killer had 6,000 rounds of ammo is irrelevant. He fired only about 100. The other 5,900 did nothing.

Myth: Guns donít kill people Ė people kill people.

Fact: The Harvard Injury Control Research Center has accumulated a considerable body of evidence about the relationship between gun availability and gun violence, concluding that more guns means more gun murders and more gun suicides.

In the past ten year about 100 million new guns have been sold, yet the murder rate continues to drop.

Myth: Americaís gun laws donít work.

Fact: There is plenty of research that demonstrates the effectiveness of a wide range of gun laws, including laws restricting access to guns by domestic violence perpetrators, laws regulating the oversight of gun dealers, and laws regulating gun permits.

That depends upon which laws are being discussed. Some laws work, some don't.

Myth: Gun ownership is on the rise and guns are everywhere.

Fact: Actually, gun ownership is significantly in decline in America, according to the General Social Survey, one of the leading sources of data in social science research. A vast majority of the American public do not own firearms.

Other Duers have previously posted other studies that show gun ownership to be rising.

Myth: If a member of the audience during the Aurora shooting were armed, tragedy could have been prevented.

Fact: There is no credible evidence that the carrying of hidden, loaded weapons decreases crime.

The Joyce Foundation is trying to dodge the question. The "myth" is not about the effect of CCW on crime, but on whether or not an armed citien might have been able to stop the carnage. There have been several mass shootings that have been stopped by armed citizens, and there have been crimes that have been stopped by armed citizens. There is a current thread about an old guy that helped the police in a shoot-out with a murderer. The old geezer (I can use that word. I am a geezer myself.) hit the bad guy five shots out of five at 165 yards with a handgun.

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Response to SecularMotion (Original post)

Thu Aug 2, 2012, 12:54 PM

23. Hello Captain Obvious

The Harvard Injury Control Research Center has accumulated a considerable body of evidence about the relationship between gun availability and gun violence, concluding that more guns means more gun murders and more gun suicides


This is the evidence for gun control???
It is like saying they discovered water is wet. I am curious, did they locate any instances of gun murders and gun suicides that did not involve a gun?

I can do a study that shows the link between alcohol availability and alcohol abuse. I will conclude more alcohol leads to more alcohol related crime and death.
So lets bring back prohibition...


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Response to SecularMotion (Original post)

Fri Aug 3, 2012, 08:42 PM

26. Joyce Foundation = Gun prohibitionists NT

 

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