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Thu Jan 24, 2013, 12:46 AM

Tricky situation: Doorbell, open, burglars, elderly residents, solution to GET A GUN?

In my hometown there was a recent home invasion robbery: "Police said a brazen home-invasion robbery of a couple in their 70s on Monday started with a knock at the door around 6:50 p.m., followed by two or three men in their 20s bursting into the Almaden Valley residence waving knives and tying up their victims before ransacking the house and fleeing in their vehicles."

The top comment? "A little 2nd Amendment medicine might have been helpful to the home owner."

I posted a response: "So how do you expect two elderly people to retrieve their weapons for self-defense in an ambush home invasion, if they locked their weapon in a safe for instance? Or should they have carried their guns with them at all times in the home?"

Someone else responded: "At least armed, there is an option, even if they aren't able to use it."

I then responded: "I'm just pointing out how ridiculous it is to blurt out "SECOND AMENDMENT" in response to stories like this one. So people should carry a gun in a holster EVEN IN THEIR OWN HOME in case of a break-in or in this case, responding to a doorbell only to encounter robbers?"

13 replies, 1565 views

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Reply Tricky situation: Doorbell, open, burglars, elderly residents, solution to GET A GUN? (Original post)
alp227 Jan 2013 OP
NYC_SKP Jan 2013 #1
Eleanors38 Jan 2013 #13
holdencaufield Jan 2013 #2
alp227 Jan 2013 #4
safeinOhio Jan 2013 #5
holdencaufield Jan 2013 #6
safeinOhio Jan 2013 #7
holdencaufield Jan 2013 #9
safeinOhio Jan 2013 #11
iiibbb Jan 2013 #12
iiibbb Jan 2013 #3
bubbayugga Jan 2013 #8
virginia mountainman Jan 2013 #10

Response to alp227 (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 01:01 AM

1. Stupid of them to respond that way.

I see nothing in the story to indicate that they'd have had any chance to use a weapon had there been one available, and as you point out it would have to be pretty much in their hands.

It's a scary thing, in any event, and I feel badly for them.

You don't get over a thing like that, a break in while you're home.

That's like being in a war.

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Response to NYC_SKP (Reply #1)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 04:40 PM

13. Hence the expression HyperPunk: those who break-in while you're home, because they get off.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 01:51 AM

2. The answer to this situation ...

 

... is what any defence expert will tell you. Do NOT have just one option to possible home invasion / break-in.

Home defence should be in layers.

1. Secure door / door frame and locks on all entrances. No one should be able to push their way in through your door without tools. Glass doors, or windows around your door frame a bad idea from a security point of view. Ground floor or easily accessible 2nd floor windows should be barred.

2. Video door monitor -- peep holes will let the assailant know you are standing by the door. Answer the door remotely by video and if you don't recognize the person, don't answer the door.

3. Have a next level plan. A determined assailant will eventually be able to gain access. Have a room, typically a room with few exterior windows, with a solid wood door (not the modern honeycomb doors), a reinforced frame and a deadbolt that can be operated from the inside. If there are windows, make sure you have opaque curtains that will prevent an assailant from seeing you in the room. Inside this room, have a mobile phone on charge -- with 911 on speed dial -- and your gun safe and ammunition. Do not leave firearms outside this room unless you want to arm your assailant.

If your first perimeter is breached (or if you suspect it will be) retreat to that room, lock the door, call 911, retrieve your weapon and hunker down. Stay on the line with 911 as they will tell you the status of responding officers and when they are in your home. Make sure you inform 911 that you are armed and they will pass that information to the responding officer.

Do not venture from that safe room until you have been assured by 911 that the officers are on your premises and have secured the situation. Do not go seeking the assailants or attempting to confront them.

If, and only if, your 2nd perimeter is breached before officers arrive, will you use your firearm and if you do -- check your target before engaging and do not attempt a wounding shot.

There is not single answer to a home intrusion scenario -- the only answer is preparation.

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Response to holdencaufield (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 02:07 AM

4. +1, great answer!

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Response to holdencaufield (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 05:49 AM

5. Blame the victims?

When I suggested the same thing a year ago, folks on this forum said that is what I was doing for suggesting a lack of home security.

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Response to safeinOhio (Reply #5)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 05:52 AM

6. A firearm can be a vital part ...

 

... of a home security program. But, it isn't the only one. A gun by itself only helps if you have it in your hand when it's needed and how can you guarantee that?

I think where people take umbrage is when someone (not saying you) says "You can't have a gun, get a dog" or "You can't have a gun, move to a more safe neighbourhood" -- both replies I've seen here.



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Response to holdencaufield (Reply #6)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:00 AM

7. That is what I've always said, along with

it should, always, be the last option.

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Response to safeinOhio (Reply #7)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:27 AM

9. I doubt very few sane people would disagree with you.

 

However, not all crime happens at home. Which is why I support allowing people the option to carry.

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Response to holdencaufield (Reply #9)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 08:10 AM

11. I guess these folks, just a few of them

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Response to safeinOhio (Reply #11)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 09:52 AM

12. ...boy that saying sure cuts both ways...

 

What you're both talking about is the impossibility to predict how any situation is going to play out.


And I'll be the first to say a gun is not for everyone.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 01:57 AM

3. This is the quandry, and why a gun is a personal choice...

 

.... a gun may help; it may help in certain circumstances.

.... a gun may hurt; it may hurt in certain circumstances.

... a gun is also the last thing in a long line of things you do for self protection.

it doesn't guarantee anything either way; as something for protection it is a personal choice. All I insist on is the option.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:11 AM

8. They never should have opened the door.

 

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 06:34 AM

10. Past Dark, unexpected "guests" are always greeted at the door armed..

I will drop my CCW pistol, which resides loaded (when I am at home, and up and about), on top of the microwave into my pocket as I go to the door. I never open the door right away, I carefully judge the situation. for example If someone is broke down, I ask a number and call someone for them. I would also not be lying that I do, "give the person" a good once over, for cues of their intent...Body language, manner of dress, and other tell tell signs that they may be up to no good. for example..

A person, be it a man or woman, with small kids, will get the "come on in" treatment.

A young man that has an "aggressive stance" along with rag tag clothes may very well get the same in return.

A person in rag tag clothes, and a "non-threatening stance" will get the "wait a moment" till i get my shoes on, and I will go out side to investigate.

Several years ago (about 15), I had a very "rag tag" and very "redneck" young couple (about 18) try to "bully" me into letting them in a 2 AM, they started to PUSH their way into my home, I was looking out a cracked door, with my left hand holding a 12 gauge behind the door, when he threw his body against the door, and it swung back I brought a pump shot gun to bear right in his chest..... Their eyes crossed very hard on the barrel of that pump 12 gauge that I used to keep just for such an situation. I still think their eyes are crossed to this day. To say the least, the threat ended instantly.. I did not need to say a single word, besides the NO that I said before he decided that they where coming in anyway.

Realize that for me to call the Sheriffs office, it is a long distance phone call, and my county is roughly 500 SQ miles, and at night their is only about 4 deputies for the whole county. ...It took an hour for a deputy to respond that night...

My wife (Who was on maternity leave) also met a very confused drunk at 3AM with a "so called assault rifle" in her hands in our kitchen... He promptly and forcefully defecated and pissed his pants, and begged for mercy on the floor until the police showed up, again, about an hour later. I was working 50 miles away at the time, and the cop beat me home by about 10 minutes. He almost ended up shot, had he not hit the floor on his own, when he saw her standing their, SHE would have put him on the floor herself.

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