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Sat Oct 27, 2012, 12:59 PM

Had to do something today

I've never done before. I went to the grocery store and some boys were outside fund raising...I said I would catch them on my way out.
As I left the store I stopped at the table, but the boys had been replaced by a father. It was the Boy Scouts...I have always supported them in the past, but today I said to the father, "I'm sorry but even though I have always done so in the past I can't donate to your organization any longer because of your exclusionary policies" He was very nice, said he respected my position and we bid each other a pleasant day. It felt so strange to not drop a few bucks into the coffers, but I just couldn't in good conscience do so.

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Arrow 16 replies Author Time Post
Reply Had to do something today (Original post)
Sekhmets Daughter Oct 2012 OP
fightthegoodfightnow Oct 2012 #1
Sekhmets Daughter Oct 2012 #2
fightthegoodfightnow Oct 2012 #3
Sekhmets Daughter Oct 2012 #4
fightthegoodfightnow Oct 2012 #5
Sekhmets Daughter Oct 2012 #6
fightthegoodfightnow Oct 2012 #7
Sekhmets Daughter Oct 2012 #8
fightthegoodfightnow Oct 2012 #9
Sekhmets Daughter Oct 2012 #10
fightthegoodfightnow Oct 2012 #11
thjudd81 Nov 2012 #12
Sekhmets Daughter Nov 2012 #13
thjudd81 Nov 2012 #14
Victor_c3 Nov 2012 #15
Sekhmets Daughter Nov 2012 #16

Response to Sekhmets Daughter (Original post)

Sat Oct 27, 2012, 07:43 PM

1. Standing Up and Speaking Out is the Best Lesson You Can Give

Thank you for speaking out. As an Eagle Scout, who decades ago lived and breathed Scouting, I grew up and found my voice as a gay man. I hope one day, a new generation will transform the Boy Scouts into an organization worthy of respect. They stand in sharp contrast to the Girls Scouts who long ago took a stand against homophobia.

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Response to fightthegoodfightnow (Reply #1)

Sat Oct 27, 2012, 08:02 PM

2. No thanks are necessary :-)

If all Americans would stand up and protect the rights of others we would be a better nation for it. My son was never a scout but my daughters were brownies for a few years...until Brownie Camp and an outhouse grossed them out so badly they vowed never to attend another meeting!

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Response to Sekhmets Daughter (Reply #2)

Sat Oct 27, 2012, 09:16 PM

3. Too funny!

I agree completely and I am just as certain your kids will grow up knowing how to find their own voice. And yes, thanks is not only necessary but deserved.

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Response to fightthegoodfightnow (Reply #3)

Sat Oct 27, 2012, 09:55 PM

4. My children are grown

Daughter is 33 son just turned 30....we lost our middle child three years ago, she would be 31 now. They are self-assured and comfortable in their own heterosexual skins...so they have no hangups about homosexuality whatsoever. They have gay and lesbian friends and find any type of bigotry revolting. They're neat adults who make their mama very proud. The only reason I posted anything about today's episode was because it felt so strange to not donate to the Boy Scouts...I've been giving to them for 30-40 years...and I almost did today, out of habit, until I remembered just how hypocritically bigoted is the organization. Not only excluding gay boys but protecting pedophiles...it's like the catholic church in khaki and badges.

You keep fighting the good fight...you will win eventually and when you do we all win.

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Response to Sekhmets Daughter (Reply #4)

Sat Oct 27, 2012, 10:13 PM

5. With Your Help!

Sorry to hear of your loss. I know, like so many gay men of my generation, how loss can consume you. I wish I could say it gets better but the only comfort I can offer is she lives with you today....as does your memory of her with me. And it sounds like you have reason to be proud of your other children.

As for giving to the Boy Scouts, I think you are. I think the biggest gift you can give them is to set them 'straight'.....no pun intended.

Thanks for your support.

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Response to fightthegoodfightnow (Reply #5)

Sat Oct 27, 2012, 11:04 PM

6. I shall share with you

the secret of my solace.... By the time we lost Tiana my head had already won the struggle with my heart and I had accepted that there is no god who listens or cares. I love the science programs that you find on television like "How the Universe Works" and "The Universe." Watching those programs taught me that Einstein's E=MC (squared) means that all matter and energy are finite and interchangeable. Matter is never destroyed, it is simply converted to energy. I also learned that we are made of stardust, literally. Thus when she died she never left me at all...she is all around me as free as the breeze as eternal as the waves she loved so much.

I lost a brother in Vietnam in 1969 and watched my mother mourn him for 35 years until her own death in 2004. She tortured herself with worries about his soul and the usual BS religious people worry about, all the while telling you they are certain their loved ones are in heaven.... I have no such worries. So while I miss her crazy laugh and the incredible generosity of her spirit, I do not grieve. Your loved ones are all around you and if you let your mind go quiet, you'll even feel their presence.

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Response to Sekhmets Daughter (Reply #6)

Sat Oct 27, 2012, 11:17 PM

7. Agree

You write

"...love the science programs that you find on television like "How the Universe Works" and "The Universe." Watching those programs taught me that Einstein's E=MC (squared) means that all matter and energy are finite and interchangeable."


Amazing....I watch those same programs and feel the same way.....although I have come to a different conclusion. I don't think faith and science are in conflict. One of the reasons I love the movie "Contact" is because both sides of the 'conflict' are seeking the same thing...the truth and the meaning of life.

As for your mother's dogma about religion, I suspect you have a view of the world and our existence that far exceeds hers.

Matter converting to energy and living with us is far more 'spiritual' than your Mom worrying about her son's soul.

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Response to fightthegoodfightnow (Reply #7)

Sun Oct 28, 2012, 12:29 AM

8. It's not a matter of faith and science being in conflict...I gave up my attempts at faith before I

discovered the universe.... And I'm not a spiritual person, at least I don't believe I am. Matter and energy are interchangeable, that is not spiritual but scientific fact.

I find most religious teachings offensive. As a very young child I learned the story of Job in Sunday School. Are you familiar with it? God allows Satan to afflict Jobs with all kinds of sorrows including the death of his children. The happy ending comes about when Job refuses to turn against God and is rewarded with new riches and new children...not his resurrected first children, but new ones. I was horrified by that. I remember asking my mother if she wouldn't be angry with God for taking us and replacing us with other children...she of course had no answer for that....That was the beginning of the end for me...and I was maybe 6 or 7. It took decades but I finally accepted that man created god in his image....and he's not such a great model. That acceptance has brought me much peace...more than I ever found in religion.

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Response to Sekhmets Daughter (Reply #8)

Sun Oct 28, 2012, 12:35 AM

9. Hhhmmm

Well, if you are thinking about how our atoms, our energy and our matter are interchangeable, I respectfully suggest you are more spiritual than you admit. I don't necessarily equate that spirituality with organized religion or Christianity. Your views are far more mind boggling and I take spiritual comfort in it.

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Response to fightthegoodfightnow (Reply #9)

Sun Oct 28, 2012, 12:50 AM

10. I shall defer to your superior knowledge of spirituality :-)

And, I am happy to have given you spiritual comfort! I'm off to my bed. It has been delightful chatting with you.

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Response to Sekhmets Daughter (Reply #10)

Sun Oct 28, 2012, 12:56 AM

11. You too!

Thanks....but I wouldn't characterize my 'knowledge' as superior. I appreciate the chat and of course your support for equality!!!!!

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Response to Sekhmets Daughter (Original post)

Thu Nov 1, 2012, 12:54 AM

12. A true American.

Thanks for standing up for what is right and just.

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Response to thjudd81 (Reply #12)

Thu Nov 1, 2012, 08:34 AM

13. No thanks are necessary...

It is the responsibility of all right thinking people to speak out in whatever ways we can.

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Response to Sekhmets Daughter (Reply #13)

Fri Nov 2, 2012, 01:14 AM

14. <3

Still.. Thanks where thanks is due!

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Response to Sekhmets Daughter (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 05:48 AM

15. I used to be a cub scout

I believe that the cub scouts and boy scouts can provide a lot of valuable experiences and life lessons to our children. However, I hate its connection to conservatism and the blatant homophobia that invariably goes with it.

I just don't understand how or why any organization dealing with our children can or should become political. I feel badly for not donating to the scouts because of their politics as it is the children who suffer as a result of their parent's politics. I look at their core values (google cub scout values) and the stance on the LGBT community just doesn't jive with they say their values are. I sure hope their mentality changes in the near future.

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Response to Victor_c3 (Reply #15)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 08:33 AM

16. Exactly....

I was so happy the boys had left the table and that I was able to say what I had to say to just the father. Perhaps if more people have that opportunity, those parents will push for change within the organization. If not, the organization will go the way of the republican party...

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