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Wed Dec 12, 2012, 05:43 PM

EU: Lieberman's Holocaust reference is inappropriate and offensive to Europeans


European Union foreign policy chief Catherine Ashton condemned the comments made by Foreign Minister Avigdor Lieberman, in which he compared the EU's policy toward Israel to the behavior of Europe toward the Jews during the period of the Holocaust.
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In an interview to Israel Radio on Tuesday, Lieberman was asked to react to the EU foreign ministers’ decision on Monday to condemn Israel for advancing the plan to build in E-1.

In reply, the foreign minister launched into a fierce, and perhaps, unprecedented attack on the EU. “I can tell you what I am not satisfied with,” said Lieberman. “I am not satisfied with the position of Europe, which once again in history is ignoring calls to destroy the state of Israel ... Europe is keeping silent. The call yesterday , what we saw, is not a condemnation of Hamas' statements but rather a call to the heads of Hamas to refrain from incitement. We have already been through this with Europe at the end of the 1930s and in the 1940s.”

The radio interviewer asked Lieberman whether he is accusing the EU of anti-Semitism. “It isn’t an anti-Semitic motive but rather it’s a narrow motive of interests,” replied Lieberman. “They are sacrificing all values in favor of interests. Then too, back in the 1940s. They already knew by the start of the 1940s exactly what was happening in the concentration camps, what was happening with the Jews and didn’t exactly act. Today they admit that even in the 1930s they prevented Jews for coming to the land of Israel.”

http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/eu-lieberman-s-holocaust-reference-is-inappropriate-and-offensive-to-europeans.premium-1.484438#



32 replies, 3020 views

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Arrow 32 replies Author Time Post
Reply EU: Lieberman's Holocaust reference is inappropriate and offensive to Europeans (Original post)
azurnoir Dec 2012 OP
Alamuti Lotus Dec 2012 #1
King_David Dec 2012 #2
azurnoir Dec 2012 #4
King_David Dec 2012 #6
azurnoir Dec 2012 #7
King_David Dec 2012 #8
azurnoir Dec 2012 #9
King_David Dec 2012 #10
azurnoir Dec 2012 #23
King_David Dec 2012 #27
azurnoir Dec 2012 #28
Scootaloo Dec 2012 #3
Purveyor Dec 2012 #13
LeftishBrit Dec 2012 #5
Scootaloo Dec 2012 #15
Violet_Crumble Dec 2012 #18
holdencaufield Dec 2012 #11
azurnoir Dec 2012 #12
Scootaloo Dec 2012 #14
holdencaufield Dec 2012 #16
Scootaloo Dec 2012 #17
geek tragedy Dec 2012 #19
geek tragedy Dec 2012 #20
holdencaufield Dec 2012 #21
geek tragedy Dec 2012 #22
holdencaufield Dec 2012 #25
geek tragedy Dec 2012 #29
holdencaufield Dec 2012 #30
geek tragedy Dec 2012 #31
bemildred Dec 2012 #24
azurnoir Dec 2012 #26
geek tragedy Dec 2012 #32

Response to azurnoir (Original post)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 09:00 PM

1. "inappropriate and offensive" is the guy's cornerstone, that's the business plan

 

It's part of why I like him so much; almost nobody discredits his cause more than he does. People like him don't seem to notice that the more that a person shrieks and flings poo, the less anybody cares about the asshole it came out of.

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Response to azurnoir (Original post)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 11:38 PM

2. 'not a condemnation of Hamas' statements but rather a call to the heads of Hamas .....

''not a condemnation of Hamas' statements but rather a call to the heads of Hamas to refrain from incitement''

Hes right there , Hamas should of been condemned like never before.

What Meshal said was hate hate hate.


http://www.memritv.org/clip/en/3671.htm

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Response to King_David (Reply #2)

Thu Dec 13, 2012, 01:15 AM

4. did you make that quote up so you could post that video?

'translated' for us by MEMRI (an organization founded by 'former' mossad and shin bet agents) ?

here is what the article really said

"Europe's commitment to Israel's security cannot be questioned," she said. "This was reiterated in the Council conclusions on Monday, as was our condemnation of inflammatory statements by Hamas leaders that deny Israel's right to exist."


really depending on that pay wall huh?

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Response to azurnoir (Reply #4)

Thu Dec 13, 2012, 06:16 PM

6. No i didn't nt

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Response to King_David (Reply #6)

Thu Dec 13, 2012, 06:27 PM

7. so can you pull it from the article for us no not just that sentence but the paragraph it appears in

along with cites?

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Response to azurnoir (Reply #7)

Thu Dec 13, 2012, 07:09 PM

8. in your OP ....

'Europe is keeping silent. The call yesterday , what we saw, is not a condemnation of Hamas' statements but rather a call to the heads of Hamas to refrain from incitement. We have already been through this with Europe at the end of the 1930s and in the 1940s.”

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Response to King_David (Reply #8)

Thu Dec 13, 2012, 07:22 PM

9. not what you quoted and debunked in any event

so in reality it was an excuse to post an OT video which you had also posted in a thread you promptly self deleted

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Response to azurnoir (Reply #9)

Thu Dec 13, 2012, 07:33 PM

10. Explain ? nt

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Response to King_David (Reply #10)

Fri Dec 14, 2012, 03:00 PM

23. here

http://www.democraticunderground.com/113425569

both are MEMRI videos and to be honest it is hard for me to tell one antiPalestinian video from another

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Response to azurnoir (Reply #23)

Fri Dec 14, 2012, 05:51 PM

27. antiPalistinian ?

That's offensive .

Please refrain from labeling all Palestinians as Hamas or terrorists ... It's offensive!

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Response to King_David (Reply #27)

Fri Dec 14, 2012, 06:05 PM

28. clever not as Hamas is Palestinian

but it is indeed nice to know you differentiate between the two

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Response to azurnoir (Original post)

Thu Dec 13, 2012, 01:05 AM

3. Oh look, a Kahanist belittling the Holocaust and using those dead and gone as political props

Stout words from a man who's been compared to Jean-Marie le Pen and Jörg Haider... by Marty Peretz, for fuck's sake.

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Response to Scootaloo (Reply #3)

Thu Dec 13, 2012, 11:44 PM

13. Indeed! eom

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Response to azurnoir (Original post)

Thu Dec 13, 2012, 01:30 PM

5. Practically everything that Lieberman says or does is inappropriate and offensive to just about

everyone.

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Response to LeftishBrit (Reply #5)

Fri Dec 14, 2012, 12:15 AM

15. Except Israeli voters, it seems

Given that "Likud Beitinu" is poised to sweep the elections.

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Response to LeftishBrit (Reply #5)

Fri Dec 14, 2012, 03:13 AM

18. That's so clearly not true

All it takes is reading this thread to notice that

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Response to azurnoir (Original post)

Thu Dec 13, 2012, 07:58 PM

11. I'm sorry if EU Bureaucrats find mention of the Holocaust offensive.

 

It wasn't much of a picnic for the Jews who lived through it either.

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Response to holdencaufield (Reply #11)

Thu Dec 13, 2012, 11:42 PM

12. it was the manner in which it was mentioned that was offensive

but it seems you approve of Yvet's approach

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Response to holdencaufield (Reply #11)

Fri Dec 14, 2012, 12:08 AM

14. No, it certainly wasn't

But of course, Avigdor Lieberman was born in 1958. He's not among those people who lived through those horrors. But he still feels that he is privileged enough to use it as a plaything, a trivial little talking-point. Something to lob out casually to score some points against a condemnation of Hamas he doesn't personally feel is worded strongly enough.

No, it wasn't a picnic for the Jews who lived through it. But I don't think Mr. Lieberman is actually aware of that.

Maybe you should take umbrage at the guy who treats the Holocaust like "Shoahgate," some weekly tabloid scandal, instead of the people who are telling him that it's in no way acceptable that he has done so?

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Response to Scootaloo (Reply #14)

Fri Dec 14, 2012, 12:37 AM

16. I believe Minister Lieberman has a point ...

 

... given the huge amount of Jewish blood Europe (which includes his home country of Russia) has on its collective hands -- not just from the Holocaust but for nearly 2,000 years of violently anti-semitic policies.

Given that history, the EU is in no position to provide any moral authority where Jewish lives are at risk and should definitely not be taking sides in a conflict that involves Jews. Condemning Israel while being conspicuously silent about those who actively seek to kill Jewish civilians is a cheque that Europe has not moral capital to cash.

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Response to holdencaufield (Reply #16)

Fri Dec 14, 2012, 01:55 AM

17. Yes, I know you do.

You think it makes sense to hold a British woman born in 1956 responsible for the atrocities committed by the Nazis in the 30's and 40's, because ermagerd, the UK is part of Europe! By this logic, Avigdor Lieberman is just as responsible for the Holocaust and for the Gulags, being not just European himself, but also Soviet.

Do you also think using the Holocaust as a toy, a trivial plaything to trot out every single time you don't get your way, is a respectful approach to the mass destruction of humanity it represents? After all, that's what Lieberman's doing, and you think he has a point. Don't get the resolution you want in the UN? It's just like the Holocaust. Don't get a free pass on violating international treaties you signed? Gosh, that's what Auschwitz must have felt like. Run out of peanut butter? Just one more thing you have in common with Anne Frank, I guess! If you can't fathom why this is vile, well... you have no room to be talking about who has what "moral capital"

Lieberman has no point, he's simply making an especially grotesque attempt at the Chewbacca Defense. Don't carry water for him, it makes you look bad.

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Response to Scootaloo (Reply #17)

Fri Dec 14, 2012, 10:32 AM

19. No, let the people who agree with the racist Moldovan gangster out themselves. nt

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Response to holdencaufield (Reply #16)

Fri Dec 14, 2012, 10:34 AM

20. But the EU should fork over aid and trade privileges, right?

Standard Israeli response to criticism--stay out of our affairs (unless you're writing us a check!).

Reminds me of 13-year old girls who demand that mom stay out of their lives, unless they need ride to the mall.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #20)

Fri Dec 14, 2012, 11:36 AM

21. In fact ...

 

... the EU is the largest contributor of AID to the Palestinians at this point.

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Response to holdencaufield (Reply #21)

Fri Dec 14, 2012, 12:43 PM

22. Palestinians need it a great deal more than the affluent Israelis do. nt

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #22)

Fri Dec 14, 2012, 04:33 PM

25. Yes ...

 

... those five-star hotels in Gaza for visiting dignitaries aren't going to build themselves.

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Response to holdencaufield (Reply #25)

Fri Dec 14, 2012, 06:23 PM

29. Oy, serves me right for debating Likudniks. nt

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #29)

Fri Dec 14, 2012, 07:04 PM

30. Especially when you have no case

 

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Response to holdencaufield (Reply #30)

Fri Dec 14, 2012, 07:05 PM

31. If you need a case to be made that the Palestinians are in more need

of economic aid than the Israelis, you are ignorant, willfully or otherwise.

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Response to azurnoir (Original post)

Fri Dec 14, 2012, 04:15 PM

24. Do Holocaust comparisons amount to Nazi comparisons?

The present juxtaposition of Lieberman's Holocaust comparisons and the Nazi/Israeli comparison thread got me thinking about that. Are not Hoiocaust comparisons also Nazi comparisons? Hence also violations of Godwin's Law? I think so, especially where the intent is to insult or cast slurs.

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Response to bemildred (Reply #24)

Fri Dec 14, 2012, 05:33 PM

26. I hadn't thought of that but you're right

however I've been told that it means more when applied to some than when applied to others

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Response to bemildred (Reply #24)

Fri Dec 14, 2012, 07:06 PM

32. IOKIYARWI

It's Okay If You're A Rightwing Israeli

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