HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Topics » Foreign Affairs & National Security » Israel/Palestine (Group) » Brzezinski: U.S. must sto...
Introducing Discussionist: A new forum by the creators of DU

Mon Dec 3, 2012, 01:33 PM

 

Brzezinski: U.S. must stop following Israel “like a stupid mule”

Leading U.S. strategist Zbigniew Brzezinski -- unofficial dean of the realist school of American foreign policy experts -- has drawn an unflattering picture of U.S.-Israel relations.

In a speech to the National Iranian American Council, Brzezinksi said:
“I don’t think there is an implicit obligation for the United States to follow like a stupid mule whatever the Israelis do. If they decide to start a war, simply on the assumption that we’ll automatically be drawn into it, I think it is the obligation of friendship to say, ‘you’re not going to be making national decision for us.’ I think that the United States has the right to have its own national security policy.”

By denying any U.S. “obligation” to “follow like a stupid mule whatever the Israelis do,” Brzezinski accurately implied that this is exactly what the U.S. has been doing up until now. And by plaintively opining that “the United States has the right to have its own national security policy,” the former National Security adviser underlined the fact that since the assassination of John F. Kennedy, who secretly went to war with Ben Gurion in a doomed effort to abort the Israeli nuclear weapons program, the U.S. has not enjoyed that right.

Brzezinski’s assertion that the U.S. is being led by the nose like a stupid mule by the Israelis is perhaps the most candid statement of its kind ever uttered in public by a high-level U.S. strategist. Brzezinski’s remarks reflect the mainstreaming of the arguments presented by leading U.S. political scientists Walt and Mearsheimer in their book The Israel Lobby.

Read more:
http://tehrantimes.com/component/content/article/84-perspectives/103634-brzezinski-us-must-stop-following-israel-like-a-stupid-mule-

27 replies, 2455 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 27 replies Author Time Post
Reply Brzezinski: U.S. must stop following Israel “like a stupid mule” (Original post)
ocpagu Dec 2012 OP
kooljerk666 Dec 2012 #1
1StrongBlackMan Dec 2012 #2
bemildred Dec 2012 #4
Hydra Dec 2012 #15
bemildred Dec 2012 #3
azurnoir Dec 2012 #17
bemildred Dec 2012 #21
azurnoir Dec 2012 #23
bemildred Dec 2012 #24
AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2012 #5
madrchsod Dec 2012 #6
Bok_Tukalo Dec 2012 #7
KimonoGirl Dec 2012 #8
Mosby Dec 2012 #9
shira Dec 2012 #10
Mosby Dec 2012 #11
ocpagu Dec 2012 #12
Mosby Dec 2012 #13
ocpagu Dec 2012 #14
Mosby Dec 2012 #16
kayecy Dec 2012 #19
Shaktimaan Dec 2012 #20
Bad_Ronald Dec 2012 #22
AverageJoe90 Dec 2012 #25
azurnoir Dec 2012 #18
AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2012 #26
DonCoquixote Dec 2012 #27

Response to ocpagu (Original post)

Mon Dec 3, 2012, 01:34 PM

1. agree, with friends like them..................

 

___________________________________________________fill in the blank

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ocpagu (Original post)

Mon Dec 3, 2012, 01:38 PM

2. Where's the Popcorn?

This will not be met well.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #2)

Mon Dec 3, 2012, 01:41 PM

4. Yeah, you are right, this needs popcorn.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #2)

Mon Dec 3, 2012, 04:47 PM

15. I brought some!



I always have plenty these days.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ocpagu (Original post)

Mon Dec 3, 2012, 01:39 PM

3. Oy. nt

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to bemildred (Reply #3)

Mon Dec 3, 2012, 05:35 PM

17. in a word n/t

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to azurnoir (Reply #17)

Tue Dec 4, 2012, 10:48 AM

21. Well: it's Zbig, it's Tehran times, it's antisemitic tropes, and it's incorrect.

And Zbig ought to know it's incorrect, he's been up there running things. But he always was a simple-minded guy.

Anyway, you just don't know where to start.

And yet the underlying idea, that we ought to be firmer with our friend and more mindful of our own and our true mutual interests, I agree with. Bibi is a belligerent idiot, reminds me of Bush the Lesser really, another disrespected 2nd son trying to outdo his older sibling by gritting his teeth harder. Bummer.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to bemildred (Reply #21)

Tue Dec 4, 2012, 05:07 PM

23. True enough Bibi will never be able to live up to the memory of Yonatan

however there's more too it, as LB pointed out long ago the pressure Israel comes under the 'circling of the wagons' (my expression) there will be, I think we sort of saw the same among the US general public at the beginning of Iraq war2, sort of they all hate us, so we must be right and stick to our guns or something

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to azurnoir (Reply #23)

Tue Dec 4, 2012, 05:13 PM

24. You can see the same thing among the Pubbies right now.

Denial and anger, next comes the bargaining.

Edit to add link: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021926753

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ocpagu (Original post)


Response to ocpagu (Original post)

Mon Dec 3, 2012, 01:54 PM

6. what else is new?

if the american taxpayer stopped giving them money for the idf the Israeli citizens would rethink their perpetual war against the palestinians. it`s easy to wage war with an unlimited amount of money.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ocpagu (Original post)

Mon Dec 3, 2012, 02:21 PM

7. I disagree with his assessment

President George H. W. Bush had no problem telling the Israelis to sit down and shut up (as during the First Gulf War) or for them to butt out (as with the reunification of Germany).

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ocpagu (Original post)

Mon Dec 3, 2012, 02:33 PM

8. HELL YES!!

 

Now THIS is what I'm talking about. America needs to wake the f*** up and drop Israel like a bad date from hell.

Drag the world into another damn war just because Israel says so? GTFO.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ocpagu (Original post)

Mon Dec 3, 2012, 02:55 PM

9. nice article, really its perfect for the new DU.

Benjamin Netanyahu’s reaction to 9/11. (He triumphantly chortled that 9/11 was “very good,” then hastily added that he meant it was very good for Israel.)
 
• Ariel Sharon’s reaction to 9/11: “We Jews control America, and the Americans know it.”
 
• Allegedly retired Mossad chief spook Mike Harari’s  huge victory party in Bangkok, Thailand celebrating the success of the 9/11 operation.
 
• The team of “dancing Israelis,” later outed as Mossad spies by The Forward, who were arrested for wildly celebrating the success of the 9/11 operation.
 
• The use of organized crime assets like then-NYC Police Commissioner Bernard Kerik to cover up the 9/11 story of the century: The arrest of Israelis with vans full of explosives trying to blow up New York’s bridges and tunnels on the morning of 9/11.
 
• The actions of newly-retired Israeli Defense Minister Ehud Barak in the immediate aftermath of 9/11: Barak, Christopher Bollyn’s top 9/11 suspect, had come to the U.S. for mysterious reasons after stepping down as PM in March 2001, and immediately after 9/11 all but ordered the U.S. to declare a “war on terror” and invade Afghanistan and other countries – making him the first public figure to describe the “war on terror” response to 9/11.
 
• The Israel lobby’s demolition of the Congressional career of 9/11-truth-seeker Rep. Cynthia McKinney.
 
• The Israel lobby’s persecution of American Muslims including Sami al-Arian, who was imprisoned and tortured for the “terrorist” crime of supporting the Palestinians’ right to defend themselves.
 
• The Israel lobby’s persecution of Christian peacemaker Mark Siljander, who was sent to prison on trumped-up charges for the crime of telling other Christians the truth about Islam, and thereby undermining the Israelis’ islamophobic “war on terror” narrative.
 
• The Israel lobby’s increasing use of its organized crime assets to dominate American politics through blackmail, fraud, drug trafficking, money laundering, assassination, and other crimes.
 
• Israel’s assassination threats against President Obama, notably the one delivered by unregistered Israeli agent Andrew Adler.
 
• Israel’s blatant intervention in U.S. elections, including its use of organized crime in vote-fraud efforts – which may finally have failed in 2012 when Netanyahu imploded at the UN, and his hand-picked puppet Mitt Romney imploded in the final election results.
 
• Israel’s ongoing attempts to drag the U.S. into wars-for-Israel that damage U.S. interests – including wars in Afghanistan, Iraq, Somalia, Pakistan and elsewhere, as well as Israel’s proposed attack on Iran.Israel’s blatant intervention in U.S. elections, including its use of organized crime in vote-fraud efforts – which may finally have failed in 2012 when Netanyahu imploded at the UN, and his hand-picked puppet Mitt Romney imploded in the final election results.
 


Yup, those fucking bloodthirsty zionists control everything.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Mosby (Reply #9)

Mon Dec 3, 2012, 03:03 PM

10. Isn't it nice when progressives eat up BS from Iran's Tehran Times? n/t

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to shira (Reply #10)

Mon Dec 3, 2012, 03:46 PM

11. It's the new normal for DU

Conspiracy theories? Perfectly OK if you can blame "Zionists".

Hate speech? Perfectly OK if you're talking about "Zionists"

Antisemitism? Nope, just talking about "Zionists".

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Mosby (Reply #11)

Mon Dec 3, 2012, 03:51 PM

12. Feel free to abord the main subject of the post.

 

"I don’t think there is an implicit obligation for the United States to follow like a stupid mule whatever the Israelis do. If they decide to start a war, simply on the assumption that we’ll automatically be drawn into it, I think it is the obligation of friendship to say, ‘you’re not going to be making national decision for us.’ I think that the United States has the right to have its own national security policy."

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ocpagu (Reply #12)

Mon Dec 3, 2012, 04:08 PM

13. israel is a good US ally in the ME

Who stopped sadaam from developing nukes? Israel.

Who stopped assad from developing nukes? Israel.

Who are other US allies in the ME and gulf? KSA, Kuwait, Bahrain etc.

We prop up and support these dictatorships and by doing so tacitly support bigotry, racism, misogyny, and religious fundamentalism. Just last week the saudis implemented a GPS based tracking system for women, they are basically treated like cattle, that's our ally!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Mosby (Reply #13)

Mon Dec 3, 2012, 04:23 PM

14. Perhaps the ME countries wouldn't feel the need of having nukes...

 

...if Israel didn't have them.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ocpagu (Reply #14)

Mon Dec 3, 2012, 04:53 PM

16. I'm all for non proliferation

If Iran develops a nuke both saudi arabia and egypt have said they will obtain one also. Egypt is talking shit but SA could absolutely get as many as they want from pakistan.

The wikileaks have made this all very clear, SA does not give a shit about israeli nukes, there only concern is shia Iran.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Mosby (Reply #16)

Tue Dec 4, 2012, 02:24 AM

19. You think that is also true of the Saudi population?..........

SA does not give a shit about israeli nukes, there only concern is shia Iran.

You think that is also true of the Saudi population?..........Even the Saudi autocrats are vulnerable to an Arab Spring uprising.


http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/161593

"According to the report, the U.S. was recently told by several of its allies in the Middle East that they would refuse to get involved in the conflict, not even providing passive assistance, and even if the U.S. was involved – because of fear of the “Arab street” that would probably look unkindly on such assistance, and concern that if the strike was unsuccessful, or only partially succesful, Iran would seek vengeance against them."

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to kayecy (Reply #19)

Tue Dec 4, 2012, 02:41 AM

20. Definitely

SA is terrified of a nuclear Iran flexing its muscles via increased regional influence. Their huge Shia dominated population combined with the tactical military advantages brought by nuclear weapons equates to numerous potential problems for SA and their status amongst regional Arab ME states.

Don't be fooled into thinking that SA's population doesn't fear Iran just because they oppose allying with Israel against fellow Muslims. They're terrified of a nuclear Iran. But they despise Israel far more.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to shira (Reply #10)


Response to shira (Reply #10)

Sat Dec 15, 2012, 04:53 PM

25. There's a few who, sadly, seem to think that PreSS "TV" is a legit media outfit.....

and not a 24/7 "We Hate Jews!" agitprop machine.....

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ocpagu (Original post)

Mon Dec 3, 2012, 05:37 PM

18. odd US media is not reporting this at all maybe the video was a bad translation?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to azurnoir (Reply #18)

Sat Dec 15, 2012, 05:03 PM

26. Operation Mockingbird

 

They say that it has been discontinued.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ocpagu (Original post)

Sat Dec 15, 2012, 05:05 PM

27. Ok Mika

Time for you to follow Joe's orders and slam your daddy.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread