Sun Apr 29, 2012, 08:42 PM
red dog 1 (5,199 posts)
Leaked Video: Live Goats' Legs Cut off By U.S. Military.
A new undercover investigation shows in graphic detail how more than 6,000 goats and pigs are cut apart, shot, and blown-up in military medical training exercises every year.
The Department of Defense says trainers slice open live animals and saw off their limbs in order to train medics in how to treat human injuries. But medical professionals, veterans and advocates counter that this kind of cruelty to animals is no longer necessary -- and is, in fact, counterproductive -- when more effective human-patient simulators can be used instead.
Video footage from the investigation is chilling:..Goats' legs are cut off with garden shears and the goats moan in pain, showing that they have not been adequately anesthetized..But worst of all is knowing that not only is this kind of animal cruelty unnecessary - it could actually make medics less prepared to treat human injuries.
According to Dr.James Santos, a retired Navy Lieutenant Commander and physician, "Compared with humans,... goats and pigs are much smaller..their skin is thicker, and the anatomy of their organs, blood vessels, and skeletons are much different."
These differences can mean that medics actually have to spend time unlearning what they know about effectively treating animals, or waste time translating from animal to human anatomy in the middle of life and death situations. Whereas human-patient simulators breathe, bleed, and even have bones to break - and allow trainees to practice treatments again and again until they get it right and are as prepared as they can be to save real lives.
Dr. Santos started a petition on Change.org calling on Defense Secretary Leon Panetta to eliminate this outdated and unnecessary cruel practice.
View video and petition at
6 replies, 3410 views
Leaked Video: Live Goats' Legs Cut off By U.S. Military. (Original post)
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Response to red dog 1 (Original post)
Sun Apr 29, 2012, 09:50 PM
panopeagenerosa (44 posts)
1. It's called 'goat lab'
In the early 1960s they were using dogs. Strays from the pound etc. until it hit the papers and there was universal horror and revulsion which is when they switched to goats and pigs. All animals are given pain management/anaesthesia and are euthanised immediately after treatment. Or so they told me. They say the barbeques at Ft. Sam Houston are regular thing at the end of the training cycle when the medics eat their patients.
The army is a very conservative organization for a reason, it has a high turnover of personnel even in peacetime (remember that? lol) so tradition is valued as a way of preserving useful technique and skills. If it aint broke, don't fix it.
You're probably right, it's time they started using human simulators but I thought you could use some background in that it was a Vietnam era improvement not some new horror show. Arguable some animals in slaughter houses suffer more for less good reason.
Response to panopeagenerosa (Reply #1)
Mon Apr 30, 2012, 05:07 PM
red dog 1 (5,199 posts)
4. Human-patient simulators are a much better way to train medics.
(From the article)...This kind of animal cruelty is unnecessary.-- it could actually make medics less prepared to treat human injuries.
According to Dr. Santos, "Goats and pigs are much smaller..their skin is much thicker, and the anatomy of their organs, blood vessels, skeletons are drastically different"
These differences can mean that medics actually have to spend time unlearning what they know about effectively treating animals, or waste time translating from animal to human anatomy in the middle of life and death situations.
Whereas human-patient simulators breathe, bleed and even have bones to break--and allow trainees to practice treatments again and again, until they get it right, and are as prepared as they can be to save real lives.
There is absolutely no reason why these animals need to be tortured...and, if you watched the video, it's obvious that they are not always given enough anesthesia
Response to red dog 1 (Reply #3)
Mon Apr 30, 2012, 09:00 PM
LeftyMom (49,057 posts)
5. Slaughterhouses don't kill quickly.
There's no profit in reducing suffering. They're too busy speeding up the line and reducing labor costs to take the time to do so at all effectively, and sometimes they have unsupported notions that doing so is harmful to the slaughter process. Chickens often don't get their necks cut by blades on the line well enough to bleed out before being dipped in scald tanks, cattle facilities often turn down the pressure on captive bolt guns because they believe rendering the animal "too dead" reduces the quality of the resulting meat, pigs often go into scald tanks alive as well, etc.
Read Slaughterhouse. http://www.amazon.com/Slaughterhouse-Shocking-Inhumane-Treatment-Industry/dp/1573921661
Response to LeftyMom (Reply #5)
Tue May 1, 2012, 04:52 PM
red dog 1 (5,199 posts)
6. Thanks for this info....I assumed that the large slaughterhouses followed Dr.Temple Grandin's
"protocol", which minimizes the pain & suffering of the animals; and which supposedly also makes for a more efficient "kill" process for the slaughterhouses.
(Clare Danes starred in the HBO movie about her called "Temple Grandin")
The fact still remains that the U.S. Military does not need to maim and torture live pigs & goats anymore, since human-patient simulators are available now and are much better at teaching medics (for the reasons outlined by Dr Santos in the article)
I hope you and others will consider signing the Change.org petition.
They have more than 60,000 signatures already, and hope to get 75,000 before submitting it to the Secretary of Defense, Leon Panetta.