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Fri Jan 25, 2013, 12:23 AM

Any union delelgates,shop stewards or union organizers here?

I'm preparing for a step 3 meeting with management. Our contention is they didn't use progressive discipline (PD) and terminated the employee unfairly.
In denying the grievance at step 2 they said, (more or less), 'soandso was an experienced employee who has received classes and trainings so we didn't think PD was necessary.
I say bunk! Any experience with this kind of thing, specifically not using PD (which is in the contract).?
Thanks

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Reply Any union delelgates,shop stewards or union organizers here? (Original post)
Dyedinthewoolliberal Jan 2013 OP
elleng Jan 2013 #1
Wellstone ruled Jan 2013 #2
kevinmc Jan 2013 #3
hay rick Jan 2013 #4
LiberalFighter Jan 2013 #5
GrantDem Jan 2013 #6
Omaha Steve Jan 2013 #8
Teamster Jeff Jan 2013 #7

Response to Dyedinthewoolliberal (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 12:32 AM

1. Check Omaha Steve.

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Response to Dyedinthewoolliberal (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 12:53 AM

2. Depends on what state you live in.

If you are in a Right to Work For Less State,that's a rough go. If not stick to the grievance procedures in your bargaining contract. If management decides to push,you hopefully will go to arbitration. Game set match.
Good luck,sounds like this Employer is a real piece of work. This is why Unions are created to have some recourse to bad management.

Where is your Locals General Counsel? This person should be at the Table with you.

Good Luck!!!

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Response to Dyedinthewoolliberal (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 01:35 AM

3. Step 3 isnot easy to win ......

You should be able to show past practice where PD was used instead of termination. Also if this person has a good record ect they should be willing for less punishment or a write up. You have to show how this will cost the company money by training a new person and loss of production. Everyone makes a mistake. Good Luck with Step 3 ..... might have to take it to Arbitration where you would probably have a better chance winning. I was a Steward /Chief Steward at GE for 20years

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Response to Dyedinthewoolliberal (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 10:12 AM

4. Progressive discipline.

If progressive discipline is mandated in your contract, failure to employ progressive discipline would probably be ruled a "fatal defect" in the discipline by an arbitrator.

In our contract (NALC) allowable exceptions to the progressive discipline requirement are itemized- infractions involving crime, theft, drugs, and violence. Any other disciplinary case must meet the requirements of progressive discipline or the discipline is disallowed.

I doubt that management's argument that employee training is a substitute for progressive discipline will be sustained if there is a neutral third party involved.

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Response to Dyedinthewoolliberal (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 11:44 AM

5. Check with your servicing rep or higher up.

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Response to Dyedinthewoolliberal (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 12:05 PM

6. Given the response of the company...

I will assume that there is an existing progressive disciplinary policy in effect.

In the absence of an egregious violation such as fighting, stealing, or something similar arbitrators have typically ruled that the employer must issue at least one level of discipline that allows your member the opportunity to improve or correct his/her behavior.

There are many angles to grievances and each one and its circumstances are unique. With that said the employer's response of "...we didn't think PD was necessary" indicates they have nothing to back their termination.

Also, in a termination case be sure to apply the seven-tests:

1. Notice
2. Reasonable Rules & Orders
3. Investigation
4. Fair Investigation
5. Proof
6. Equal Treatment
7. Penalty

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Response to GrantDem (Reply #6)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 07:10 PM

8. I agree


Sorry it took me so long to get here.

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Response to Dyedinthewoolliberal (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 02:34 PM

7. Good advice above

From the information that you have given it seems like a slam dunk winner (with back pay) in arbitration for the employee. PD is in your contract yet the company ignores it with their best argument being "soandso was an experienced employee who has received classes and trainings so we didn't think PD was necessary".....Really? It should be obvious to the company itself that they will lose this one. I wonder why they would push it this far?

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