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Wed Oct 24, 2012, 01:46 AM

Environmental Groups: Don't Import Natural Gas

By Anita Hofschneider 10/23/2012

Hawaii Gas wants to bring liquefied natural gas to Hawaii to help lower the cost of energy.

But environmental groups oppose the move and are working to prevent it for environmental reasons.

The Sierra Club and the Blue Planet Foundation filed motions with the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission late last week to intervene in the Hawaii gas company's attempt to import the fossil fuel.

Hawaii Gas asked FERC for approval to import LNG in August. The application (pdf) is still pending. The company hopes that natural gas will help improve the state's energy efficiency as well as reduce costs for consumers.

More: http://www.civilbeat.com/articles/2012/10/23/17439-environmental-groups-dont-import-natural-gas/

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Reply Environmental Groups: Don't Import Natural Gas (Original post)
ellisonz Oct 2012 OP
ProgressiveProfessor Oct 2012 #1
ellisonz Oct 2012 #2
ProgressiveProfessor Oct 2012 #3
ellisonz Oct 2012 #4
ProgressiveProfessor Oct 2012 #5
ellisonz Oct 2012 #6

Response to ellisonz (Original post)

Wed Oct 24, 2012, 10:55 AM

1. Another attempt to raise the cost of living so the middle class and poor cannot stay in Hawaii

If rethugs were doing it, that would be the mantra but when its

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Response to ProgressiveProfessor (Reply #1)

Wed Oct 24, 2012, 01:36 PM

2. To be fair...

...unless we dramatically reduce consumption of fossil fuels Hawaii people won't really be able to afford them in the long run.

Let the oil companies show this is better in Court. Do you remember what happened last time a big business tried to jump the legal shark in Hawaii?

There might be an argument made that this would be good for businesses in the transportation industry with vehicle fleets, but they need to show it's an appropriate option with the existing framework of laws.

Are you opposed to the path to clean energy?

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Response to ellisonz (Reply #2)

Wed Oct 24, 2012, 02:01 PM

3. Hawaii was the first place in the US where I saw the American dream breaking down

It has gotten no better since. The poor are pushed further away and in many cases off the island disrupting the extended families that are common. It would be worse if the wealthy did not need bus boys and janitors. They are rapidly becoming the isles of privilege.

The interesting part is that it is not just the poor who are leaving. Checkout where your high school classmates are living on a percentage basis. How many Punahou/Iolani grads stayed there? What about Kaimuki or Kalihi? Even the children of the well to do are bailing out.




I have a large (as in well excess of need) solar plant on my property. Cleanest you can get

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Response to ProgressiveProfessor (Reply #3)

Wed Oct 24, 2012, 02:20 PM

4. You live out in the desert in California...

...the reality that you well know is that there just is not enough land and water in the islands to support an ever-growing population. That's just the plain truth. That's why my best guess is that there is something like 400,000 Hawaii people living on the Mainland. I would add that one of those individuals is President of the United States of America!

Building over the last few remaining bits of country on Oahu will not fix that! I feel your pain, but being in denial about the reality of the situation is not a solution.

"The Price of Paradise" isn't going away no matter how many high-rise condos and new subdivisions you build.

KEEP THE COUNTRY COUNTRY, BRAH

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Response to ellisonz (Reply #4)

Wed Oct 24, 2012, 02:31 PM

5. I do now, but grew up on Oahu

My real concern is equity. The rich will find a way to live there while the poor are forced away disrupting families. Its not about keeping the country country, but keeping places for the less fortunate to live. Moiliili, Kapahulu, and others are facing gentrification and unlike on the mainland, there are hard limits to expansion. Ohana zoning can only go so far.

So while I understand the desire to limit development etc, its being done on the back of the poor, and that is what pisses me off.

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Response to ProgressiveProfessor (Reply #5)

Wed Oct 24, 2012, 02:43 PM

6. My family lives in Kaimuki...

...our land has been in our family since 1942. I don't think tearing up all the business and apartments on Waialae Ave to build big multi-use apartment complexes is going to solve this problem. There simply isn't enough land! I agree with you, I don't like it either, but it is what is is - a series of island chains in the middle of the Pacific. Oahu is maxed out and I'm not sure lots of building on the outer islands is the solution either. Yeah there is some room for redevelopment - Kakaako, parts of Moiliili, Iwilei, Kalihi Kai, Barbers Point. But developments such as Koa Ridge and Hooplili aren't trying to increase urban density to provide affordable housing, they're sprawl!

We can do development in a smart way, but no matter what we do, it won't bring down the cost of living, it just will grow the middle class on Hawaii. What we really need to be looking at is why there is persistent inter-generational poverty. The school system needs drastic reform and there are a number of environmentally friendly industries that can be developed to provide good jobs to future generations: clean energy, more sustainable tourism, sciences, medicine...

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