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Tue Sep 18, 2012, 05:13 AM

Greek protests enter menacing phase

http://mg.co.za/article/2012-09-16-greek-protests-enter-menacing-phase



<snip>


While politicians were fixated on Germany's constitutional court ratifying the eurozone bailout mechanism and the general elections in Holland last week, Greece's three-party coalition was locked in fraught negotiations over a new €12.5bn austerity package. The cuts in disability benefits, ordered by debt inspectors from the "troika" of lenders at the EU, ECB and IMF, threw into sharp relief the tough process that the weakest member of the eurozone is being forced to suffer.

For the first time in living memory, military personnel took to the streets alongside police officers, fire brigade officials, teachers and doctors as Greeks vowed to resist further pay and pension cuts that have already led to plummeting living standards.

This week, before a general strike scheduled for September 26—the 17th this year—judges will walk off the job, shaking one of the central pillars of Greek society.

Nearly three years into the debt crisis, the mood among Greeks has shifted from one of bewilderment and shock, borne of seeing their seemingly robust economy collapse almost overnight, to fury and fear as poverty and panic spread.

Increasingly, ordinary people are speaking of "blood being spilled" and even "civil war". After the hiatus of a long summer, there are few who doubt that Greece is about to enter an autumn of mass discontent as the endless efforts to keep bankruptcy at bay move into a menacing new phase.

<snip>

15 replies, 1776 views

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Arrow 15 replies Author Time Post
Reply Greek protests enter menacing phase (Original post)
Starry Messenger Sep 2012 OP
HiPointDem Sep 2012 #1
tama Sep 2012 #5
Starry Messenger Sep 2012 #6
HiPointDem Sep 2012 #14
Starry Messenger Sep 2012 #15
xchrom Sep 2012 #2
dipsydoodle Sep 2012 #3
tama Sep 2012 #4
TBF Sep 2012 #7
dipsydoodle Sep 2012 #9
BOG PERSON Sep 2012 #11
socialist_n_TN Sep 2012 #8
TBF Sep 2012 #10
BOG PERSON Sep 2012 #12
Starry Messenger Sep 2012 #13

Response to Starry Messenger (Original post)

Tue Sep 18, 2012, 06:11 AM

1. How much different is this than a physical economic blockade or seige?

 

the results are starting to seem the same.

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Response to HiPointDem (Reply #1)

Tue Sep 18, 2012, 07:29 AM

5. Neocolonialism

 

Greeks are not blockaded but occupied by Troika and banksters and their "own" government. The article was good news, in Greece police, army and judges are starting to switch side from occupying force to resistance.

There are lots of good news from Greece (that corporate media is not paying much attention to), people are rebuilding their society from bottom and abandoning the "government", there is immense amount of solidarity, responsible activism and creativity bursting. Like in Argentina.

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Response to tama (Reply #5)

Tue Sep 18, 2012, 10:14 AM

6. I saw that part as good news too.

Shifting the judges.

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Response to Starry Messenger (Reply #6)

Wed Sep 19, 2012, 11:27 PM

14. this is a right wing source, but it had some details about the judges so i'm posting it anyway, as

 

it appears to be reporting facts w/o trying to make some winger point:

But the Greek government, in order to cut public expenses and to bring the nation’s fiscal situation back to order, plans to cut the salary of those magistrates and prosecutors by 25 percent. Stournaras met with the association and tried to persuade the members to accept pay cuts. But after already seeing their salaries reduced by almost 38 percent since the beginning of Greece's recent financial woes, the Association of Magistrates and Prosecutors voted unanimously to reject the government’s proposal and instead the members voted to begin a partial strike beginning on September 17 and lasting five days.

Already these officials work only five hours a day — from 10:00 in the morning to 3:00 in the afternoon — but under the partial strike the magistrates and prosecutors will work only one hour a day, and only cases nearing the statute of limitations will be heard. This slowdown hits a Greek judicial system in which it sometimes takes 10 years for a case to come to trial.

The Association of Magistrates and Prosecutors will meet again on September 22 to determine whether or not to continue this partial strike...

http://www.thenewamerican.com/world-news/europe/item/12890-greek-judges-and-prosecutors-strike


so accepting the 25% cut would mean their salaries have been cut in half since the fiscal crisis began. that's big for the upper middle classes. i don't see how they could hold support together if even the top 20% are getting hit so hard.

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Response to HiPointDem (Reply #14)

Thu Sep 20, 2012, 08:37 AM

15. Ouch.

Little wonder they're in a fighting mood. I think there is a line in the manifesto about the petty bourgeois sometimes acting in a revolutionary way...a draconian haircut like that would probably do it.

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Response to Starry Messenger (Original post)

Tue Sep 18, 2012, 06:22 AM

2. Du rec. Nt

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Response to Starry Messenger (Original post)

Tue Sep 18, 2012, 06:23 AM

3. Their robust economy was an illusion.

All smoke and mirrors lies and deceipt.

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Response to dipsydoodle (Reply #3)

Tue Sep 18, 2012, 07:12 AM

4. US economy isn't?

 

What else is money but smoke and mirrors lies and deceipt?

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Response to dipsydoodle (Reply #3)

Tue Sep 18, 2012, 10:21 AM

7. Sounds like a good description of Wall Street. nt

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Response to TBF (Reply #7)

Tue Sep 18, 2012, 10:27 AM

9. That's not too far from the truth

The bankers told them how to rig the books so's they could get in the Euro. It was being in the Euro which allowed them such large loans in the form of bonds ans subsequent bailouts. So - the bankers had helped themselves. Over the years Greece has obviously benefited but now they're paying the price for money spent earlier.

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Response to dipsydoodle (Reply #3)

Tue Sep 18, 2012, 11:09 PM

11. ~everything is an illusion~

ooOOOoooOOOOoooOO

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Response to Starry Messenger (Original post)

Tue Sep 18, 2012, 10:24 AM

8. The change in the military and police support is significient......

No revolution has ever succeeded without support of the military, or at least the lower level military, the EMs and NCOs and lower ranking officers.

This IS an extremely volitile situation though. Just because there's growing sentiment among the general population for revolution doesn't mean that that revolution will be socialist. There are two other options, the fascists and some sort of military strongman coup. Or even a junta of higher ranking military officers. But things are coming to a head and it does bear watching.

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Response to socialist_n_TN (Reply #8)

Tue Sep 18, 2012, 10:32 AM

10. That I think is the danger both in Greece and here -

the military has to turn and there is too much interest in fascism.

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Response to Starry Messenger (Original post)

Tue Sep 18, 2012, 11:16 PM

12. you can tell which way which segments of society are going to turn

by looking at who creates surplus value and who *appropriates* it . at the end of the day, i don't think judges and cops are going side with revolutionaries.

i think whether or not the military will be sympathetic to communist revolution depends on whether they are conscripted forces (because they're more democratic than volunteer ones) and on how successful communists have been at reaching out to them.

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Response to BOG PERSON (Reply #12)

Wed Sep 19, 2012, 08:47 AM

13. It could just be a temporary shift.

I haven't looked at the KKE piece to see if there has been reaching out to the judges and cops. I did find this article, which suggests indirectly (to me at least) that the reaction of the judges might be from the racist overstepping of the Golden Dawn:



<snip>

Justice Minister Antonis Roupakiotis threatened tougher punishment for ethnic crimes, with sentences of over three years in jail for those who attack migrant workers.

The public order ministry also said it would no longer provide police guards for MPs from the far-right Golden Dawn party, which is seen by many as a key factor contributing to the climate of xenophobia in Greece.

<snip>

On 7 September, a group of several dozen flag-waving Golden Dawn supporters clad in black T-shirts raided a street market in Rafina, northeast of Athens. A video clip posted online showed them checking migrants' papers and overturning their stalls, leaving merchandise strewn on the ground.

It also featured a Golden Dawn MP saying he had to step in where the police had failed in order to drive out "illegal vendors".

<snip>



I'll try to follow things more closely until the General Strike on the 26th.



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