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Fri Apr 13, 2012, 10:46 AM

Case of man shot at 90 times on freeway 'tragic,' LAPD says

Source: Los Angeles Times

Los Angeles Police Department officials described the shooting death of a 19-year-old man after a bizarre high-speed chase on the 101 Freeway "tragic" but defended the officers' actions.

Eight Los Angeles police officers fired more than 90 rounds, killing him.

LAPD officials will review several factors related to the incident, including communication tactics and whether the large number of rounds fired endangered other freeway motorists.

When asked if this may have been a case of suicide by cop, LAPD Lt. Andy Neiman said, "It's certainly bizarre behavior, and it ended in a tragic situation for all involved."

Read more: http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/lanow/2012/04/case-of-man-shot-at-90-times-on-freeway-tragic-lapd-says.html

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Reply Case of man shot at 90 times on freeway 'tragic,' LAPD says (Original post)
IDemo Apr 2012 OP
grantcart Apr 2012 #1
robinlynne Apr 2012 #10
unblock Apr 2012 #2
avebury Apr 2012 #3
AtheistCrusader Apr 2012 #11
TheWraith Apr 2012 #13
AtheistCrusader Apr 2012 #14
Bluenorthwest Apr 2012 #18
AtheistCrusader Apr 2012 #23
XemaSab Apr 2012 #19
Downwinder Apr 2012 #4
KansDem Apr 2012 #5
armodem08 Apr 2012 #7
robinlynne Apr 2012 #12
avebury Apr 2012 #15
Johnny Rico Apr 2012 #6
Kelvin Mace Apr 2012 #8
XemaSab Apr 2012 #20
Kelvin Mace Apr 2012 #26
bluedigger Apr 2012 #9
msongs Apr 2012 #16
Mosby Apr 2012 #17
The Second Stone Apr 2012 #21
ManiacJoe Apr 2012 #22
tawadi Apr 2012 #24
agentS Apr 2012 #25

Response to IDemo (Original post)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 10:52 AM

1. This helps clarify it a little

He drove a black Crown Victoria, which his uncle said was a retired police cruiser that had been purchased at an auction.

During the chase, Arian called 911, and according to a partial transcript of the call released by the LAPD, he claimed to have a gun and made threats to the police.


"I have been arrested before for possession of destructive devices, I'm not afraid of the cops," he told the dispatcher. "If they pull their guns, I'm going to have to pull my gun out on them."

The dispatcher, according to the release, pleaded for Arian to surrender, saying "I don't want you to hurt yourself."

Arian responded with expletives and warned that the police are "going to get hurt."

. . . .

After cutting across lanes, Arian stopped, jumped out of his car and began running on the freeway. Facing police while back-stepping, he extended both arms with clasped hands, a gesture captured on video by a KTLA-TV news helicopter.

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Response to grantcart (Reply #1)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 12:14 PM

10. the whole thing was taped live. We all saw it happening live on the news. He

kept running and they kept shooting.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 11:04 AM

2. i feel pretty good about the first 88 rounds. not sure about #89. #90 was definitely overkill

here's some more context:

"Police did not recover a gun from the scene."



yes, his behavior and threats and perhaps history would suggest the cops had reason to see him as a danger to them, and he certainly was being a danger to others on the freeway, but i maintain that when cops use lethal force, they take on the responsibility of getting it right. at the end of the day, they could have resolved the situation with no loss of life.

the fact that they put so many bullets out there suggests that there was something more going on than simply trying to resolve the situation professionally.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 11:12 AM

3. Even if the shooting was justified,

90 rounds is definitely excessive force.

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Response to avebury (Reply #3)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 12:15 PM

11. Good freakin grief.

It takes about 2 seconds to plow through 10 rounds. There were eight officers. Once they start firing, they will fire until the suspect hits the ground.

Sounds excessive when you think of it as a serial transaction with all bullets being fired from the same gun.

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Response to AtheistCrusader (Reply #11)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 12:23 PM

13. It may not have taken long, but it was still kind of excessive.

The bigger problem being that letting loose 90 rounds in an urban or semi-urban environment, when you're surrounded by hard surfaces perfect for ricochets, is a recipe for someone else getting hurt. The cops are lucky none of their rounds caused any serious injuries.

It seems to me that in cases like these, the police should have a couple of officers acting as designated marksmen, whose job it is to put the target down if need be, rather than every officer emptying his weapon simultaneously.

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Response to TheWraith (Reply #13)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 12:43 PM

14. Probably a little bit of predator/prey - adrenaline thing going on as well.

I've noticed, once an officer fires, everyone with a gun unloads. It just happens. I doubt any amount of training can prevent it.

The volume of fire is potentially disturbing, but I would call it 'normal'. Each shooter should be aware of backstop, and individually refrain from firing, if necessary. Some may not have fired, some may have emptied their weapons, and I would assume 15+1 depending on weapon.

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Response to AtheistCrusader (Reply #14)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 09:49 PM

18. I watched a large group of LAPD face down a drunk woman with a tiny pen knife

They pumped many rounds out, killed her, struck two passing citizens. I heard one wounded woman ask an officer for help, he told her to shut up. Although only the cops had guns, they called the injuries to citizens the result of 'cross fire' as if there was a gun fight.
My 82 year old retired neighbor said 'I could subdue a woman like that single handed at my age'.
Great, great outfit, the LAPD. This is one of the nicer stories this eyewitness could share with you, the worst is utterly disgusting, utterly. And yet this one has a needless killing in it.
Great outfit. Much courage. The sort of knife that comes on a key chain.

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Response to Bluenorthwest (Reply #18)

Sun Apr 15, 2012, 01:26 AM

23. That is a truly awful story.

Sometimes, there just ain't no justice.

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Response to avebury (Reply #3)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 10:48 PM

19. It looked like there were about 15 cops opening fire

That's about 6 rounds per cop. I bet if you thought someone was shooting at you, you would do no less.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 11:22 AM

4. Sound like a place for an assisted suicide charge.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 11:25 AM

5. Video


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Response to KansDem (Reply #5)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 11:35 AM

7. Jeez... Imagine being in the car near him and seeing the guy get shot to death. Nuts...

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Response to armodem08 (Reply #7)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 12:15 PM

12. We all saw it. It was filmed live by the helicopter. There weren't any cars right near him that I

could see. the freeway was shut down. he got out of the car and was running away down the empty freeway.

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Response to robinlynne (Reply #12)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 12:48 PM

15. That sure looked like there was a civilian (non cop) car pretty close to the

guy the the police turned into swiss cheese. If I was in that car I would certainly not have been very happy.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 11:33 AM

6. Suicide by cop. What can you do?

 

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Response to Johnny Rico (Reply #6)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 11:53 AM

8. 90 rounds?

The cops seem rather indifferent to the public in the immediate vicinity.

Also, I would suggest that remedial marksmanship classes and firearms safety is called for. 90 rounds with one suspect and one gun is indicative of panic fire by the police. Panic fire gets police and innocent bystanders killed.

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Response to Kelvin Mace (Reply #8)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 10:53 PM

20. If there's someone opening fire towards the cops

and any innocent people who are behind the cops, exactly how many minutes would you say, at minimum, the cops should take to figure out how many rounds to send in response, and who among them should send these rounds?

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Response to XemaSab (Reply #20)

Sun Apr 15, 2012, 05:37 PM

26. And what about the people BEHIND the

guy they are shooting at?

These cops panicked, and just fired to empty their clips. This shows a lack of discipline and a disregard for the safety of the public.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 11:59 AM

9. Sounds like a group reaction.

When the man mimicked pointing a weapon, they all reacted and unloaded theirs. Pulling the trigger probably becomes an instinctive reaction when eight shooters are all doing it simultaneously under those conditions.

ETA: After watching the video, I don't know what happened.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 12:58 PM

16. LAPD. 'nuff said nt

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 01:24 PM

17. the cops are out of control in this country

I just disgusted.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 10:58 PM

21. Shooting a man once is tragic. 90 times is a waste of ammunition

Asked why they shot the man 90 times the police spokesman for the LAPD said: "We ran out of bullets."

Seriously, WTF is wrong with these police officers?

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Response to The Second Stone (Reply #21)

Sat Apr 14, 2012, 12:16 AM

22. Most of the time is it poor marksmanship.

> Seriously, WTF is wrong with these police officers?

Most need more range time.... Wait, that is probably not what you meant....

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Sun Apr 15, 2012, 10:08 AM

24. 90 times seems excessive

Wonder what the norm is in situations like this.

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Response to IDemo (Original post)

Sun Apr 15, 2012, 11:22 AM

25. 90 times?! Damn, whatever happen to 3 shots downrange?

Yeah, I think 90 rounds downrange would be a DANGER to anyone unfortunate enough to be walking or driving by in the kill zone for those rounds.

LAPD, crazy as usual!

Look, the guy was nutso, and a danger, I get that. So shoot the guy once or twice, not 9000 times! You don't wanna hit people sitting at home, right?

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