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okaawhatever

(9,453 posts)
Wed Dec 3, 2014, 07:56 PM Dec 2014

Hungary up in arms after US senator calls prime minister 'neo-fascist dictator'

Source: The Guardian

Hungary’s foreign ministry summoned the US envoy on Wednesday after the US senator John McCain called Prime Minister Viktor Orban a “neo-fascist dictator”.

The United States has become increasingly critical of Orban’s government, accusing him of getting too close to Russia since east-west tensions rose over Ukraine.

Hungary’s foreign minister called in the US chargé d’affaires, Andrea Goodfriend, over McCain’s comments, made in the US Senate during a political spat over the appointment of Hollywood producer Colleen Bell as US ambassador in Budapest.

McCain, a Republican, told the Senate on Tuesday: “I am not against political appointees … I understand how the game is played, but … [Hungary] … is on the verge of ceding its sovereignty to a neo-fascist dictator, getting in bed with Vladimir Putin, and we’re going to send the producer of The Bold and The Beautiful as the ambassador.” Bell has since been approved in the Senate and is expected to take up her position in Hungary.

Read more: http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2014/dec/03/mccain-calls-hungary-prime-minister-neo-facist-dictator

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Hungary up in arms after US senator calls prime minister 'neo-fascist dictator' (Original Post) okaawhatever Dec 2014 OP
A diplomatic note to Hungary explaining McCain is an asshat and was the one that chose Palin should Fred Sanders Dec 2014 #1
Certainly. We must bow and scrape to our fascist betters. former9thward Dec 2014 #3
Are you for real? You on McCain's side? You remember what party Obama belongs to, which one do you? Fred Sanders Dec 2014 #4
I read the article. former9thward Dec 2014 #6
Are YOU for real? You on the fascists' side? Android3.14 Dec 2014 #8
What? Fred Sanders Dec 2014 #9
Indeed! pscot Dec 2014 #14
see post #7. McCain is right on this, though I oppose McCain in general uhnope Dec 2014 #10
I read the article and others on the situation in Hungary. My older brother lives in neighboring rpannier Dec 2014 #19
So thankful McCain is not our president. Feel sorry for Colleen Bell... /nt think Dec 2014 #2
Because "worst pilot in the world and prisoner turncoat" would be better qualification? Fred Sanders Dec 2014 #5
I loathe McCain but he's right about this uhnope Dec 2014 #7
I hate to say it but I agree with McCain. urg! snappyturtle Dec 2014 #11
Can we not tell them Grandpa is sick, and that's just how we let him entertain himself? n/t jtuck004 Dec 2014 #12
It reads like he's calling Putin the "neo-fascist dictator", to me muriel_volestrangler Dec 2014 #13
If you say you are ceding your national sovereignty to a "neo-fascist", are you not being called one? Fred Sanders Dec 2014 #15
No, I don't think he was calling Hungary a 'neo-fascist dictator' muriel_volestrangler Dec 2014 #16
Obama appointed the ambassador to Hungary, it was the issue in the article.....?.... Fred Sanders Dec 2014 #17
Hungary is going seriously right wing, so a real, foreign service ambassador would be a good idea muriel_volestrangler Dec 2014 #20
Broken clock McCain is right on the matter. Dawson Leery Dec 2014 #18

Fred Sanders

(23,946 posts)
1. A diplomatic note to Hungary explaining McCain is an asshat and was the one that chose Palin should
Wed Dec 3, 2014, 07:59 PM
Dec 2014

clear the air.

Yet there he is week after week an honored guest of the mass media.....it is unexplainable.

McCain reminds me of certain criminal lawyers and political commentators that value publicity over credibility, publicity is like a drug to these pitiful addicts.

former9thward

(31,804 posts)
3. Certainly. We must bow and scrape to our fascist betters.
Wed Dec 3, 2014, 08:02 PM
Dec 2014

We would not want to have Hungary or Putin offended.

Fred Sanders

(23,946 posts)
4. Are you for real? You on McCain's side? You remember what party Obama belongs to, which one do you?
Wed Dec 3, 2014, 08:03 PM
Dec 2014

Maybe you want to read the article before your knee jerk rush to judgment, I will give you the benefit of the doubt on that.

former9thward

(31,804 posts)
6. I read the article.
Wed Dec 3, 2014, 08:08 PM
Dec 2014

Hungary is moving to an alliance with Russia. I have seen Putin described as a fascist countless times on DU. Has that changed?

 

Android3.14

(5,402 posts)
8. Are YOU for real? You on the fascists' side?
Wed Dec 3, 2014, 08:16 PM
Dec 2014

Gee, doesn't sit too well when someone does it to you, eh Fred?

rpannier

(24,304 posts)
19. I read the article and others on the situation in Hungary. My older brother lives in neighboring
Wed Dec 3, 2014, 09:21 PM
Dec 2014

Czech Republic.

McCain is pretty much right about Hungary.
I would provide you with the articles, but post #7 has already done that

Yes, I agree with McCain. It's irrelevant that he's a Republican.

Fred Sanders

(23,946 posts)
5. Because "worst pilot in the world and prisoner turncoat" would be better qualification?
Wed Dec 3, 2014, 08:07 PM
Dec 2014

Good enough for President for the asshat that chose Palin.

 

uhnope

(6,419 posts)
7. I loathe McCain but he's right about this
Wed Dec 3, 2014, 08:16 PM
Dec 2014

Do not look away from the tragedy of Hungary
http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2014-04-07/is-hungary-the-eu-s-only-dictatorship
The world is in denial about the situation under PM Viktor Orban

He has pushed through constitutional changes outlawing gay marriage and proclaiming Christianity's special role as a cornerstone of Hungarian statehood. He fans the flames of Hungarian nationalism, issuing Hungarian passports to ethnic Hungarians living in neighboring countries and, in a recent speech, calling Serbian and Romanian towns by their Hungarian names.

He's Hitler-like regarding the Roma
http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/hungarian-journalist-says-roma-should-not-be-allowed-to-exist-a-876887.html
Hungary's Racism Problem: Orbán Friend Says Roma 'Shouldn't Be Allowed to Exist'
Zsolt Bayer, a prominent conservative commentator, has sparked outrage in Hungary and abroad for comparing Roma to animals and saying they "shouldn't be allowed to exist." Criticism of the remarks is growing, but Prime Minister Orbán will likely keep silent.

http://www.errc.org/article/forced-evictions-in-hungary-letter-to-hungarian-prime-minister-viktor-orban--open-letter/226
Forced Evictions in Hungary: Letter to Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orbán - open letter
On August 9, 2000, the ERRC sent a letter to Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orbán to express concern at recent evictions of Roma from their housing in various parts of Hungary, as well as about recent legislation which may lead to large numbers of abusive evictions on racist grounds.

Just because McCain said it doesn't mean it's not true, but the Putinistas will scream and cry, hmm I wonder why

snappyturtle

(14,656 posts)
11. I hate to say it but I agree with McCain. urg!
Wed Dec 3, 2014, 08:24 PM
Dec 2014

It seems we're doing everything possible to restore cold war status with Russia. Dumb. imho

I would like to see a diplomat with extensive foreign service take this post.

muriel_volestrangler

(101,154 posts)
13. It reads like he's calling Putin the "neo-fascist dictator", to me
Wed Dec 3, 2014, 08:28 PM
Dec 2014

Without ellipses:

"I am not against political appointees," the senator said. "I understand how the game is played, but here we are, a nation (Hungary) on the verge of ceding its sovereignty to a neo-fascist dictator, getting in bed with (Russian President) Vladimir Putin, and we're going to send the producer of The Bold and The Beautiful as our ambassador."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-30318898

If Hungary is 'ceding its sovereignty', surely that wouldn't be to its own PM, but to someone external - ie Putin?

Fred Sanders

(23,946 posts)
15. If you say you are ceding your national sovereignty to a "neo-fascist", are you not being called one?
Wed Dec 3, 2014, 08:58 PM
Dec 2014

....?...

Struggling to defend The One That Chose Palin over the twice elected President of your own party...part of why the voting folk stay away.

muriel_volestrangler

(101,154 posts)
16. No, I don't think he was calling Hungary a 'neo-fascist dictator'
Wed Dec 3, 2014, 09:06 PM
Dec 2014

It wouldn't really make sense, would it? So the dictator is the person in the sentence - Putin.

"the twice elected President of your own party"? Huh? What has this to do with Obama? He's not in the story at all. It's the Hungarian government that is complaining about McCain. The nearest we get to Obama is "the United States has become increasingly critical of Orban’s government, accusing him of getting too close to Russia since east-west tensions rose over Ukraine", which is closer to McCain's view, but diplomatic. I'm not saying it was a good idea of McCain to put it this way, but Orban is a toady of Putin's.

"part of why the voting folk stay away"? You are not making any sense at all.

muriel_volestrangler

(101,154 posts)
20. Hungary is going seriously right wing, so a real, foreign service ambassador would be a good idea
Wed Dec 3, 2014, 09:28 PM
Dec 2014

It's all very well appointing supporters to ambassadorships that consist mainly of holding receptions and staying friends with the country, but Hungary has gone a long way to the right. I recommend the guest posts on Paul Krugman's blog for background:

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=%22krugman%22+%22hungary%22

Their attitude to Roma, and sometimes Jews, is very worrying:

http://www.npr.org/blogs/codeswitch/2014/03/09/287342069/increased-hostility-against-jews-and-roma-in-hungary

A recent article:

Budapest autumn: hollowing out democracy on the edge of Europe

Rightwing prime minister Viktor Orbán is using his huge electoral majority to rewrite the rules, and not just for Hungary

Bernadett Szél, MP and co-leader of a small Green liberal party, cites the events in Kishantos and Budapest as a prime example of the “endless cynicism” of the prime minister and his party, Fidesz, whose actions and policies set him apart in the European Union, and are setting off alarm bells in Brussels and Washington. “Kishantos is a symbol of what Orbán is doing. It’s pure power and pure destruction. Fidesz is the state. The party is the state. We don’t know how to end that.”

In a time of collapsing public confidence in the political classes across Europe, Orbán can claim to be unique – a gifted, popular strongman with the most formidable electoral mandate in the EU. Untroubled by a fragmented and morally bankrupt centre-left opposition, Orbán led his rightwing Fidesz to a landslide victory in 2010. He coasted to a second term last April, won the European elections in May and in October took control of virtually every town and city in Hungary in local elections.

Highly unusually, he has a two-thirds parliamentary majority, meaning that the vast Westminster lookalike on the banks of the Danube in Budapest is a rubber stamp. After his election hat-trick this year, he need not face the voters again until 2018. He shows every sign of using that time to reshape Hungary.
...
The number one item on Orbán’s destroy list appears to be the western democratic model. In an infamous speech to supporters in Romania in July, he declared the western model dead and cited the authoritarian regimes of Russia, China, Turkey and Singapore as the templates to follow. “We are parting ways with western European dogmas, making ourselves independent from them,” he declared. “We have to abandon liberal methods and principles of organising a society. The new state that we are building is an illiberal state, a non-liberal state.”

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/29/budapest-viktor-orban-democracy-edge-hungary

So it's a worrying political situation, and one that a senator is within his rights to say should be handled by a professional diplomat, not a fundraiser who works in TV. McCain just said it in way that inflames tensions, rather than helping get a better-qualified ambassador appointed.

Dawson Leery

(19,348 posts)
18. Broken clock McCain is right on the matter.
Wed Dec 3, 2014, 09:17 PM
Dec 2014

Viktor Orban has given every implication if he could get away with it, he would round up Jews, Gays, Immigrants, and send them into concentration camps. He can't do it because Hungary is a western nation, the EU will give them hell and isolate the nation.

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