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Fri Aug 23, 2013, 01:38 PM

Breaking: Army psychiatrist convicted of murder for Fort Hood shooting, now eligible for death

Source: Associated Press

@AP: BREAKING: Army psychiatrist convicted of murder for Fort Hood shooting, now eligible for death penalty. -SS

SOLDIER GUILTY OF MURDER FOR FORT HOOD SHOOTINGS

By WILL WEISSERT and PAUL J. WEBER
Aug. 23 1:44 PM EDT

FORT HOOD, Texas (AP) Army Maj. Nidal Hasan was convicted Friday in the 2009 shooting rampage at Fort Hood, a shocking assault against American troops at home by one of their own who said he opened fire on fellow soldiers to protect Muslim insurgents abroad.

The Army psychiatrist acknowledged carrying out the attack in a crowded waiting room where unarmed troops were making final preparations to deploy to Afghanistan and Iraq. Thirteen people were killed and more than 30 wounded.

Because Hasan never denied his actions, the court-martial was always less about a conviction than it was about ensuring he received the death penalty. From the beginning of the case, the federal government has sought to execute Hasan, believing that any sentence short of a lethal injection would deprive the military and the families of the dead of the justice they have sought for nearly four years.

A jury of 13 high-ranking military officers reached a unanimous guilty verdict in about seven hours. Hasan had no visible reaction as the verdict was read. In the next phase of the trial, they must all agree to give Hasan the death penalty before he can be sent to the military's death row, which has just five other prisoners. If they do not agree, the 42-year-old could spend the rest of his life in prison.

Read more: http://bigstory.ap.org/article/jury-fort-hood-rampage-resume-deliberations

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Reply Breaking: Army psychiatrist convicted of murder for Fort Hood shooting, now eligible for death (Original post)
Hissyspit Aug 2013 OP
CaliforniaPeggy Aug 2013 #1
hlthe2b Aug 2013 #3
shenmue Aug 2013 #2
atreides1 Aug 2013 #4
littlewolf Aug 2013 #10
JustAnotherGen Aug 2013 #26
Dreamer Tatum Aug 2013 #5
derby378 Aug 2013 #30
24601 Aug 2013 #37
leftynyc Aug 2013 #6
Bully Taw Aug 2013 #7
oldhippie Aug 2013 #8
Bully Taw Aug 2013 #9
GalaxyHunter Aug 2013 #23
7962 Aug 2013 #12
Bully Taw Aug 2013 #14
geek tragedy Aug 2013 #16
7962 Aug 2013 #19
ProudToBeBlueInRhody Aug 2013 #41
christx30 Aug 2013 #13
Bully Taw Aug 2013 #15
christx30 Aug 2013 #17
Bully Taw Aug 2013 #18
derby378 Aug 2013 #31
christx30 Aug 2013 #33
branford Aug 2013 #21
The Stranger Aug 2013 #25
branford Aug 2013 #32
The Stranger Aug 2013 #39
The Stranger Aug 2013 #22
branford Aug 2013 #34
The Stranger Aug 2013 #38
branford Aug 2013 #42
The Stranger Aug 2013 #44
branford Aug 2013 #45
nomorenomore08 Aug 2013 #28
ProudToBeBlueInRhody Aug 2013 #40
Eugene Aug 2013 #11
Amerigo Vespucci Aug 2013 #20
GalaxyHunter Aug 2013 #24
MrSlayer Aug 2013 #27
4Q2u2 Aug 2013 #29
jessie04 Aug 2013 #35
Tx4obama Aug 2013 #36
GreenStormCloud Aug 2013 #43

Response to Hissyspit (Original post)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 01:39 PM

1. I think this is what he wanted. n/t

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Reply #1)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 01:41 PM

3. Yes, indeed... I think it was a foregone conclusion that he'd be found guilty & likely be executed.

Not denying he deserves it, (despite being profoundly anti-death penalty), but there will be no "winners" in this whole saga.

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Response to Hissyspit (Original post)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 01:40 PM

2. Glad to hear the verdict

Not sure how I feel about the death penalty. But he is a murderer.

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Response to Hissyspit (Original post)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 01:45 PM

4. I don't want him executed

He wants to die, in hopes of becoming a martyr.

I want him to spend the rest of his miserable life behind bars, knowing that he failed!!!

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Response to atreides1 (Reply #4)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 02:21 PM

10. Yup with you there ... I understand supermax prisons are nice this time of year. nt

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Response to atreides1 (Reply #4)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 03:37 PM

26. +1

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Response to Hissyspit (Original post)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 01:56 PM

5. Supermax, solitary confinement, for life nt

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Response to Dreamer Tatum (Reply #5)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 04:52 PM

30. Hasan should be lucky that the toughest prison we have is ADX Florence

You want a supermax prison? Welcome to Russia's Black Dolphin Prison.

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Response to derby378 (Reply #30)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 09:23 PM

37. He's in the Army and convicted by a Courts Martial. He should be going to the Military Disciplinary

Barracks (prison) at Ft. Leavenworth, Kansas.

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Response to Hissyspit (Original post)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 01:58 PM

6. I want the judge to give him life

in supermax and make a statement that the US has no desire to create martyrs and since he wants to die, that's why the judge is going to make him live.

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Response to Hissyspit (Original post)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 02:05 PM

7. i hope he gets the treatment he needs...

 

he is obviously mentally ill, and most likely not responsible for his actions. He should be treated and evaluated. The death penalty has never solved anything, and life in prison is just as inhumane. if we can do so many wonderful things as a society, wouldn't one of the best be to make Nidal well and return him to society as rehabilitated?

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Response to Bully Taw (Reply #7)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 02:12 PM

8. Oh my ....

 

... that would sound like the most compassionate course of action, wouldn't it?

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Response to oldhippie (Reply #8)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 02:13 PM

9. compassion is what makes us human...

 

without compassion for those that have wronged us (or our society) what are we?

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Response to Bully Taw (Reply #9)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 03:35 PM

23. Animals.

 

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Response to Bully Taw (Reply #7)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 02:37 PM

12. Oh please tell me you're being sarcastic.

You can try to rehabilitate criminals, but premeditated mass murder is not a "treatable" crime. We have too many so-called rehabilitated killers who are released and kill again. Release the drug crooks and keep the murderers behind bars or execute them.

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Response to 7962 (Reply #12)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 02:39 PM

14. people don't make themselves criminals...

 

a society turning its back on people make them criminals.

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Response to Bully Taw (Reply #14)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 02:53 PM

16. You think you're rather clever, but I doubt you're fooling anyone nt

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Response to Bully Taw (Reply #14)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 03:01 PM

19. Stop it! I cant laugh anymore. My stomach aches.

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Response to Bully Taw (Reply #14)

Mon Aug 26, 2013, 05:08 PM

41. So, what's your CC handle?

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Response to Bully Taw (Reply #7)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 02:39 PM

13. I don't think he needs

compassion. He needs to sit on a bench in a small room with no human contact until he dies. He doesn't need treatment. Give him 2 decent meals a day and a toilet let him talk to his lawyer once a month to try to mount some half-hearted appeal. But there is no reason to ever return him to society. He murdered 13 people. There's no coming back for that. If he needed treatment, it was before the murders.

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Response to christx30 (Reply #13)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 02:41 PM

15. it is hard to forgive those that hurt us

 

But that is what we must do to live in the kind of society we hope to achieve one day.

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Response to Bully Taw (Reply #15)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 02:55 PM

17. This isn't about forgiveness.

In every society, there are just some damaged people that can't be helped. We need to just put him in storage until he dies, so he can't hurt anyone else. I don't feel any anger towards him. I'm not calling for his execution. I'm not calling for him to be defiled ("let's trick him into eating pork, and tell him later."). It's childish and stupid.
I'm saying that people like Hassan are cant be helped. Execution would be helping him. It'd give him what he wants. He needs to know that he will die alone and forgotten. He needs to know that his "cause", whatever it is, is lost.

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Response to christx30 (Reply #17)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 03:00 PM

18. i was kinda on board with your statement, but...

 

somewhere along the line, it seems like you are angling toward vengeance. What is actually the most humane way to deal with someone that is not able to be helped? Life in prison or death? Take vengeance out of the equation and what are you left with?

I do not know that he cannot be helped, though. and I suspect that you really do not either.

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Response to Bully Taw (Reply #18)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 04:56 PM

31. I don't see it as vengeance, but rather a balancing of the karmic checkbook

I'd rather not see him get executed, either, but the families of the victims deserve justice. I think a life sentence in ADX Florence without parole would be a suitable measure of justice.

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Response to Bully Taw (Reply #18)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 05:12 PM

33. I'm not talking about death.

I hope he has a long, healthy life. As long as he is in in that small room forever and he is not able to spread his hate, I hope he dies at the age of 79. He killed 13 people. He thought it was absolutely the right thing to do for his religion. For him, those people were worthy of death. You start with that and what else can he do that will be productive for society? Will he cure cancer? Are you looking for him to someday get out of prison?
About the only thing I can envision for him to do is to serve as a warning to others. You do not get to die for Allah. No glory will ever come from attacking innocent people. You will end up in a cage and die alone and forgotten. Try to work toward making life better for others of your faith, instead of keeping the world in darkness.

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Response to Bully Taw (Reply #7)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 03:18 PM

21. Do you have any evidence that Hassan could not differentiate between right and wrong,

or did not know that his actions were illegal. Those are usually the standards to support a not guilty be reason of insanity defense. Moreover, those suffering from mental disease or defect are not immune to criminal prosecution or necessarily protected from the deleterious effects of actions they knew to be wrong.

If Hassan suffers from a lesser mental illness, he will receive treatment while in custody, just as the Army is treating his physical injuries.

Hassan is free to raise his mental competency on appeal. Since he is a trained psychiatrist, and the judge was particularly careful when letting him represent himself, I expect most appellate courts will almost summarily dismiss such claims.

I have no objection to Hassan receiving a death sentence considering the nature and extent of his crime. I similarly would not object if his punishment is a lonely, small cell in a supermax facility for the rest of his life. So long as Hassan's last breath is that of an incarcerated prisoner, justice will be served.

I'm a both a lawyer and a liberal. I believe that the criminal justice system should show compassion when warranted. However, I am not an idiot. Hassan has demonstrated no remorse or anything justifying a punishment less than death or life imprisonment. Hope is not a rehabilitative therapy or strategy.

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Response to branford (Reply #21)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 03:37 PM

25. It's pretty idiotic to ask a poster "do you have any evidence" as if he/she is counsel on the case.

The legal standard for guilt by reason of insanity is not necessarily the correct one -- only the one that courts have arrived after some decades of its erosion. Perhaps it should be overturned in the right case.

Nor does this address the question of whether the Defendant was fit to stand trial in the first place. Given that he is a "trained psychiatrist," it would appear that his actions clearly weigh against his being fit to stand trial, especially his insistence that he represent himself, put on no defense, and demand the worst punishment possible.

But that's thinking like a lawyer.

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Response to The Stranger (Reply #25)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 05:04 PM

32. I believe it is very fair to ask what evidence the poster possesses,

considering this case has been under public scrutiny for years and the trial has just concluded. I'm not asking her expert legal opinion concerning obscure legal procedural minutia, only that she cite something available in the vast public record to support her contentions. Lawyer or not, providing evidence to support your assertions is the bedrock of effective civil discussion and debate.

You appear to be making many assertions based upon your own preconceived notions about Hassan, as do we all. First, Hassan was in fact evaluated as to whether he was fit to stand trial. He is welcome to raise the issue on appeal.

And why, exactly, would the fact that he was a trained psychiatrist weigh against his being fit to stand trial. Similarly, how does his desire to represent himself, admit his actions during his defense and not object to punishment, demonstrate his inability to stand trial. Blatant stupidity, or a belief in jihad or any other justification for one's crimes, does not necessarily prove one is legally insane or unfit to stand trial. Someone can easily be outrageously foolish and/or sufficiently righteous/sanctimonious enough to believe their actions were justified, yet still fully appreciate what they have done, its implications and potential punishment. If Hassan wished to represent himself, he had a fool for a client. However, it is not prima facie evidence of legal insanity. The trial judge meticulously ensured that Hassan knew the pitfalls of representing himself, was satisfied that he understood the implications, and even appointed a shadow defense counsel to protect his interests. You may believe that Hassan was unfit to stand trial or so insane as to be protected from criminal liability, but numerous doctors, the judge and the jury quite obviously disagree.

You apparently object generally to the standards and procedures that the criminal justice system, with some minor variations among different jurisdictions, uses when dealing with those who are mentally ill or whose conduct is so outrageous that you and others seem to impute such illness. You are most certainly free to have any views you wish, and advocate for a different system or result, but most jurists and the general public believe the system is fair. If anything, there are objections that too many protections are provided to these monsters, both those who are mentally ill and those who are just cruel sociopaths.

If you believe the case of Nidal Hassan will change the standards used to determine whether a defendant is fit to stand trial or is criminally responsible for their actions, well . . , good luck to you.

What your post was most notable lacking is any demonstration that Hassan did not received due process under the law, that his potential punishments do not fit his crimes, or evidence of his remorse sufficient to justify leniency or the opportunity for rehabilitation. Those issues are certainly worthy of discussion.

Your appear to equate agreeing with your assertions and opinions as "thinking like a lawyer." I've practiced long enough to know that you better have facts and evidence to back-up your opinions, and that hope and sanctimony very rarely win the day in court. If you are an attorney, or involved with the legal system, as you seem to imply, your criticism that I was "idiotic" for requesting that the prior poster provide evidence to support her contentions even after the conclusion of Hassan's trial, is most bewildering.

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Response to branford (Reply #32)

Mon Aug 26, 2013, 05:00 PM

39. Then, instead of asking another poster what "evidence [they] have he could not differentiate

between right and wrong," you should have known to pull the court's file or ask the court reporter for a transcript of the hearing.

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Response to Bully Taw (Reply #7)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 03:32 PM

22. Amazing, reading the bloodthirst on this thread, purportedly coming from "Progressives"

Really disgusting, especially given the issue of mental illness present here.

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Response to The Stranger (Reply #22)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 06:23 PM

34. The fact that you keep on repeating it, doesn't make it true!

Other than your belief, what is your evidence that he either lacked the ability to participate in his own defense, that he did not appreciate the nature of his conduct or the proceedings, or that he did not understand that his actions were illegal.

Having strong religious beliefs, thinking that your conduct is justified, representing yourself, proffering a lousy defense, or just plain idiocy, are rights guaranteed by the Constitution, not prima facie evidence of sufficient mental illness to absolve Hassan of criminal liability. Hassan was evaluated by doctors, provided more than sufficient due process, proudly admitted his conduct in support of his honestly held religious beliefs, and duly convicted by a jury of his peers. He will also be allowed to appeal both his conviction and any sentence he receives.

Additionally, a desire to see a criminal punished is not "bloodthirst," it is justice. Are you are really claiming that society does not have the right to punish a multiple murderer? Hassan will be given a sentence as dictated by the law. He will be able to appeal that sentence. He will not be tortured (as defined by the law, not you), his dietary, medical and religious needs will be met and accommodated, proper security measures will be instituted in accordance with the threat he poses, and he will have access to an attorney to remedy any issues while incarcerated (or prior to his execution).

You may have sympathy for Hassan. However, others, including myself, do not share your concern for a convicted murderer. I believe that he is entitled to due process and protection from cruel and unusual punishment. I've seen absolutely nothing that raises any issues, and he will be able to appeal to multiple courts. That is precisely where my concern ends. Whether he sits in a small cell for the rest of his natural life or receives a needle in his arm, the only one Hassan can blame for his situation is himself.

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Response to branford (Reply #34)

Mon Aug 26, 2013, 04:55 PM

38. Scuttling your own defense in order to ensure the worst penalty IS EVIDENCE of his condition.

You don't seem to know what evidence is.

And cheering the graphics of a person being put to death perfectly exemplifies bloodthirst.

Congratulations.

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Response to The Stranger (Reply #38)

Mon Aug 26, 2013, 05:12 PM

42. His defense was "justification."

It is considered a viable, if rarely helpful defense, which he apparently believed.

It is not the job of the judge or the system to protect of defendant from their own foolishness or mistakes. That is precisely the reason the judge constantly ensured that Hassan knew and appreciated the effects of his conduct and proffered defense and tried to get him to employ an attorney. The judge even refused to permit his appointed "shadow counsel" to withdraw.

And I most certainly was not "cheering." You are projecting. I simply stated that he will ultimately be sentenced in accordance with the law, likely either death or life imprisonment (I'm personally fine with either sentence), he will have more than ample opportunity to appeal, and that he can only blame himself for his punishment.



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Response to branford (Reply #42)

Tue Aug 27, 2013, 12:14 PM

44. You implied that there was no evidence of his insanity.

I noted that the very circumstances under which the trial is taking place is evidence itself of his insanity.

You apparently don't deny this.

The rest is your own personal meanderings.

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Response to The Stranger (Reply #44)

Tue Aug 27, 2013, 12:40 PM

45. I most certainly deny that.

You are free to believe that "the he very circumstances under which the trial is taking place is evidence itself of his insanity," but the law most certainly begs to differ.

Exhibit A - Nidal Hassan has been found guilty of multiple homicides and the penalty phase of his prosecution will begin shortly.

You may stamp your feet, and wail and cry on anonymous message boards, but your lonely, fringe beliefs will not alter the Hassan trial, or quite frankly, any other case where a defendant's mental competency is at issue.

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Response to Bully Taw (Reply #7)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 03:48 PM

28. Can we really justify "returning to society" someone who killed that many people?

Even if you argue, on human-rights grounds, that no one deserves life without parole - which is a valid argument, even if I don't necessarily agree - how can we be reasonably sure that a guy like this isn't a permanent threat to others?

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Response to Bully Taw (Reply #7)

Mon Aug 26, 2013, 05:06 PM

40. Oh, jesus....

...tell ya what, why don't you take him in to live with you after five years and a clean bill of mental health from an equally understanding therapist?

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Response to Hissyspit (Original post)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 02:34 PM

11. Next, what more can Hasan say to further seal his fate?

He's determined to be a martyr and he certainly will succeed at it.

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Response to Hissyspit (Original post)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 03:02 PM

20. I'd rather see life in prison, no possibility of parole, general population

He deserves to spend every waking moment of his life thinking about what he did.

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Response to Hissyspit (Original post)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 03:36 PM

24. see ya, wouldn't wanna be ya!

 

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Response to Hissyspit (Original post)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 03:46 PM

27. Put him in the deepest, darkest hole possible.

 

And leave him there to rot.

Normally, I'd be all about executing this asshole but since that he wants, we should deny him.

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Response to Hissyspit (Original post)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 03:53 PM

29. He has a Cellmate

He and Bales were foung guilty on the same day. Make them share a cell for all eternity. Then after they die, bury them next to each other.

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Response to Hissyspit (Original post)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 07:16 PM

35. "Yes he deserves to die...

 

and I hope he burns in hell."

sorry, I have no compassion for him.

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Response to Hissyspit (Original post)

Fri Aug 23, 2013, 08:54 PM

36. Kick n/t

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Response to Hissyspit (Original post)

Tue Aug 27, 2013, 09:46 AM

43. No DP for him, I hope.

He is a radical Muslim who yelled, "Allah Akbar" as he was killing people. He has been in contact with radical Islamic teachers. He believes that if he dies as a martyr to Islam that he will gain admittance to Paradise, which comes 72 virgins for his sexual pleasure, each of which becomes a virgin again after he deflowers her. And his erection never goes down. He will die believing that, therefore he will die happy.

Better to put him in solitary confinement forever.

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