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Mon Feb 11, 2013, 03:34 PM

Navy Seal who allegedly shot Bin Laden says US military has abandoned him

Last edited Tue Feb 12, 2013, 03:07 AM - Edit history (2)

Source: The Guardian

A retired Navy Seal who claims to have killed Osama bin Laden by shooting him three times in the forehead has accused the US military of abandoning him to his fate without any financial support, healthcare or security protection as he makes the hard transition to civilian life.

The former commando was a member of the team of 23 Navy Seals that stormed a house in Abbottabad, Pakistan, on 2 May 2011 and killed the world's most wanted terrorist, according to Esquire. An article in the magazine, written in collaboration with the Center for Investigative Reporting, tells the commando's story as apparently the last person to see Bin Laden alive.

But it is the Navy Seal's caustic comments about his treatment at the hands of the military as he seeks to make the shift back to civilian life that are attracting most attention. The "Shooter", as he is anonymously referred to, tells the magazine that after the Abbottabad raid he felt burned out and decided to take early retirement three years before the official requirement of 20 years' service.

As a result, he said: "my healthcare for me and my family stopped. … I asked if there was some transition from my Tricare to Blue Cross Blue Shield. They said no. You're out of the service, your coverage is over. Thanks for your sixteen years. Go fuck yourself."

Read more: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/feb/11/navy-seal-bin-laden-military-benefits



Edited to add link to Esquire article by Phil Bronstein "The Man Who Killed Osama bin Laden... Is Screwed"

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Reply Navy Seal who allegedly shot Bin Laden says US military has abandoned him (Original post)
alp227 Feb 2013 OP
valerief Feb 2013 #1
elleng Feb 2013 #5
actslikeacarrot Feb 2013 #24
elleng Feb 2013 #25
kestrel91316 Feb 2013 #17
shanti Feb 2013 #33
Scairp Feb 2013 #74
southernyankeebelle Feb 2013 #78
Alcibiades Feb 2013 #100
southernyankeebelle Feb 2013 #103
Alcibiades Feb 2013 #105
southernyankeebelle Feb 2013 #106
CANDO Feb 2013 #98
sarge43 Feb 2013 #28
xtraxritical Feb 2013 #57
Sunlei Feb 2013 #72
valerief Feb 2013 #80
NYC_SKP Feb 2013 #2
elleng Feb 2013 #8
CTyankee Feb 2013 #26
elleng Feb 2013 #31
CTyankee Feb 2013 #35
elleng Feb 2013 #37
CTyankee Feb 2013 #43
LibGranny Feb 2013 #63
CTyankee Feb 2013 #64
LibGranny Feb 2013 #65
CTyankee Feb 2013 #68
LibGranny Feb 2013 #70
Sunlei Feb 2013 #73
LibGranny Feb 2013 #93
elleng Feb 2013 #3
matt819 Feb 2013 #12
Siwsan Feb 2013 #21
Dustlawyer Feb 2013 #95
atreides1 Feb 2013 #19
Ter Feb 2013 #85
elleng Feb 2013 #87
Siwsan Feb 2013 #4
Kber Feb 2013 #7
AtheistCrusader Feb 2013 #49
Siwsan Feb 2013 #52
TwilightGardener Feb 2013 #6
elleng Feb 2013 #9
TwilightGardener Feb 2013 #20
madokie Feb 2013 #10
elleng Feb 2013 #16
Burma Jones Feb 2013 #11
TwilightGardener Feb 2013 #14
Burma Jones Feb 2013 #22
AsahinaKimi Feb 2013 #13
DhhD Feb 2013 #15
bluedigger Feb 2013 #18
John2 Feb 2013 #23
tammywammy Feb 2013 #34
Scairp Feb 2013 #75
glinda Feb 2013 #47
patrice Feb 2013 #27
xtraxritical Feb 2013 #60
patrice Feb 2013 #61
sdfernando Feb 2013 #29
toby jo Feb 2013 #30
Ikonoklast Feb 2013 #32
Journeyman Feb 2013 #36
Solly Mack Feb 2013 #38
Tommy_Carcetti Feb 2013 #39
tammywammy Feb 2013 #44
Blue_Tires Feb 2013 #45
sarge43 Feb 2013 #51
ReRe Feb 2013 #40
DallasNE Feb 2013 #41
Downtown Hound Feb 2013 #42
TexasProgresive Feb 2013 #46
Blue_Tires Feb 2013 #53
Swede Atlanta Feb 2013 #48
jimlup Feb 2013 #50
msanthrope Feb 2013 #71
jimlup Feb 2013 #84
NYC Liberal Feb 2013 #91
MrSlayer Feb 2013 #54
uhnope Feb 2013 #55
SoapBox Feb 2013 #56
Dyedinthewoolliberal Feb 2013 #58
mrmpa Feb 2013 #59
patrice Feb 2013 #62
high density Feb 2013 #66
tclambert Feb 2013 #67
Adsos Letter Feb 2013 #88
Incitatus Feb 2013 #102
MyTwoSense Feb 2013 #69
IggleDoer Feb 2013 #101
liberalmuse Feb 2013 #76
DeSwiss Feb 2013 #77
merh Feb 2013 #79
fujiyama Feb 2013 #89
kanooga Feb 2013 #81
NNguyenMD Feb 2013 #82
tavernier Feb 2013 #83
Ter Feb 2013 #86
Franker65 Feb 2013 #90
RobinA Feb 2013 #92
TwilightGardener Feb 2013 #94
RobinA Feb 2013 #99
MADem Feb 2013 #104
marble falls Feb 2013 #96
Baclava Feb 2013 #97
24601 Feb 2013 #107

Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 03:37 PM

1. Isn't that how all U.S. non-officer military are treated? nt

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Response to valerief (Reply #1)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 03:40 PM

5. Probably, but not with 'Go fuck yourself.'

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Response to elleng (Reply #5)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:24 PM

24. The military says "go fuck yourself" all the time...

...to service members. Just not in those exact words. Sounds like he is finding out what a mess the VA is.

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Response to actslikeacarrot (Reply #24)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:27 PM

25. Sounds like he doesn't know what he signed up for,

imo, based on posts in this thread.

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Response to valerief (Reply #1)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 03:56 PM

17. No. People are free to leave.

I find it hard to believe that he didn't understand the consequences of leaving before he had 20 years in.

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #17)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:42 PM

33. exactly

it's TWENTY years for retirement, and not a day less. did he think he was getting a golden parachute just because he whacked bin laden?

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Response to shanti (Reply #33)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:09 PM

74. He couldn't hang in there for three more years?

It seems like a small price to pay to get his retirement pay and medical for life. Surely they could have found some duty for him that was not stressful, no more most notorious terrorists in the world to kill, at least right now, so I'm sure they wouldn't have required the guy to go back to a combat situation. Some nice quiet duty in Japan maybe? Okinawa perhaps? I understand it's very nice there.

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Response to Scairp (Reply #74)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:32 PM

78. I thought the very same thing. My goodness what is he complaining about. Everyone knows

 

20 yrs and you get your pension and your pay for your medical care with Tricare. Sixteen years is already past. You mean to tell me you couldn't hang in there in an easier assignment for another 4 yrs til retirement? I have a brother in law that was a Vet and stayed in after VN. He stayed in for 18 yrs. He couldn't take it any more. We tried hard to talk him into staying in. But no. He got out and got a job in his field as a civilian on a military post. I still think he made a mistake. But he got a great paying job doing the same job he did in the military. Man could he build a computer. Very smart guy.

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Response to southernyankeebelle (Reply #78)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 12:36 PM

100. As a civilian Army employee

His years in the service count toward his pension & benefits. This is one reason why there are so many vets in the post office and other parts of the government.

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Response to Alcibiades (Reply #100)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 01:50 PM

103. He had to stop working because his has allot of back problems. Serious problems

 

and I tried and tried to tell him to go for disability but he won't do it. His wife is a GS 11 and she is still working for the Army. I feel so bad for him because he want's to work. So he does little things around the house and cooks dinner. Some days he can't do anything. He was in the hospital about 3 months ago and we almost lost him. He still is recuperating.

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Response to southernyankeebelle (Reply #103)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 01:38 PM

105. It sounds like he is working then

He's a homemaker. Might not admit to the job title, but it's a full-time job.

It is a shame about the disability. My whole family has been career military & civil service, except for me, and I'm a homemaker, too (my wife is a GS-13). My first ex-brother-in-law started off with something like 10% disability, claiming back problems (which were legitimate, but not really debilitating) and foot problems he said began as a logistics sgt in the 1970's and 1980s. He kept going back to the VA again and again, and now he counts as 100% disabled and lives in Vegas, where he pretty much gambles full time. Nice guy, best of my sister's husbands so far, but he is one of the folks that people who like to say benefits ought to be cut would hold up as an example of someone who is working the system.

And yet here, ironically once again, we have someone else who who would certainly qualify but won't, because of pride or something else. I can understand that. My grandfather was the youngest master sergeant in the army in 1940 at age 19 and later served in heavy combat in Italy, where his Lts were killed twice and he served as a Lt. temporarily: he could have gotten a battlefield commission but refused because he was 20/200 in one eye and was afraid they would find out he bribed a doctor to get into the Army in the first place. He always played it off, saying he was part of a career NCO culture and wouldn't have deigned to serve as an officer, but the truth was it was his one great regret, besides having to see his boys die (the only time he really talked about that was when he got dementia and suddenly he was in Italy again). My dad was a career army pilot, finished up as a Chief Master Warrant Officer 5, with 2 long tours and 3 short tours in Vietnam. Shot down 3 times by ground fire, light injuries. The most severe injury he sustained flying was during a hiatus in his service when he crashed a crop duster a few months after I was born, which caused him to have sciatica for the rest of his life. He never admitted to this to a doctor, and still never has (he now flies civil aviation) because of flight physicals.

It seems to me that a lot of the desk jockey types are the first to put "combat veteran" bumper stickers on their cars and apply for benefits, and many of the folks for whom those benefits are actually intended never apply and just want it all to go away.

Anyway, I hope he feels better.

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Response to Alcibiades (Reply #105)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 02:47 PM

106. I also come from a long line of veterans. My dad served in WWII, Korea and was

 

in VN right before we actual went in. He retired in l963 after 22 yr. He said he had enough and was getting old. He was wounded with machine gun fire right up his leg. But he loved being in the military. He was in the Army Air Corp and then went with the Air Force and stayed in. My father-in-law was also in as a grunt. He also was in WWII, Korea and VN. He was in for 24 yrs and would have stayed longer if his wife didn't force him to retire. She didn't want him to go back to VN and was scared they would send him back. Sure enough after he had put in his retirement they were going to send him back. Thank god he didn't go. He said out of all three places he was at he said VN was the worse. He was wounded also. But like my dad he loved it. My husband was in for 21 yrs. He was a chaplain's assistant. But please let me tell you about these desk jockeys that many give a bad name to. My husband begged to go to Desert Storm. They wouldn't let him go. He had to stay and make sure that the things the soldiers needed on the battle field were sure to get to those people. He made sure the families back home were taken care of when they had issues. Sometimes people forget that. Those desk jockeys did their jobs and didn't even get a thank you. I remember my husband having to make sure families were called if they haven't heard from their loved ones. Sometimes them guys would call back to the office with family issues and he would have to make sure it was taken care of. People seem to forget that. All our military are great people. The wives that stay home and take care of their families while their spouses are off doing their job earn every bit of that retirement and Tricare just like their spouse did. That is the least our country can do for their families. Every soldier who has a spouse gives credit to their spouse. I know every time my husband was promoted he always thanked me first because without my support he knew he couldn't have a family and do his job without worrying. Our life in the military environment is something I would never ever trade. I am sure you feel the same. You meet so many interesting people.

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #17)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 10:48 AM

98. That's what I'm thinking.

You know going in that 20 years is the goal for even the basic retirement. It takes 30 to get the full package. That was instituted way back in the 80's.

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Response to valerief (Reply #1)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:35 PM

28. No. We don't all get to do an Audie Murphy, but grind out 20 and the bennies aren't bad.

Hubby and I are living quite nicely.

What'shisname sounds like a spoiled brat. He expects special perks and privileges for doing his duty. Further, any career noncom who claims s/he doesn't know that no 20, no retired goodies is either too dense to be let outdoors without a keeper or is a lying sack.

He and his family are entitled to VA bennies. God knows they aren't great, but Uncle Sugar did not tell him to go fuck himself.

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Response to sarge43 (Reply #28)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 06:20 PM

57. He has no proof that he was the one that killed Bin Laden and so what if he did? It was his job.

 

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Response to valerief (Reply #1)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:25 PM

72. The same for most Americans, you quit your 'job' and you lose your work benefits.

There may be some kind of 'early retirement' package deals but that's it. He needs to get a job if the book won't support him.


Watch, in a couple months the republicans will be using him for some political position.

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Response to Sunlei (Reply #72)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:06 PM

80. I don't risk my life for my employer, though. nt

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 03:38 PM

2. Anything that sheds light on this problem, experienced by so many, is a good thing.

Personally, his going on a press tour seems a bit unseemly, if that's what he's doing.

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Response to NYC_SKP (Reply #2)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 03:44 PM

8. Right, SKP,

and sounds like he's hyping his treatment, which is likely the usual treatment (without 'Go fuck yourself') of others similarly situated. A book in the works, maybe? 'Retirement' costs.

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Response to elleng (Reply #8)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:31 PM

26. He probably had to strike while the iron was hot, so to speak. After 3 years his

story might not be as sensational as it is now. Book plus movie deal sounds more like it. Perhaps they offered him enough to cover his medical insurance, plus more...

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Response to CTyankee (Reply #26)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:39 PM

31. Right, yank,

but doubt they offered him anything.
How's the snow in your neighborhood???

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Response to elleng (Reply #31)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:51 PM

35. Looking forward to my 4th day in captivity tomorrow. City still CLOSED.

Neighbor just picked up some groceries and a pinot noir for us. No plow guy in sight today. Hopefully, tomorrow. My other neighbor, a doc at Yale, shoveled our front step so we could get the door open! That woman is strong!

So, with food, wine and hot showers we'll be OK...

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Response to CTyankee (Reply #35)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:56 PM

37. Glad you've got the necessities!

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Response to elleng (Reply #37)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 05:08 PM

43. Oh, and heat and electricity, which I am thankful for!

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Response to CTyankee (Reply #35)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 06:50 PM

63. where do the critters (esp. dogs)

go to potty?

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Response to LibGranny (Reply #63)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 07:03 PM

64. I don't have one but I worried about that when the snow first fell...

neighbor has a little one. They're walking him now in the plowed out portion of the street (we only have one half of our streets plowed by the city at this point). Before that I guess they just let him out and hoped for the best...I'll have to ask them.

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Response to CTyankee (Reply #64)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 07:05 PM

65. I had a dachshund for 15 years and she HATED snow!

Can't say I blamed her though considering the circumstances! So that was my first thought when you all got all that snow! Thanks for the answer.

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Response to LibGranny (Reply #65)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 07:18 PM

68. Their dog is pretty little too, and very short, tho not as much as a dachshund.

Oy, your poor dachshund...so close to the ground and the snow...musta been really cold on her!

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Response to CTyankee (Reply #68)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:06 PM

70. It was definitely cringeworthy!

I can't imagine all that snow! I've seen ppl on here say they'd rather have the snow than tornadoes but I can say I'd rather have tornadoes! You do get some advance warning and can prepare!

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Response to LibGranny (Reply #65)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:30 PM

73. lol, reminds me how dachshunds all love to burrow under the blankets but not in the snow :)

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Response to Sunlei (Reply #73)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 09:59 AM

93. Oh yeah, she had a knack for rolling herself up

in her blanket till all you could see was her nose!

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 03:39 PM

3. Sorry, doubter here.

They may have told him there is no longer coverage for him and his family, as would be the case for other Federal employees in similar situations, but 'Go fuck yourself' sounds like a gratuitous dramatization, either by him, the guardian, or both.

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Response to elleng (Reply #3)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 03:48 PM

12. I thought the same thing

I was going to respond at Salon but thought I'd wait till the article turned up here.

Of course, there's really no information to go by - how many years of service, the nature of his release from the Navy, etc. - so it would be helpful for the vets on the site to chime in.

It certainly sounds to me like he's been treated the way anyone would be treated after his service has completed. Sure, he participated in a highly publicized military action, and he seems to have done with valor. That's super. But the military is like almost anything else. First, what have you done for me lately? And once you're out, you're out, regardless of your exploits. There are thousands of soldiers, sailors, marines, and, yes, even civil servants, who have served their country nobly, with sacrifice and courage. But when you're out, sorry, but you're out. The perks are gone. The benefits are gone. It's nothing personal. Really. That said, you would think someone with those skills could find employment with any number of military contractors.

Since he hasn't revealed his identity, we certainly don't know who he is. I don't see how anyone else could find out, unless he releases that information himself, the way other Seals on the that operation have done. So why the paranoia? That seems uncalled for and might be symptomatic of something else. PTSD?

Again, no judgment here. Just an observation based on that brief article.

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Response to matt819 (Reply #12)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:00 PM

21. I'm actually a little surprised any of these SEALS are speaking about the raid

Just going on my experience with the SEALS I knew. They just didn't talk about their "jobs" - at all.

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Response to Siwsan (Reply #21)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 10:25 AM

95. My cousin was a Seal in the 1st Iraq war. He said, " we took out their mines (at sea),

then put our mines out. Then we went onshore and did some stuff and came back. That was all he ever said about it.

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Response to elleng (Reply #3)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:00 PM

19. The 'Go fuck yourself', line.

Is never said in those words, but the meaning is clear!!!

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Response to elleng (Reply #3)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 11:17 PM

85. Yeah, plus you don't say that the head Team 6 SEAL

 

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Response to Ter (Reply #85)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 11:22 PM

87. Sh*t, you don't say that to ANYONE!

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 03:40 PM

4. He resigned. He didn't retire. There is no 'early retirement' provision for military benefits

Everybody who goes into the military knows that, once you leave, unless you have a service related issue, your benefits end when you receive your DD 214. I really don't know what he expected.

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Response to Siwsan (Reply #4)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 03:43 PM

7. Seriously - where's he been?

Of course it sucks that Americans can't count on basic health care, no matter who their employer is. I guess he expects to be treated better because of his outstanding service?

I wish all of us were treated better.

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Response to Siwsan (Reply #4)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 05:40 PM

49. I wonder if he's got a bit of a 'But I'm a hero!' complex?

I don't know what his deal is, but sounds possibly related.

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Response to AtheistCrusader (Reply #49)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 05:43 PM

52. That's the vibe I get

And since there's really no good way to verify his "I shot Bin Laden" claim, I see major red flags. Like I've said, the SEALS I knew, just did NOT brag, or talk about their assignments.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 03:41 PM

6. I'm going to say this, unpopular as it may be:

from personal anecdote only (take it for what it's worth), special forces members do not really seem to consider themselves part of the rest of the military, but something above and beyond. I have no doubt that this guy thought he would get some special consideration for his service that other veterans who separate before retirement don't get. The question is, does he deserve what 20-year retirees get? I don't know.

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Response to TwilightGardener (Reply #6)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 03:46 PM

9. Factual is good, 'popular' or not.

Thanks

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Response to elleng (Reply #9)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:00 PM

20. I am guessing it's coming as a shock to him to be treated like

the rest of the regular military at his rank--just another veteran. From what I have heard, they have a totally different lifestyle and unique culture, apart from average troops. What a letdown it must be to have accomplished something historic and heroic, and not be able to trade on that. I do feel a little bad for him. But my husband is a retiree, he put in the TIME to get the bennies, simple as that.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 03:47 PM

10. I don't know if I want to believe this or not

Help me out. I spent one tour of duty in the navy being honorably discharged in October of '70 and I didn't use my VA healthcare until my 54th birthday because of a DVT and spent a week in the hospital. I was awarded disability at that time. How is what this man is saying jive with my experience?

One of my tours of duty in the Navy was teaching survival to guys like this guy at the SERE school east of San Diego.

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Response to madokie (Reply #10)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 03:55 PM

16. Post # 4 discusses: 'No early retirement.'

'Everybody who goes into the military knows that, once you leave, unless you have a service related issue, your benefits end when you receive your DD 214. I really don't know what he expected.'

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 03:47 PM

11. If he is indeed the guy that killed OBL

Just about any Defense Contractor will pay him very well to just shake hands and schmooze.....

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Response to Burma Jones (Reply #11)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 03:49 PM

14. He needs to keep that part of his identity hidden, though.

For his and his family's safety. Which is why I wouldn't run around talking to reporters if I were him, but hey...

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Response to TwilightGardener (Reply #14)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:02 PM

22. True 'dat....

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 03:49 PM

13. Republicans may make you a hero while you are in active duty status

But once you are retired, or leave Active duty, you are dead to them. You are on your own.. Veterans, no matter who they are..are ignored by Republican Politicians. As for Tea Baggers, their view is no one is ENTITLED to anything. Not even those who have served their country. Not even if you sacrificed a body part. You are not Entitled to anything.

Baka tame! Neboken Ja Neyo!

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 03:51 PM

15. Who is responsible for ruining the Veterans Job Bill that was in Congress last year? GOP.

Obstructionism is taking this country downward. I would be ashamed to vote for any Republicans who voted to refuse help to our soldiers who have returned home to the nothingness that this nation is becoming due to obstructionism and greed.

I hope someone can help him with the VA Health Care System. A Means test should help him receive low cost or free care. The family might qualify for Medicaid, just apply. The County Hospital District, Eligibility Office, should be able to direct the contacts and applications.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 03:56 PM

18. They would have let him sit at a desk and evaluate video games if he wanted.

They would have given him any reasonable duty assignment he requested for the remainder of his time until retirement. All he had to do was STFU and quit whining.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:14 PM

23. Early retirement for the military is twenty years.

 

So why would he get out after 16 years unless he had a disability or he failed at getting promoted. His claim doesn't make any sense. And if he got an honorable discharge, he still was elgible for some benefits. He still can go to the V.A. also and apply. He just don't get all the benefits for soldiers that served the full 20 years. and in order to get a disability for early release, you have to go to a medical review board. The only other ways is if they throw you out under UCMJ or you volunteered to end your enlistment. There are millions of vets out here, that you can't snow.

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Response to John2 (Reply #23)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:49 PM

34. If he no longer wanted the job I wonder what he could have done.

Would they have found a desk job for him to use to coast through another 4 years? Could he have done 4 years as a reservist to count toward 20 years? I ask, because I'm unsure of the details in military retirement. I wonder if his status as a Navy Seal he thought he'd get the bells and whistles that a 20 year retiree gets....

edited to add: And he could get a seriously good job with a defense contractor if he wanted.

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Response to tammywammy (Reply #34)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:13 PM

75. Exactly

Thank you. Every single active duty person knows you do not get a bloody thing if you choose to get out before your 20 years. I just don't understand how he couldn't do another 3 or 4 years and retire with his benefits intact and his life his own.

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Response to John2 (Reply #23)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 05:33 PM

47. Yes. I believe you are spot on this one.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:32 PM

27. Sorry! But welcome to the world MOST Americans live in, without military job security. nt

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Response to patrice (Reply #27)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 06:29 PM

60. Twenty years does not even come close to retierment in the civilian world.

 

He just wants to sell books and movies.

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Response to xtraxritical (Reply #60)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 06:34 PM

61. Tell me about it & The days of lots of us keeping a job even 10 years are way LONG gone, so it

doesn't even matter when retirement is vested.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:37 PM

29. Part of this is his own doing

He wasn't so concerned about security when he mouthed up about being the one that shot bin laden was he? I have doubts about some of the rest of what he is saying. The transition back to civilian life is not easy after 16 years and granted the military doesn't always help as much as they probably should but I doubt it is nearly as bad as he makes it out to be.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:38 PM

30. I've seen other guys quit the military and face this reality - 'Hey, where's gravy train?'

 

They do hard work, dangerous work, but it's all ladled out: the job, paycheck, future, 'toys', lifestyle, retirement. In civvy life, you have to go and get it - a different kind of difficult. I see it as a reality adjustment, one this guy hasn't made yet.

In related news - a friend who was in the marine spec forces - recon, told me awhile back that the guy who wrote the book on being a sniper would be 'taken care of'. 'They don't like that', he said, 'you watch'. Here we go again, I thought. The guy was Chris Kyle. Chris was the guy shot at the firing range by the ptsd guy he was 'helping'.

Now before I knew this guy I would have said oh shit happy coincidence. But now, no. Heard, and lived, too much. Spec forces guys usually just shut up - it's a class thing, at least that's what I always thought. It's a danger thing, too, apparently. Real ugly stories out there. They make good money. But it's no questions allowed. After retirement, from what I can tell, these guys are watched for 2 things, going rogue, and writing. Some stuff should come out, some shouldn't. It's dicey. I wonder how long our hero here will be allowed to go on like this. He sounds like a major whiner on one level, but he 's up against some pretty dark stuff on another. I think he'll shut up.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:40 PM

32. Looks like he made a bad decision, and now regrets it.

Should have stuck it out for the four years, then retired.

I guess he never paid attention to what his benefits were if he left before his full twenty.

Now he wants 'special' treatment? Why? He left, no one made that decision for him.


Hope he learns something from this.

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Response to Ikonoklast (Reply #32)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:52 PM

36. Got that right. None of us asked him to enlist, & retirement at 20 is the perk dangled to keep him…

He didn't take "early retirement." He chose to leave without approved cause before retirement was attained, and now regrets it. Rather than spouting this bullshit he should re-enlist. With his training, provided he had no marks against his service record, he'd be welcomed back. Now? Not so much. But maybe.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:56 PM

38. Did he expect to get an exception?

I'm confused as to what he expected.

I say that as a military spouse.



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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:58 PM

39. My question here is....

....is the guy complaining about the general policy towards servicemen who've taken earlier retirement and who he believes are getting the shaft,

....or....

....is he complaining because he's the guy who supposedly killed Bin Laden and therefore he should be afforded preferential treatment above others in the same situation?

If it's the former, then he might have some valid concerns.

If it's the latter, I'm not feeling much sympathy for him.

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Response to Tommy_Carcetti (Reply #39)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 05:11 PM

44. I have a feeling it's the latter, not the former. n/t

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Response to Tommy_Carcetti (Reply #39)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 05:17 PM

45. +1

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Response to Tommy_Carcetti (Reply #39)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 05:43 PM

51. Early retirement? No such thing.

After 20 years of active duty, released from active duty and placed in retired reserve status. Retirees can be recalled to active duty.

Less than 20 and either discharged, (gov't has no claim on the bod) or if still have time left on the contract. released from active duty and place on inactive reserve until time is up, then discharged.

If an enlisted gets out one day before hitting the big Two Oh, s/he gets exactly the same goodie bag as the one striper who bails after six months and one day. As noted up thread, he's either a bag of hair or a lying sack because anyone with 16 years on AD knows this. Most everyone with 16 days knows this. It's engraved on the barracks and berth walls

If I were What'shisface, I wouldn't run that whine du jour past an 11Bravo who did four tours in the Stan. What'sit not the only member of US armed forces who routinely hang their hindquarters over the line.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:58 PM

40. So sad...

... for one, because being a Navy Seal doesn't give him some recompense for putting his life on the line for 16 years, not to mention the fact that he was the one who killed OBL. And two, why he feels he has to voice his discontent in Esquire magazine. I so wish he could have held on for 4 more years. Something just doesn't seem right. Why doesn't he realize his options, now that he's out, are limitless?

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 04:59 PM

41. Not Sure What To Make Of This

Is this person who he says he is, for starters.

When your read the full article it says he is eligible for health insurance for 5 years after leaving the service so that would bridge him until his retirement benefits begin, so somebody is wrong here.

Was this person expecting some kind of windfall for being the one who actually shot bin Laden and it simply didn't materialize. It sure sounds like the prudent thing would have been to wait for it to materialize before quitting your day job. Something better than driving a beer truck in Milwaukee, one assumes. Frankly, I don't think his story passes the smell test -- starting with whether this person is who he claims to be.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 05:02 PM

42. Yes, welcome to the last forty years

Uncle Sam has a long, not-so-proud history of pissing on its "heroes."

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 05:27 PM

46. Siwsan posted: I'm actually a little surprised any of these SEALS are speaking about the raid

My only experience with these people would be my father. Dad was Army special forces and those people don't talk about missions except with others of their kind.

Dad has left us but if he were still alive I believe he would've been extremely angry at this showboat. Perhaps enough to offer to put a 45 caliber pill in his skull.

It makes me wonder if this guy really took out bin Ladin. Regular combat vets don't talk about combat much less special forces of whatever stripe.

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Response to TexasProgresive (Reply #46)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 05:53 PM

53. I'm thinking the cat was let out of the bag once some people started

cashing in hollywood-style...

People are human, and want in on the book deals and technical consultancy fees and sit next to Ms. So-and-so at the Oscars...

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 05:38 PM

48. I recognize the 20 year requirement but....

 

I think there are some extra-ordinary missions that may require some adjustments....

I believe in equality and equity of treatment....but I think there are some missions that may require some adjustments.

My father who flew as a turret-gunner in WWII, got extra "credit" for especially dangerous missions. He volunteered for those both so that he could reduce his total number of missions but also so that he could spare men with wives and families the additional risk.

Why don't we do some form of evaluation on a military person's life? It seems reasonable to me.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 05:40 PM

50. When you commit murder for hire for the biggest organized crime faction on the planet

What else would you expect? I know I know, I'm not allowed to say that it was a wanton crime to murder Osama in cold blood - but the truth remains that it was.

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Response to jimlup (Reply #50)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:24 PM

71. No--that's your truth. Are you suggesting the President committed a "wanton crime" ordering

that Osama be killed?

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Response to msanthrope (Reply #71)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:59 PM

84. Yes... it is really fairly simple if you are capable of seeing beyond the accepted propaganda.

And don't confuse my statement with saying that I support Al Qaida or terrorism. I don't. I support legal process. Seal team 6 had an obligation to attempt to take Osama alive. They didn't even try. They ran some silly cover story about an encounter in the bedroom but don't be naive. It was wanton premeditated murder. And ANY US President in the last 60 years would have done exactly the same thing because EVERY US president in the last 60 years is a blatant war criminal. History is written by those with power. Laws are enforced for those with power. Don't be naive. Open your eyes and see the truth of the world.

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Response to jimlup (Reply #50)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 04:03 AM

91. If it was a "wanton crime", then fuck yeah civil disobedience.

And fuck Osama.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 05:57 PM

54. What civilian job does commando train you for?

 

I mean you're basically a professional assassin. If all you've trained for in life is fighting and killing, what use can you put those skills to in civilian life? Particularly when you're burnt out. Security, police work and merc would seem to be out, so what can this guy do for a living?

You would think the guy that killed OBL could write some books or do motivational speaking at the corporate level and clean up. Something like that.

I hope he makes out.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 06:01 PM

55. He gets 5 years of healthcare on quitting for being combat vet

so it's not accurate. This article is taking advantage of an upset man who is lashing out. There is also a transition program, so the military does not just say Bye and FU.

If he had stuck it out for 4 more years he would have a pension.

Most soldiers see that what he's saying is not accurate.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 06:04 PM

56. He "retired" before his time...

what does he expect.

Try that shit in a normal, everyday world type job.

You quit and you are not at retirement age OR you didn't fulfill your commitment...you get nada.

No sympathy from me...man up and shut your pie hole.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 06:26 PM

58. well, that's how they do it.

Maybe he doesn't get it?

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 06:28 PM

59. No offense to the Seal, but..........

he should have known what would happen to his benefits. He should have had an exit interview. What he can do, is re-up in the Naval Reserve & his time will count toward retirement. I'm not sure, but I think 2 years of Reserve duty is equal to one year of active duty, therefore in six years he would have time served for 20 years.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 06:36 PM

62. Book deal coming up, probably complete with phony NYT's Bestseller support for dishing on the

government, for Glen Greenwald's fans out there.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 07:10 PM

66. Welcome to the world the rest of us live in

I could put in 25 years at my current employer and when that's up I get jack shit for healthcare coverage until I'm 65 and can go on Medicare.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 07:12 PM

67. The guys on that raid obviously rate high on the list of targets for terrorists' revenge.

They need extra security, and I have no problem with us taxpayers footing the bill for it. Abandoning them should not be an option.

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Response to tclambert (Reply #67)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 11:36 PM

88. I agree with you on the extra security. n/t

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Response to tclambert (Reply #67)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 01:46 PM

102. If they all kept their mouths shut like they were supposed to, it wouldn't be a problem.

I do agree that some opportunistic individuals shouldn't ruin the safety of the whole group, and now that they may be identified some kind of protections should be made.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 07:57 PM

69. Gotta raise the BS flag on this one.

 

Those of us who have served know - and I mean really KNOW - that you don't get retirement benefits unless you retire with at least twenty years, or are medically retired. You can't punch out at sixteen years and then complain that you're not provided with a retirement package. Serve less then twenty and you get VA benefits, you can take your TSP with you, and you can get some hiring preference for a government job. But if you want health coverage and a monthly pension...keep repeating the number twenty. This is something ingrained in service members. So to be whinging about no retirement benefits at sixteen years is a crock. (And did he really want the SeaBees to fix up his house. Really?!)

PS - And if he did come back in and retire, he actually could afford a pot to piss in and the window to toss it out.

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Response to MyTwoSense (Reply #69)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 01:35 PM

101. There is an "eaarly retirement" for some individuals.

If the military no longer needs (or has to many of) some people in a certain position(MOS/AFSCs), the military offers an early retirement from time to time.

Also some individuals retire and got, let's say a 50% retirement, but have only been in a few years. Their base pay is rather paltry and their retirement pay is 50% of paltry. So he may complain that he isn't getting enough.

Others have decided to settle in an area with no military or VA facilities within several hundred miles of where they chose to live. Then they complain that they have no medical or commissary/Bx privileges.

The Navy Seal who killed OBL would be "Golden" for the rest of his career. He would easily get a promotion or two before reaching retirement eligibility. If he left on his own volition, he must have thought that he would get more $$$ on the outside.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:17 PM

76. Welcome to the corporate war machine.

It's inexcusable, but I've seen it all my life. The military chews you up, spits you out and fuck you. Try talking to a homeless person and you'll likely find that they served their country and lost just about everything because of it. The VA is substandard in most cases. You'd think a country that worships war and soldiers would take better care of them.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:31 PM

77. Cogs don't get healthcare....

...cogs get replaced.



K&R

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:02 PM

79. The Esquire article is a good read.

Sadly, he is not the only military person abandoned by our government. There are tens of thousands out there and so many more to come.

War is hell and so is life after being a part of that war.

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Response to merh (Reply #79)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 01:52 AM

89. I read the article too

It gives great perspective on the challenges, the rush, the secrecy, and ultimate frustration of participating in the most elite fighting force in the world.

I sympathize with the guy in some ways - he knew what he'd be forfeiting by leaving before his twenty years, but there is no way the country can abandon (especially the security and well being) of those like "the shooter". I also hope the country does a better job finding a way to transition such people back to civilian life.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)


Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:19 PM

82. I'm pretty sure he can get healthcare at any VA

Granted it may not be 100% free, but he's service connected to a degree.

VA Healthcare can vary depending where you go, but every major large city VA center I've worked at provides care that's on par with major University hospitals.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:22 PM

83. It makes me wonder what the REAL shooter is doing these days

and how many more "I'm the one's" will come forward to take the credit.

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Response to tavernier (Reply #83)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 11:19 PM

86. "If" there is a shooter...

 

n/t

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 02:58 AM

90. I'm sure he has options, he just needs to get up and do the work

Look at the global interest in Matt Bisonette's book. I'm sure a lot of people would be interested if this guy wrote a book. There are many ways to make money after being involved in special operations. I hear the money in private security isn't bad either.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 08:41 AM

92. Question

for those who know. I know next to nothing about the internal workings of the military. Would he be required to be in Special Forces for 20 years? Is it reasonable that he could have moved to some "regular" job. I mean, I get that he's "above" all that, being Special Forces, but given his willingness, could he realistically expect to move to a less stressful job? Again, I don't have an agenda, I'm just wondering as a person who is interested in combat trauma. I mean, 20 years in Special Forces? Yikes.

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Response to RobinA (Reply #92)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 10:08 AM

94. No--I don't think Special Forces guys are expected to keep doing it for

more than a couple of enlistments, just because the physical training and deployment tempo would be too much for a 20 year career. Most of them, I think, start out in other military career fields and "try out" for special forces. I am certain he could have transitioned out--many people in the military transition or cross-train into different career fields and jobs and units. My husband did, several times.

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Response to TwilightGardener (Reply #94)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 11:46 AM

99. Thanks For Your Response nm

*

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Response to RobinA (Reply #92)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 02:29 PM

104. It is a "volunteer" specialty, like being an aircrewman.

This gentleman said he had medical issues, too--he could have easily been put on limited duty and set to pushing paper somewhere. He could have transitioned to recruiting duty (a popular option) for the balance of his time in service. There are a number of positions he could have held, easily, had he decided to stay in until his retirement kicked in. Certainly, with "shooting Bin Ladin" on his resume, he'd be given consideration. Certainly his commanding officer would go to bat for him, and that would be all it would take.

There is something that is decidedly "off" with this account. As I have said elsewhere, I am very surprised at Phil Bronstein. This report, written by him, would not pass his "editor's eye" if someone else handed it in to him. A HUGE chunk of this story is missing, and it just does not make sense.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 10:43 AM

96. He should have hung in for three more years. Does he really think he deserves a bounty?

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 10:43 AM

97. Everybody and the world knows you don't get shit for doing anything less than 20 yrs.

There are no "special circumstances".

It is what it is.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 07:57 PM

107. Presume that he is telling the truth and Killed OBL - thanks for that. But the service didn't

abandon him - indeed, in effect, he abandoned the Navy. If he was injured and unable to continue based upon service-connected disability, there is military retirement eligibility specifically for that.



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