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Fri Dec 28, 2012, 11:27 PM

Saudis detain 41 for 'plotting' to celebrate Christmas

Source: USA Today

Religious police in a province in northwestern Saudi Arabia have raided a house and detained more than 41 guests for "plotting to celebrate Christmas," according to a police statement, Al-Akhbar reported Friday.

The newspaper, published in Beirut, said the raid in Al-Jouf is the latest in a string of crackdowns on residents perceived to threaten Saudi Arabia's strict religious code.

Al-Akhbar said the host of the alleged Christmas gathering is reported to be an "Asian diplomat." Guests included 41 Christians, as well as two Saudi Arabian and Egyptian Muslims.

The host and the two Muslims were said to be "severely intoxicated," the police statement said.

Read more: http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2012/12/28/saudi-arabia-plotting-celebrate-christmas-religious-police/1796747/



Our 'allies.'

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Reply Saudis detain 41 for 'plotting' to celebrate Christmas (Original post)
onehandle Dec 2012 OP
AldoLeopold Dec 2012 #1
Demenace Dec 2012 #18
AldoLeopold Dec 2012 #30
JackRiddler Dec 2012 #23
leveymg Dec 2012 #27
AldoLeopold Dec 2012 #31
JackRiddler Dec 2012 #33
AldoLeopold Dec 2012 #35
JackRiddler Dec 2012 #36
AldoLeopold Dec 2012 #39
BigDemVoter Dec 2012 #34
JackRiddler Dec 2012 #37
oldhippydude Dec 2012 #2
Archae Dec 2012 #11
oldhippydude Dec 2012 #14
freshwest Dec 2012 #15
xtraxritical Dec 2012 #22
treestar Dec 2012 #21
R. Daneel Olivaw Dec 2012 #3
triplepoint Dec 2012 #4
Walk away Dec 2012 #5
Lydia Leftcoast Dec 2012 #8
Thor_MN Dec 2012 #6
hughee99 Dec 2012 #7
Purveyor Dec 2012 #9
JDPriestly Dec 2012 #10
muriel_volestrangler Dec 2012 #17
Demenace Dec 2012 #19
leveymg Dec 2012 #28
MADem Dec 2012 #25
AldoLeopold Dec 2012 #32
jillan Dec 2012 #12
The Green Manalishi Dec 2012 #13
trusty elf Dec 2012 #16
Gregorian Dec 2012 #20
MADem Dec 2012 #24
dorkulon Dec 2012 #26
jmowreader Dec 2012 #29
Swede Atlanta Dec 2012 #38

Response to onehandle (Original post)

Fri Dec 28, 2012, 11:33 PM

1. So what?

We live in a secular world - they can live in a religious one, but, in my opinion, it weakens them.

Let them weaken themselves. Let us rise and include, while they exclude. It is not our place to interfere in their religious laws or customs.

They're only allies while they're useful, then, when they're no longer useful, we can separate from their company.

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Response to AldoLeopold (Reply #1)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 11:59 AM

18. So it is now okay for the Saudis to arrest those attempting to celebrate an holiday openly?

 

..But Iran with no such open attack on non muslims are the bad guys. Iran - a truly near secular nation is daily vilified as Islamists while the true face of the Islamists get a pass! So, this is not about the tags we hear daily about Iran, it is about who is against Iran!

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Response to Demenace (Reply #18)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 06:04 PM

30. Well I'm not against Iran per se

Though I know the "United States" is against Iran. Hell, I didn't vote for Clinton in the primaries because she went on Bill O'Reilly and said she wanted to bomb Iran.

I'm a big fan of real politics you see. I'd just as soon invade countries for their natural resources instead of saying its for this "freedom" garbage.

Most of the hijackers on 9/11 were Saudis or from the Saudi Peninsular nations. They were inadvertently funded by Saudi Sheiks and their runaway prince. Iran is a sponsor of terrorism as well, and they have oil and juicy uranium deposits in the Kush mountains.

I'd just as soon invade them all and say why we were doing it or, more preferably, not do it at all and leave them to their nonsense - but that's not how this game is played I'm gathering.

The one thing I won't sanction is invading or cutting relations because of religious issues mixed with politics. You have to be pretty dense, fanatical, or just plain nuts to do what they did in Saudi Arabia. I have empathy, but no sympathy, for these people, and I'm sick of this Johnny Freedomseed approach to American foreign policy.

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Response to AldoLeopold (Reply #1)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 01:14 PM

23. The US fights wars for Saudi Arabia.

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Response to JackRiddler (Reply #23)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 02:28 PM

27. Many US and UK corporations and media have Saudi/GCC ownership or control.

All these companies also contribute enormous amounts money in federal elections.

That explains a great deal about news content and what does and doesn't get covered, and why, as well as the wars we fight.

Follow the money.

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Response to JackRiddler (Reply #23)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 06:05 PM

31. The US fights wars for Saudi Oil

Big difference. I'm cool with that - as long as we don't say its to free this or that people. Oil is undesirable, but currently necessary, I'm afraid.

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Response to AldoLeopold (Reply #31)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 06:29 PM

33. You're talking about killing millions to fill your gas tank.

You're cool with that. It's "undesirable, but currently necessary."

What's a genocide or two? Those are foreigners. We need oil!

Do you think this logic makes you sophisticated somehow? Will they give you a membership in the CFR?

Even on the terms you claim, it's untrue; naive Machiavellianism for the masses. The net effect of US imperialist policy has been to raise the price of oil and make the supply less secure.

The US fights wars for those interests that hold the most sway within the military-industrial-Congressional-policymaking complex. For their profit. To fulfill their geostrategic visions. Saudi Arabia is a junior partner in this alliance of interests and has a degree of influence.

It certainly has nothing to do with securing oil for you or "the American people."

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Response to JackRiddler (Reply #33)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 06:40 PM

35. Well that escalated quickly

I never said anything about genocide - geez. I don't want to fight for oil - but if we're going to do it, and its naive to think we won't, we might as well say we're doing it.

Shit man, I'm an environmental scientist - I'm kinda against petroleum based economies, especially because its launched our carrying capacity into the stratosphere.

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Response to AldoLeopold (Reply #35)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 06:52 PM

36. Nonchalance about war is not a virtue.

The US fights wars for Saudi Oil
Big difference. I'm cool with that - as long as we don't say its to free this or that people. Oil is undesirable, but currently necessary, I'm afraid.


What does "I'm cool with that" mean?

Is it an escalation for me to be too explicit about the consequences of your statements? Should I have just written, "I'm not"?

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Response to JackRiddler (Reply #36)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 08:07 PM

39. I'm not virtuous

But I am cynical. I'm sorry. I just am.

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Response to JackRiddler (Reply #23)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 06:37 PM

34. More like the USA fights wars for Saudi Arabia's O-I-L!!

and they try to couch it in such bullshit terms-- "fighting for freedom" or other such horse shit.

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Response to BigDemVoter (Reply #34)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 06:56 PM

37. It's not so easy to separate.

US policy makers have always been married to the Saudi monarchy. Ever since That's how they get access to the oil, in their minds. Which is stupid -- since at least until now the oil would have sold on the world market regardless, and surely for lower prices without all the wars and crises.

The military-industrial complex generates wars for profit and to fulfill geostrategic visions that have nothing to do with reality. (They are so remote and fantastic and ultimately destructive that the practitioners are forced to reassure themselves by calling it realpolitik.)

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Response to onehandle (Original post)

Fri Dec 28, 2012, 11:37 PM

2. wonder when fokkks is going to cover this....

this is the real deal Bill

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Response to oldhippydude (Reply #2)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 12:38 AM

11. Faux or O'Reilly never will.

A Saudi bigwig owns a big chunk of News Corp, which Faux "news" is a part of.

That's why Saudi outrages never get even mentioned, much less criticized on Faux "news" programs.

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Response to Archae (Reply #11)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 01:36 AM

14. which was my point...........

should have found a way to show sarcasm

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Response to Archae (Reply #11)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 01:39 AM

15. +1,000

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Response to Archae (Reply #11)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 12:50 PM

22. The Bush's (Sr. & Jr.) are personal friends of the Saudi Royal family.

 

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Response to oldhippydude (Reply #2)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 12:49 PM

21. good point

They can quit whining about the alleged War on Christmas in the US

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Response to onehandle (Original post)

Fri Dec 28, 2012, 11:38 PM

3. And the West supports the Saudis.


They can knock down the WTC, but Christmas is bad.

Oh well. I hope our $$ helps them enforce total loyalty.

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Response to onehandle (Original post)

Fri Dec 28, 2012, 11:47 PM

4. Saudi Arabia--Another F_ed-UP Country

 

I spent a lifetime there during my year-long hitch as an ex-pat working an engineering contract in Riyadh. Never saw a more repressive and hypocritical people...except maybe when I worked in mainland China. I'll hold my powder on that until I see the right news story about that country here on DU.

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Response to onehandle (Original post)

Fri Dec 28, 2012, 11:53 PM

5. Years ago a friend of my Dad's landed in a Saudi Jail while they were working on a project...

outside of Riyadh. He was in for six months for possessing alcohol. It would have been longer but their company had good relations with the local government. My Dad would drive out to the desert to "visit" him every Saturday and bring food and money to pay the guards. They don't feed prisoners. Your food must come from the outside and it can't be too good or it will be stolen by the jailers or other prisoners. My Dad could never actually speak to him but he would stand at a big gate along with other visitors while the prisoners were walked across a far courtyard. You had to yell at each other. As my Dad tells it, his friend barely responded after a few months.

When his company finally managed to have him released he was taken out on a stretcher and put directly on a plane to England and into a hospital.

Everyone who works or visits Saudi knows that this can happen if you break the rules. This is the law of the country. I have been on flights out of Riyadh when, as soon as you clear Saudi airspace, the bar carts start to roll and Muslim and Christian alike bang down expensive scotch like it's water. That same bottle of scotch down on the ground can get you thrown in prison for years.

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Response to Walk away (Reply #5)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 12:11 AM

8. Yes, one of my grad school roommates from Thailand had a Thai friend who was a flight attendant

on the Saudi national airline. (Flight attendant is not considered a decent job for a Saudi woman, so all the flight attendants are foreigners.)

She said that all the Saudis would get on the plane in traditional dress, the women in full abaya, and then, as soon as the captain announced that they were leaving Saudi airspace, everyone (women included) would take off their traditional robes to reveal the latest fashions and start ordering alcoholic drinks.

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Response to onehandle (Original post)

Fri Dec 28, 2012, 11:56 PM

6. I read the headline and was thinking, "Isn't he in the hospital?"

They really should be detaining 43...

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Response to onehandle (Original post)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 12:01 AM

7. It's the "war on Christmas"! n/t

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Response to onehandle (Original post)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 12:24 AM

9. Time to embargo and boycott all Saudi goods and services!!! LOL. eom

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Response to onehandle (Original post)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 12:25 AM

10. A lot of DUers criticize Israel for the fact that it is identified as the "Jewish" state.

But thus far, Israel does not punish Muslims for practicing their religion.

Where is the outrage about Saudi Arabia?

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Response to JDPriestly (Reply #10)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 07:17 AM

17. The outrage is there pretty much all the time

Just about all DUers that have any opinion about Saudi Arabia have a bad one. It's here in this thread. No-one likes Saudi Arabia here. Maybe you just haven't read DU threads about the country before.

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Response to muriel_volestrangler (Reply #17)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 12:07 PM

19. Someone from another favored nation had to jump in...

 

This had to somehow become something about Israel when for once the topic is what it is the Saudis? One favored nation cannot standby while we discuss another favored nation, seems someone is feeling ignored here!

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Response to Demenace (Reply #19)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 02:41 PM

28. KSA and Israel are allies of convenience. They both want the US to knock off Iran for them.

You really think you own us?

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Response to JDPriestly (Reply #10)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 02:15 PM

25. No, but they do discriminate against Jews for so doing.

As long as you want to try to hijack this thread, here's some light reading for you to keep you occupied:

http://blogs.rj.org/wrj/2012/12/14/reform-movement-dismayed-by-continued-religious-discrimination-in-israel/

New York, N.Y., December 14, 2012 – Friday morning, Israeli police detained four women as they prayed at the Western Wall in Jerusalem. The group of 138 men and women was organized by Women of the Wall, an organization that fights for women’s right to pray freely, while donning prayer shawls and other religious articles, at the Western Wall. Among those detained was Reform Rabbi Elyse Frishman, senior rabbi of Barnert Temple in Franklin Lakes, NJ, the oldest synagogue in New Jersey and editor of the Reform Movement’s Reform Movement’s siddur (prayer book), CCAR’s Mishkan T’filah, used in over 700 North American congregations.


In response to these detentions, URJ President Rabbi Rick Jacobs, said, “The Reform Movement is shocked and disappointed by the continuous discrimination against non-Orthodox worshipers at the Western Wall, the holiest site for Jews. The Kotel should be open to the entire Jewish people and must not be used as a tool of division. We urge the Israeli government to repeal these discriminatory policies and be true to the democratic ideals on which the state was founded. This incident is a visible reminder of what non-Orthodox Jews face every day in Israel. Because of our deep love for Israel we are committed to ensuring that Jews are free to practice Judaism in whichever way they choose.”


There's plenty of religious boneheadedness to go around.

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Response to JDPriestly (Reply #10)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 06:08 PM

32. I should hope not

I criticize Israel for wanting a state that hasn't existed for over 2000 years in the heartland of a people who have dwelt there, in relative peace, for 2000 years.

They could be Buddhist Anarchist Socialists for all I care, it still would change the fact I don't have a car. (ahh Ferris)

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Response to onehandle (Original post)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 12:50 AM

12. There you go Bill - we found your war on Christmas.

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Response to onehandle (Original post)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 01:04 AM

13. Good thing those Christian Republicans would never condone ANYTHING the Saudi's do.


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Response to The Green Manalishi (Reply #13)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 06:35 AM

16. Saud and Fraud

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Response to onehandle (Original post)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 12:48 PM

20. Well at least you won't find helicopter Santas with synchronized roof lighting.

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Response to onehandle (Original post)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 02:08 PM

24. So stupid. It's not like Isa (Jesus) is a stranger to Islam.

He's regarded as a prophet--just not "THE" prophet, on a par with Moses and Ibrahim.

Isa ain't the enemy, but the Religious Police in SA sure seem to be, don't they? What a bunch of dumbass hardasses. Either that, or someone got wind of a nice stash of Johnny Walker and other nice beverages at that shindig, and they wanted to "confiscate" it for their own purposes.

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Response to onehandle (Original post)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 02:25 PM

26. You had me at "Religious police."

Just plain fucked up.

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Response to onehandle (Original post)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 03:08 PM

29. The Taliban modeled themselves after the Saudis

The Saudis also funded the Taliban. If you sometimes can't tell the difference between the two...well, there's a reason.

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Response to onehandle (Original post)

Sat Dec 29, 2012, 06:57 PM

38. Where if FAUX News' broadcast about the "war on Christmas" in Saudi Arabia?

 

This country, and most western-style democracies, accept "freedom of religion". Unfortunately in this country for many that means some form of Christianity and of course we let the Jews do their thing because we want the end times to come with the rebuilding of the Temple in Jerusalem. But if you are Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, etc. this "freedom" does not really apply to you.

The U.S. has long ignored its human rights principles (including freedom of religion) if the country in question has some intrinsic value to us. Saudi has lots of oil and our economy needs oil so we look the other way.

It is the worst of hypocrisy and another reason why the U.S. is not "God's chosen" country nor are we a "City on a Hill" or exceptional in any way. As a nation we are self-serving narcissists that will do anything to get our way.

I realize many of us disagree with this but I think that succinctly expresses the truth.

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