North Korean satellite 'tumbling out of control,' US officials say

to bomb North Korea.

He makes me sick.

Even the Chinese facepalmed over this. Howsabout launching some food into mouths, Kim?

PB

...an idea what's going to happen to the object as we speak. However, there was a situation in the last few years with a Russian satellite which was also in a degrading orbit and also out of control and even our best estimates were something like an 8-12+ hour window- which basically meant about the best we could do was guess which side of the planet it would likely come down on and that was it.

Also, you can't really "shoot something down" that's in orbit. Not like in the airplane sense.

Unless the North Koreans are willing to talk about what's in the satellite, breaking it up into smaller pieces through some sort of explosion could only cause more problems. I think we have things in space and on the ground which can blind satellites but I'm not even sure we'd try to take it out with a missile if it was coming down over our territory: It's probably safer to keep it in one big chunk than break it up into many chunks while that high up.

PB

It's going 20k+ miles per hour. It needs to be slowed down to reenter the atmosphere. Shooting it will only put lots of debris in LEO. The best thing we can do is extend an offer to help them stabilize it or force a reentry over the Pacific. They will decline, but at least it's something. They might not be able to communicate with it but we probably could if they gave us the frequencies and the code, etc.

...and take a crack at it.

What could possibly go wrong, other than a miss?

ETA the only major problem I have tonight is cloud cover. The high-altitude winds are kind of tricky too.

beknown as the Dong shot heard 'round the World.

... I'll hold your beer while you take the shot, and yell "Boo-yah!" when you hit it.

If I was smart enough, I'd post the video on youtube.

Good hunting, slackmaster!

..... and they are unlikely to have been able to launch anything massive enough to survive re-entry. Not really something to be concerned about.

I'd be surprised if there was any "communicating with it" or "forcing a re-entry" relevant to this object.

I'm no physicist but the thing is going about 15-20 thousand miles an hour AND out of control, not even a stable orbit, so I don't think there is any human technology in existence to even attempt something like that. All the rest of the world can do is track it and hope it lands in the ocean or in an unpopulated area like the middle of the Sahara. Who knows what it is anyway. It might not even be a working satellite in the sense that they put it up there for communication or some nefarious purpose, just a hunk of junk they shot into space for the hell of it. Hopefully it will mostly burn up in the atmosphere and there will only be small pieces to look out for.

is still floating around up there making it a big problem for intact satellites.

The Chinese shot down a satellite in a stable orbit from a land base. Much of the debris is still in orbit, creating a bit of a pain for everything else up there.

The US shot down a satellite in a failing orbit from a ship shortly after that. Since that orbit was already decaying, the debris fell back to Earth.

I imagine they did, as that was a primary criticism of the missile defense tests we had during the Bush era. The targets had transponders so successful hits were a sham. Thanks for pointing those out. I tried to look up how it was done, didn't find much.

Shooting down a non-friendly satellite would be a lot harder. How would they know exactly where it is? Radar isn't that accurate as far as I know, but I'm no rocket scientist.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Burnt_Frost

Aegis missile defense has a long track record of successful intercepts. Yes the initial tests did use transponders but that was 15 years and numerous successful tests ago.

So it was much less than 15 years ago. Also, that was the article that I checked. It does not say how the satellite was targeted and zeroed in on.

And the system has progressed a lot in the past 10 years.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RIM-161_Standard_Missile_3

and has been that accurate for a long, long time. The US has had anti-balistic-missile missiles since the 1960s.

This thing, whatever it is, apparently isn't in anything like a stable orbit. I say leave it and it will mostly burn up in the atmosphere with small pieces landing, well, somewhere. That is what I suspect will happen anyway. And if the Chinese want to shoot at an unstable piece of space junk, which I also suspect it is, they can explain the consequences if any critical satellites from other countries are damaged or destroyed in the process.

They've been plastering the entire country with statues and portraits of those guys. Why not put one really high, above the highest mountain - in space?

... on 2 Broke girls

I want to have his baby

capability of their rocket systems. Even if the 'satellite' is tumbling out of control, the main purpose of the launch may well of been achieved.

They just want to show that they can now hit anywhere in the world, or at least, are close to doing so. They have achieved that they've wanted for so long. Now hopefully they can focus on the people and get over the war drum beating.

And certainly will.

The next, and greater, challenge is hitting a target.

Yes, it would require a "laser designator" but still, LGBs are accurate, and a really old technology. Almost 40 years old.

I'll have you know that the North Korean air force has the sharpest-eyed bullet-throwers you can strap to the underside of a biplane!

That would be the ultimate lampoon.

needed for low earth orbit is the same 30,000 ft/sec needed for an ICBM.
A high school shop class could probably build a working replica of any of the first satellites that announced the space age with "beeps" from above.
This was a "throw weight" test.

'satellite' was probably a sham piece of machinery. All the n. koreans were doing is seeing if their INTERCONTINENTAL missile worked. maybe? I was writing when pampango was. great minds think alike.

Only the United States should be allowed to have ICBM's and nooqueler weapons.

(For you lurkers, I'm too lazy to look for the sarcasm thing)

(For you lurkers, I'm too lazy to look for the sarcasm thing.)

Pretty scary stuff!

I just went outside and saw it with my binoculars.


and im drunk.

if a picture has pixels, you can tell it's fake.

That includes a space shuttle. Nobody on the ground has ever been hurt. Launching satellites has been a proxy for ICBM technology since Sputnik.

If the satellite fell out of orbit, they'll have to replace it. Nice way to test your ballistic missile technology...

kinda remarkable to me. Would it not be better to have N.Korea sit at the table of nations and engage them as a sovereign nation trying to enter the 21st century instead of making them a perpetual enemy toy justify the need for more and more weapons of war? Maybe treating them as we would like them to be might actually help them become a sane nation. Obviously their people have something to offer just as all peoples around the world. We have during our history sat with some of the most brutal in-humane dictators as respected leaders of their nations...but they were the pariahs we liked. As long as Saddam was treated like a leader of his sovereign nation we were able to deal with him, supplying him with the very weapons we later said made him a bad person. Yet we were able to ally ourselves with the past Shah of Iran and Musharaff who overthrew and duly elected sovereign and set up a military dictatorship... but they were our pals. Look at the outcome. We refuse to deal with governments we don't like even when they are no real threat to us simply because their economic and social systems we view as a threat to capitalism. Cuba is another example. Think what these "outcast" nations and governments may have been able to contribute to the world had we not insisted on making them pariahs and labeled them "terrorists." Think who does the labeling and for what reasons. Our sons and daughters are sent off to die and we kill thousands for what purpose? Freedom and democracy? I think not. More for the power and wealth of the 2% of the world who are very good at making us believe black is white, evil is good, and lies are truth.

The North will likely continue to be a one-party dictatorship like China.

However, instead of workers being paid an average of 60 cents an hour to manufacture things heading to the United States, it'll be 25 cents an hour.

the US would trade with the country - not continue with sanctions.

The sad thing is the people of North Korea are taught from birth to hate the U.S. and all it stands for. I believe they will open up someday, but it's going to be a while.

Juche is a pretty ugly ideology that way.

North Korea has every right to launch rockets

And then we get to start offering our opinion, especially when those missiles fly over our territory or the territory of our allies.

It should tell you something that even the Chinese condemned the launch.

Do you...feel the North Korean government is unfairly persecuted?

Just wondering.

PB

Does everyone get to object to them also?

PB

"Airspace" ends around the Karman Line by most definitions; orbit is well beyond that.

The United States does the very same thing

I would be a hypocrite if I held your view

Still, they've been the laughing stock of the international community with their rocket launches looking like an unstable and poorly constructed fireworks display. This "sort-of" successful launch solidifies Kim's rule and establishes North Korea as regional threat, more so than ever before. I focused on the implications of this in a recent article.

[link:http://unapologeticallyliberal.wordpress.com/2012/12/12/north-korea-crazy-with-a-side-of-rockets/|

The US has had far more missile failures than North Korea

Are we a laughing stock ?

Some people did call the US a laughing-stock as we were getting beat in the Moon Race by the Russians, including a string of failures.

Then we got our shit together and had a string of very successful launches, put a man on the Moon, sent probes to other planets, etc.

risk such failures. Not saying it's the best route for them to go or anything. Although, I'm not sure I really understand why any country has any legit right to condemn them trying. I read something about the rocket going over Japanese airspace, which seems like the only act that could be rightfully condemned. At the same time, I fully understand why various countries do not want the crazy bastards in charge of that country to have ICBMs that work.

are dangerous to ourselves.

We're all screwn, actually.

determine exactly what the satellite is supposed to do.

Geeezzzz, it's supposed to tumble.