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Thu Nov 29, 2012, 06:19 PM

Accused leaker Manning says he considered suicide while in custody

Source: CNN


By Larry Shaughnessy, CNN Pentagon Producer
updated 5:27 PM EST, Thu November 29, 2012

Fort Meade, Maryland (CNN) -- Army private Bradley Manning, charged in the largest leak of classified material in American history, spoke at length on Thursday about his treatment in military custody, saying he grew distressed and considered suicide at one point.

In a clear voice and often gesturing with his hands at a hearing at Ft. Meade, Maryland, the bi-spectacled Manning described his experiences publicly for the first time since his arrest more than two years ago.

The hearing was held to consider a defense motion to have his case dismissed on grounds his confinement so far has been harsh and has amounted to enough punishment.

At the very least, his lawyers hope the judge would take his confinement into account and sharply reduce his sentence, if convicted at his court-martial set to begin early next year ...



Read more: http://www.cnn.com/2012/11/29/justice/manning-wikileaks/index.html



WikiLeaks suspect tells court he was suicidal
by Dan De Luce | November 30, 2012

... Manning said that soon after his detention he lost phone privileges and started to feel increasingly anxious and distressed ...

Before his transfer to Quantico, Manning said guards at a US brig in Kuwait repeatedly searched his cell and scattered his possessions.

He said he felt increasingly "hopeless."

Manning said he soon had suicidal thoughts, which he conveyed to mental health counselors ...

http://www.thejakartaglobe.com/afp/wikileaks-suspect-tells-court-he-was-suicidal/559025




Army GI testifies he thought he'd die in custody
Posted: Nov 29, 2012 12:47 PM EST Updated: Nov 29, 2012 5:57 PM EST
By By DAVID DISHNEAU
Associated Press

FORT MEADE, Md. (AP) - An Army private charged in the biggest security breach in U.S. history testified Thursday that he felt like a doomed, caged animal after he was arrested in Baghdad for allegedly sending classified information to the secret-spilling website WikiLeaks ...

"I remember thinking I'm going to die. I'm stuck inside this cage," Manning said in response to questions from defense attorney David Coombs. "I just thought I was going to die in that cage. And that's how I saw it - an animal cage."

Manning was later sent to a Marine Corps brig in Quantico, Va., in July 2010. His lawyers are seeking dismissal of all charges, contending his pretrial confinement at Quantico was needlessly harsh ...

Speaking in emphatic bursts, sometimes stumbling over his words, Manning said that at Quantico, where he was held for nine months in highly restrictive maximum custody, "I started to feel like I was mentally going back to Kuwait mode, in that lonely, dark, black hole place, mentally" ...

http://www.kswt.com/story/20218322/judge-accepts-terms-of-mannings-proposed-plea

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Reply Accused leaker Manning says he considered suicide while in custody (Original post)
struggle4progress Nov 2012 OP
99th_Monkey Nov 2012 #1
struggle4progress Nov 2012 #3
99th_Monkey Nov 2012 #5
struggle4progress Nov 2012 #16
99th_Monkey Nov 2012 #22
RoxyNexus Nov 2012 #2
99th_Monkey Nov 2012 #6
struggle4progress Nov 2012 #7
AnotherMcIntosh Nov 2012 #8
struggle4progress Nov 2012 #14
AnotherMcIntosh Nov 2012 #21
msanthrope Nov 2012 #11
struggle4progress Nov 2012 #15
msanthrope Nov 2012 #20
JDPriestly Nov 2012 #23
Joey Liberal Nov 2012 #4
AnotherMcIntosh Nov 2012 #9
Paulie Nov 2012 #24
hrmjustin Nov 2012 #10
graham4anything Nov 2012 #12
struggle4progress Nov 2012 #13
ForPeace Nov 2012 #17
struggle4progress Nov 2012 #18
Pterodactyl Nov 2012 #19
Scurrilous Nov 2012 #25
struggle4progress Nov 2012 #28
asjr Nov 2012 #26
struggle4progress Nov 2012 #27
asjr Nov 2012 #29

Response to struggle4progress (Original post)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 06:30 PM

1. How could Manning NOT have "considered suicide"

Last edited Thu Nov 29, 2012, 07:44 PM - Edit history (1)

when every 1/2-hour someone came up to his cell to ask him if he's about
ready to kill himself yet?

Which is what they did to Manning during his first horrendous 9 months at
the Marine Corps Base Quantico, in Virginia.

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Response to 99th_Monkey (Reply #1)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 06:45 PM

3. Manning's suicidal ideation predated transfer to Quantico, to judge from his testimony

and that of his assessors

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Response to struggle4progress (Reply #3)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 07:13 PM

5. So what? My post still stands.

Manning's treatment by authorities was abusive and was deliberately
designed in part to induce suicidal "ideations".

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Response to 99th_Monkey (Reply #5)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 09:01 PM

16. You're careless with details, are verifiably wrong in part, and make unproven claims

such as "Manning's treatment was deliberately designed induce suicidal ideations"

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Response to struggle4progress (Reply #16)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 11:38 PM

22. That is my opinion

I never claimed it was anything more (or less) than that, even though
it is based on observation and information, I have no problem calling it
an opinion.

I can only hope you stay in your "verifiable & proven" box, as you may
become dangerous if you were to escape.

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Response to struggle4progress (Original post)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 06:41 PM

2. "He broke the law"

 






OBAMA: So people can have philosophical views but I can’t conduct diplomacy on an open source … That’s not how the world works.

And if you’re in the military… And I have to abide by certain rules of classified information. If I were to release material I weren’t allowed to, I’d be breaking the law.

We’re a nation of laws! We don’t let individuals make their own decisions about how the laws operate. He broke the law.



OBAMA: What he did was he dumped…



OBAMA: No it wasn’t the same thing. Ellsberg’s material wasn’t classified in the same way.


President Obama has already made up his mind. He thinks Manning “broke the law.” It’s no wonder he considered Manning’s abuse to “meet our basic standards” when he thinks Manning is already guilty.

This is vile.

As a reminder: the Pentagon plans to hold Manning indefinitely. Might as well, since they think he’s guilty already.

http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2011/04/22/obama-on-manning-he-broke-the-law-so-much-for-that-trial/

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Response to RoxyNexus (Reply #2)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 07:15 PM

6. I'd love to hear Obama's passion for law enforcement directed at Wall St.

and the Bush Crime Family, including Rove, Rummy and the lot of them.

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Response to RoxyNexus (Reply #2)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 07:37 PM

7. That was a moronic stunt, for a number of reasons

First, it would be entirely immoral of the Executive, to allow prosecution of the soldier, if the Executive were not convinced of his guilt: while it might be sometimes be reasonable to object "The Executive is prosecuting this soldier, even though the Executive is convinced this soldier is innocent," it can scarcely be reasonable to complain "The Executive is prosecuting this soldier, because the Executive is convinced this soldier is guilty"

Second, the folk who pulled this stunt, and the folks who publicized this stunt, themselves actually believe that the soldier handed the documents over to Wikileaks, but they regard that action as laudable -- and so there is a certain gross hypocrisy in their complaint that Executive believes the soldier did those things, when they themselves believe the soldier did those things

Third, although it would probably have been grossly inappropriate for the Executive to make a great public noise about the soldier's guilt, because this would have risked prejudicing against the defense, the Executive made these comments in a small private gathering, to a tiny handful of people who had solicited his views on the topic, and who subsequently made every possible effort to publicize these comments, making a great complaint that the Executive was prejudicing against the defense, though these comments would have been heard by only the tiny handful of people who had solicited the remarks, had not that handful gone out of their way to ensure the remarks were very widely reported. And here, again, their gross hypocrisy is again absolutely clear, for the remarks could not possibly have any prejudicial impact, unless widely reported, and yet all reporting of the comments was engineered by those who wished to complain about their potential prejudicial impact: in fact, the actual original recordings of the remarks are of such low quality, that they can scarcely be heard, for which reason various putative transcripts (not always entirely consistent with each other) are always provided

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Response to RoxyNexus (Reply #2)


Response to AnotherMcIntosh (Reply #8)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 08:58 PM

14. A selective-prosecution defense probably needs to be narrowly drawn to succeed:


"I got a ticket for entering the intersection when the light turned yellow, even though the patrolman assigned to that intersection often sees fifty cars a day running the red light and does nothing" may succeed

"Lots of other people aren't prosecuted for various other crimes, so why I am prosecuted for this crime?" probably won't succeed

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Response to struggle4progress (Reply #14)


Response to RoxyNexus (Reply #2)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 08:09 PM

11. He did break the law--that's not at issue. You do know that defense is pleading guilty on 7

counts, right, with the rest to be determined at trial.

Manning did break the law.

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Response to msanthrope (Reply #11)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 08:59 PM

15. He's been given permission to plead guilty on several substitute counts, but has not yet done so

and (not being obligated to do so) might not do so

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Response to struggle4progress (Reply #15)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 09:47 PM

20. You are correct, thanks for the clarification. nt

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Response to struggle4progress (Reply #15)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 02:50 AM

23. The soldiers and officers responsible for the torture

at Abu Ghraib did an extreme amount of damage to our war and peace efforts around the world.

Our torture and renditioning of prisoners, including our renditioning of a man who had been illegally taken into custody due to mistaken identity (same name, entirely different person) really hurt our reputation around the world.

I wonder who will serve the longest sentence -- Bradley Manning (assuming he pleads or is found guilty of at least some of the charges pending against him) or the Abu Ghraib and renditioning military and intelligence personnel.

In my humble opinion, the renditioners and torturers, the Abu Ghraib and renditioning personnel harmed our country far more than Bradley Manning's alleged conduct.

I think that Bradley Manning may have broken his promises and betrayed secrets and, if found guilty, will pay a price for that. I also think he was a disturbed young man whose problems were ignored by his commanding officers and that those officers are partly to blame for Manning's alleged behavior if it is proved that he did what he is accused of.

While I disapprove of breaches of confidentiality by one entrusted with secrets whether of a person, an employer or the military, to the extent that, in this case, the breaches permitted the public to learn of events that appear to have been war crimes, I am grateful that we were provided with the information that was released.

It appears that the military was covering up probable criminal behavior and disregard for civilians in at least a few instances.

In addition to Bradley Manning, it may be that some of the people in the military who wantonly attacked unarmed civilians ought to also answer for those wrongs. I am thinking of the video of the killing of the news reporter with the camera and the child in the van. Those murders were far more damaging to our country than what Bradley Manning is accused of doing.

That fact does not excuse Manning's conduct. It may explain it however, and it raises questions about the justice of pursuing claims against Manning but not against the brutal killers of the news reporter.

I am not saying that the killing of the news reporter necessarily is a crime. There may be some legal reason that it is not. But as far as I can tell, the possibility that it was a crime, considering how wanton it was, should be investigated and resolved. And the public should be informed of the outcome of the investigation.

I think that history will judge the government's treatment of Manning and its lack of concern about potential war crimes committed during the Bush era the way that we judge FDR's wholesale internment of people of Japanese descent in prison camps in the California desert. It will be viewed as morally despicable but a sign of the desperation and inadequacy of the leaders of the time.

I disapprove of a soldier's disclosure of secrets, but I am glad in this case that we were given access to the secrets. It vindicated many of us who had suspicions and doubts about the conduct of our leaders. Manning's alleged disclosure proved those of us right who did not believe that the conduct of our military in Iraq and Afghanistan was befitting to American soldiers.

After all, our military is the moral descendent of the army of George Washington who refused to torture even the worst of the Hessian troops who had been brutal to American captives. Shame on the whole bunch.

There was a lot of dishonor in this situation. I'm glad the truth came out, and I hope that our military will act honorably in the future. Whether the drones will be used in a manner that does honor to the traditions of George Washington's army remains to be seen.

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Response to struggle4progress (Original post)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 06:55 PM

4. The Army wants to nail this kid

Manning did cause the biggest security breach in our history. The fact that he did that AND is an enlisted soldier will make him an easy target for the Army brass. Why was an Army PFC placed in a Marine Corps brig?

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Response to Joey Liberal (Reply #4)


Response to AnotherMcIntosh (Reply #9)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 07:10 AM

24. Or Julius Rosenberg

He along with his wife got the electric chair. And were civilians.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julius_and_Ethel_Rosenberg

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Response to struggle4progress (Original post)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 08:01 PM

10. I wish freedom for this man.

These sob's will stop at nothing to torment this man.

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Response to struggle4progress (Original post)


Response to graham4anything (Reply #12)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 08:45 PM

13. It's not a press release but a news report from his pretrial hearing

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Response to struggle4progress (Original post)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 09:09 PM

17. Bi-spectacled?

n/t

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Response to ForPeace (Reply #17)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 09:13 PM

18. prolly meant "bespectacled"

copy editing often seems to have fallen by the wayside nowadays

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Response to struggle4progress (Original post)

Thu Nov 29, 2012, 09:18 PM

19. Good thing they had him on a suicide watch.

It would be irresponsible to let him kill himself while in custody.

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Response to struggle4progress (Original post)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 04:02 PM

25. GI charged in WikiLeaks case admits making noose

<snip>

"The Army private charged with handing over reams of classified material to WikiLeaks acknowledged Friday that he tied a bedsheet into a noose and contemplated suicide shortly after his arrest.

The pretrial testimony appeared to support the military's argument that it was trying to protect Pfc. Bradley Manning from harming himself by keeping him in strict isolation, taking away his clothes and shackling him when he was outside his cell.

Manning's lawyers argue that the conditions he experienced for nine months at the Marine Corps brig in Quantico, Va., amounted to illegal punishment, lasting well past the time he was having suicidal thoughts, and that the charges against him should be dropped as a result.

Under cross-examination by prosecutor Maj. Ashden Fein, Manning testified that he fashioned the noose while being held in Kuwait soon after he was accused of engineering the biggest leak of classified material in U.S. history."

Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/11/30/3120441/prosecutors-questioning-manning.html#storylink=cpy

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Response to Scurrilous (Reply #25)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 06:18 PM

28. ... "I certainly made a noose," Pte Manning said. "The sheet noose in particular" ...

He acknowledged having written on a form when he first arrived at Quantico that he was "always planning and never acting" upon suicidal thoughts, but said that "it might have been a sarcastic answer" ...

Wikileaks suspect Bradley Manning admits making noose
30 November 2012 Last updated at 17:50 ET
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-20563539

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Response to struggle4progress (Original post)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 04:15 PM

26. Something I have not understood about this for a long time is

does the U.S. have any actual knowledge that this young man did what he is charged with?

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Response to asjr (Reply #26)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 06:03 PM

27. I'll guess we'll learn when the actual trial begins. There seems to be widespread

belief that Manning did this, to judge from the number of folk at this site lauding him as a hero for this action

There are also the supposed Lamo logs that Wired published sometime ago, purporting to show Manning bragging about this

The defense motions over a long period of time suggest a mitigation rather than actual-innocence defense: Manning suffered from gender dysphoria, Manning should never have been allowed access to restricted documents; the document release didn't really do much harm; Manning has suffered so much in pretrial custody, that the government cannot be allowed to try him; &c&c

And there's the latest defense feeler, which is the request for permission to plead to a number of lesser included charges, which which stipulate some transfer by Manning of material to Wikileaks

Dunno. Maybe he's nuts enough to brag about stuff he didn't do, in hopes of earning glory in his circle of friends or something. People have done stuff like that before. It's my understanding, for example, that Mata Hari was probably shot as a spy, not because she really was a spy, but because the stripper was a liar and attention-whore who stupidly lied and attention-whored her way through some very dangerous circles during the Great War, not realizing what she was falling into until it was too late



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Response to struggle4progress (Reply #27)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 06:41 PM

29. Thank you very much for this information. It has been

blurred for quite some time and you make sense to me.

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