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Wed Nov 14, 2012, 07:42 PM

Boehner To Obama: No, You Tell Dems To Pass Our Tax Bill

Source: TPM



SAHIL KAPUR 5:52 PM EST, WEDNESDAY NOVEMBER 14, 2012

House Speaker John Boehner (R-OH) stonewalled President Obama's call Wednesday to extend the middle income tax rates set to expire in January, and hinted that the two will remain at a dead stop at least until they meet Friday.

"Well, I think instead of the House moving on the Senate bill, the Senate ought to move on the House bill," he told reporters during a late afternoon briefing in the Capitol.

A reporter pressed him on why he won't, as Obama suggested, vote to extend the middle income tax cuts both sides agree on the need to extend. "We are not going to hurt our economy and make job creation more difficult, which is exactly what that plan will do," he said. "It's not the direction we want to go because it's going to hurt job creators in America."

Boehner dodged again when asked about Obama's clear refusal to extend the lower tax rates for the top bracket.

"I look forward to my conversation beginning with the president on Friday," he said.

-30-

Read more: http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entry/boehner-to-obama-no-you-tell-dems-to

91 replies, 11854 views

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Reply Boehner To Obama: No, You Tell Dems To Pass Our Tax Bill (Original post)
DonViejo Nov 2012 OP
ItsTheMediaStupid Nov 2012 #1
Faygo Kid Nov 2012 #20
Liberalynn Nov 2012 #27
cliffordu Nov 2012 #42
BouzoukiKing Nov 2012 #58
NYtoBush-Drop Dead Nov 2012 #50
yends21012 Nov 2012 #2
Drale Nov 2012 #3
Qutzupalotl Nov 2012 #4
PSPS Nov 2012 #12
Qutzupalotl Nov 2012 #28
OnionPatch Nov 2012 #74
Volaris Nov 2012 #56
John2 Nov 2012 #5
Qutzupalotl Nov 2012 #6
ReRe Nov 2012 #34
Panasonic Nov 2012 #35
Jamaal510 Nov 2012 #77
Incitatus Nov 2012 #85
Blasphemer Nov 2012 #61
reflection Nov 2012 #7
BlueCaliDem Nov 2012 #25
Panasonic Nov 2012 #36
BlueCaliDem Nov 2012 #63
elleng Nov 2012 #8
melody Nov 2012 #9
BlueCaliDem Nov 2012 #26
ReRe Nov 2012 #44
BlueCaliDem Nov 2012 #62
ReRe Nov 2012 #64
xxqqqzme Nov 2012 #65
ReRe Nov 2012 #66
2naSalit Nov 2012 #79
ReRe Nov 2012 #87
2naSalit Nov 2012 #90
AnnaLee Nov 2012 #10
ReRe Nov 2012 #45
Ter Nov 2012 #54
Spitfire of ATJ Nov 2012 #55
AnnaLee Nov 2012 #69
2naSalit Nov 2012 #80
SemperEadem Nov 2012 #11
BeyondGeography Nov 2012 #13
swayne Nov 2012 #14
railsback Nov 2012 #15
meow2u3 Nov 2012 #16
loyalkydem Nov 2012 #17
msongs Nov 2012 #18
Liberalynn Nov 2012 #32
2naSalit Nov 2012 #81
EC Nov 2012 #19
wanttosavetheplanet Nov 2012 #21
Ellipsis Nov 2012 #29
riderinthestorm Nov 2012 #22
Mc Mike Nov 2012 #70
olddad56 Nov 2012 #23
Liberalynn Nov 2012 #40
Liberalynn Nov 2012 #24
canuckledragger Nov 2012 #30
Liberalynn Nov 2012 #41
beac Nov 2012 #43
dlwickham Nov 2012 #59
canuckledragger Nov 2012 #72
2naSalit Nov 2012 #82
SoapBox Nov 2012 #31
Panasonic Nov 2012 #33
Jeff In Milwaukee Nov 2012 #37
AndyTiedye Nov 2012 #38
ballaratocker Nov 2012 #39
GeorgeGist Nov 2012 #46
Smilo Nov 2012 #47
daleo Nov 2012 #48
harun Nov 2012 #49
glacierbay Nov 2012 #51
Dyedinthewoolliberal Nov 2012 #52
Volaris Nov 2012 #57
madrchsod Nov 2012 #53
FreeBC Nov 2012 #60
2naSalit Nov 2012 #83
4lbs Nov 2012 #67
ancianita Nov 2012 #68
Hotler Nov 2012 #71
Arkana Nov 2012 #73
Fearless Nov 2012 #75
MisterScruffles Nov 2012 #76
and-justice-for-all Nov 2012 #78
2naSalit Nov 2012 #84
ItsTheMediaStupid Nov 2012 #88
sakabatou Nov 2012 #86
davidpdx Nov 2012 #89
Jon_Trevathan Nov 2012 #91

Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 07:46 PM

1. Back to Clinton's top rates or off the cliff.

Take it or leave it.

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Response to ItsTheMediaStupid (Reply #1)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:11 PM

20. Works for me. Fired up, ready to jump.

Not this time, Boner. Yeah, it will cost me, but no way are they going after the rest of us to spare the Koch brothers.

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Response to Faygo Kid (Reply #20)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:19 PM

27. +1

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Response to Faygo Kid (Reply #20)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:37 PM

42. LOL. "Fired UP!!, Ready to Jump!!"

that should SOOOOO be an OP

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Response to Faygo Kid (Reply #20)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 11:47 PM

58. Perhaps they should invite Jerry Brown...

...to their little confab.

He appears to have a pretty good handle on budgetary stuff, doesn't he? There may be value in picking through his brain.

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Response to ItsTheMediaStupid (Reply #1)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 09:16 PM

50. back to their GD job creators...

Where are your Job creators TAN MAN? Hope the President reams you a new one Boehner! Get back in your bottle.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 07:47 PM

2. The repugs have a new term they are going to beat to death - job creators

They are going to pull that one out anytime they don't get their way. I think the American public is aware of the fact that the term is simply the same thing as the 1% and corporate masters who haven't done anything to create jobs in the last 12 years.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 07:47 PM

3. I look forward to the day

Boner is in a cell with Tom Daley.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 07:48 PM

4. WE are the job creators.

Demand drives job creation, not tax policy.

Boehner's threats are empty and his economic ideas are false.

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Response to Qutzupalotl (Reply #4)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 07:55 PM

12. Not like it used to be

In the past, increased demand created jobs here. Now, increased demand creates jobs in China and account balances in the Cayman Islands.

Without the return of domestic manufacturing, domestic demand doesn't have as much of a positive effect here as it used to.

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Response to PSPS (Reply #12)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:20 PM

28. But tax policy even less so,

right?

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Response to PSPS (Reply #12)

Thu Nov 15, 2012, 11:39 PM

74. Hopefully there will also be

something in the Dem's tax plan like stopping tax breaks for companies that outsource and giving them to those that create jobs here. That would be a move in the right direction, anyway.

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Response to Qutzupalotl (Reply #4)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 11:22 PM

56. Yep. and he's going to find out that that he CAN'T get what he wants...

For The President to "move" on any deal, BOEHNER is the one that has to do the heavy lifting. For us to get what what we NEED (re-instatement of Clinton-Era tax rates on the wealthy) all we have to do is exactly NOTHING. Polls are already leaning towrd blaming the GOP if the sequestration goes into effect. The Speaker is running out of time now. All he can do now is bluff (and maybe, Beg).

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 07:49 PM

5. So

 

his position is giving taxcuts to the middle class will hurt the economy and jobs. You heard it America. Hang that remark around his neck!

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 07:49 PM

6. Take the top tax rate to 50%.

That's fair.

You're lucky to have a country to succeed in. Now pay up.

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Response to Qutzupalotl (Reply #6)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:26 PM

34. Hear! Hear!

100% agree with you!!! "50%, take it or leave it. Just know, before you make your decision, that each time you refuse, the rate goes up 10%. Comprende? Got it?... and if you don't make your mind up by the recess, then buckle down, buddy, we're going to take a little ride over your cliff. kapiche? So what say you, Mr Speaker?" No more Mr nice guy, Mr President.

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Response to Qutzupalotl (Reply #6)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:27 PM

35. No. FDR levels were 95%

 

and we need to corral the ultrawealthy.

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Response to Panasonic (Reply #35)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 03:57 AM

77. 95%? Are you serious?!

That makes today's top tax rates that Republicans whine about look like a joke. I can't believe it...95% during FDR...it'll be interesting to see whether our elected leaders can and/or are willing to someday return top income taxes to that rate. But I'm not holding my breath, since the RW has successfully duped almost 1/2 the country into worrying about how much SOMEBODY ELSE gets taxed who makes much more than they do.

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Response to Qutzupalotl (Reply #6)

Thu Nov 15, 2012, 12:45 AM

61. The wealthy have been so coddled and the masses have been so brainwashed...

That 50% sounds like a drastic number when it certainly is not. Their tax rates have been at historic, and ridiculous, lows for over 30 years. Repealing the Bush tax cuts still leaves them with a huge gift from the government that they don't deserve. They should be thankful that the debate in D.C. is not (yet) about hammering out a deal that actually involves a fair tax rate for the corporate welfare kings.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 07:49 PM

7. Fuck you, Oompa Loompa.

God these recalcitrant dickheads are pissing me off.

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Response to reflection (Reply #7)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:18 PM

25. Oompa-loompa?!?

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Response to BlueCaliDem (Reply #25)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:27 PM

36. Just for you.

 

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Response to Panasonic (Reply #36)

Thu Nov 15, 2012, 01:58 AM

63. ROFLMAO!

You had me literally laughing out loud behind my monitor! I didn't expect that!

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 07:49 PM

8. p.o.s.

We may have to start working on removing the entire repug House.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 07:50 PM

9. I guess they're just not going to get it until they get voted out

They're too stupid -- or too afraid of their masters -- to do otherwise.

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Response to melody (Reply #9)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:19 PM

26. Thanks to Republican gerrymandering

that's going to be hard to do. Yes, their constituents are too stupid and too afraid of their masters to vote in their own financial interest.

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Response to BlueCaliDem (Reply #26)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:46 PM

44. Hard? yes. Impossible, NO!

Never say never. When we win back the majority in 2014, WE will get to do some gerrymandering, right? And my suggestion, after we gain the majority again, is slice the USA up fair and square into sensible, non-salamander-like, districts and cast the old gerrymandering system in the history bin. Abolish it, period. Anyway, that's my idea, and I'm stickin' to it.

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Response to ReRe (Reply #44)

Thu Nov 15, 2012, 01:56 AM

62. I don't know if states can redistrict in 2014. I don't know what the rules are

but I don't think there is any redistricting allowed. I could be wrong. I HOPE I'm wrong cuz it would be wonderful to win back the seats in the House and kick those lazy-ass Republicans back into the minority where they belong.

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Response to BlueCaliDem (Reply #62)

Thu Nov 15, 2012, 03:42 AM

64. Admittedly, I don't know allot about it either...

....maybe someone will pipe in and explain it to us.

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Response to ReRe (Reply #44)

Thu Nov 15, 2012, 04:37 AM

65. Redistricting is different

in each state and is supposed to be done after the 10 year census. Don't know about your state, but in most states districts are redrawn by the state legislature. CA voters approved an party member equal commission by a proposition in '08. The districts are a tad more balanced but cities & counties have been split, which really sucks.

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Response to xxqqqzme (Reply #65)

Thu Nov 15, 2012, 06:25 AM

66. I don't know why, but I got it in my head...

....that redistricting was done if you're the majority party, and now I do remember something about the Census having something to do with it too. Well, I say if it's good enough for CA, it's good enough for everyone. I look at CA as the laboratory for democracy. .

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Response to ReRe (Reply #66)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:53 PM

79. It's both factors

Redistricting, in most states occurs following the results of the decennial census (10 year) have been calculated, as that is how the number of House reps are determined... by population density. It is normally the majority party of the state legislature who draws the district maps. In those states where the Voting Rights Act is in effect (those who have a history of discrimination tactics in the voting process) have to have those district boundaries approved (precleared) by the DoJ via a DC district court panel.



Consequently, during this current session of the SCOTUS, Justice Roberts has decided that they will hear arguments and revisit Sec. 5 of the VRA to determine if it has outlived its usefulness... based on the premise that we now have a black president, I think it was???

Which is ludicrous given the fiasco that was Oh, FL, and still is AZ in this last election cycle. If they determine that it can be left behind and no longer applies, you KNOW they are bought and paid for shills of the neocons and will surely hand hamRove and his crime syndicate carte blanche in the next election... that being 2014 when we have our next chance to do some more House cleaning.

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Response to 2naSalit (Reply #79)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 09:30 PM

87. Sometimes I wonder how we can call ourselves....

.... a democracy. When does that case come up in the SC? At the end of this term, like springish? If "Sec. 5 of the VRA has outlived it's usefulness since we have a black president." Do you think Roberts knows how absurd that sounds? There are a thousand threats on the life of the black President each and every day? That's like something you would hear out of the mouth of Lewis Black (my favorite comedian since the passing of George Carlin.) It's a right wing court, alright. Just because Roberts let Obama's ACA stand does not change the fact that it is a right wing court.

So, the state's re-juggle the districts as per the Census and whichever party has the majority in that state?

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Response to ReRe (Reply #87)

Sat Nov 17, 2012, 12:31 PM

90. that's

pretty much it. It's a states' issue and the majority party usually does the gerrymandering with census data as their partial guide, or excuse. Not sure when the hearing date is for the Sec.5 of AVR but I can look into it later, I just stopped by for quick purview of comment responses... You might find the schedule of case hearing for the court on the SCOTUS web site or Thomas or somewhere like that that.

I like Lewis Black too, he's very eerily entertaining.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 07:51 PM

10. Got my bikini on, standing on the edge, waiting for a cooling dip. Let's go over! One two three.nm.

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Response to AnnaLee (Reply #10)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:48 PM

45. Juuuuuuuuuuuummmmp!

I'm ready!! Let's go!

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Response to AnnaLee (Reply #10)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 10:51 PM

54. Pics please!

 

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Response to Ter (Reply #54)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 11:05 PM

55. Thought it would be further...

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Response to Spitfire of ATJ (Reply #55)

Thu Nov 15, 2012, 08:39 AM

69. Gives a new perspective to "slipery slope".

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Response to Spitfire of ATJ (Reply #55)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:59 PM

80. OUCH!

I never watched that though I saw it somewhere recently... dang. He's going to wish he'd been less foolish by the time he's 40.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 07:51 PM

11. ... said the asshole who has not passed one job's bill in the 2 years

since the tea fucktards have had him hanging in effigy on the steps of the capitol.

he doesn't pay much attention to what goes on in his state... isn't his term up in 2 years?

Ohio--you know what you need to be out doing--the ground game of life needs to be amping up in Ohio, going hard in the paint on his ass.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 07:56 PM

13. Democratic Senate, Democrat in the WH

Let's go with the Republican solution.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 07:57 PM

14. These so called job creators have tax cuts RIGHT NOW, that they aren't using to create jobs.

 

They're just sitting on the money that was supposed to be used to stimulate the economy. Since they can't find a way to do that....get the money back by raising the tax rates on these people. It didn't work so, let them find out the hard way. At least if they don't create jobs, they can't still get the benefit of ill-gotten gains.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:02 PM

15. We can survive

 

We did fine with the Clinton rates, and will do fine now. Off the 'cliff'. Besides, the majority of Americans said they would blame the Republicans if no deal is struck.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:02 PM

16. Who the hell do you think you are, Agent Orange? nt

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:03 PM

17. Hey Bohner

we won, you lost. You play by our rules

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:07 PM

18. boner does this because it works. someday it might not work. then he will stop nt

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Response to msongs (Reply #18)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:24 PM

32. +1

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Response to msongs (Reply #18)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 06:01 PM

81. Yeah... like this week!

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:10 PM

19. Well, the hell with them

I really didn't pay that much more in taxes during Clinton. In fact I was doing so much better than during Bush. Can't compare to now, I've finally retired. I love Social Security.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:12 PM

21. Seriously...

The goof ball Tea Partiers are only a bunch of ignoramuses used in a side show put out by the Republicans to distract attention from those really pulling their strings - Sheldon Adelson, the Koch Brothers, Karl Rove, Grover Norquist, The US Chamber of Commerce, et al. The President does, indeed, have a mandate (as he noted to today in addition to mentioning that MORE people than voted for him agreed with tax increases on the top 2%). This term, however, we will need to do more than just talk about what needs to be done. It is time for us to organize and ACT in support of the POTUS. We need to be involved locally and nationally, doing everything in our power BEYOND blogging - essentially organizing voters to respond to the Republicans' shenanigans in droves. If we sit this one out like we did last time around, we will be in the same place we were before. We need to stand up and fight against their divisive obstruction just like our President did today.

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Response to wanttosavetheplanet (Reply #21)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:21 PM

29. welcome to DU.

Nice Rant.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:14 PM

22. STILL trying to pass off the millionaires and billionaires as "job creators"??!! Really??!

That's been sooooo debunked but Boehner's still trying to get this past us??

Unbelievable.







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Response to riderinthestorm (Reply #22)

Thu Nov 15, 2012, 08:47 AM

70. They have this new theory

Tax cuts for the rich will trickle down and help everyone by reinvigorating the nation's economy...

They also have this new theory that we should give de-regulation of big businesses a try, that might help.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:17 PM

23. Jobs are created by consumers not corporations

supply doesn't matter much when you don't have demand. What is going to make a wealthy business owner hire people? a tax cut, or a lot of consumers for demanding whatever it is they are providing?

We tried the corporate welfare game in the Bushco era, it got us into the mess, not out of it.

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Response to olddad56 (Reply #23)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:32 PM

40. That's logic something Pukes don't get

Another thing they don't get, if you raise the retirement age or cut SS and Medicare on Seniors, they will stay in their jobs longer, this will leave even less opportunity for younger people entering the job market. No turnover in existing jobs, no new jobs created, that will be one big mess, but guess what PuKes don't care. As long as they keep the tax breaks for billionaires that's all they care about.

The Democrats should not even consider negotiating with these swine. Let the PUKES hang themselves with their own rope, figuratively speaking of course.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:17 PM

24. Then let's go over the cliff Boner

if he refuses to compromise then neither should our side.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:21 PM

30. Boehner's kinda arrogant...

...for a weeping cheeto, ain't he?

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Response to canuckledragger (Reply #30)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:36 PM

41. Kind of?

His picture is next to the word in the dictionary.

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Response to canuckledragger (Reply #30)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:38 PM

43. "weeping cheeto"



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Response to canuckledragger (Reply #30)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 11:57 PM

59. that has to be the funniest thing I've seen in a long LONG time

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Response to dlwickham (Reply #59)

Thu Nov 15, 2012, 04:55 PM

72. Not my original sadly...

...but 'borrowed' the name from a liberal facebook troll I subscribe to:

https://www.facebook.com/TheWeepingCheeto

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Response to canuckledragger (Reply #30)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 06:07 PM

82. Kinda...



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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:22 PM

31. I say...pedal to the medal, to the cliff!

Fuck you Boner and the Fake Tan you rode in on!

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:26 PM

33. Very well. Activate Project X^2

 

Time to destroy the remaining Republicans.

Republicans has ZERO mandate, and they just bought the fucking farm and are attempting to PISS on it.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:30 PM

37. What he should do...

Keep talking about compromise, but firm on raising taxes on the 1%. And as much as it causes a grand mal freak-out on DU, he should even hint and compromising on entitlements. Not to worry, Boehner will never get the votes to raise taxes, so any "tweaks" are just for show.

In the meantime, go off the fiscal cliff. Make all the Bush tax cuts expire. The beauty is that we'll rid ourselves of a hideously bad fiscal policy, and the Republicans will take the blame. And once they start feeling the heat, Obama and the Democrats can THEN restore those tax cuts that benefit the middle class.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:31 PM

38. Nothing Has Changed and Nothing Will

The Party of No never left. We're stuck with them in the House until 2020 due to massive gerrymandering.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:32 PM

39. Please, please!

Don't get clowned this time Obama! You hold two aces and Boehner holds a joker and a card that has the instructions for pinochle on it. Remember what your buddy, Bubba, did. Clinton faced down Newt during the government shutdown and emerged with more prestige and a better deal for the American public.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:52 PM

46. Call the Waambulance

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:55 PM

47. Earth to Boehner

you are not the President and what you want is not what the American people want.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 09:06 PM

48. Election have consequences

Eventually the GOP will have to accept that.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 09:14 PM

49. If Obama was not going to cave he would threaten to let them all expire.

Which he has not and will not do.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 09:21 PM

51. Did I miss something?

 

I was under the impression that we had won the election? And by a wide margin. Am I wrong?
Who the hell is Boner to be telling us what to pass? I hope Mr. Tan Man loses in the next election and we're finally done with him.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 10:10 PM

52. Good Grief!

As Bugs Bunny might say, 'You realize of course, this means war!" Are they posturing for their own egos? Certainly their bluff will be called and then the GOP can be the party that raised taxes on EVERYBODY.............

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Response to Dyedinthewoolliberal (Reply #52)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 11:29 PM

57. "the party that raised taxes on EVERYBODY............."

rather than have to raise taxes on thier Rich friends.

The GOP motto seems to have morphed from "I got mine, fuck yours" to
"I WILL get mine, or YOU will be Punished"

Hey Boehner. Ill suffer a little so the COUNTRY can be better off. Fuck You, and the "Job Creators" who rode in on you.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 10:35 PM

53. he`s a funny boy.....

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Thu Nov 15, 2012, 12:35 AM

60. Wait a second here... The republicans actually have a plan?

 

That seems pretty far-fetched to me. Developing an actual plan would require them to do some work.

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Response to FreeBC (Reply #60)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 06:23 PM

83. THEIR plan

is to continue to attempt to make this a one term president. I don't think cheetoman's sobered up enough to realize the election's over and he lost.

Aside from this being a slope rather than a cliff, I think it's only a cliff for those suicide bomber teabaggers, all those components don't HAVE to go into effect immediately on 1/1/13. And if we let sequestration go forth, the DoD will have to go through financial review, which will defund the damned wars and a more sane budget can be worked out for the DoD including more accountability from that end of DC. It doesn't have to hurt the social safety net either as the president also holds the power of executive order to tidy up any messes until the nest Congress can work this stuff out.

If we don't buy their bull and let the sequestration go forth, it will hang the baggers out to dry and we can castrate those weenie wavers with a machete... which is what I'm hoping for. There are so many details to be worked out here that I think it would be unwise to make a deal with this Congress and best to wait until the recently elected and more sane representatives reconfigure our tax structure and budget accountability requirements.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Thu Nov 15, 2012, 06:52 AM

67. Wow Boner. Who won the Presidential election? Who got more popular votes than anyone else in

history? Which party increased their Senate and added seats in the House?

You don't have the mandate to tell PRESIDENT OBAMA Jack Shit, you piddly little House boy.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Thu Nov 15, 2012, 07:50 AM

68. Remember this on Friday, Boner:

You represent a gerrymandate!

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Thu Nov 15, 2012, 09:45 AM

71. Boner is a dick. nt

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Thu Nov 15, 2012, 04:58 PM

73. Fuck you, Boner.

You know perfectly well it will die a quick death in the Senate and then you'll go out and whine about how the President doesn't want to work with you.

HE'S THE GODDAMN PRESIDENT AND HE JUST WON A CONVINCING REELECTION. YOU BETTER BEND THE FUCK OVER.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 01:06 AM

75. Umm... no.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 01:09 AM

76. You Lost

 

Get over it.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 12:42 PM

78. There is no cliff...

ugh. Its a bump and one that a win for us if they do NOTHING. Nothing is the best solution, the shrub cuts end and there are no negotiated cuts to social programs at all. The shrub cuts needs to go without an ultimatum.

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Response to and-justice-for-all (Reply #78)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 06:28 PM

84. Absolutely agree!

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Response to and-justice-for-all (Reply #78)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 10:23 PM

88. Yes - off the cliff we go before leting boner call the shots

We reconvene Congress early in January introducing a middle class tax cut in the senate that brings down everyone's rates except the $250,000 and above.

BTW, fuck raising the threshold for the top rate above $250,000.

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 07:51 PM

86. He's a douchebag, through and through

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Sat Nov 17, 2012, 07:18 AM

89. To quote that old geezer in the dirt

"Well, there you go again"

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Response to DonViejo (Original post)

Sun Nov 18, 2012, 08:44 AM

91. Debunking Boehner's Claims

House Speaker John Boehner recently stated that “According to Ernst & Young, raising the top rates would destroy nearly 700,000 jobs in our country.” In doing so, John Boehner was implicitly representing to the American people and to his colleagues in Congress that the report's methodologies were credible and its conclusions were worthy of belief. With this understanding, let's take a look at what the report actually had to say. (http://www.nfib.com/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=OMV7uZczVaM%3d&tabid=1083)

First, the Ernst & Young study was based on a very "long term" macroeconomic model which the authors of the Ernst & Young study described as follows: “For models of this type, roughly two-third to three-quarters of the long-run effect is reached within a decade.” (see footnote 22) Because the context in which House Speaker Boehner cited these job-losses implied that they would be a short-term impact of President Obama's tax policy, the Washington Post assigned Three Pinocchios to Boehner statement (calling his claim "simply absurd").

Since the immediate economic prescriptions needed to help accelerate our anemic recovery must focus on the short-term, it is important to understand that the Ernst & Young study may be understood to actually support the opposite of Boehner's tax policy. In assessing the potential short-run effects, the Ernst & Young ("EY") study stated the following:

"While the EY GE model is used to estimate economic impacts in the long-run, the higher tax rates can be expected to have a short-run impact as well, although through a different channel. During periods when the economy is performing below full employment, changes in fiscal policy can be expected to have significant effects on economic performance. During such periods, there is often a strong case for fiscal stimulus provided other avenues for stimulating the economy, such as monetary policy, are not available or have been exhausted" (EY, page 12)

Did you catch that? The authors of the Ernst & Young study acknowledged the roll of simulative economic policies when an economy is weak - like it is today. The Ernst & Young study went on to endorse the predictions of the Congressional Budget Office ("CBO") on both the short-term effects should Congress allow our economy to fall off the fiscal cliff and the effects of postponing this economic disruption for another year:

"... CBO projects that under current law policies, the economy will contract by 1.3% in the first half of 2013 before growing by 2.3% in the second half of 2013, meeting the standard textbook definition of a recession of two consecutive quarters of negative economic growth. The CBO also projects that employment would increase by 2 million more jobs under the scenario where the budget deficit is not reduced." (EY, page 12)

Prior to the election House Speaker John Boehner and the Congressional Republicans categorically rejected any tax increase to the wealthy (including contributors to the Republican PACs who tried to buy the election) and his deceitful 700,000 job-loss claim was a shameless and "absurd" scare tactic to further that agenda. This assessment of Boehner's dishonesty can be implicitly underlined when the above quotes from Ernest & Young report and the following quotation are combined:

"While CBO did not separately analyze the near-term effects of the provisions affecting high-income taxpayers, the deficit impact of the higher tax rates is nearly $70 billion or 10% of the total fiscal cliff in calendar year 2013, and totals nearly $1.1 trillion over the ten year budget window. Although a disproportionate share of the tax change is likely to be channeled through savings for taxpayers facing the top tax rates as compared to other taxpayers, these policies can still be expected to have significant effects on output and employment in the near term." (EY, page 12)

Therefore, based on the Ernst & Young report, the following may be concluded:

1. There appears to be some value in the government providing continued support for the demand side of our economy through a stimulus spending. In this regard, because there is near universal agreement that the United States is in need of infrastructure repairs and improvements and because we now have historic low interest rates for the Government's long-term borrowing, it would seem appropriate for Congress to support new investments in America's infrastructure to help jump-start our economy.

2. Since the present "fiscal cliff" law will, according to the Ernst & Young study, cause conditions that meets "the standard textbook definition of a recession", I believe most Americans will be unforgiving if Congress were to allow its propensity for acrimonious debate to further damage the economy. Also, because any delay in passing this legislation will, in itself, cause damage, including reducing the accumulated wealth of everyone with stock and similar investments, it would seem appropriate for Congress to act quickly by supporting President Obama's tax plan, which, in essence, will lower taxes for everyone -- except the very wealthy, from their scheduled January 1, 2013 levels.

3. As to Boehner's insistence that the rich also receive tax reductions, the Ernst & Young report correctly states that a "disproportionate share of the tax change is likely to be channeled through savings for taxpayers facing the top tax rates as compared to other taxpayers". This implies that the short term needs of our economy would be best served by allowing the tax cuts for the rich to expire, as the present law requires, and to use the resulting revenues to stimulate the economy as the Ernst & Young study appears to recommend.

As to the long-term effects of adopting President's Obama's tax plan, it is important to note that the relevant finding of the Nonpartisan Congressional Research Service were as follows:

"The results of the analysis suggest that changes over the past 65 years in the top marginal tax rate and the top capital gains tax rate do not appear correlated with economic growth. The reduction in the top tax rates appears to be uncorrelated with saving, investment, and productivity growth. The top tax rates appear to have little or no relation to the size of the economic pie.
However, the top tax rate reductions appear to be associated with the increasing concentration of income at the top of the income distribution. As measured by IRS data, the share of income accruing to the top 0.1% of U.S. families increased from 4.2% in 1945 to 12.3% by 2007 before falling to 9.2% due to the 2007-2009 recession. At the same time, the average tax rate paid by the top 0.1% fell from over 50% in 1945 to about 25% in 2009. Tax policy could have a relation to how the economic pie is sliced—lower top tax rates may be associated with greater income disparities."
SOURCE: Congressional Research Service, Taxes and the Economy: An Economic Analysis of the Top Tax Rates Since 1945, September 14, 2012 (http://graphics8.nytimes.com/news/business/0915taxesandeconomy.pdf)

This finding calls into serious question the central tenet of Boehner's economic theory. Also, when coupled with the finding that Boehner's 700,000 job-loss claim was "simply absurd", there should be no rational reason (other than self interest) for a majority in the House of Representative to oppose President Obama's plan. It was clear that President Obama's plan to lower taxes for everyone -- other than the wealthy, was the will of the people on election day and, according to a recent Rasmussen poll, 57% of Americans support it today. It is important that we write our Congressmen today to inform them of our displeasure should they permit November to end without the looming budget crisis having been resolved.

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