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Wed Nov 7, 2012, 01:20 AM

Puerto Rico Votes in Favor of Statehood

Source: Outside the Beltway

The two-part referendum first asked voters if they wanted to change Puerto Rico's 114-year relationship with the United States. A second question gave voters three alternatives if they wanted a change: become a U.S. state, gain independence, or have a "sovereign free association," a designation that would give more autonomy for the territory of 4 million people.

With 243 of 1,643 precincts reporting late Tuesday, 75,188 voters, or 53 percent, said they did not want to continue under the current political status. Forty-seven percent, or 67,304 voters, supported the status quo.

On the second question, 65 percent favored statehood, followed by 31 percent for sovereign free association and 4 percent for independence.

Read more: http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/puerto-rico-votes-in-favor-of-statehood/

54 replies, 7737 views

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Arrow 54 replies Author Time Post
Reply Puerto Rico Votes in Favor of Statehood (Original post)
NYC Liberal Nov 2012 OP
olddad56 Nov 2012 #1
NYC Liberal Nov 2012 #2
msanthrope Nov 2012 #4
joshcryer Nov 2012 #20
msanthrope Nov 2012 #28
joshcryer Nov 2012 #29
msanthrope Nov 2012 #32
barbiegeek Nov 2012 #33
dangerdoll Nov 2012 #41
bluedigger Nov 2012 #5
NYC Liberal Nov 2012 #6
bluedigger Nov 2012 #9
NYC Liberal Nov 2012 #12
bluedigger Nov 2012 #16
Humanist_Activist Nov 2012 #14
JackRiddler Nov 2012 #10
Posteritatis Nov 2012 #13
Fearless Nov 2012 #19
NYC Liberal Nov 2012 #21
Octafish Nov 2012 #35
cthulu2016 Nov 2012 #15
gottavote Nov 2012 #30
Kennah Nov 2012 #51
closeupready Nov 2012 #38
blackspade Nov 2012 #45
Nika Nov 2012 #47
Poll_Blind Nov 2012 #3
Volaris Nov 2012 #7
NYC Liberal Nov 2012 #8
kenfrequed Nov 2012 #11
Volaris Nov 2012 #18
Bacchus4.0 Nov 2012 #42
kenfrequed Nov 2012 #54
Volaris Nov 2012 #17
Sgent Nov 2012 #36
treestar Nov 2012 #22
Angleae Nov 2012 #25
treestar Nov 2012 #26
eppur_se_muova Nov 2012 #37
freedomboogie Nov 2012 #23
Scootaloo Nov 2012 #24
Odin2005 Nov 2012 #27
jpak Nov 2012 #31
Bacchus4.0 Nov 2012 #40
barbiegeek Nov 2012 #34
Hemp_is_good Nov 2012 #39
pampango Nov 2012 #43
Humanist_Activist Nov 2012 #49
Kennah Nov 2012 #52
muriel_volestrangler Nov 2012 #44
gutierrez Nov 2012 #46
Beowulf Nov 2012 #48
BlueinOhio Nov 2012 #50
Bad_Ronald Nov 2012 #53

Response to NYC Liberal (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 01:23 AM

1. what about the people of this country? Do we get to vote? What does the US have to gain

by Puerto Rico becoming a state?

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Response to olddad56 (Reply #1)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 01:27 AM

2. Congress needs to ratify.

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Response to olddad56 (Reply #1)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 01:27 AM

4. Buying new flags will boost the economy. Enjoy your stay. nt

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Response to msanthrope (Reply #4)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 02:47 AM

20. Hahaha, goddamn, that was a beautiful reply.

Holy shit. I have not... I don't even have words for that. Brilliant.

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Response to joshcryer (Reply #20)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 08:25 AM

28. Thank you!!! Lately, I've had to come up with several alternatives to

"go f*** yourself raw," which is not permitted.

This includes my new pet phrase "Your concern is noted. Please feel free to share more of your concerns, and enjoy your stay." It is easily adjustable to circumstance.


TO THE JURY---I AM NOT TELLING ANYONE to go f*** themselves raw. I am simply noting that when I feel the urge to use profanity, I substitute something else.

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Response to msanthrope (Reply #28)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 08:28 AM

29. Hey.

I'm fine with saying it.

That poster can go fuck themselves for saying, straight up, that Puerto Rico should not have the self-determination of being a U.S. state. They voted for it, it is their right as a peoples. I really don't like the filthy undertones that poster litters the thread with.

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Response to joshcryer (Reply #29)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 08:57 AM

32. Yes, josh, I agree with the sentiment, but I have a troll swarm

that would hypocritically agree with you but alert on me.


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Response to msanthrope (Reply #28)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 09:12 AM

33. OMG THAT IS BRILLIANT

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Response to msanthrope (Reply #28)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 11:14 AM

41. that is perfection, right there...

"Your concern is noted. Please feel free to share more of your concerns, and enjoy your stay."

SO, SO stealing this! I have a notorious potty mouth that I try desperately to control in polite company - this is the best, all-purpose, FU substitute I've found yet! Thank you!

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Response to olddad56 (Reply #1)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 01:29 AM

5. Congress has to do it.

It's just a non binding referendum. The biggest impediment to Congress approving it is that the number of seats - 383 - is set by law and admitting PR would require redistricting. No state is willing to give up their seats for PR. So it isn't going to happen anytime soon.

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Response to bluedigger (Reply #5)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 01:36 AM

6. Redistricting or simply adding a few more seats.

Do we know the likelihood of this Congress voting for statehood?

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Response to NYC Liberal (Reply #6)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 01:42 AM

9. I think adding seats requires an Amendment.

In any case, there is a practical problem. The US Capital is full!

Seriously.

Redistricting is the traditional method for the last few admissions, I think.

http://www.disinfo.com/2011/02/should-america-expand-the-size-of-congress/

And the number of seats is 435. I got that wrong too.

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Response to bluedigger (Reply #9)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 01:48 AM

12. Actually 435 is an artificial cap set in 1913 (I believe).

It used to be raised automatically as the population increased. Since it was capped, it was actually raised several times since then (it was raised for a few years after AK and HI were admitted in 1959).

It's set by law but it can always be adjusted.

Congress regularly increased the size of the House to account for population growth until it fixed the number of voting House members at 435 in 1911. The number was temporarily increased to 437 in 1959 upon the admission of Alaska and Hawaii (seating one representative from each of those states without changing existing apportionment), and returned to 435 four years later, after the reapportionment consequent to the 1960 census.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_House_of_Representatives#Apportionment

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Response to NYC Liberal (Reply #12)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 01:57 AM

16. Thanks for looking it up.

By population, PR falls between OK and CT and would get 5 seats.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territories_by_population

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Response to bluedigger (Reply #9)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 01:51 AM

14. Its not Constitutionally Mandated, only through a Congressional law...

Congress basically stopped voting to expand itself since the early 20th Century.

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Response to olddad56 (Reply #1)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 01:42 AM

10. You're about 114 years too late to ask that question.

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Response to olddad56 (Reply #1)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 01:49 AM

13. Puerto Rico's population *are* "people of this country." (nt)

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Response to Posteritatis (Reply #13)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 02:12 AM

19. +10000!

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Response to Posteritatis (Reply #13)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 03:01 AM

21. Best answer.

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Response to Posteritatis (Reply #13)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 09:23 AM

35. Thank you, Posteritatis.

I am constantly surprised by how little people know about Puerto Rico.

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Response to olddad56 (Reply #1)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 01:52 AM

15. Ever mailed a letter to Puerto Rico? 45 cent stamp.

They already are part of America, and have been for a very long time.

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Response to olddad56 (Reply #1)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 08:32 AM

30. taxpayers

We have been subsidizing Puerto Rico for way too long. This is the first time Puerto Ricans have voted to give up extra subsidies and become part of the country on the same basis as the other fifty states.

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Response to gottavote (Reply #30)

Thu Nov 8, 2012, 01:31 AM

51. Welcome to DU. Enjoy your stay.

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Response to olddad56 (Reply #1)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 11:01 AM

38. A more Democratic government.

K&R

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Response to olddad56 (Reply #1)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 02:12 PM

45. They already voted.

In case you didn't realize, PR is a US territory, and it's citizens are also US citizens.
The country gains a state and another voice in our democracy.

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Response to olddad56 (Reply #1)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 02:19 PM

47. Puerto Rico has been part off thsi country as a U.S. Territory quite a while

What do we all have to lose by making it a state?

I see this as a win win situation if this becomes reality.

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Response to NYC Liberal (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 01:27 AM

3. I am genuinely amazed! Interested to see how this unfolds.... nt

PB

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Response to NYC Liberal (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 01:39 AM

7. That seems like a BFD...

I know some people who live in PR, and when I talk to them, there never seems to be a lot of enthusiam for Statehood, they kind of like it the way it is. If this is for real, as far as I know, it's a sea change in local politics down there.
Come on, in, we Welcome you, and w're glad you could join us.=)

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Response to Volaris (Reply #7)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 01:41 AM

8. How they have it now seems like the best of both worlds.

But they may want to be able to vote and have representation in Congress, I suppose.

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Response to NYC Liberal (Reply #8)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 01:46 AM

11. uhm... no

How they have it now is really just a boon to the desire for cheap labor.

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Response to kenfrequed (Reply #11)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 02:11 AM

18. Are they not under Federal Minimum Wage Laws?

If that's the case, yeah, that's a pretty good reason to upend the status quo...

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Response to Volaris (Reply #18)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 11:34 AM

42. Federal minimum wage laws and other federal laws apply to PR

under the "dream" status of the Commonwealth Party (Popular Democratic Party) PR would not be under US federal law but retain US citizenship for residents and receive US federal funding. What I found interesting is that the enhanced commonwealth status was an option in the second part of the referendum, but the PDP apparently chose to support the current status instead even though they have always denied PR is a territory.

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Response to Bacchus4.0 (Reply #42)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 01:25 PM

54. Factually inaccurate.

PR's minimum wage law is below the US minimum wage and varies according to industry. There are special dispensations given to territories to this effect.

Employers covered by FLSA need only pay 4.10 an hour. Others not covered by FLSA can petition to keep wages lower than federal law (of 7.25) by demonstrating that the rate would negatively affect their business.

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Response to NYC Liberal (Reply #8)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 02:09 AM

17. Oh I agree, the only thing they can't do NOW

as an American Territory is have a vote counted in Congress (even though I thought they had a non-voting Rep there now..like an Ambassador? to Congress, kiind of like?, because they don't actually HAVE an actual Ambassador, right?)
But if they want in, fuck it, let them come. I say we should extend the offer to most of Central America, as well, but that's just me.

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Response to Volaris (Reply #17)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 09:24 AM

36. They have a non-voting rep to the House

the same as D.C.

Its a little more than an ambassador, since they have full congressional privileges other than voting on the house floor (can sit on committee's, serve constituents, speak on the floor, etc.)

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Response to NYC Liberal (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 04:56 AM

22. Fascinating

Now I wonder about the process for becoming a state, and will look it up.

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Response to treestar (Reply #22)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 05:50 AM

25. It isn't much of a formal process on paper.

"The Congress shall have Power to dispose of and make all needful Rules and Regulations respecting the Territory or other Property belonging to the United States…" -- U.S. Constitution, Article IV, Section 3, clause 2

That's all the constitution says about it.

The typical process is (per http://usgovinfo.about.com/od/uscongress/a/statehoodproc.htm):

# The territory holds a referendum vote to determine the people's desire for or against statehood.

# Should a majority vote to seek statehood, the territory petitions the U.S. Congress for statehood.

# The territory, if it has not already done so, is required to adopt a form of government and constitution that are in compliance with the U.S. Constitution.

# The U.S. Congress - both House and Senate - pass, by a simple majority vote, a joint resolution accepting the territory as a state.

# The President of the United States signs the joint resolution and the territory is acknowledged as a U.S. state.

Note: No valid petition for statehood has been denied by congress.

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Response to Angleae (Reply #25)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 08:08 AM

26. Thanks! That does not even sound that hard.

The R House now won't sign it, so we need a D house next time!

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Response to treestar (Reply #22)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 10:46 AM

37. Just ask Newt Gingrich -- he did the research on admitting that Moon colony. nt

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Response to NYC Liberal (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 05:28 AM

23. Fantastic

Go Puerto Rico!

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Response to NYC Liberal (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 05:39 AM

24. Bet that kicks the "official language" dumbasses right in the cajones.

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Response to NYC Liberal (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 08:19 AM

27. Congrats, Puertorricanos!!!

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Response to NYC Liberal (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 08:43 AM

31. Two more Democratic Senators?

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Response to jpak (Reply #31)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 11:05 AM

40. absolutely correct. That is likely the main reason it WON'T happen

Under the Constitution, Congress makes the rules over territories

"The Congress shall have power to dispose of and make all needful Rules and Regulations respecting the Territory or other Property belonging to the United States; and nothing in this Constitution shall be so construed as to Prejudice any Claims of the United States, or of any particular State."


PR would be overwhelmingly Democratic. Republicans will fight PR statehood for that reason.

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Response to NYC Liberal (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 09:13 AM

34. Fascinating

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Response to NYC Liberal (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 11:02 AM

39. About time!

 

I've been saying PR should shit or get off the pot.
I'm not sure they're really ready for the transition to proper statehood, but it should be amusing.
as it stands, they are a protectorate, a property of the United States with it's citizens being technically American citizens when born, but not much more right than that.

I have no problem admitting them into our happy cluster fuck of a country.
There are about 10 other territories we need to bring in as well.
We have to stop all this territorial "made in america"n sweatshop BS.

I welcome them, and this should do interesting things to tourism and such.
Going to PR would become 'domestic travel'

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Response to NYC Liberal (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 11:53 AM

43. Puerto Ricans: The only American citizens who cannot vote for congress and the president.

A funny kind of 'citizenship' that they have. Can't blame them for wanting to change it.

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Response to pampango (Reply #43)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 03:14 PM

49. Not Really true, you have U.S. Citizens in Guam, U.S. Virgin Islands...

the Commonwealth of the Northern Mariana Islands and American Samoa. There are other territories, but they are mostly uninhabited.

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Response to pampango (Reply #43)

Thu Nov 8, 2012, 01:33 AM

52. D.C. residents can vote for President, but they only get a Delegate

They also pay U.S. income taxes. Taxation without representation anyone?

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Response to NYC Liberal (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 12:44 PM

44. K&R (nt)

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Response to NYC Liberal (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 02:17 PM

46. hypocritically

 

hypocritically

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Response to NYC Liberal (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 02:26 PM

48. Didn't President Ford propose statehood for Puerto Rico?

That was a different world then, but there is some history of Republican support for PR statehood. This is a big deal, btw, and dems should be supporting this big time. This would be a direct strike against the GOP disenfranchisement strategies and anti-Latino/a policies.

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Response to NYC Liberal (Original post)

Thu Nov 8, 2012, 01:12 AM

50. About Time

Puerto Ricans are United States citizens and if they are the mainland can vote in the elections. Should have been made a state way back to after the Spanish American war. But racism would not allow that so made a territory instead. In fact, comments in the congressional record went something along the line " that brown people should not be allowed to rule themselves." They almost did not let Arizona and New Mexico become states because there were not enough people living there from a European descent. A movement to be completely independent also has been thought about. Just think, if Cuba had been made a state, how history would have been changed. When Teddy Roosevelt landed there people ran waving American flags expecting to be made into a state also. My senior project in college had be on Caribbean or South America. I chose Puerto Rico because my aunt is from there.

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Response to NYC Liberal (Original post)

Thu Nov 8, 2012, 02:08 AM

53. I think this is absolutely great news! I hope Congress ratifies it.

 

On a more frivolous note, I wonder which of the major sports will be the first to place either an expansion team in San Juan or move an existing franchise there? San Juan is such a beautiful city, and a lot more prosperous than people realize. I remember the Expos played several games there a few years ago just prior to MLB moving them to D.C. and drew excellent crowds, but the harsh economics of baseball may not favor a place like San Juan which would probably be deemed a "small market". Perhaps the NBA?

At any rate, welcome aboard!

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