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Tue Jul 17, 2012, 08:53 AM

 

17 people hurt in Tuscaloosa, Ala., bar shooting

Source: AP

July 17, 2012

TUSCALOOSA, Ala. (AP) A gunman opened fire at a bar in the hometown of the University of Alabama, wounding multiple people, police said Tuesday.

A total of 17 people were being treated at DCH Regional Medical Center, hospital spokesman Brad Fisher told The Associated Press.

Four of the victims have been admitted to the hospital, and two of them were receiving critical care, Fisher said. It wasn't immediately known whether all had been hit by gunfire, he said.

-snip-

Riley Dunn, a University of Alabama senior who was injured in the shooting, estimated that there were 80 to 90 people in the area at the time. One gunshot rang out, then about 20 seconds later "that's when he really started firing them off" and everyone scattered, Dunn said.

Read more: http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5iAll5Eaoy--Q5xYDqRqZBDx2_dxw?docId=00e371d1655940d0bb3bcf9fe4b80bbc

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Arrow 140 replies Author Time Post
Reply 17 people hurt in Tuscaloosa, Ala., bar shooting (Original post)
UnrepentantLiberal Jul 2012 OP
TheMightyFavog Jul 2012 #1
still_one Jul 2012 #2
michreject Jul 2012 #6
still_one Jul 2012 #16
permatex Jul 2012 #40
PavePusher Jul 2012 #58
still_one Jul 2012 #89
Marrah_G Jul 2012 #3
permatex Jul 2012 #5
still_one Jul 2012 #18
permatex Jul 2012 #21
still_one Jul 2012 #22
permatex Jul 2012 #31
uh clem Jul 2012 #54
PavePusher Jul 2012 #61
permatex Jul 2012 #64
still_one Jul 2012 #90
Hoyt Jul 2012 #91
permatex Jul 2012 #100
SheilaT Jul 2012 #27
permatex Jul 2012 #34
Hoyt Jul 2012 #92
permatex Jul 2012 #101
Warren Stupidity Jul 2012 #32
hack89 Jul 2012 #35
permatex Jul 2012 #36
uh clem Jul 2012 #45
permatex Jul 2012 #46
PavePusher Jul 2012 #62
Hoyt Jul 2012 #93
PavePusher Jul 2012 #95
Hoyt Jul 2012 #97
PavePusher Jul 2012 #99
Hoyt Jul 2012 #104
PavePusher Jul 2012 #105
Hoyt Jul 2012 #107
sarisataka Jul 2012 #108
Hoyt Jul 2012 #109
sarisataka Jul 2012 #110
michreject Jul 2012 #114
donquijoterocket Jul 2012 #50
permatex Jul 2012 #55
PavePusher Jul 2012 #65
freshwest Jul 2012 #51
slackmaster Jul 2012 #70
freshwest Jul 2012 #80
donquijoterocket Jul 2012 #53
PavePusher Jul 2012 #66
Hoyt Jul 2012 #94
PavePusher Jul 2012 #96
permatex Jul 2012 #102
PavePusher Jul 2012 #59
dixiegrrrrl Jul 2012 #78
PavePusher Jul 2012 #98
dixiegrrrrl Jul 2012 #103
sarisataka Jul 2012 #106
jberryhill Jul 2012 #4
MrDiaz Jul 2012 #7
jberryhill Jul 2012 #9
BamBamBane Jul 2012 #10
permatex Jul 2012 #11
Jack Sprat Jul 2012 #12
permatex Jul 2012 #23
Jack Sprat Jul 2012 #33
permatex Jul 2012 #42
UnrepentantLiberal Jul 2012 #49
Judi Lynn Jul 2012 #25
AnOhioan Jul 2012 #28
rl6214 Jul 2012 #111
uh clem Jul 2012 #48
slackmaster Jul 2012 #52
permatex Jul 2012 #63
PavePusher Jul 2012 #69
slackmaster Jul 2012 #8
Warren Stupidity Jul 2012 #13
AtheistCrusader Jul 2012 #15
MADem Jul 2012 #20
AtheistCrusader Jul 2012 #56
Warren Stupidity Jul 2012 #29
slackmaster Jul 2012 #39
AtheistCrusader Jul 2012 #57
MADem Jul 2012 #19
slackmaster Jul 2012 #37
PavePusher Jul 2012 #74
PavePusher Jul 2012 #68
slackmaster Jul 2012 #71
PavePusher Jul 2012 #72
Remmah2 Jul 2012 #116
Warren Stupidity Jul 2012 #14
permatex Jul 2012 #24
Warren Stupidity Jul 2012 #30
slackmaster Jul 2012 #41
permatex Jul 2012 #43
zellie Jul 2012 #17
permatex Jul 2012 #26
hack89 Jul 2012 #38
onehandle Jul 2012 #44
permatex Jul 2012 #47
onehandle Jul 2012 #60
permatex Jul 2012 #67
bongbong Jul 2012 #73
snooper2 Jul 2012 #75
slackmaster Jul 2012 #76
DBoon Jul 2012 #79
slackmaster Jul 2012 #81
4th law of robotics Jul 2012 #83
slackmaster Jul 2012 #84
Remmah2 Jul 2012 #117
dixiegrrrrl Jul 2012 #77
slackmaster Jul 2012 #82
4th law of robotics Jul 2012 #85
bongbong Jul 2012 #86
rl6214 Jul 2012 #112
bongbong Jul 2012 #118
rl6214 Jul 2012 #119
bongbong Jul 2012 #120
rl6214 Jul 2012 #121
bongbong Jul 2012 #122
rl6214 Jul 2012 #123
bongbong Jul 2012 #124
rl6214 Jul 2012 #125
bongbong Jul 2012 #126
rl6214 Jul 2012 #127
bongbong Jul 2012 #128
rl6214 Jul 2012 #129
bongbong Jul 2012 #130
rl6214 Jul 2012 #131
bongbong Jul 2012 #132
rl6214 Jul 2012 #135
bongbong Jul 2012 #136
rl6214 Jul 2012 #137
bongbong Jul 2012 #140
struggle4progress Jul 2012 #87
Tejas Jul 2012 #88
wordpix Jul 2012 #133
Tejas Jul 2012 #134
adigal Jul 2012 #113
ileus Jul 2012 #115
Bucky Jul 2012 #138
primavera Jul 2012 #139

Response to UnrepentantLiberal (Original post)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 09:25 AM

1. Nobody killed?

Lady Luck was on the side of those patrons. Speedy recovery to those hurt.

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Response to UnrepentantLiberal (Original post)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 09:30 AM

2. Hope everyone is ok. Is Alabama one of the states that allows guns in bars like Arizona?

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Response to still_one (Reply #2)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 10:12 AM

6. What does this have to do with Arizona?

This happened a couple thousand miles away.

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Response to michreject (Reply #6)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 11:35 AM

16. Because there are a few states that have a law allowing concealed weapons in bars. Arizona is one

of them. The owners of those establishments have always been against that, claiming that alcohol and guns are not a good combination

I was wondering if Alabama also had such a law that is all

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Response to still_one (Reply #16)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:32 PM

40. Business owners can post no guns allowed on their doors.

 

When they do, that makes it illegal. Of course, someone with criminal intent will disobey the signs.
And it's more than a few now, hasn't seemed to be a problem.

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Response to still_one (Reply #16)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 01:20 PM

58. You can actually look this stuff up.

 

www.handgunlaw.us

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Response to PavePusher (Reply #58)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 03:34 PM

89. Thanks, I googled it and the search wasn't clear

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Response to UnrepentantLiberal (Original post)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 09:36 AM

3. Guns and alcohol , never a good mix.

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Response to Marrah_G (Reply #3)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 10:06 AM

5. The shooter wasn't in the bar drinking

 

he came in and started shooting.
The state I live in does allow concealed carry in bars, but you can't be drinking, thats the law in most of the states that allow concealed carry in restaurants and bars.
Hasn't seemed to be a problem yet and some of these laws have been around for years.

Any private business can put up a no guns allowed sign, problem with that is that criminals don't obey those signs.

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Response to permatex (Reply #5)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 11:39 AM

18. Then nothing could have prevented that, however, concealed weapons in bars is a stupid law, but hey

they want to go back to the wild west let them. Unfortunately in this situation it appears it would not have prevented anything.

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Response to still_one (Reply #18)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 11:52 AM

21. Actually the myth of the wild west is just that

 

a myth, the eastern states at that time were much more violent then the western states. As far as concealed carry in bars, I'd like to hear your reasons why you think it's a bad idea.
When a CCP holder carrys in a bar, they are prohibited from consuming any alcohol whatsoever, and they better not let the weapon print or get flashed, in some states that will get you a misdemeanor charge and loss of your CCP.

I agree with your last statement, in this situation, no law would have prevented this shooting.

However, if just one citizen with a CCP had been on scene, things might have turned out differently, not saying they would, just saying that it might have been stopped after a few shots were fired.

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Response to permatex (Reply #21)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 11:58 AM

22. Because alcohol contributes to more heated exchanges, even if the person with the weapon isn't

drinking, someone else who is could say something that he would take as offensive, and it would be all to easy to use that weapon

If the weapon was not on his person, if he had to go out and get it, that process might cool the person off

I won't go to those establishments, where concealed weapons are allowed, especially in certain states where there is a lot of frustration simmering

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Response to still_one (Reply #22)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:13 PM

31. But the opposite has been shown to be true

 

I just recently applied for my CCP and it was pounded into my head the consequences of doing something stupid like what you suggest.
The huge majority of CCP holders are pretty level headed, honest citizens who made the decision to be able to defend themselves if it ever came to that. I admit that I wrestled with my decision to apply for about a year, weighing the pros and cons, whether I could take another human life if I was, through no fault of my own, put in that situation. It wasn't an easy decision, but now that I've done it, I feel confident that I'm not going to do what you suggest might happen.
You can check the stats on the conviction rate of CCP holders, FL and TX post those stats every year.

Your choice to not want CCP in bars and I respect that.
What are your views on CCP in general?

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Response to permatex (Reply #31)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 01:09 PM

54. "You can check the stats on the conviction rate of CCP holders..."

I have and it's doesn't look good for the CCPs.

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Response to uh clem (Reply #54)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 01:23 PM

61. Citation to your information, please? n/t

 

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Response to PavePusher (Reply #61)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 01:27 PM

64. I'll bet it's Brady or VPC stats.

 

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Response to permatex (Reply #31)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 03:38 PM

90. I don't buy the stats, and I have seen enough fights with alcohol involved that to me it is common

sense

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Response to permatex (Reply #31)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 05:56 PM

91. Yea, but there are lots of folks who aren't criminals per se, who don't get a permit.

We've become much to complacent with guns in this country.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #91)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 07:37 PM

100. So fucking what.

 

It's there choice not to get one just as it's my choice to get one.
Folks who are not criminals per se have a different word, law abiding citizens. You on the other hand, by your own words, were a criminal at one time.

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Response to permatex (Reply #21)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:09 PM

27. And exactly how is that going to be enforced?

It depends on the CCP holder being honest and sensible enough not to drink while carrying.

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Response to SheilaT (Reply #27)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:17 PM

34. If it was such a problem

 

the states that allow it would have repealed those laws by now. The huge majority of CCP holders are honest lawful citizens who took the time and spent the money to apply for and get their CCP. Sure, your always going to have a few assholes who fuck up and break the law, but they usually pay a pretty steep price for the fuck up.

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Response to permatex (Reply #34)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 05:58 PM

92. No the states wouldn't repeal. Too much right wing gun lobbying money from NRA and others.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #92)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 07:41 PM

101. So provide the links to what you are claiming.

 

Show us the proof that the states wouldn't repeal those laws because of the NRA if those laws caused such problems, which, so far, they haven't. Just once, put your money where your mouth is.

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Response to permatex (Reply #21)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:16 PM

32. my state, NH, driven of course by ALEC and the NRA

has removed brandishing as an offense under SYG. You can now pull your gun out and use it to threaten other people, without risking jail time, under our fabulous new stand your ground idiocy. Plus you can keep a loaded gun in your car, just in case you need to shoot while driving.

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Response to Warren Stupidity (Reply #32)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:26 PM

35. Only on your property and only to a trespasser and only after he refuse to leave.

A bill that would make it lawful to brandish a gun at a trespasser who refuses a homeowner's request to leave received mostly support at a public hearing yesterday.

The bill was inspired by Moultonboro farmer Ward Bird, who was jailed on a mandatory minimum three-year sentence for brandishing a gun at a trespasser who refused to leave his remote property.

Republican Rep. Betsey Patten, whose district includes Bird's property, said her bill would also remove the mandatory minimum sentence provision of the criminal threatening law.


http://www.concordmonitor.com/article/242213/bill-would-allow-show-of-guns-to-trespassers

Do you think 3 years was an appropriate sentence?

And the NRA and ALEC had nothing to do with it.

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Response to Warren Stupidity (Reply #32)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:28 PM

36. Heres a text of Senate bill 88

 

http://legiscan.com/gaits/text/347750
Nowhere does it say what you claim.

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Response to permatex (Reply #21)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:50 PM

45. "However, if just one citizen with a CCP had been on scene,..."

Didn't the shooter have a CCP? At any rate, he was probably considered a responsible gun owner until he started shooting.

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Response to uh clem (Reply #45)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:54 PM

46. Where did you get that?

 

They haven't even caught the guy yet. Did you even read the article?

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Response to uh clem (Reply #45)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 01:25 PM

62. Hoyt, are you running a sock puppet? n/t

 

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Response to PavePusher (Reply #62)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 06:01 PM

93. No. You are not in the gungeon now. People don't buy your more guns in public promotion.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #93)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 06:18 PM

95. "You are not in the gungeon now."

 

Facsinating. You acknowledge (and approve of) a double-standard in behavior on DU. Most interesting.


" People don't buy your more guns in public promotion."

I'm sure you can cite to me "selling" something.... somewhere....


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Response to PavePusher (Reply #95)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 06:25 PM

97. Nope, you hang out with your gun promoting buddies in the gungeon. Here you see how people really

feel about guns and right wing groups like the NRA who are run by people like Grover Norquist, Teddy Nugent, John Bolton, Bob Barr, Ollie North and a host of other right wingers.

Fact is, we should have continued the ban on the type guns this yahoo used to shoot up a bar. But, because of the NRA, similar right wing groups, and a few "liberals" who can't function without a gun on city streets, this crud goes on and the gun manufacturers keep making more and more money.

By the way, the guy who shot up that bar looks like the yahoos that flooded gun stores after President Obama was elected, preparing to "take their country back."

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #97)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 06:45 PM

99. What make and model of gun was used?

 

Was it one that would have fallen under the "ban" requirements?

Can you back up your claim to knowledge that has not been made public yet?

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Response to PavePusher (Reply #99)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 09:14 PM

104. Do you plan on waiting for all the facts before you'll pull your gun if you think

you are being threatened? I bet not.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #104)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 11:02 PM

105. There is a wee bit of difference between making decisions during an emergency situation....

 

and arm-chair kibitzing from the safety of where-ever your computer is located.

You would know that if your life was even a tenth as eventful as you have claimed.

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Response to PavePusher (Reply #105)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 11:19 PM

107. What are the odds of anything happening where most people need a gun?

Especially compared to negative gun outcomes.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #107)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 11:23 PM

108. Oh about...

eight hundred thousand to two million times a year. The lower anti-gun source says at least one hundred fifty thousand. Even Brady et al. recognize there are many defensive gun uses every year.

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Response to sarisataka (Reply #108)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 11:44 PM

109. Come on, how many times are you actually at risk if you are moderately careful?

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #109)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 11:55 PM

110. I will agree with you there

many things can be avoided by being careful. Sometimes, however, lighting does strike...

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Response to PavePusher (Reply #62)

Wed Jul 18, 2012, 07:08 AM

114. Too funny. nt

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Response to permatex (Reply #21)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:59 PM

50. given

how bad most people are with handguns it most likely might have ended with even more casualties. Never have been quite sure why gunners think another gunner is going to put their rounds in the 9 or 10 ring especially if the initial gunner starts shooting back.Targets are one thing a target that shoots back is another. Firefights especially in enclosed spaces are a good way to increase collateral damage and friendly fire casualties, to use a couple of the more oxymoronic euphemisms.

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Response to donquijoterocket (Reply #50)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 01:10 PM

55. Not necessarily true

 

most CCP holders practice quite often, I don't have my CCP yet, should be here next week or so, but I regularly practice my shooting skills, I can outshoot the two of my relates that are LEO, and I can probably outshoot most street cops who usually only shoot a gun when they have to do their annual firearms qualification.
Here's a recent video of a CCP holder thwarting an armed robbery at an internet cafe with appox. 30 people there.
http://legiscan.com/gaits/text/347750

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Response to donquijoterocket (Reply #50)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 01:27 PM

65. You have evidence of existance of a statistically significant problem....

 

of legal gun carriers causing such problems?

Please post a citation to evidence supporting your assertion.

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Response to permatex (Reply #21)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 01:01 PM

51. If their weapons are concealed, how does the bartender know they're not allowed a drink?

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Response to freshwest (Reply #51)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 01:50 PM

70. As is true of MOST laws, the proscription against drinking while carrying a weapon is self-enforced

 

HTH

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #70)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 03:00 PM

80. If the person is not reliable, like Rodriquez, things will get out of hand.

Too many variables, nothing to be done, except to avoid a crowd. There are good reason not to go to bars, although this was not a drunken patron, or so it would appear. This story is not really about CCW, RKBA, the state of Alabama, the university nearby or bars. Just a violent person who shouldn't have been armed, but laws don't stop criminals. It would only be politically interesting if there was evidence of bias. We may never know. I don't guess any laws will be changed by this.

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Response to still_one (Reply #18)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 01:06 PM

53. one thing

Maybe breaking down the attitude that guns are a solution to anything.

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Response to donquijoterocket (Reply #53)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 01:29 PM

66. They are sometimes a possible solution to some things.

 

No-one claims they are an applicable solution to everything.

OMG, This just in: Any object can be used in a criminal/negligent/harmful way!! More on this shocking fact at TonightsObviousNewsAt10!!!!

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Response to donquijoterocket (Reply #53)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 06:06 PM

94. We've outlawed cigarettes in most public places, but the NRA has paid for laws allowing guns.



I'm with you, we've glamorized gun far too long. Unfortunately, we'll sit on our asses for the next decade and another 100 million guns will pollute society.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #94)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 06:21 PM

96. Bullshit.

 

We've outlawed use, not carry of cigarettes.

As usual, your attempt at analogy is Teh Phale.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #94)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 07:44 PM

102. And I'm doing my best to make your nightmare come true.

 

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Response to still_one (Reply #18)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 01:21 PM

59. Please cite to where it's been a statistically significant problem...

 

with otherwise legal carriers getting drunk and shooting places up.

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Response to permatex (Reply #5)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 02:52 PM

78. Actually, 11 of the shots were fired from outside the bar

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Response to dixiegrrrrl (Reply #78)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 06:27 PM

98. Well that's crap reporting.

 

"He used a military-type assault rifle, Anderson said, but police are unsure of the caliber or rate of fire."

In other words, they don't know shit, but the reporter decided to do some creative fear-mongering word play.

Sigh.



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Response to PavePusher (Reply #98)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 09:09 PM

103. the 17 "injured" seems accurate.

not "wounded" but "injured.
tho is now reported to be in critical condition.
Al.com is keeping up with the latest.
and we have friends who got to the University up there.

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Response to PavePusher (Reply #98)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 11:15 PM

106. How can they not know the caliber?

Recover one bullet and grab a caliper...

ROF? ~60 rpm, same for any semiautomatic rifle.

The picture is to fuzzy for any positive ID on the rifle. I would guess an AK derivative but it could be about anything.

Very happy no one was killed.

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Response to UnrepentantLiberal (Original post)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 09:51 AM

4. They like that sort of thing

Smells like.... Freedom!

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Response to jberryhill (Reply #4)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 10:42 AM

7. your post

 

shows everyone how little educated you actually are on the. Was the guy doing the shooting a concealed handgun license holder, or a criminal who acquired a gun illegally.

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Response to MrDiaz (Reply #7)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 10:47 AM

9. lol

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Response to MrDiaz (Reply #7)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 10:49 AM

10. Or was he just another fear-freaked gun hugger?

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Response to BamBamBane (Reply #10)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 10:53 AM

11. That is just so..............................

 

original......................not. More bigotry against gun owners on display.
Why am I not surprised.

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Response to permatex (Reply #11)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 11:26 AM

12. Bigotry against gun owners?

 

I don't think so. I'm a gun owner and I don't take it that way. The main reason I own a gun is to protect myself against violence prone gun owners.

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Response to Jack Sprat (Reply #12)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 11:58 AM

23. How about the little snark about over compensating?

 

Just how did you take that? 99.9% of gun owners in this country are honest law abiding citizens and that poster's comment was, IMHO, insulting. You may not take it that way and thats your perogative, I choose to take it as an insult.

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Response to permatex (Reply #23)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:16 PM

33. It wasn't insulting at all, unless

 

of course, you're one of those gunowners that's really into his guns. If you adore your guns and sleep with them at night and even talk to them some everyday, then I can understand where you're coming from.....I guess.

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Response to Jack Sprat (Reply #33)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:35 PM

42. You just made my point

 

I tried to have a civil conversation with you and you just had to throw in your little snarky remarks.
Have a good day.

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Response to Jack Sprat (Reply #33)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:59 PM

49. Talking to your gun is not a good sign.

 

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Response to BamBamBane (Reply #10)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:02 PM

25. Thanks for sharing the image.

Welcome to D.U.

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Response to BamBamBane (Reply #10)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:09 PM

28. +1

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Response to BamBamBane (Reply #10)

Wed Jul 18, 2012, 04:01 AM

111. Do you know what that gun is or what it was used for or did you just think it was a cute photo?

 

It is actually called a punt gun, a huge shotgun used to kill an entire flock of birds at one time such as ducks. They were outlawed for hunting by most states in the 1860s

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Response to MrDiaz (Reply #7)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:57 PM

48. You see it's like this...

If a reponsible gun owner commits a crime, he gets reclassified as a criminal so won't tarnish the reputations of the gun lovers. As far as a legally purchased weapon goes, any criminal can purchase a gun from a private seller with cash ans without a background check.

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Response to uh clem (Reply #48)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 01:01 PM

52. You are misinformed about federal law, specifically 18 USC section 922 (d)

 

As far as a legally purchased weapon goes, any criminal can purchase a gun from a private seller with cash ans without a background check.

In the situation you describe here, the buyer has committed a crime. If the buyer knows or has reason to believe the buyer is not legally allowed to have a firearm, the buyer has also committed a crime.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/922

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #52)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 01:25 PM

63. I love it when posted facts

 

overcome emotional dribble.
Thanks.

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #52)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 01:48 PM

69. Not to mention any number of state laws broken.... n/t

 

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Response to UnrepentantLiberal (Original post)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 10:43 AM

8. Cap on backwards. Shirt untucked. Gang hit.

 

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #8)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 11:29 AM

13. you forgot "Negros"

but your point is clear: no need to be concerned.

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Response to Warren Stupidity (Reply #13)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 11:33 AM

15. From the surveilance photo, he appears to be white.

Do you imagine gang member automatically means 'black'? Maybe you should re-visit and adjust your personal biases.

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Response to AtheistCrusader (Reply #15)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 11:45 AM

20. Look at the pictures I posted downthread, tell me what color that dude is. nt

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Response to MADem (Reply #20)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 01:16 PM

56. Yeah, that bottom one is the one I saw on the news article.

Looks like a white guy to me.

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Response to AtheistCrusader (Reply #15)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:10 PM

29. I imagine the poster was trivializing the shooting.

And yes it is a dog whistle.

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Response to Warren Stupidity (Reply #29)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:30 PM

39. You have a vivid imagination, and apparently some biases as well

 

Can a white person be a gang member? How about an Asian? Hispanic?

Or all all gang members black in your mind?

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Response to Warren Stupidity (Reply #29)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 01:18 PM

57. Funny. You seem to be the only one that hears it.

Where I come from, the descripton he used immediately conjures a white guy, because that is, statistically, the most numerous gang banger, population wise.

I tend to question whether it was a gang hit though. If it was, this guy was a spectacularly shitty shot.

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Response to Warren Stupidity (Reply #13)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 11:44 AM

19. Could be a white guy. I can't tell from the picture. Can you?

If he's a brother, he's pink. Very pink. Very bright. He has a very visible tattooed left arm.

I don't know what universe you come from -- that hat and big shirt look is popular amongst the white people too down that way.




http://blog.al.com/tuscaloosa/2012/07/tuscaloosa_shooting_copper_top.html


Copper Top, located at the intersection of Fourth Street and 23rd Avenue in downtown Tuscaloosa about a mile away from the University of Alabama campus, is frequented by UA students.

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Response to Warren Stupidity (Reply #13)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 02:22 PM

74. "gang"=/="racism"

 

But thanks for playing the race card, it certainly exposes your standards.

Good luck with that.

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #8)


Response to PavePusher (Reply #68)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 01:51 PM

71. Actually, Warren Stupidity played the race card in this thread

 

And lost.

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #71)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 02:17 PM

72. Arrgh, sorry, replied in wrong place. I'll delete and move. n/t

 

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #71)

Wed Jul 18, 2012, 11:59 AM

116. Kinda hurts one's credibility.

 

One that constantly submarines to the lowest common denominator.

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Response to UnrepentantLiberal (Original post)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 11:29 AM

14. Open carry state.

See how much safer it is?

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Response to Warren Stupidity (Reply #14)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:01 PM

24. So how is that relevent to this?

 

It's also a shall issue state, is that relevent to this shooting?

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Response to permatex (Reply #24)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:11 PM

30. actually it is a may issue for concealed carry.

yes gun culture is relevant to the shooting.

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Response to Warren Stupidity (Reply #30)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:35 PM

41. The idea of may issue is to prevent the "wrong" people from getting permits

 

Who do you think that term refers to, Warren Stupidity?

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Response to Warren Stupidity (Reply #30)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:41 PM

43. I stand corrected on shall issue

 

but this isn't a gun culture issue, it's a criminal issue.

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Response to UnrepentantLiberal (Original post)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 11:37 AM

17. Yeah....We need more guns

 

in the hands of insane lunatics

Just super

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Response to zellie (Reply #17)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:04 PM

26. No, we need the states to do a better job of reporting

 

judgements of mental health to NICS. We need better mental health care in this country.

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Response to zellie (Reply #17)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:28 PM

38. No - we need less lunatics

properly funded mental health care - lets focus on the import issue.

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Response to UnrepentantLiberal (Original post)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:47 PM

44. You can trust gun owners. They can police their own actions. No regulation needed.

I mean, bankers.

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Response to onehandle (Reply #44)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 12:56 PM

47. You can trust lawful gun owner alot more than banksters.

 

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Response to permatex (Reply #47)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 01:22 PM

60. You can trust bankers alot more than lawful gun owners.

See. I can issue platitudes too.

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Response to onehandle (Reply #60)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 01:33 PM

67. Platitudes and atitudes seems to be all you have.

 

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Response to UnrepentantLiberal (Original post)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 02:17 PM

73. Replies in this thread

 

Gun-relgionist: "Nothing so bad about guns. I don't have any evidence, but they're GREAT!"

Liberal: "Guns are dangerous."
Gun-religionist: "WHERE IS YOUR PROOF? I WANT EVIDENCE! And it can't be from places that I hate like the Brady Campaign! Only NRA-approved sources meet my approval!"

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Response to bongbong (Reply #73)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 02:31 PM

75. It's mostly a bunch of speculation about what happened

Maybe some dude that was in the bar had raped his daughter and he went bonkers?


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Response to snooper2 (Reply #75)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 02:41 PM

76. I'm thinking he got 86'd for bringing a live opossum into the club

 

I've seen that happen.

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #76)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 02:55 PM

79. did the bar have a posted policy against this?

"No Marsupials Allowed"?

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Response to DBoon (Reply #79)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 03:04 PM

81. It was a violation of California state law, something in the Health and Safety Code

 

No children or non-humans allowed in bars except for service animals, but aquariums and maybe caged birds are OK. The guy who brought the opossum into the club thought it would be funny, but the bartender and the bouncer were not amused.

It's really amazing how many people in my neighborhood have service dogs.

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Response to DBoon (Reply #79)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 03:05 PM

83. But placental mammals would be fine right?

 

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Response to 4th law of robotics (Reply #83)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 03:08 PM

84. I think a service iguana would be allowed

 

Or a service alpaca.

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #84)

Wed Jul 18, 2012, 12:01 PM

117. I'll discuss that with my seeing eye turtle.

 

As soon as he gets back from his jog.

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Response to snooper2 (Reply #75)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 02:49 PM

77. "I was taking drugs, and things got out of hand at the bar,"

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Response to dixiegrrrrl (Reply #77)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 03:05 PM

82. That was real "white" of him to turn himself in

 

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Response to dixiegrrrrl (Reply #77)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 03:08 PM

85. Clearly the bars fault. And guns

 

not the individual doing drugs.

Definitely not.

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Response to snooper2 (Reply #75)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 03:12 PM

86. Or maybe

 

There are too many loose nuts with guns floating around America.

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Response to bongbong (Reply #86)

Wed Jul 18, 2012, 04:08 AM

112. Didn't you forget your :rofl: and your "gun religionist" bullshit?

 

You know, the normal shtick you like posting when it comes to guns?

Can't make a post based upon fact so you have to resort to your shtick.

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Response to rl6214 (Reply #112)

Wed Jul 18, 2012, 04:51 PM

118. Obsessed

 

> You know, the normal shtick you like posting when it comes to guns?

I didn't know you were so obsessed with my posts! I'll try harder next time just for you, sweetie-pie!

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Response to bongbong (Reply #118)

Wed Jul 18, 2012, 10:29 PM

119. Obsessed? Yes you are.

 

See, there ya go, you got your little in there this time. Aren't you cute.

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Response to rl6214 (Reply #119)

Thu Jul 19, 2012, 04:35 PM

120. Oh dear

 

> Obsessed? Yes you are.

Back to the old "I know you are but what am I?" stuff from 2nd grade. You must be running out of "witty" stuff to post. You were just getting entertaining. A pity.

One question: Are you a self-professed "tough guy" like permatex?

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Response to bongbong (Reply #120)

Thu Jul 19, 2012, 08:58 PM

121. Tough guy? No, I just go with the flow. If anyone is "a self-professed "tough guy"

 

they usually aren't that tough. I like the Teddy Roosevelt quote "speak softly and carry a big stick".

I'd like to see exactly where permatex professed to be a "tough guy" and what the conversation was about and the context it was in.

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Response to rl6214 (Reply #121)

Fri Jul 20, 2012, 12:11 PM

122. ROFL

 

> If anyone is "a self-professed "tough guy" they usually aren't that tough.

You said it (that you were a "tough guy"), so I guess that means you AREN'T tough. Basically, you sound really confused about yourself.

It looks like Gun Religion messes up people's heads.

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Response to bongbong (Reply #122)

Fri Jul 20, 2012, 03:19 PM

123. please show me

 

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Response to rl6214 (Reply #123)

Fri Jul 20, 2012, 03:50 PM

124. Sorry, different poster

 

Thought I was responding to the self-professed "tough guy" (as he claimed in one of his posts to me) permatex.

Gun-relgionists are easy to mix up, my bad.

But maybe YOU can answer my question. Why is a person a "tough guy" when they need to carry gun(s) to feel safe enough to appear in public, but they're a 'wimpy librul' if they have no such fear gripping their persona?

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Response to bongbong (Reply #124)

Fri Jul 20, 2012, 04:36 PM

125. "Sorry, different poster"

 

Yeah, but did you go edit your insulting post, nope.

"my bad"

As usual

"But maybe YOU can answer my question. Why is a person a "tough guy" when they need to carry gun(s) to feel safe enough to appear in public, but they're a 'wimpy librul' if they have no such fear gripping their persona?"

I don't claim to be a "tough guy" because I carry a gun nor do I "need to carry a gun (s) to feel safe enough to appear in public"

There may be some out there that do but I don't carry a gun out of fear, I carry a gun so I am prepared in a situation that I may need one. I came close to drowning once but I don't fear water because of it. It dosen't keep me out of pools, rivers or lakes, I just make sure I am prepared when entering water so I don't get in over my head (pun intended). I don't like heights but that dosen't prevent me from going up on/in tall buildings, roller coasters or even mountain climbing. Your fear arguement dosen't hold water.

So to answer your question, it's not a matter of a "tough guy" vs a "wimpy librul", it's being prepared vs not being prepared, your attempts at insults aside.

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Response to rl6214 (Reply #125)

Fri Jul 20, 2012, 05:14 PM

126. Yowza

 

> Your fear arguement dosen't hold water.

Maybe not in your case, but it does in lotsa other gun-religionists' cases.

> So to answer your question, it's not a matter of a "tough guy" vs a "wimpy librul", it's being prepared vs not being prepared,

Prepared? Why aren't you prepared for a gas attack? Why not carry around a gas mask? Why is the "preparation" that gun-relgionists need seem to coincide so closely with just carrying a gun? There are plenty of scenarios where a gun wouldn't make a difference.

No one can prove that they are just "preparing" and aren't "scared".

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As always, the run-relgionist's "arguments" dissolve in a pool of facts & logic.

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Response to bongbong (Reply #126)

Fri Jul 20, 2012, 06:35 PM

127. How often do we have gas attacks compared to armed robberies or assaultis in general

 

Fail

"Why is the "preparation" that gun-relgionists need seem to coincide so closely with just carrying a gun?"

Why would you think it coincides just with carrying a gun? I try to be prepared in most aspects in my life. I carry a firstaide kit in my Jeep along with jumper cables, tool, an emergency jumpstart battery, emergency water, rations and blanket, a flashlight, spotlight, winch, shovel, two jacks and a spare tire. Most people would think those preparations are a bit much, I don't. In fact I had my jumpstart battery out of the Jeep yesterday and threw it in at the last minute and sure enough I needed to use it on a friends car. How many gas attacks do you see. I'm sure you can cite a few. I'll wait.

"There are plenty of scenarios where a gun wouldn't make a difference. "

And there are plenty fo scenarios, posted here everyday where they do.

"No one can prove that they are just "preparing" and aren't "scared". "

And you can't prove that they are prepared that they are scared of something. All you have is your whining, accusations and name calling.

"As always, the run-relgionist's "arguments" dissolve in a pool of facts & logic."

Facts and logic? To borrow a line from you:



There would have to be first of all SOME FACTS presented by you in order to prove any logic.

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Response to rl6214 (Reply #127)

Fri Jul 20, 2012, 07:07 PM

128. LOL

 

> How often do we have gas attacks compared to armed robberies or assaultis in general

There are plenty of other ways to "prepare" than with just guns. I picked one, but I'm sure your fear tells you to carry a gun, so it doesn't matter.

> fe. I carry a firstaide kit in my Jeep along with jumper cables, tool, an emergency jumpstart battery,

Why not lots of other stuff? Why just that? Why not be prepared for more kinds of problems?

I know lots of people (millions, in fact) who live in "dangerous" places like NYC and don't carry guns. No fear from them.

Logic and facts? Your fear & gun-religion rule them out to be a member.

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Response to bongbong (Reply #128)

Fri Jul 20, 2012, 08:24 PM

129. "Logic and facts? Your fear & gun-religion rule them out to be a member. "

 

WOW, you really are just dense. Keep coming back to the same old shtick when your (lack of) "logic" has been used against you. Again in your words

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Response to rl6214 (Reply #129)

Fri Jul 20, 2012, 11:58 PM

130. Worship your PRECIOUS!

 

Oh boy. You gun-relgionists are sure predictable.

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

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Response to bongbong (Reply #130)

Sat Jul 21, 2012, 02:30 AM

131. You just keep up with your juvenile shtick

 

just reinforces what everyone here knows of you.

I'm sure all the other 12 year olds walk around talking about your precious.

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Response to rl6214 (Reply #131)

Sat Jul 21, 2012, 09:00 PM

132. OK

 

> just reinforces what everyone here knows of you.

That's alright, this is a Liberal chatboard, and Liberals think gun-religionists are completely nuts.

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Response to bongbong (Reply #132)

Sat Jul 21, 2012, 11:52 PM

135. "That's alright, this is a Liberal chatboard, and Liberals think gun-religionists are completely nut

 

That's right, and recent surveys have shown that their are more liberal gun owners on this chatboard than those that don't own guns and that's not a gungeon survey so GET USED TO IT.

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Response to rl6214 (Reply #135)

Sun Jul 22, 2012, 05:28 PM

136. PROVE IT

 

> d recent surveys have shown that their are more liberal gun owners on this chatboard than those that don't own guns

In the immortal words of gun-relgionists everywhere, PROVE IT.

Oh, and BTW, on-line polls don't count since they're EASILY hacked to produce false vote counts, something that is right up the alley of gun-relgionists.

GET GOING! You're going to have to produce a statistically rigorous poll of DU members. That's a tough one!

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Response to bongbong (Reply #136)

Sun Jul 22, 2012, 07:31 PM

137. In the immortal words of YOU...google it, I'm not going to do your work for you

 

"Oh, and BTW, on-line polls don't count since they're EASILY hacked to produce false vote counts"

So you can hack the polls here on DU? Sure you can.

Never fail to amuse yourself with all those do you.

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Response to rl6214 (Reply #137)

Mon Jul 23, 2012, 04:12 PM

140. LOL

 

So you have no proof for your claim.

Don't worry, none of you gun-religionists do. You're just typical in that respect. Also typical in your worship of a death-dealin' piece of iron.

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Response to UnrepentantLiberal (Original post)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 03:12 PM

87. Suspect held in Alabama bar shooting that wounded 17

By Verna Gates
TUSCALOOSA, Alabama | Tue Jul 17, 2012 2:05pm EDT

(Reuters) - ... Police spokesman Brent Blankley said he would not provide additional details. A press conference was scheduled for 1 p.m. local time, he said.

Police Chief Steven Anderson said earlier that the shooter may have been targeting someone ...

"The individuals who were there are very blessed that they were not killed," he said.

The shooting at the Copper Top bar in downtown Tuscaloosa may be connected to an earlier shooting at a residence in the nearby town of Northport, Anderson said. One person was injured in that incident ...

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/07/17/us-alabama-shooting-idUSBRE86G0IS20120717

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Response to UnrepentantLiberal (Original post)

Tue Jul 17, 2012, 03:27 PM

88. UPDATE

 

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014168989

Police: Alabama bar shooting suspect in custody

(CNN) -- The suspect in an early morning shooting at a bar in Tuscaloosa, Alabama, is in custody, Police Chief Steve Anderson said Tuesday.

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Response to Tejas (Reply #88)

Sat Jul 21, 2012, 09:23 PM

133. how many more of these mass shootings before we get gun control?

Christ, you can buy guns every day and order semi auto magazines on the internet up the wazoo. One gun seller in AZ limited his customers to "only" one semi-auto weapon per day. And when a person buys these things in huge quantities, sometimes for days or months on end, no one flags the buyer and informs police.

Great system.

I feel safe now

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Response to wordpix (Reply #133)

Sat Jul 21, 2012, 10:05 PM

134. Gun control, like in Mexico?

 

Mexico has tough gun laws, but they do not appear to be working very well for Mexico.

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Response to UnrepentantLiberal (Original post)

Wed Jul 18, 2012, 07:07 AM

113. I love my gun, love my gun!

Don't you be taking it away from me, you hear?

God bless 'merica.

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Response to UnrepentantLiberal (Original post)

Wed Jul 18, 2012, 08:26 AM

115. Guns wound people.

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Response to UnrepentantLiberal (Original post)

Mon Jul 23, 2012, 08:37 AM

138. If everyone in that bar had been heavily armed, this wouldn't have happened.

or at least it would have played out differently.

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Response to UnrepentantLiberal (Original post)

Mon Jul 23, 2012, 02:55 PM

139. Just another day in Gunland - n/t

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