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Sat Jun 2, 2012, 04:20 AM

Zimmerman credibility could be issue in legal case

Source: Associated Press

Zimmerman credibility could be issue in legal case
By KYLE HIGHTOWER and MIKE SCHNEIDER | Associated Press 1 hr 9 mins ago.

SANFORD, Fla. (AP) The credibility of Trayvon Martin's shooter could be an issue at trial after a judge said that George Zimmerman and his wife lied to the court about their finances to obtain a bond, legal experts say.

That's because the case hinges on jurors believing his account of what happened the night the 19-year-old was killed.

The questioning of Zimmerman's truthfulness by the judge on Friday could undermine the defendant's credibility if it is brought up at trial. It also may complicate how his defense presents him as a witness, said Orlando-area attorney Randy McCLean, who is a former prosecutor.

"The other key witness, unfortunately is deceased," McClean said. "Basically, Zimmerman is going to be asking the jury to believe his version of the facts ... As the case stands now, his credibility is absolutely critical to the case."


Read more: http://news.yahoo.com/zimmerman-credibility-could-issue-legal-case-070716310.html

30 replies, 4661 views

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Arrow 30 replies Author Time Post
Reply Zimmerman credibility could be issue in legal case (Original post)
Judi Lynn Jun 2012 OP
longship Jun 2012 #1
Cosmocat Jun 2012 #8
Frank Cannon Jun 2012 #27
rocktivity Jun 2012 #20
Boabab Jun 2012 #2
canuckledragger Jun 2012 #6
magical thyme Jun 2012 #3
crim son Jun 2012 #9
DallasNE Jun 2012 #12
magical thyme Jun 2012 #13
DallasNE Jun 2012 #15
BumRushDaShow Jun 2012 #4
LiberalFighter Jun 2012 #5
slackmaster Jun 2012 #7
csziggy Jun 2012 #24
slackmaster Jun 2012 #30
DallasNE Jun 2012 #10
Quixote1818 Jun 2012 #17
JDPriestly Jun 2012 #19
DallasNE Jun 2012 #21
onehandle Jun 2012 #11
naaman fletcher Jun 2012 #14
DallasNE Jun 2012 #16
Quixote1818 Jun 2012 #18
naaman fletcher Jun 2012 #23
Quixote1818 Jun 2012 #29
Smilo Jun 2012 #22
rocktivity Jun 2012 #25
rocktivity Jun 2012 #26
Omaha Steve Jun 2012 #28

Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 04:56 AM

1. If I was defense lawyer, there's no way that I put him on the stand.

Unfortunately, for my client that would mean that he would likely be convicted. But that would also happen if I put him on the stand. The difference is that if he doesn't lie under oath on the stand, he may get a more lenient sentence.

Zimmerman's toast either way.

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Response to longship (Reply #1)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 10:33 AM

8. He is in a tough spot

most murder trials, the defense can cast doubt on the evidence/facts.

Gee, how do you REALLY know he was there? How do you REALLY know he pulled the trigger?

The facts in this case are not in question - Zimmerman shot Martin.

The defense is based on stand your ground.

Minus Zimmerman testifying, the simple facts are some half unstable twit stalked a kid making a 7-11 run and ended up shooting him.

In order for Zimmerman to make a stand your ground defense, he has to explain why his life was in danger.

That means the can of worms that is his mouth is going to have to open.

And, once he gets on the stand, no way to hide his being a certifiable moron.

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Response to Cosmocat (Reply #8)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 10:53 PM

27. If that idiot has to rely on his mouth...

to get him out of trouble, he may as well head over to his tailor's right now and have himself measured for a stockpile of orange jumpsuits.

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Response to longship (Reply #1)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 05:27 PM

20. Maybe a plea deal to aggravated manslaughter?

That's the killing of a child or senior person you're intentionally trying to injure -- maximum thirty years. I think Trayvon's family could go for that, it saves the time and expense of a trial, and I think Zimmerman could go for getting out of jail as opposed to only qualifying for parole twenty or thirty years from now!


rocktivity

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Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 05:37 AM

2. Gee, ya think?

If this travesty ever makes it to court (assuming Georgie Porgie doesn't make a run for the border), the watching public will see another deeply dysfunctional family on display -- just like the Anthonys.

It seems that all of the Zimmermans lie -- though I don't recall hearing from the mother -- and the 'mistruths' aren't even very creative.

It was clear from the night of Trayvon's murder that huge fabrications were told. All we can hope is that this all comes out in court.

The revoking of bail is a very good first step.

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Response to Boabab (Reply #2)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 10:14 AM

6. At the moment he can't run anywhere

his bail has been revoked due to the issues mentioned in the original post.

He can only get out now if daddy decides to pull some string & help him break out..

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Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 06:49 AM

3. is that article a little slanted?

1. it doesn't mention the 2nd passport
2. it doesn't mention the taped jailhouse phone conversation


And then there's this:

"Both McClean and Hill said O'Mara would be able to challenge the admissibility of the bond revocation at trial by questioning its relevance."

Ok, the Zimmerman's jointly lied to the court while under oath about how much money they had. Zimmerman reported his passport missing and got a new one issued *two weeks after killing Martin* and only returned one of the two passports.

Sure looks like a flight risk to me. And if you think that a track record of lying, and apparently planning to skip the country isn't relevant, then I have a really nice money-making bridge for sale...

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Response to magical thyme (Reply #3)


Response to magical thyme (Reply #3)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 11:35 AM

12. Do You Have A Link

Showing the 2nd passport was issued 2 weeks after Martin was killed. I read one account that said Zimmerman reported his original passport lost in 2004, indicating he has had both passports much longer than that. O'Mara also said the 2nd passport flap is his fault because it was in his possession and he forgot to turn it in when he turned in the other passport. That hardly passes the smell test. O'Mara has his own credibility issues.

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Response to DallasNE (Reply #12)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 12:25 PM

13. abcnews -- I saw it last night somewhere. here is a link to local affiliate

http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/story?section=news/national_world&id=8685484

The judge's move comes after prosecutors filed a motion requesting to revoke his bond on Friday, saying Zimmerman misled the court about his finances and his possession of a second passport, which he acquired two weeks after he shot unarmed 17-year-old Trayvon Martin during an altercation.

In recordings of conversations also released Friday, Zimmerman and his wife were heard talking cryptically about his second passport in a safety deposit box they shared. The two spoke in code in the recording.

Zimmerman's original passport was due to expire in May. He applied for a second passport, claiming the first one was lost or stolen.



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Response to magical thyme (Reply #13)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 01:57 PM

15. Thank You

I had some doubts about my source because it didn't make that much sense regarding when the 2nd passport was acquired. The "due to expire in May" 2012 was the same as well as the claim the 1st passport was lost or stolen. With a passport due to expire normal people use the old passport to acquire the new passport, they don't report it as lost or stolen and use their birth certificate to acquire a new passport. It was the expiring passport that was turned in too. The Judge can't be too happy with attorney O'Mara either because this is sloppy work on his part at best.

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Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 09:02 AM

4. WTF? "what happened the night the 19-year-old"

Trayvon was 17. If anything, it's AP that has a huge credibility problem. Do any of these organizations really have any editors anymore? Ironically CNN's web page had a link to an editorial about the fall of the copy editor and proof-reader in response to the Rmoney "Amercia" fiasco.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/06/01/opinion/perlman-romney-needs-editor/index.html?hpt=hp_bn7

And here you have AP proving the point.

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Response to BumRushDaShow (Reply #4)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 09:37 AM

5. AP imo has had a credibility problem for many years.

Probably organized for the purpose of collecting membership fees and will accept anyone.

Twitter accounts
Kyle Hightower -- @khightower
Looks like he has only spent about 6 years (maybe it is more) at the Orlando Sentinel primarily to cover the Orlando Magic.


Mike Schneider -- @MikeSchneiderAP
He's a data journalist? Working 18 years for AP.

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Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 10:16 AM

7. This analysis is based on an assumption that the case will be presented to a jury

 

That is not a certainty.

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #7)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 07:53 PM

24. But this situation will hurt Zimmerman if he goes for immunity under SYG

Since the same judge will be the one who would hear that claim. And somehow I don't think this judge will believe anything Zimmerman has to say.

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Response to csziggy (Reply #24)

Sun Jun 3, 2012, 10:57 AM

30. Indeed. Pissing off the judge is always a bad move.

 

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Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 11:25 AM

10. There Is Still Much That We Don't Know

And much of what we do "know" is speculation.

To me it looks like attorney Mark O'Mara might be up to his eyebrows in how this has played out. One wonders if he coached Zimmerman and his wife on the code they used when talking about their finances. Take a look at the following because it stinks to high heaven.

In late April, Zimmerman's attorney, Mark O'Mara, said that the money raised by the website was put into a trust account that the attorney controls. But Corey stated Friday in the court documents: "The money still belongs to defendant and he can demand it at any time."

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Response to DallasNE (Reply #10)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 04:16 PM

17. Interesting


I remember the other attorneys distanced themselves quickly from that account. Or at least appeared to after Zimmerman found O'Mara.

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Response to DallasNE (Reply #10)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 05:05 PM

19. Maybe there is some sort of trust account handled by O'Mara in trust for Zimmerman???

I have no idea, but there could be some sort of arrangement like that.

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Response to JDPriestly (Reply #19)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 06:10 PM

21. One Account I Saw

Said Zimmerman and his wife had the funds parked in a credit union account. When I saw that I thought I remembered O'Mara saying it was under the control of his law firm then I came across this news item confirming my memory. There is a lot about this that really stinks, both for the Zimmerman's and for O'Mara.

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Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 11:28 AM

11. Careful. NRAhadists will come around to defend their poster child.

From their 'secret' locations.

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Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 12:37 PM

14. From my understanding

 

This is not in any way admissible at trial.

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Response to naaman fletcher (Reply #14)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 02:11 PM

16. Could Not The Prosecutor Bring It Up In His Opening Statement

By framing it as part of a pattern of behavior by Zimmerman?

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Response to naaman fletcher (Reply #14)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 04:18 PM

18. Anything Zimmerman said in the courtroom or said to police is fair game. nt

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Response to Quixote1818 (Reply #18)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 07:43 PM

23. eh..

 

About the case, yes, but I just don't think that this is admissible, it has nothing to do with the killing.

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Response to naaman fletcher (Reply #23)

Sun Jun 3, 2012, 12:28 AM

29. Yes it does because the bond is because of the killing. They passed the starting line


the instance he got in front of the judge the very first time. It's all interconnected now even if it seems abstract. As the saying goes, anything you say that can be used against you WILL be used against you. If you say anything at all that will bolster their case against you even if it's lying about the bond, they are going to use it to show you lied in court. Even if you just misspoke or honestly didn't remember something right. If they CAN use your statement - if it's going to help their case - they WILL use it.

Also, the police are free to lie to you during an interrogation, and if you tell them something because you thought their lies were the truth - and your statements incriminate you - they will use it because they legally can.

In this case his actions speak to his honesty so they will use it to show he can't be trusted. There is no way the judge is going to knock them down for bringing it up. They will probably bring it up in the opening and closing statements.

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Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 07:00 PM

22. Zimmerman also lied about

getting another passport - he checked the box that said lost/stolen - when he had had to surrender it.

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Response to Smilo (Reply #22)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 10:20 PM

25. Prosecutors said Zimmerman did not surrender a second passport, but the judge dismissed that concern

comparing it to losing a driver's license, applying for a new one, then finding the old one. (link)
When I get new credit cards, I don't just toss the old ones in the trash -- I destroy them by cutting them into pieces. Zimmerman KNEW he had two passports and that they were BOTH valid as of the time bond hearing. He should have told the judge about them and/or turned them both in.


(Judge) Lester seemed most concerned about phone calls between Zimmerman and his wife while he was in jail that showed they knew of the tens of thousands of dollars he collected...In one of the conversations, according to the state's motion, Zimmerman tells his wife, Shelly, "If the bond is more than 15, pay the 15." (link)
LOL -- way to incriminate yourself!


Defense lawyer Mark O'Mara...said Zimmerman did not lie, but was simply unclear about how he could use the money, and that his office has been keeping close tabs on the funds. (link)
You mean it never occurred to YOU, counselor, to even suggest to your client should put some of the money towards his bail? Or was your idea of "keeping tabs" on it was making sure that YOU got paid? Sounds like there's a whole lot of "misunderstanding" going on...


rocktivity

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Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 10:28 PM

26. Having less-than-zero credibility didn't do Casey Anthony any harm

Indeed, the defense will probably "go the OJ way" -- put the entire investigation on trial, garnished with race-baiting.


rocktivity

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Response to Judi Lynn (Original post)

Sat Jun 2, 2012, 11:09 PM

28. Sorry I duped your post



K&R!

OS

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