Sat Apr 28, 2012, 12:13 AM

alp227 (20,459 posts)

United States Talks Fail as Pakistanis Seek Apology

Source: New York Times

The latest high-level talks on ending a diplomatic deadlock between the United States and Pakistan ended in failure on Friday over Pakistani demands for an unconditional apology from the Obama administration for an airstrike. The White House, angered by the recent spectacular Taliban attacks in Afghanistan, refuses to apologize.

The Obama administration’s special envoy to Afghanistan and Pakistan, Marc Grossman, left the Pakistani capital Friday night with no agreement after two days of discussions aimed at patching up the damage caused by the American airstrikes last November that killed 24 Pakistani soldiers on the Afghanistan border.

Both sides insist that they are now ready to make up and restore an uneasy alliance that at its best offers support for American efforts in Afghanistan as well as the battle against some extremist groups operating from Pakistan. The administration had been seriously debating whether to say “I’m sorry” to the Pakistanis’ satisfaction — until April 15, when multiple, simultaneous attacks struck Kabul and other Afghan cities.

Read more: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/28/world/asia/talks-between-us-and-pakistan-fail-over-airstrike-apology.html?pagewanted=all

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10 replies	Author	Time	Post
United States Talks Fail as Pakistanis Seek Apology (Original post)	alp227	Apr 2012	OP
This message was hidden by jury decision.	DeMo Kratt	Apr 2012	#1
Things that bad over there?	gratuitous	Apr 2012	#3
DeMo Kratt	MrScorpio	Apr 2012	#4
Well, now she'll have more time for her four beautiful children	gratuitous	Apr 2012	#5
We don't investigate our crimes against humanity	gratuitous	Apr 2012	#2
This whole Afghanistan-Pakistan thing is one, big, ugly mess for us.	Comrade Grumpy	Apr 2012	#6
The Taliban isn't giving up. They never gave up to anyone.	Selatius	Apr 2012	#7
There never was any Taliban before 1995	cosmicone	Apr 2012	#8
If we wait a few weeks both the Prime Minister and President of Pakistan will probably be gone.	grantcart	Apr 2012	#9
But the generals will remain.	Comrade Grumpy	Apr 2012	#10

Response to alp227 (Original post)

DeMo Kratt This message was hidden by Jury decision.

Response to DeMo Kratt (Reply #1)

Sat Apr 28, 2012, 12:30 AM

gratuitous (49,292 posts)

3. Things that bad over there?

Ya got nothing else now that Romeny's your nominee? So long.

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Response to DeMo Kratt (Reply #1)

Sat Apr 28, 2012, 12:32 AM

MrScorpio (55,316 posts)

4. DeMo Kratt

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Response to MrScorpio (Reply #4)

Sat Apr 28, 2012, 12:37 AM

gratuitous (49,292 posts)

5. Well, now she'll have more time for her four beautiful children

Though "she's" up rather late. Drunk dialing, maybe?

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Sat Apr 28, 2012, 12:29 AM

gratuitous (49,292 posts)

2. We don't investigate our crimes against humanity

Why would we apologize for them? Don't those Pakistanis appreciate how exceptionally exceptional we are in the United States? And after all we've done for them, the ingrates.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Sat Apr 28, 2012, 02:25 AM

Comrade Grumpy (3,381 posts)

6. This whole Afghanistan-Pakistan thing is one, big, ugly mess for us.

We need to extricate ourselves post haste.

Our troops are supposed to be out of Afghanistan in 2014, and then what for Kabul?

We're fighting the Taliban to the bitter death, and trying desperately to negotiate something with them.

We've given the Pakistanis billions to help us out against the Taliban and Al-Qaeda, but they're running their own game, aiding and abetting insurgents based in the NWFP who attack Afghan and NATO forces. It's like we're paying for all sides in this war.

And now the Pakistanis have their own insurgency with the Pakistani Taliban.

And we won't stop dropping drones on the territory of our (sort of) allies, the Pakistanis.

This whole thing is bad, bad joke.

And we keep killing and generating people who wnat to kill us. What's not to like?

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Response to Comrade Grumpy (Reply #6)

Sat Apr 28, 2012, 04:58 AM

Selatius (20,440 posts)

7. The Taliban isn't giving up. They never gave up to anyone.

Many older commanders in the Taliban were once commanders in the Mujahadeen when they were fighting the Soviet Red Army. They won that war. The Red Army didn't have home field advantage like the Mujahadeen fighters did, and the US army doesn't either.

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Response to Selatius (Reply #7)

Sat Apr 28, 2012, 12:12 PM

cosmicone (3,379 posts)

8. There never was any Taliban before 1995

It is entirely a creation of Pakistani ISI and most of the Taliban foot soldiers are active duty Pakistani military.

The solution to Afghanistan lies in an annihilation of Pakistani military-ISI complex and stomping on any ambitions Pakistan may have of being militarily relevant. This will divert more funds to the economic development and well-being of the Pakistani people -- if they chhose to remain one nation sans military.

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Response to alp227 (Original post)

Sat Apr 28, 2012, 12:38 PM

grantcart (38,744 posts)

9. If we wait a few weeks both the Prime Minister and President of Pakistan will probably be gone.

http://www.telegraphindia.com/1120427/jsp/foreign/story_15424630.jsp

Islamabad, Apr 26: Pakistan's Supreme Court on Thursday convicted Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani of contempt of court but gave him a token punishment of less than even two minutes in a case that could see him stepping down as a fall out to "willfully flouting, disregarding and disobeying the court's direction.

"The accused Syed Yousuf raza Gilani, prime Minister of Pakistan/Chief Executive of the federation is found guilty of and convicted for contempt of court," Judge Nasirul Mulk, who headed the seven-judge panel that heard the contempt case, said in a short order.

Gilani, who became Prime Minister after his Pakistani Peoples Party (PPP) came to power in March 2008, was charged with contempt in February over his refusal to order re-opening of corruption cases against President Asif Ali Zardari in Swiss courts.

Gilani had pleaded not guilty and opted to defend himself in the case, which can weaken his government aiming to complete its five year tenure in March 2013

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Response to grantcart (Reply #9)

Sat Apr 28, 2012, 12:47 PM

Comrade Grumpy (3,381 posts)

10. But the generals will remain.

The Pakistani politicians may be feckless feudalists, but those generals have a crazed, paranoid ideology, and they have control over the nukes.

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